Sasuke is 1 septillion times faster

[Rizengan01]

No it wasn't.

It was.

First of all, you're milking out anything you can from Madara's statement. Madara simply stated "You're still fast on your own without S/T." Not "He's faster than me."

I didn't say Madara said Sasuke was faster than him. I'm hammering the point that Madara pointed out that Sasuke is incredibly fast, because you are trying to make this a focus on a surprise attack, when even Madara said the focus was speed. I'm keeping the context in mind, and not letting it be lost.

Well duh about the race, but in races, what happens when even a faster guy stops to take a drink or something?

Why stop? That's not Mandatory. And Madara still failed to defend himself.

No he hasn't. It's Madara facing Sasuke and being blitzed as if he's slower that's fanfic.

Not true.

Next, we see Madara at the same spot. Meaning, he didn't move an inch when he put the eye in, leaving time for Sasuke to catch up, which hardly qualifies as out-speeding.

See, you try to force logic that doesn't follow up in this manga. You know the context of a speed blitz? That's when a character completely out-speeds another one. If Character A could only move 1 meter forward in the time that character B moves 1000 Meters, then when Character B moves 1 meter, it will mean character a moved 1/1000 of a meter. By comparison, it makes Character A look like they weren't moving at all, but that was because Character B was simply vastly faster.

What we have here, is Madara moving forward, yet Sasuke moving forward much faster. Madara even outright comments on Sasuke's movement speed. And as I pointed out above, he also *tried* to defend himself.

Next, we clearly see Madara's body turning sideways as evident by the motion lines. Meaning he only began to turn in Sasuke's direction when he was already on top of him, meaning it's catching him off-guard, not blitzing him head-on.

Madara began turning in the first panel of that page, just so we're clear. Secondly, turning is movement, which incorporates movement speed. I'm not sure what point you are trying to make by saying Madara was turning, thus this feat is null, but it sounds like an improper point to me. If Sasuke was able to run past Madara in the time that it took Madara to turn around, then you don't understand that this indicates how fast Sasuke was?

Another fine point to bring up would be Minato +FTG or Tobirama + FTG. They literally teleport right next to Madara (Tobirama teleporting behind him, while Minato teleported in front of him), yet their attacks were too slow, and so Madara manhandled them. Here, Sasuke didn't even teleport, but literally ran up to Madara - Madara who has sensing, along with his otherworldly speed and reaction time - so where does this place Sasuke? Far above Minato. Far above Tobirama. It places him on a level that literally blitzed Madara.

In comparison, Naruto's put Madara in tight spots while facing him directly.

Madara was forced to use Limbo to intercept him and couldn't even cancel his jutsu on time to defend himself.

This is such hypocrisy. There Madara wasn't moving at all, yet you don't acknowledge that. There, Madara was focused on Sasuke (like he was focused on Obito's eye above), yet you don't acknowledge that at all. Why not?

And then you don't even acknowledge that Naruto failed to get past that single clone. Naruto, who easily brushed off a clone earlier (before Madara absorbed the Shinju, and before Naruto activated his chakra cloak). But then, that clone blocked him, and even knocked him pack a page or two later. You just completely ignore that.

You also ignored that Sasuke's reaction was fast enough that he saw the clone appear, and even launched his sword at it (making a direct hit no less). Why do you ignore this as well?

Here, Naruto's clones go toe-to-toe with limbo clones.

That is true. But Madara's Limbo clones survived, and I don't recall any confirmation that Naruto's clones did.

Naruto has solid feats of matching Madara physically while Sasuke only has a sneak-attack feat. Sorry to break it to you, but at best, Sasuke rivals Naruto's speed. His power is in his eyes, not juubi jin bodies.

That is not true. Sasuke has better feats. Not that I'm saying he is faster certainly, but he certainly has better feats.

*I'm not on the Base too often, so I may or may not miss your reply. I'll try to hit it whenever I can

 

[King Of Pop]

No he hasn't. It's Madara facing Sasuke and being blitzed as if he's slower that's fanfic.

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Here, Madara's facing away from Sasuke and putting in Kakashi's eye.

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Next, we see Madara at the same spot. Meaning, he didn't move an inch when he put the eye in, leaving time for Sasuke to catch up, which hardly qualifies as out-speeding. Next, we clearly see Madara's body turning sideways as evident by the motion lines. Meaning he only began to turn in Sasuke's direction when he was already on top of him, meaning it's catching him off-guard, not blitzing him head-on.


In comparison, Naruto's put Madara in tight spots while facing him directly.

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Madara was forced to use Limbo to intercept him and couldn't even cancel his jutsu on time to defend himself.


Here, Naruto's clones go toe-to-toe with limbo clones.

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Naruto has solid feats of matching Madara physically while Sasuke only has a sneak-attack feat. Sorry to break it to you, but at best, Sasuke rivals Naruto's speed. His power is in his eyes, not juubi jin bodies.

lol you are basically misinterpreting the manga. the first scan you showed was madara already implanting kakashis eye, he already implanted the eye before sasuke got to him so your claim of madara putting in kakashis eye when sasuke arrived is false, he had already done the implant

2nd scan, madara is not facing away, he can clearly see him coming, its not like he was caught of guard, he just couldnt react

the bold is false and wrong interpretation. madara had already done the implant, then he turned only to find sasuke near him. how can you say sasuke caught him off guard when madara clearly saw the guy coming, heck he even made a statement about sasuke being fast, next thing he was cut. that just shows he couldnt react and not that he was caught off guard, madara had already done the implant so nothing was distracting him. besides you forget this is the same madara whos back was turned against a speed guy like tobirama who tried to bliz him off guard, yet madara still reacted to him and put him on the floor. thats because madara possesees quality sensing like naruto, he juubi jin for crying out loud, he has good reactions so even if he wasnt facing sasuke he should still have been able to dodge or react if he could but he the truth is he couldnt as sasuke was too fast heck madara even acknowledged the speed. theres no excuse here, sasuke was just too fast for him, something naruto post shinju hasnt been shown to do.

those other scans of naruto validate my point, madara reacted to him there but couldnt react to sasuke as ive shown, he wasnt in a bad spot, he clearly reacted.

currently naruto doesnt have any solid feat that surpasses sasukes. madara has yet to proclaim that he is fast or anything, sasuke is the one who has actually received such praise. your whole post was trying to downplay what sasuke did while trying to hype up naruto own which wasnt as impressive as you made it sound. sasuke has shown the better feat, until naruto shows something more currently sasuke is faster eyes or not

 

[Rizengan01]

Your logic is flawed. Madara has sensing abilities and knew of Sasukes prescence. It was no sneak attack feat. At the same time you contradict your post when Naruto attacked Madara from behind as well when he was trying to figure outt where Sasuke went and he reacted easily. Sneak attack or no? Madara had a head start against Sasuke. I cannot stress the importance of Madara taking off full speed before Sasuke , he sensed Sasuke coming and still couldn't react

This.

More like he didnt give a crap. He could already get to Obito and being cut in half meant nothing to him.

Why do you think Madara switched the staff to his left (dominant) hand when he went to face Sasuke?

 

[King Of Pop]

More like he didnt give a crap. He could already get to Obito and being cut in half meant nothing to him.

thats merely opinion lol and as someone said its fanfic as madara couldnt do anything, he was blized, you people need to deal with it lol

 

[Turson]

Dats fanfic and your proof goes as far as your opinion.

I dont know about that. Sasuke was coming at him with sword, it wasnt hard to fathom what he was trying to do, but at the same being cut in half meant very little to him. In fact, it dint even phase him and he regenerated in no time. Anyway, getting the second Rinnegan was the priority and Madara knew very well that Obito can destroy it anytime, so he just started to teleport. Surely, it was a good decision becuase if it took him two or three seconds longer his precious Rinnegan would be gone.

 

[King Of Pop]

Your logic is flawed. Madara has sensing abilities and knew of Sasukes prescence. It was no sneak attack feat. At the same time you contradict your post when Naruto attacked Madara from behind as well when he was trying to figure outt where Sasuke went and he reacted easily. Sneak attack or no? Madara had a head start against Sasuke. I cannot stress the importance of Madara taking off full speed before Sasuke , he sensed Sasuke coming and still couldn't react

thissss. saying sasuke used sneak attack when madara has juubi sensing, he was clearly aware of sasuke heck he even saw him. thats just trying to grasp at straws and downplay what sasuke did lol. i dunno , its like people think anything speed must automatically belong to naruto when sasuke has shown something better. we cant deny manga

 

[King Of Pop]

lol rizengan, i completely agree. nice posts

 

[Berserker]

thissss. saying sasuke used sneak attack when madara has juubi sensing, he was clearly aware of sasuke heck he even saw him. thats just trying to grasp at straws and downplay what sasuke did lol. i dunno , its like people think anything speed must automatically belong to naruto when sasuke has shown something better. we cant deny manga

They are trying to downplay him any chance they get. It's pretty sad. Sasuke is pretty important in this manga it's time people just acknowledge what he can do.

I dont know about that. Sasuke was coming at him with sword, it wasnt hard to fathom what he was trying to do, but at the same being cut in half meant very little to him. In fact, it dint even phase him and he regenerated in no time. Anyway, getting the second Rinnegan was the priority and Madara knew very well that Obito can destroy it anytime, so he just started to teleport. Surely, it was a good decision becuase if it took him two or three seconds longer his precious Rinnegan would be gone.

Sorry taking a hit that could potentially kill you(not saying it could but Madara doesn't know what else they up their sleeve) is pretty moronic in Madaras sense. But I digress nothing to discuss unless you have a manga scan saying Madara purposely got hit because for now it sounds like a bad excuse.

 

[Turson]

Sorry taking a hit that could potentially kill you(not saying it could but Madara doesn't know what else they up their sleeve) is pretty moronic in Madaras sense. But I digress nothing to discuss unless you have a manga scan saying Madara purposely got hit because for now it sounds like a bad excuse.

Well, you have to show me a manga scan that proves that Sasuke was just too fast and Sasuke couldnt react. We have different opinions, I just think mine is more logical considering what was happening there. Like I said - Madara knew very well that Sasuke is coming at him at sword, so he could evaluate the risk. He could stay there and play with Sasuke little longer or waste no time and prevent Obito from destroying Rinnegan. It was simple decision.

 

[Berserker]

Well, you have to show me a manga scan that proves that Sasuke was just too fast and Sasuke couldnt react. We have different opinions, I just think mine is more logical considering what was happening there. Like I said - Madara knew very well that Sasuke is coming at him at sword, so he could evaluate the risk. He could stay there and play with Sasuke little longer or waste no time and prevent Obito from destroying Rinnegan. It was simple decision.

Madara: "You're so fast Sasuke" -proceeds to get cut in half-. I know you read the manga you just choose to go against facts not even an opinion. It's a personal problem honestly.

 

[Rizengan01]

Well, you have to show me a manga scan that proves that Sasuke was just too fast and Sasuke couldnt react. We have different opinions, I just think mine is more logical considering what was happening there. Like I said - Madara knew very well that Sasuke is coming at him at sword, so he could evaluate the risk. He could stay there and play with Sasuke little longer or waste no time and prevent Obito from destroying Rinnegan. It was simple decision.

I ask you again, why do you think Madara shifted his staff to his left (dominant) hand when he turned to face Sasuke?

And he already commented on how dangerous Sasuke was. Why would he voluntarily take an attack from Sasuke if he could've just blocked/dodged it? That makes no real sense. If he wasn't going to teleport to Kamui dimension until after Sasuke completed his attack anyway, then he had no reason at all to be hit by it.

And if he was fast enough to block/dodge it, why wouldn't he do so? Not just because it would keep him from taking the damage, but because it would set him up to kill Sasuke. That was his entire problem from the get-go. He saw Sasuke's eye, and realized how handy it was. He wanted it for himself. But he couldn't get it. He realized that Sasuke (and Naruto) was too dangerous - that's why he decided to go for his eye in that particular moment in the first place.

If he had to opportunity to handle Sasuke right then and there (with no Naruto present), and take the eye, why didn't he?

None of that adds up to me. But I'll hear you out if you have something to say.

 

[Turson]

You're so fast Sasuke proceed to get cut in half. I know you read the manga you just choose to go against it. It's a personal problem honestly.

Unfortunately, I dont understand the meaning of this post.

Why would he voluntarily take an attack from Sasuke if he could've just blocked/dodged it?

I already explained that. Madara knew very well that Sasuke is coming at him at sword, so he could evaluate the risk. He could stay there and play with Sasuke little longer or waste no time and prevent Obito from destroying Rinnegan. It was simple decision.

 

[Berserker]

Unfortunately, I dont understand the meaning of this post.

Hype: You're so fast Sasuke

Feat: Catches up to Madara and cuts him in half.

= Fact.

Opinion is subjective, but all you did was make up something to benefit your claim when it actually has no basis. You say your opinion is more logical but it has no facts behind it. I already explained to you Madara has no intention of taking hits on purpose as that would be plain moronic. That's my opinion but the above is a fact and you cannot deny it.

 

[Rizengan01]

Unfortunately, I dont understand the meaning of this post.

He said "you're so fast" is what Madara said - indicating Sasuke's speed was why that happened.

I already explained that. Madara knew very well that Sasuke is coming at him at sword, so he could evaluate the risk. He could stay there and play with Sasuke little longer or waste no time and prevent Obito from destroying Rinnegan. It was simple decision.

So Madara prepared his staff to defend...then thought about it...and he decided it would be better to get cut in half than to block the attack. And that is the answer you want to give me? Legitimately?

EDIT:

Just to reiterate, Madara used Kamui AFTER Sasuke finished his attack. So whatever he chose to do during/before Sasuke's attack was finished wouldn't have had any affect on the time period you speak of (going to Kamui dimension to get his eye as quickly as possible).

 

[Zealous Sparks]

Technically this is true, albeit rather stupid:

Naruto's speed times 10^24 is still < Instant

 

[~Sky~]

Considering Sasuke is the only one with noticeable foot speed feats like blitzing a jubbi Jin on foot your argument is invalid.

Naruto did that too though.

 

[Rizengan01]

Naruto did that too though.

I think memory is failing me. When did Naruto do that?

 

[Turson]

He said "you're so fast" is what Madara said - indicating Sasuke's speed was why that happened.

Yes, thats true, he praised Sasuke for his speed, but that doesnt mean he couldnt react. Look at this scene - Madara was able to turn back and formulate a though before he was cut down. It didnt look like he couldnt react. And lets be serious... Sasukes body being that much faster than Madaras? It doesnt have any sense story-wise. Sasuke is supposed to have eye power... Madara has both halves.

Just to reiterate, Madara used Kamui AFTER Sasuke finished his attack. So whatever he chose to do during/before Sasuke's attack was finished wouldn't have had any affect on the time period you speak of (going to Kamui dimension to get his eye as quickly as possible).

Either way, dealing with Sasuke would slow him down. Two, three more seconds and bye bye Rinnegan.

 

[~Sky~]

I think memory is failing me. When did Naruto do that?

Here: [

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Madara acknowledged that Naruto did what he did because he had gotten stronger, not because he himself was still recovering, so no excuses for Madara there.

He also got him here: [

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[Berserker]

Here: [

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Madara acknowledged that Naruto did what he did because he had gotten stronger, not because he himself was still recovering, so no excuses for Madara there.

He also got him here: [

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]--->[

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Are you on something Madara clearly blocked his attack in both scans.