Sasuke Can Use Genjutsu Without Eye Contact. Why Do People Deny This?

[SharinganProdigy]

Every time I see this topic being brought up, I see some seriously bad arguments trying to dismiss this statement. I believe that Sasuke can use his rinnegan to perform genjutsu without requiring eye contact. This belief comes from him casting genjutsu on all of the bijuu while they are positioned in a circle all around him.

Hagoromo says he did this "with a single glance." People use this line to say that eye contact must be required then. How does that make any sense? I believe this argument comes from a severe misunderstanding of what "eye-contact" means. Eye contact is "the act of looking directly into another's eyes"/"a meeting of the eyes of two persons." That means that Hagoromo saying he did it with a glance ("to look quickly or briefly") does not in any way imply that Sasuke somehow looked into a bijuu's eyes as that bijuu happened to look back into his eyes at that exact moment and then did this eight more times. That's ridiculous. Glance =/= eye contact.

People also suggest that Sasuke spun around somehow making this eye contact because he spun in his fight with Kabuto to use a surrounding amaterasu defense. Notice how Kishimoto drew and made it clear that Sasuke spun around in that panel but that was never shown or made clear in the bijuu panel...? You cannot claim that he did that same thing against the bijuu but argue Kishimoto just forgot to draw that hugely important detail. Those that argue that he spun around and somehow got lucky enough to meet every single one of the bijuus' eyes have the burden of proof on them because they are arguing something that was never shown. Because there is no proof to prove said argument, you may as well drop it. You're essentially saying "Sasuke spun around while looking into each bijuu's eyes. He then got lucky enough for every single bijuu to also be looking directly into Sasuke's eyes at the same exact point he looked into theirs! Oh, also Kishimoto completely forgot to draw every bit of this ever happening. Whoops!"

"But Sasuke is using a sharingan genjutsu so he totally MUST require eye contact!"

Shisui's kotoamatsukami is also a genjutsu ability of the mangekyou sharingan yet it does not require eye contact. So is izanami and izanagi. Sasuke himself has had some questionable genjutsu uses where he shouldn't have been able to hit someone with genjutsu via eye contact (Against Deidara and against Cee). Infinite tsukuyomi is a "rinnegan genjutsu" that does not require eye contact. It's similar in the way that it's an AoE (area of effect) ability where it affects those touched by its light. Amenotejikara, Sasuke's teleportation ability, does not require him to view the area he wants to teleport to in order to shift himself there. With all of this evidence, why are people still arguing that it must need eye contact because it's from a doujutsu?

Another notable use (that I won't argue in this thread for) is when he used genjutsu on Sakura with his back to her. Her head is down and her eyes are closed but let me guess: "Through his peripheral vision, Sasuke totally makes eye contact with Sakura off-panel!" This example is less strong that the bijuu panel and more "iffy" but I do think it is worth a mention.

"Well, if he's so good, why didn't he use it against Naruto?!!!"

He most likely believed it wouldn't help against Naruto. He kind of learned a hard lesson when he tried MS genjutsu on Bee. We'll never know if it would have helped or not as he never did try it on Naruto.

Sidenote: It would be of great help if someone could tell me how to post image links in my threads/posts without it holding my response for mod review so that I can post manga scans in my thread. Thanks.

 

[Ricardo]

wall of text didn't read

You must be registered for see images

 

[Cresee]

Sidenote: It would be of great help if someone could tell me how to post image links in my threads/posts without it holding my response for mod review so that I can post manga scans in my thread. Thanks.

I think you need more than 50 posts in order to avoid mod response.

 

[SharinganProdigy]

Thanks so much for the response. I'm fairly new so I still don't know how things work but people keep ignoring this question. It's hard to make threads because I can't link anything so it just looks like a wall of text...

Then I'll get people like the first response who don't read but respond anyway. :/

 

[Amazeballs]

Typical Sharingan Genjutsu does require eye contact; the ones you pointed out are the exceptions. Generally, we are to assume that eye contact occurred. Kishi fudges it a lot, and doesn't go out of his way to make the eye contact plausible or believable. He doesn't want to constantly resort to showing fights where people stare at Sasuke's feet for fear of making eye contact.

Don't get me wrong, I have also questioned how, for example, Sasuke made eye contact with every single one of the Bijuu; you'd think some of them would be looking elsewhere, or see what he was doing and look away. However, this is likely not meant to demonstrate Sasuke's ability to perform Genjutsu without eye contact, and is simply plot. Kishi wanted the Bijuu under Genjutsu, and tried to smooth over the moment by having Hagoromo praise Sasuke's skill as a way of saying "don't worry, fans, even I don't know how exactly he pulled this off."

 

[Jiren]

I agree Sasuke solos.

 

[The Necromancer]

Typical Sharingan Genjutsu does require eye contact; the ones you pointed out are the exceptions. Generally, we are to assume that eye contact occurred. Kishi fudges it a lot, and doesn't go out of his way to make the eye contact plausible or believable. He doesn't want to constantly resort to showing fights where people stare at Sasuke's feet for fear of making eye contact.

Don't get me wrong, I have also questioned how, for example, Sasuke made eye contact with every single one of the Bijuu; you'd think some of them would be looking elsewhere, or see what he was doing and look away. However, this is likely not meant to demonstrate Sasuke's ability to perform Genjutsu without eye contact, and is simply plot. Kishi wanted the Bijuu under Genjutsu, and tried to smooth over the moment by having Hagoromo praise Sasuke's skill as a way of saying "don't worry, fans, even I don't know how exactly he pulled this off."

To be fair, Sasuke placed Deidara in a genjutsu multiple times without eye contact.

 

[ROHAN]

In Sasukebase we had a discussion on this :-

Me :

Spoiler

This is a thread based on an explanation to the event in which Sasuke one-shotted the Bijuus.

You must be registered for see links

Note : This thread needs manga panels as evidence, so I would appreciate if you guys can collect it for me. I have slow net. MP means Manga Panel.

First off, we know that the Bijuus were in a complete circle when summoned by Hagoromo.

MP: Showing Bijuus in circle.

Now, we know that Sasuke didn't spin like a Ballerina to bring every bijuu in his Vision Range and put them in Genjutsu.

MP: Sasuke standing in same spot, didn't move an inch after Rinne Genjutsu.

On Top of that Hagoromo said Sasuke did it with just a glance, so complete eye contact didn't happen.

MP: Insert Hagoromo Statement panel.

So, how did all the Bijuus fall under Rinne Genjutsu ?

Explanation - 1 : Bijuu Mind Link

We know that all the Bijuus have a mental link to Naruto. They are separate mental entities with a connection.

MP : Hagoromo's statements of Kuruma being a mental link between Naruto and Bijuus.

MP: Bijuus co-operating with Naruto mentally throughout Madara - Kaguya - Sasuke (Only Kuruma) Fights.

We can assume that if one bijuu falls under Rinne Genjustu, the Genjutsu spreads through the mental link and puts all the Bijuus in Genjutsu.

But, this also makes Naruto fall under Rinne genjutsu because of his mental link to the Bijuus.

The only reason Naruto didn't fall under Rinne Genjutsu was because Sasuke wanted to fight him.

MP: Insert Panels showing Sasuke's resolve to fight Naruto.

If a bijuu falls under Rinne Genjustsu, there is no one to break Naruto out of said Genjutsu thus the "Perfect Jin Immune to Genjutsu" statement is invalid.

Explanation - 2 : Izanami Workings :-

We know that Izanami is a genjutsu that works on all senses rather than only vision.

MP: Put panels of Itachi saying this after putting Kabuto in Izanami.

Rinne Genjutsu perhaps works on the same principle as it didn't require eye contact. ^See Above.

This makes Rinne Genjutsu extremely OP as it's instant (Supported By Hagoromo) and requires no long term preparations like Izanami.

MP: Find panels showing Itachi saying that Izanami takes time to set up.

This also would explain Rinne Genjutsu/Mugen Tsukuyomi working on Blind people; it works on senses, not on Vision.

Sasuke has a watered down Mugen Tsukuyomi. Why you may say ?

Well, if Sasuke can block Mugen Tsukuyomi, why can't he cast it ? All that he would need will be the moon to act as an eye to put everyone in the illusion. Sasuke can easily create a Moon by using Chibaku Tensei.

MP: Panels of Black Zetsu saying Sasuke can block Mugen Tsukuyomi.

Michael :

Spoiler

Sasuke genjutsu'd the bijuu externally, Naruto still had half kurama within. Try Again

Me :

Spoiler

Basically it means that Yin Kuruma was inside Naruto and not in the external environment. This would mean that the Bijuus inside Naruto will be immune to Rinne Genjutsu. This means the mind link theory breaks down cause if the minds were connected then even Yin Kuruma should fall under Rinne Genjutsu also cause Sasuke only intended to not hit Naruto.

A counter explanation would be that Sasuke didn't consider Yin Kuruma within Naruto at all. This makes sense cause Sasuke did not see Yin Kuruma getting transferred to Naruto by Obito.

The first argument is shaky, so I would go with the second argument.

 

[Retsu]

Didn't stop shin or any of his clones and sure as heck didn't stop Naruto at vote 2 so claiming that he can absolutely solo anybody relevant with a glance is an outright lie.

 

[Jiren]

Didn't stop shin or any of his clones and sure as heck didn't stop Naruto at vote 2 so claiming that he can absolutely solo anybody relevant with a glance is an outright lie.

He can solo all kage with sharingan genjutsu dont lie to yourself.

 

[SharinganProdigy]

Didn't stop shin or any of his clones and sure as heck didn't stop Naruto at vote 2 so claiming that he can absolutely solo anybody relevant with a glance is an outright lie.

You didn't read my post. No one said anything about someone "solo-ing." I addressed why he may not have used it against Naruto and you failed to address the topic of the post. More people should read.

 

[SharinganProdigy]

Typical Sharingan Genjutsu does require eye contact; the ones you pointed out are the exceptions. Generally, we are to assume that eye contact occurred. Kishi fudges it a lot, and doesn't go out of his way to make the eye contact plausible or believable. He doesn't want to constantly resort to showing fights where people stare at Sasuke's feet for fear of making eye contact.

Don't get me wrong, I have also questioned how, for example, Sasuke made eye contact with every single one of the Bijuu; you'd think some of them would be looking elsewhere, or see what he was doing and look away. However, this is likely not meant to demonstrate Sasuke's ability to perform Genjutsu without eye contact, and is simply plot. Kishi wanted the Bijuu under Genjutsu, and tried to smooth over the moment by having Hagoromo praise Sasuke's skill as a way of saying "don't worry, fans, even I don't know how exactly he pulled this off."

So let me get this straight. Everything that goes along with what I said is deemed as an "exception" because you say so? Is that a joke? Manga fact: there are doujutsu genjutus that can be used without eye contact. Whatever you want to call it doesn't invalidate said facts. You don't have to assume eye contact occured because the only other rinnegan genjutsu doesn't require it and we have several examples of doujutsu genjutsu not requiring it as stated in the OP.

Because it shows something you don't like, it's also just "plot." Incredible.

 

[King Of Pop]

Didn't stop shin or any of his clones and sure as heck didn't stop Naruto at vote 2 so claiming that he can absolutely solo anybody relevant with a glance is an outright lie.

the insecurity of some of you fanboys has a tendency of rearing its ugly head. op never even mentioned anything about soloing anyone or a vs scenario, the thread is simply addressing exactly how sasuke placed genjutsu on the bijjus. learn how to read before getting all defensive

 

[SharinganProdigy]

In Sasukebase we had a discussion on this :-

Me :

Spoiler

This is a thread based on an explanation to the event in which Sasuke one-shotted the Bijuus.

You must be registered for see links

Note : This thread needs manga panels as evidence, so I would appreciate if you guys can collect it for me. I have slow net. MP means Manga Panel.

First off, we know that the Bijuus were in a complete circle when summoned by Hagoromo.

MP: Showing Bijuus in circle.

Now, we know that Sasuke didn't spin like a Ballerina to bring every bijuu in his Vision Range and put them in Genjutsu.

MP: Sasuke standing in same spot, didn't move an inch after Rinne Genjutsu.

On Top of that Hagoromo said Sasuke did it with just a glance, so complete eye contact didn't happen.

MP: Insert Hagoromo Statement panel.

So, how did all the Bijuus fall under Rinne Genjutsu ?

Explanation - 1 : Bijuu Mind Link

We know that all the Bijuus have a mental link to Naruto. They are separate mental entities with a connection.

MP : Hagoromo's statements of Kuruma being a mental link between Naruto and Bijuus.

MP: Bijuus co-operating with Naruto mentally throughout Madara - Kaguya - Sasuke (Only Kuruma) Fights.

We can assume that if one bijuu falls under Rinne Genjustu, the Genjutsu spreads through the mental link and puts all the Bijuus in Genjutsu.

But, this also makes Naruto fall under Rinne genjutsu because of his mental link to the Bijuus.

The only reason Naruto didn't fall under Rinne Genjutsu was because Sasuke wanted to fight him.

MP: Insert Panels showing Sasuke's resolve to fight Naruto.

If a bijuu falls under Rinne Genjustsu, there is no one to break Naruto out of said Genjutsu thus the "Perfect Jin Immune to Genjutsu" statement is invalid.

Explanation - 2 : Izanami Workings :-

We know that Izanami is a genjutsu that works on all senses rather than only vision.

MP: Put panels of Itachi saying this after putting Kabuto in Izanami.

Rinne Genjutsu perhaps works on the same principle as it didn't require eye contact. ^See Above.

This makes Rinne Genjutsu extremely OP as it's instant (Supported By Hagoromo) and requires no long term preparations like Izanami.

MP: Find panels showing Itachi saying that Izanami takes time to set up.

This also would explain Rinne Genjutsu/Mugen Tsukuyomi working on Blind people; it works on senses, not on Vision.

Sasuke has a watered down Mugen Tsukuyomi. Why you may say ?

Well, if Sasuke can block Mugen Tsukuyomi, why can't he cast it ? All that he would need will be the moon to act as an eye to put everyone in the illusion. Sasuke can easily create a Moon by using Chibaku Tensei.

MP: Panels of Black Zetsu saying Sasuke can block Mugen Tsukuyomi.

Michael :

Spoiler

Sasuke genjutsu'd the bijuu externally, Naruto still had half kurama within. Try Again

Me :

Spoiler

Basically it means that Yin Kuruma was inside Naruto and not in the external environment. This would mean that the Bijuus inside Naruto will be immune to Rinne Genjutsu. This means the mind link theory breaks down cause if the minds were connected then even Yin Kuruma should fall under Rinne Genjutsu also cause Sasuke only intended to not hit Naruto.

A counter explanation would be that Sasuke didn't consider Yin Kuruma within Naruto at all. This makes sense cause Sasuke did not see Yin Kuruma getting transferred to Naruto by Obito.

The first argument is shaky, so I would go with the second argument.

So you agree with the OP that it does not require eye contact?

 

[SharinganProdigy]

the insecurity of some of you fanboys has a tendency of rearing its ugly head. op never even mentioned anything about soloing anyone or a vs scenario, the thread is simply addressing exactly how sasuke placed genjutsu on the bijjus. learn how to read before getting all defensive

Thanks. It's a bit ridiculous how insecure some people on this site are. I am not saying anyone would "solo" anyone else. I just want to tell people what I think happened in the manga and that some others' attempts at downplaying that feat are faulty at best.

 

[SharinganProdigy]

He can solo all kage with sharingan genjutsu dont lie to yourself.

You are part of what gives Sasuke fans a hard time. I love Naruto and Sasuke as they are both my top favorite but holy crap, certain people on this site say some ridiculous things to defend their fav or just bait a fight like you're doing right now. You shouldn't do this, man. That's how you start a flame war in an unrelated thread.

 

[DHOH]

So let me get this straight. Everything that goes along with what I said is deemed as an "exception" because you say so? Is that a joke? Manga fact: there are doujutsu genjutus that an be used without eye contact. Whatever you want to call it doesn't invalidate said facts. You don't have to assume eye contact occured because the only other rinnegan genjutsu doesn't require it and we have examples of doujutsu genjutsu not requiring it. Because it shows something you don't like, it's also just "plot." Incredible.

Don't worry you'll get that a lot when attempting to give Sasuke actual credit for his feats.

 

[Tantalus Thief]

OP: Who knows in the end. In the Deidara fight, Sasuke placed him in genjutsu when it should've been very unlikely. Same thing against C(Raikage's guard). I reckon Naruto can break out of the genjutsu due to being a perfect jinchuuriki.

 

[BlackBison]

Spoiler

Every time I see this topic being brought up, I see some seriously bad arguments trying to dismiss this statement. I believe that Sasuke can use his rinnegan to perform genjutsu without requiring eye contact. This belief comes from him casting genjutsu on all of the bijuu while they are positioned in a circle all around him.

Hagoromo says he did this "with a single glance." People use this line to say that eye contact must be required then. How does that make any sense? I believe this argument comes from a severe misunderstanding of what "eye-contact" means. Eye contact is "the act of looking directly into another's eyes"/"a meeting of the eyes of two persons." That means that Hagoromo saying he did it with a glance ("to look quickly or briefly") does not in any way imply that Sasuke somehow looked into a bijuu's eyes as that bijuu happened to look back into his eyes at that exact moment and then did this eight more times. That's ridiculous. Glance =/= eye contact.

People also suggest that Sasuke spun around somehow making this eye contact because he spun in his fight with Kabuto to use a surrounding amaterasu defense. Notice how Kishimoto drew and made it clear that Sasuke spun around in that panel but that was never shown or made clear in the bijuu panel...? You cannot claim that he did that same thing against the bijuu but argue Kishimoto just forgot to draw that hugely important detail. Those that argue that he spun around and somehow got lucky enough to meet every single one of the bijuus' eyes have the burden of proof on them because they are arguing something that was never shown. Because there is no proof to prove said argument, you may as well drop it. You're essentially saying "Sasuke spun around while looking into each bijuu's eyes. He then got lucky enough for every single bijuu to also be looking directly into Sasuke's eyes at the same exact point he looked into theirs! Oh, also Kishimoto completely forgot to draw every bit of this ever happening. Whoops!"

"But Sasuke is using a sharingan genjutsu so he totally MUST require eye contact!"

Shisui's kotoamatsukami is also a genjutsu ability of the mangekyou sharingan yet it does not require eye contact. So is izanami and izanagi. Sasuke himself has had some questionable genjutsu uses where he shouldn't have been able to hit someone with genjutsu via eye contact (Against Deidara and against Cee). Infinite tsukuyomi is a "rinnegan genjutsu" that does not require eye contact. It's similar in the way that it's an AoE (area of effect) ability where it affects those touched by its light. Amenotejikara, Sasuke's teleportation ability, does not require him to view the area he wants to teleport to in order to shift himself there. With all of this evidence, why are people still arguing that it must need eye contact because it's from a doujutsu?

Another notable use (that I won't argue in this thread for) is when he used genjutsu on Sakura with his back to her. Her head is down and her eyes are closed but let me guess: "Through his peripheral vision, Sasuke totally makes eye contact with Sakura off-panel!" This example is less strong that the bijuu panel and more "iffy" but I do think it is worth a mention.

"Well, if he's so good, why didn't he use it against Naruto?!!!"

He most likely believed it wouldn't help against Naruto. He kind of learned a hard lesson when he tried MS genjutsu on Bee. We'll never know if it would have helped or not as he never did try it on Naruto.

Sidenote: It would be of great help if someone could tell me how to post image links in my threads/posts without it holding my response for mod review so that I can post manga scans in my thread. Thanks.

If I remember correctly sasuke said something on the lines of I'm gona destroy all 9 tailed beast, which got the attention of every tailbeast. This caused every tailed beast to look at sasuke. Now when you look at someone in anger more than likely you are gona look them in the eye and at that moment sasuke put all 9 of'em in a genjustu which is a feat that no other person has done.

 

[SharinganProdigy]

If I remember correctly sasuke said something on the lines of I'm gona destroy all 9 tailed beast, which got the attention of every tailbeast. This caused every tailed beast to look at sasuke. Now when you look at someone in anger more than likely you are gona look them in the eye and at that moment sasuke put all 9 of'em in a genjustu which is a feat that no other person has done.

So you are arguing that "Sasuke spun around while looking into each bijuu's eyes. He then got lucky enough for every single bijuu to also be looking directly into Sasuke's eyes at the same exact point he looked into theirs! Oh, also Kishimoto completely forgot to draw every bit of this ever happening. Whoops!"

So something not shown in the manga happened? There are bijuu behind Sasuke so what you're saying is he turned to them and every single one happened to look in his eye while he looked into theirs...all with zero evidence.