Sasori (PawsX) VS Darui (Ser Jamie Lannister)

LuckyMan

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Darui will win the fight mainly with his speed and precision techniques. Sasoris tricks and weapons won't do well against a full fledged shinobi such as Darui when he was pushed to his limits by an ailing old woman and early part 2 Sakura. I believe Darui can trump him because he has long range techniques to defend against Sasoris own long range attacks and he uses Raiton, the element that pierces through and breaks shit up! Naw mean?!


Hiruko

Mostly a defensive puppet with a hard shell on its back. Chiyo states , something like Sakura's punch. We dont know much of anything about Black Lightning so we cant say it breaks the shell, storm release has a good chance of doing a lot of damage maybe even breaking it if Darui uses a lot of beams.

Sasori cant defeat Darui with Hiruko but he can use it to test out Darui's speed and reactions by and .
Sasori testing Darui in Hiroku is the surest way he'll lose. Chiyo never implied something as strong as Sakuras punch is needed to break through Hiruokus shell, she only said doesn't have the destructive force needed. Its impossible for Chiyo to have meant Sakuras punch was necessary when she she never saw it with the shell on its back so she never knew the amount of damage it could sustain to begin with. She went with the most destructive blow they had and it was enough but that doesn't mean Darui can't break through Hiroku with his physical power. He won't be needing physical power in that situation anyway because will destroy Hiroku and kill Sasori.

That there is over two dozen precision lasers that will wreck Sasoris shit up! Darui can increase the number of lasers at will and that can be doubled, tripled, or quadrupled! For an example of how extreme the precision Laser Circus is take ! Gin is holding Samui in a choke hold, they are literally squished up against one another yet Darui without so much ass tickling Samui. The red arrows are indicators of all the tight openings the lasers went through. Openings like will get Sasoris ass smoked! Lasers will implode him from inside Hiruko easily.

Him testing Darui in Hiroku will result in getting a mouth full of deez nuts because when he opens up to attack it makes a to kill him in one shot, they are too fast for him to dodge, too strong for him to tank, and penetrate that opening and or the others dozen after dozen imploding and killing him. I imagine something like this when the lasers get inside

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Sasori in Hiroku loses easily. In-fact, if Sasori does not immediately pull out his real self he loses to Darui low-mid difficulty for reasons explained above.


Third Kazekage
Through his human Puppet of the Third Kazekage Sasori is able to use the magnet release to control Iron Sand.

Flight

Sasori makes and he can multitask with the sand making . Now there is no reason Sasori cant make a smaller construct for himself to stand on in the air as he attacks below, he doesnt weigh much as a puppet. So not only was it hard to land an attack on Sasori before but if he is now in the air as well its almost impossible.
Its not hard for Darui to land an attack on Sasori at all! Sasori is not fast enough to dodge Laser Circus on foot. None of his puppets are fast enough to evade and even if he shields himself with a puppet, he gets the Gin treatment and they bend around it and nail him in his core, killing him. Sasori floating in the air won't help him at all bro, nah, not when Laser Circus has a range of at least 120 meters! That the least I'll say but anyone can look at this distance and tell its way farther than 120 meters but lets keep it simple and say 120 since more than that won't really matter!

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So as you see the range of Laser Circus is ridiculous. Darui will have no problem landing his blasts at all and Laser Circus is a sure hit! They're Guided! Flow and bend like Water! Fast! Explosive! Numerous! Powerful! Blinding! Okay, I ran out of stuff to say about it but point is its a great attack for someone like Sasori and its too much for him to deal with.



Iron Sand Attacks/Constructs​

Sasori compresses to make , he then fires them at Darui. Darui can side however Sasori can leave the sand in the ground, then fire again to where Darui moved so he is pushed back to where he originally was then bring the sand from the . Sasori can pretty much mark the whole place with sand bullets leaving Darui no where to go as they would be able to shoot up from anywhere.
The problem with this premise is that is where the fight takes place and there is ample room for Darui to move around. They aren't in an enclosed cave like Sakura and Chiyo were and Sasori only has so much at his disposal. With all this water around him Darui can spend less chakra and make larger to stop the bullets. He can't cover this entire area with its AoE and it won't be long before Darui his attack and even Sakura without Chiyos aid anymore was evading Iron Sand and counter attacking so this will be no problem for Darui.


World Method

Sasori brings the sand together and then in the form of spiked branches, as Sakura states it . There is no escape from this attack as it will appear behind you, under you breaking from the ground. Sakura many times and all over the place. Even if he somehow manages to not get scratched at all he still has absolutely no place to go since he is boxed in at every point, this leaves him wide open for Sasori to finish him off from the outside.
Iron Sand can't under Darui because all of the sand are in the two obejcts above him, not underwater/ground so he doesn't need to worry about attacks from below. Correct, Sakura was cut several times by this attack but this is someone who is much faster than Sakura then. Daruis speed is slightly below that of V1 Ay's. The manga showed he Ays blitz on Sasuke but the anime gave us a clearer representation of what happened and it was Ay who got there first.

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Still though, being close to V1 Ays level of speed is more than enough to evade Iron Sand, the bullets, the spears, and the 3D objects, all are evaded by Darui.

He also has no defense against this technique, his cleaver is useless, suiton cant help stop this as the Iron sand cuts right through the water as it easily did the earth. Black Lightning hasnt shown the force to stop a technique of this level or something as strong as compressed iron and Storm release is not strong enough unless aimed in the same place but we know World method goes everywhere.
Actually, Daruis best defense for this technique is his offense. When the Third Kazekage comes out Darui will know its the source of the Iron Sand and he has a couple ways to deal with it. Hes fast enough to evade but lets say push really comes to shove. can shield Daruis body from being cut. When this move is used his body first becomes shrouded in Raiton as the image you posted in the OP shows! The he then pushes the Raiton off to attack but this is a great way to prevent himself from getting cut. The other method for defending against World Order is using mass scale Laser Circus but not to target the sand! Darui will launch it at Sasori and the Third Kazekage! This gives Sasori an ultimatum. When World order begins, it quickly branches out but when it gets like its the perfect opportunity to use Laser Circus and destroy the puppet! All the lasers will bend around the sand and blow the source up, making it .

You might ask yourself well why won't Sasori just move Third Kazekage, well, Laser Circus is guided and too fast. Even if Sasori moves his puppet out of the way they bend past it and nail him in the core. Now Sasori has an ultimatum, either he stops World Order and covers him and Third Kazekage in a shield to defend or he or the puppet gets toasted and even if he does defend, mass scale Laser Circus will still most likely pierce through and kill him, more on why that could happen later!


100 Puppets

and attached with threads coming from a cavity in Sasori's body. Sasori does not use his fingers to control them, he can freely move them . Now Chiyo had 10 puppets helping her fend off the 100 and , Darui can take out a couple with Raton but more will come and there is no way he can go without getting no scratches all by himself.
Well its Chiyo who got cut and she was a tired old woman......

Sakura easily evaded the strikes of at least 10 at once . Those puppets aren't humans with minds of their own. They rush in with simple straightforward attacks like Zetsus, aren't fast at all like Zetsus, and easily destroyed, like Zetsus! Darui can do what Sakura did even better and if necessary he can put up a huge Water Wall and combine Inspiration Wave with it destroying many of them. Black Panther runs through and destroys many. Laser Circus is the best move for them as there is possibly no limit to what Darui can shoot as long as he has chakra. In his fight with Gin+Kin bros he was multitasking on

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Without getting touched and he only did get hit when he had to save Samuis life and he didn't know Edos regenerated so fast after he cut Kinkakus arm off! Had he not been baby sitting Atsui and Samui, Gin+Kin would never have touched him, infact, after that point they couldn't hit him at all and he ran circles around their asses! So yeah, Darui has many ways to defeat the 100 puppets and he'll most likely have his sword too since if they come out, the Third Kazekage is already destroyed.



Darui's Ninjustu

Suiton

Darui is shown shooting the water at the , Sasori's puppets stay , Sasori simply needs to to keep the puppets higher in the air to avoid his suiton and raiton combination. Darui definitely does not have the range to reach Sasori with his suiton.

Now there is a water source in this location however Darui still needs to get to it but they start on this giant Plateau[ ]-[ ] Sasori knowing Darui uses suitons wont let him reach this water source by continuing to attack him so he focuses on Sasori, Darui cant take any chances to not dodge one of Sasori's attack because of the poison that he knows about. If Darui somehow manages to get to the water source then Sasori simply stays in the air launching attacks below as Darui had a water source and hardly used it even against a so his suiton wont get that big of a boost.
Sasori has no real way of dealing with Daruis speed. If he starts in Hiroku Darui simply shunshins to the lake and there is nothing he can do about it. He'll need to leave Hiroku to actually try to win the fight but Darui isn't wasting time and giving him the upper hand and by the time he gets out and opens the scroll for the puppet Darui is already on the water. Simple. Already addressed, Sasori in the air means nothing because Suitons will be scaled up for Darui and Laser Circus range is more than enough.

Kinkaku was at point blank range in Daruis face and threw a large scale Katon at him that required no seals so it was fast, and at the time he had just leanred of the Banana Fans capability. He just didn't use Suiton in the fight and thats that but that doesn't mean if he were to use a Suiton it wouldn't be scaled up because they will.

Storm Release/Black Lightning

None of these attacks will ever reach Sasori because he will have layers of defense that it needs to get through before it reaches him. He can use in front of him, if he has them out, if he is using himself, hand summons if 3rd[ ]-[ ] as you can see it creates a wall of arms and Hiruko or if using Hiruko. Darui will need to go through all of those defenses to finally reach Sasori with one of his attacks.
Addressed pretty much everything here except the Flame Throwers, that fire isn't stopping Laser Circus since one of the components of Laser Circus is water therefore it will plow through the fire or simply bend around it. Iron Sand will only be a useful defense unless he covers himself in a sphere like Gaara does because if not, again, precision ninjutsu my friend, flows around and kills him. Even with sphere around him, enough laser circus will pierce through the sphere and kill Sasori since one of the components for it is Doton, which is weak to Raiton.




Darui's Kenjustu/Close Combat

The third Kazekage puppet is shown to have with weapons on . Darui will need to focus on the third's attack so he wont be able to see Sasori's finger movements so he cant predict the attack patterns, one scratch and he is done. Sasori's fingers moved extremely fast and many moves were done in a short amount of time, Darui's kenjustu has never shown to match something that speed.
If the Kazekage rushes him he locks it in a Water Wall like he did Sasuke and and destroys it with Black Panther. CQC is the worst strategy to use for the Kazekage, his weapons mean jack shit if its arms get cut off with and plus the puppet has no technique. This is Darui, who bested Suigestu (master swordsman) and and Kinkaku and Ginkaku easily in CQC and they were highly proficient with weapons in CQC, better than the Kazekage Puppet I would say.

At any given moment while in close combat this strategy can by used [ ]-[ ]-[ ]-[ ]. Trapping Darui with the arms, if he gets out then releasing the poison gas and tying him, Sakura was not able to react to the arms, and Chiyo was not able to react to the second trap.
Chiyos Mother and Father puppets ripped through those arms like paper with wire. Darui coats his sword with Raiton and severs them all off on one swing no difficulty. Black Panther shields him and toasts all of them too. This combo is not difficult for him to counter at all. Again, Sakura was unable to react, this is someone who is tiers above her in everything dealing with speed.

Darui's cleaver will be since the magnetic force would just draw it to the iron sand and Sasori can then destroy the weapon by crushing it with the iron sand and adding the leftover metal to the rest of the sand. Sasori has shown with his iron sand when . There is no way these shapes could keep their form after a punch from Sakura[ ]-[ ] if they were not compressed strongly together, its the same as when to make it harder. Sasori bonds the sand together by magnetizing it, the cleaver is destroyed when the iron bonds around it, crushing it.
Agreed. When the Third Kazekage comes out it becomes a long range battle so the sword won't really be useful at all but my premise for him dealing with the Third and the 100 puppets was without his sword anyway. He can take him out with or without his weapons but since the Third will get destroyed swiftly, he'll most likey have his weapons when it comes to the 100 puppet phase.

Whew! Took longer than expected because I was half way done then Windows did an automatic update and turned off laptop!!! Had to start all over and forgot a lot of what I said at first!!!!!!!
 
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LuckyMan

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Is invisible man even going to take this remotely serious?
I had to take it easy on this one. I was a bit rustled when I lost most of what I said at first when laptop rebooted and I needed to focus so I took a more easy going approach. My last post will be interesting and well written. I have a few more tricks up my sleeve too so stay tuned.
 

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Darui will win the fight mainly with his speed and precision techniques. Sasoris tricks and weapons won't do well against a full fledged shinobi such as Darui when he was pushed to his limits by an ailing old woman and early part 2 Sakura. I believe Darui can trump him because he has long range techniques to defend against Sasoris own long range attacks and he uses Raiton, the element that pierces through and breaks shit up! Naw mean?!
The old woman was also a puppet master who knew exactly how to fight Sasori and Sakura had prep to make antidotes, they would have been finished once IS came out without that. Darui has none of this.

Sasori testing Darui in Hiroku is the surest way he'll lose. Chiyo never implied something as strong as Sakuras punch is needed to break through Hiruokus shell, she only said doesn't have the destructive force needed. Its impossible for Chiyo to have meant Sakuras punch was necessary when she she never saw it with the shell on its back so she never knew the amount of damage it could sustain to begin with. She went with the most destructive blow they had and it was enough but that doesn't mean Darui can't break through Hiroku with his physical power. He won't be needing physical power in that situation anyway because will destroy Hiroku and kill Sasori.
Sakura's punch did this[ ]-[ ] but when she punched she kill Sasori with the blow meaning the shell can take a lot of force and even then still protects Sasori. Darui's fired lasers and all they did was push . Now yes if Darui uses a lot of lasers he can break the shell but he wont be killing Sasori as well.

Hiruko is meant as a defensive puppet, its not meant to hinder Sasori's ability and get him killed before he can do anything else. A lot people dont realize this and think he easily gets killed while in Hiruko but even Sakura's blow only destroyed the shell and not Sasori inside.

That there is over two dozen precision lasers that will wreck Sasoris shit up! Darui can increase the number of lasers at will and that can be doubled, tripled, or quadrupled! For an example of how extreme the precision Laser Circus is take ! Gin is holding Samui in a choke hold, they are literally squished up against one another yet Darui without so much ass tickling Samui. The red arrows are indicators of all the tight openings the lasers went through. Openings like will get Sasoris ass smoked! Lasers will implode him from inside Hiruko easily.

Him testing Darui in Hiroku will result in getting a mouth full of deez nuts because when he opens up to attack it makes a to kill him in one shot, they are too fast for him to dodge, too strong for him to tank, and penetrate that opening and or the others dozen after dozen imploding and killing him. I imagine something like this when the lasers get inside
You are forgetting that right there which will protect[ ]-[ ] against those precision lasers taking some of the lasers and lessening the attack.

Not to mention the explosion from destroying Hiruko can hide the shot right out last minute that will release to the side. Darui will still have the laser circus hale ring going which keeps and wont be able to dodge all the needles.

Its not hard for Darui to land an attack on Sasori at all! Sasori is not fast enough to dodge Laser Circus on foot. None of his puppets are fast enough to evade and even if he shields himself with a puppet, he gets the Gin treatment and they bend around it and nail him in his core, killing him. Sasori floating in the air won't help him at all bro, nah, not when Laser Circus has a range of at least 120 meters! That the least I'll say but anyone can look at this distance and tell its way farther than 120 meters but lets keep it simple and say 120 since more than that won't really matter!

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So as you see the range of Laser Circus is ridiculous. Darui will have no problem landing his blasts at all and Laser Circus is a sure hit! They're Guided! Flow and bend like Water! Fast! Explosive! Numerous! Powerful! Blinding! Okay, I ran out of stuff to say about it but point is its a great attack for someone like Sasori and its too much for him to deal with.
As I already explained before Sasori is able to multitask with the Iron sand, he wont just be floating in the air, he can move the iron sand construct keeping him in the air. He moved 14 iron sand constructs[ ]-[ ]-[ ] at a time and while the smaller spike constructs he shot before .

Its got range but as I explained up there they dont pack a lot of power at all having only pushed Ginkaku back and not actually damaging him much. I said thats its even harder to hit Sasori because he has so many layers of defense it has to go through before hitting him, iron sand being the toughest to get through nor has laser circus shown the power to get through iron sand.

Floating in the air helps completely evading his suiton and raiton combo and any CQC if he ever got to that.

The problem with this premise is that is where the fight takes place and there is ample room for Darui to move around. They aren't in an enclosed cave like Sakura and Chiyo were and Sasori only has so much at his disposal. With all this water around him Darui can spend less chakra and make larger to stop the bullets. He can't cover this entire area with its AoE and it won't be long before Darui his attack and even Sakura without Chiyos aid anymore was evading Iron Sand and counter attacking so this will be no problem for Darui.
They start though, as for only having so much iron sand to go around that is false. First the sand used to make was the same sand used to make these spikes[ ]-[ ] which are shown to still be in the same place when the two bigger constructs were made[ ][ ][ ] meaning Sasori brought out more sand, also the bullets are so he can easily cover the whole area leaving Darui no where to go.

This strategy has nothing to do with attack pattern as even if Darui sees through it he still has no safe place.

Iron Sand can't under Darui because all of the sand are in the two obejcts above him, not underwater/ground so he doesn't need to worry about attacks from below. Correct, Sakura was cut several times by this attack but this is someone who is much faster than Sakura then. Daruis speed is slightly below that of V1 Ay's. The manga showed he Ays blitz on Sasuke but the anime gave us a clearer representation of what happened and it was Ay who got there first.

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Still though, being close to V1 Ays level of speed is more than enough to evade Iron Sand, the bullets, the spears, and the 3D objects, all are evaded by Darui.
True, my mistake it only comes from above. But there is no dodging this technique no matter what speed feats Darui has, as Sakura states it goes and its already the area behind her since the spikes which leaves Darui no place to run even with his speed. With there is no way Darui doesnt get not one single scratch.

Actually, Daruis best defense for this technique is his offense. When the Third Kazekage comes out Darui will know its the source of the Iron Sand and he has a couple ways to deal with it. Hes fast enough to evade but lets say push really comes to shove. can shield Daruis body from being cut. When this move is used his body first becomes shrouded in Raiton as the image you posted in the OP shows! The he then pushes the Raiton off to attack but this is a great way to prevent himself from getting cut. The other method for defending against World Order is using mass scale Laser Circus but not to target the sand! Darui will launch it at Sasori and the Third Kazekage! This gives Sasori an ultimatum. When World order begins, it quickly branches out but when it gets like its the perfect opportunity to use Laser Circus and destroy the puppet! All the lasers will bend around the sand and blow the source up, making it .

You might ask yourself well why won't Sasori just move Third Kazekage, well, Laser Circus is guided and too fast. Even if Sasori moves his puppet out of the way they bend past it and nail him in the core. Now Sasori has an ultimatum, either he stops World Order and covers him and Third Kazekage in a shield to defend or he or the puppet gets toasted and even if he does defend, mass scale Laser Circus will still most likely pierce through and kill him, more on why that could happen later!
World method is from the two big constructs but as I explained above Sasori still has access to the sand spikes he shot before, those can be used to protect himself and the 3rd puppet by creating a shield.

Laser circus is slowed down big time because it needs to bend and twist around first before making its way to Sasori who will have the time to put up defenses.

If Darui uses Black Panther to shield himself then he is still trapped after and is completely vulnerable an attack from the 3rd or an Iron sand attack.

Well its Chiyo who got cut and she was a tired old woman......

Sakura easily evaded the strikes of at least 10 at once . Those puppets aren't humans with minds of their own. They rush in with simple straightforward attacks like Zetsus, aren't fast at all like Zetsus, and easily destroyed, like Zetsus! Darui can do what Sakura did even better and if necessary he can put up a huge Water Wall and combine Inspiration Wave with it destroying many of them. Black Panther runs through and destroys many. Laser Circus is the best move for them as there is possibly no limit to what Darui can shoot as long as he has chakra. In his fight with Gin+Kin bros he was multitasking on

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Without getting touched and he only did get hit when he had to save Samuis life and he didn't know Edos regenerated so fast after he cut Kinkakus arm off! Had he not been baby sitting Atsui and Samui, Gin+Kin would never have touched him, infact, after that point they couldn't hit him at all and he ran circles around their asses! So yeah, Darui has many ways to defeat the 100 puppets and he'll most likely have his sword too since if they come out, the Third Kazekage is already destroyed.
Yes Chiyo having 10 puppets helping her still got cut. Darui is by himself and wont have his sword because it would have been destroyed by the 3rd Magnet's release. Suiton + raiton combo is ineffective because the puppets float in the air which allows them to move much faster than zestu run on feet. He got hit because he was using laser circus and , same thing will happen here as he is firing at a bunch of puppets more will come from all sides, he simply gets overwhelmed.

Sasori has no real way of dealing with Daruis speed. If he starts in Hiroku Darui simply shunshins to the lake and there is nothing he can do about it. He'll need to leave Hiroku to actually try to win the fight but Darui isn't wasting time and giving him the upper hand and by the time he gets out and opens the scroll for the puppet Darui is already on the water. Simple. Already addressed, Sasori in the air means nothing because Suitons will be scaled up for Darui and Laser Circus range is more than enough.

Kinkaku was at point blank range in Daruis face and threw a large scale Katon at him that required no seals so it was fast, and at the time he had just leanred of the Banana Fans capability. He just didn't use Suiton in the fight and thats that but that doesn't mean if he were to use a Suiton it wouldn't be scaled up because they will.
First off Darui has no idea what Hiruko can do so again he wont risk trying to get to the water source when he knows about the poison. If he tries then Sasori just shoots needles in the direction he is running stopping him from moving forward, forcing him to fight. All he has is formation wall which simply creates a wall of water around himself, his suitons wont be reaching new heights especially not heights the puppets can go.

Now if some chance Darui reaches the the water source then Sasori uses the . The spear causing a big shock wave then it quickly turns horizontal and breaks through the cave, Darui has absolutely nothing to defend against that since it cut through the rock no water will stop it, he will need to dodge, wherever he does dodges to then the hammer and if he was quick enough then Sasori activates a smaller scale world method from the hammer block which will be near Darui, he doesnt need to fuse them to use it, all he needs is to .

Addressed pretty much everything here except the Flame Throwers, that fire isn't stopping Laser Circus since one of the components of Laser Circus is water therefore it will plow through the fire or simply bend around it. Iron Sand will only be a useful defense unless he covers himself in a sphere like Gaara does because if not, again, precision ninjutsu my friend, flows around and kills him. Even with sphere around him, enough laser circus will pierce through the sphere and kill Sasori since one of the components for it is Doton, which is weak to Raiton.
Magnet release uses doton and fuuton. Fuuton beats raiton.

If the Kazekage rushes him he locks it in a Water Wall like he did Sasuke and and destroys it with Black Panther. CQC is the worst strategy to use for the Kazekage, his weapons mean jack shit if its arms get cut off with and plus the puppet has no technique. This is Darui, who bested Suigestu (master swordsman) and and Kinkaku and Ginkaku easily in CQC and they were highly proficient with weapons in CQC, better than the Kazekage Puppet I would say.
Water wall wont be able to touch the 3rd for reasons already stated and Black Panther is defended against with the wall of arms. The 3rd will get into CQC with Darui who will need to draw his sword to match the 3rd's weapons, a puppet can make moves much faster than a human can as all it takes is for fingers to move which is where you get the shown. Now Darui will have more strength behind his kenjustu then a puppet with strings but the plan isnt to beat him in kenjustu but to set him up for the trap.

Chiyos Mother and Father puppets ripped through those arms like paper with wire. Darui coats his sword with Raiton and severs them all off on one swing no difficulty. Black Panther shields him and toasts all of them too. This combo is not difficult for him to counter at all. Again, Sakura was unable to react, this is someone who is tiers above her in everything dealing with speed.
Sakura did not react, and with the next trap Chiyo wasnt able to see it coming or react.

I dont think Sasori will need to use anything farther than the 3rd Kazekage, Iron Sand is simply too versatile for Darui's arsenal:

  • Suitons become useless due to flight/floating
  • Darui's cleaver is gone once IS comes out along with his kenjustu
  • And Darui cannot win this match with just Laser circus due to its lack of fire power

Nice debate man. Fun match. However your cropped panels were killer, wish you would have linked pages instead.
 
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Worm

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You better slay all of the boltons
And not screw up like you did at the black water

The kingslayer is a fodder now
They need to go. Like, I'd rather have ten God damn Jofferys instead of a single Ramsay.

No. Ramsay is only a dprick to Sansa and Reek.

Joffery was a dprick to everyone.

@Argus

Jaime ain't fodder, he'd still slay Ramsay's ass with his left hand.
Aye m8s! Lets list up all of Ramsay's accomplishments and wank so far, both book-wise and show-wise!

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- kills his own brother and gains the title of Roose's only heir
- takes over House Hornwood's lands by slaying the whole house and making their Lady marry him, then rapes her and locks her up in a tower where she starves to death after eating her own fingers
- is feared through the whole North and considered more black-hearted and cruel than Roose
- tricks Ser Rodrik Cassel into slaying Reek instead of him after he rapes and kills a peasant girl
- tricks Theon into accepting him as his most loyal Servant and comes up with the idea to shit on everyone by flaying and burning two boys and then saying it's Bran and Rickon
- kills Gelmarr, Aggar and Gynir, ironborn who knew the truth about the bodies
- marches into Ser Rodrik Cassel's forces, chops off Cassel's hand and slaughters Rodrik, Leobald Tallhart and Cley Cerwyn
- takes the corpses back to Theon, tricks him into trusting him and then knocks him out and slaughters most of Winterfell
- cuts off Theon's Little Theon and makes him bathe in shit
- Theon shits himself so much he doesn't have the courage to cut open Ramsay's throat during a close shave
- charges head first at a bunch of Ironborn wearing armor and shields while he himself has no shirt or anything, manages to slaughter and scare off most of them
- tricks Moat Cailin's Ironborn and takes over it after slaughtering them
- in the books, he rapes Jeyne Poole and forces Theon to watch
- in the show, he screws over Sansa and rapes her in front of Theon
- he smacks down Mance Rayder and locks him up butt-naked above Winterfell where he has only the flayed skin of women to keep him warm
- threatens Jon Snow
- threatens Stannis Baratheon and Theon tells Stannis he should watch himself because Ramsay will hurt him
- in the show, slaughters one of Stannis' camps which leads to Stannis burning his own daughter, Shireen Baratheon
- Roose and Theon agree that Ramsay is completely fearless

What a man. Is it really possible to be this GAR?

''Strip off their skin. A naked man has few secrets, but a flayed man's got none.''

Robett: The evil is in his blood. He is a bastard born of rape. A Snow, no matter what the boy king says.
Wyman: Was snow ever so black? Ramsay took Lord Hornwood's lands by forcibly wedding his widow, then locked her in a tower and forgot her. It is said she ate her own fingers in her extremity ... and the Lannister notion of king's justice is to reward her killer with Ned Stark's little girl.
Robett: The Boltons have always been as cruel as they are cunning, but this one seems a beast in human skin.


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The old woman was also a puppet master who knew exactly how to fight Sasori and Sakura had prep to make antidotes, they would have been finished once IS came out without that. Darui has none of this.
Agreed but

1. You don't need to know how to fight Sasori to beat him.
2. Yes, they as in Chiyo and Sakura would have been finished, but this is not them.
3. Correct, he has no antidotes nor is he a puppet master, but hes not as weak as Sakura and Chiyo.

Sakura's punch did this[ ]-[ ] but when she punched she kill Sasori with the blow meaning the shell can take a lot of force and even then still protects Sasori. Darui's fired lasers and all they did was push . Now yes if Darui uses a lot of lasers he can break the shell but he wont be killing Sasori as well.

Hiruko is meant as a defensive puppet, its not meant to hinder Sasori's ability and get him killed before he can do anything else. A lot people dont realize this and think he easily gets killed while in Hiruko but even Sakura's blow only destroyed the shell and not Sasori inside.
Its not that Laser Circus didn't damage Ginkaku, its that Darui didn't make them explode because Samui would have been caught in the explosion and possibly killed. We know he can make them explode:




So why didn't they explode? Simple, as stated above, Darui was protecting Samui. Even when the lasers didn't explode, they still pierced Ginkakus skin and did damage to him because the same edo flakes in the air from when Darui chopped off Kinkakus arm are floating over Ginkaku and around him after Laser Circus pushed him back. They were on water so no, this wasn't dust or dirt from the ground.



You are forgetting that right there which will protect[ ]-[ ] against those precision lasers taking some of the lasers and lessening the attack.

Not to mention the explosion from destroying Hiruko can hide the shot right out last minute that will release to the side. Darui will still have the laser circus hale ring going which keeps and wont be able to dodge all the needles.
Hirokus tail isn't deflecting lasers because the lasers had enough force to push Kinkaku back, something a shuriken, or even 10 shuriken (since Darui hit him with 10 lasers) still wouldn't be able to do so the force behind the lasers are >>>> the force behind shuriken thrown and we'd be talking about several dozen lasers, not 10. Besides, these things bend and flow like water and are much faster than shuriken so the odds of Hiroku deflecting or lessening them with his tail is slim to none.

As I already explained before Sasori is able to multitask with the Iron sand, he wont just be floating in the air, he can move the iron sand construct keeping him in the air. He moved 14 iron sand constructs[ ]-[ ]-[ ] at a time and while the smaller spike constructs he shot before .
Correct, they kept their form but they didn't move. Now ask yourself, why would he shoot the spikes and leave them in front of them and let them walk past without re-magnetizing it to impale them after he just shot the bullets and missed, but reformed them to attack again with the spears?




After he shot the bullets, he raised the iron sand from the ground and reformed it into spears. After he shot the spears he formed 2 giant constructs but didn't re-magnetize the spears and reform them again. That there proves there is a limit to what the puppet can control and we never seen it control more than that at once again. The spears didn't move at all while he was forming those constructs so no, he cant multitask on manipulating 14 constructs while also forming/attacking with the giant ones.

Its got range but as I explained up there they dont pack a lot of power at all having only pushed Ginkaku back and not actually damaging him much. I said thats its even harder to hit Sasori because he has so many layers of defense it has to go through before hitting him, iron sand being the toughest to get through nor has laser circus shown the power to get through iron sand.

Floating in the air helps completely evading his suiton and raiton combo and any CQC if he ever got to that.
Already addressed above that there were edo flakes coming off of Ginkaku after he was hit with Laser Circus despite them barely exploding and that was just 10 of them. When he attacked Ginkaku with mass Laser Circus he didn't resurface until the end of the chapter.



Now what was Ginkaku doing all that time? He was reforming back after the Laser Circus blew him up. 10 lasers pierced him, barely exploding so if more than 2 dozen that actually did explode hit him he would at the very least lose a couple of limbs. Darui can increase the amount of lasers and shoot them continuously as long as he has chakra too. How do I know this?




Shukaku tells them to coordinate with the medical team and that the attack on Obito must last longer than 5 minutes. Next panel we see Sakura on Daruis back pumping him with chakra while he shoots Laser Circus. This is the exact same thing she did with Obito that let him continuously use Kamui, which means she was going to pump Darui with chakra and let him shoot Laser Circus which means as long as he has chakra he can use it continuously.

Now you might say, "well Darui doesn't have much chakra". Wrong! Darui (even though not this Darui) is the Fifth Raikage and we know all the Raikages have enormous chakra levels. However, even in his young war arc state, his chakra was probably the greatest of all his fellow commanders (Gaara, Kakashi, Kitsuchi, Mifune). How do I know this?



So right off the bat we know from this Darui is not some jonin with "average" chakra levels. Someone like Ten-Ten with average chakra collapsed and nearly died after using the Banna Fan to destroy one of Kakuzus hearts.




Darui used 3 (Seven Star Sword, Crimson Gourd, Amber Pot) out of the 5 tools along with other jutsu he used but to really put emphasis on how high his chakra levels are, he was confident he could use them again if he had the Rope of Clarity.



Shinobi know how much chakra they have left to fight with and if Darui was confident he could use the tools all over again he has a enormous chakra levels but don't take my word for it, even Databook 4 says:

.

So without the Sage Tools hindering him, I have no doubt Darui can continuously shoot his move at Sasori and even if he doesn't continuously shoot them, he can just triple the number he used on Ginkaku in one shot from over 2 dozen to 7 dozen lasers and no shell is tanking it and Sasori isn't surviving something of that level in Hiroku. Also he can use Laser Circus on the run or in motion through the air.

On the Run:
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In the Air:
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Notes: Look at the sheer speed at which he executed it on the run. Hes carrying three large weapons, he throws his own sword at Ginkaku and right when its deflected mass laser cricus is raining down on him before he can even react to get up. Note that he had Seven Star Sword in his right hand and Amber Pot in his left, he had to drop both weapons to use Laser Circus then pick them back up but it was so fast we didn't even see it happen.

Darui can jump in the air to evade Sasori and blast him with so many lasers he'll be overwhelmed almost instantly. If he has to dodge ongoing attacks like Iron Sand, he can use it on the run to evade and attack simultaneously so he has a way to always be on the move while shooting a move that Sasori can't dodge and will bend around all of his puppets and defenses along with having the range to go anywhere he runs to hammer him.

They start though, as for only having so much iron sand to go around that is false. First the sand used to make was the same sand used to make these spikes[ ]-[ ] which are shown to still be in the same place when the two bigger constructs were made[ ][ ][ ] meaning Sasori brought out more sand, also the bullets are so he can easily cover the whole area leaving Darui no where to go.

This strategy has nothing to do with attack pattern as even if Darui sees through it he still has no safe place.
Already addressed. Its true Sasori did bring out more sand but he could only use what he just brought out which means he has a limit to what he can control at once. I'm not doubting Sasori can make more Iron Sand because the manga has showed that he could already but the manga also showed he (the Puppet) has a limit to what he can control at once so making more sand he can't control is a waste of chakra and time for him since it'll just be sand laying around like those spears were.

If the bullets were microscopic Chiyo and Sakura wouldn't have been able to see and dodge them without some sort of dojutsu so I know thats false. It doesn't really matter where they start because the lake is right below them and Darui has the advantage there with his Raiton so if push comes to shove (which will only come if Third Kazekage comes out) Darui can leap below where his Raiton will have greater range of effect.

True, my mistake it only comes from above. But there is no dodging this technique no matter what speed feats Darui has, as Sakura states it goes and its already the area behind her since the spikes which leaves Darui no place to run even with his speed. With there is no way Darui doesnt get not one single scratch.
Sakuras statement doesn't mean Darui will get hit. Her statement is just what it is, a statement. With that logic thats basically saying everyone in that same situation will get scratched by Iron Sand because "it goes everywhere" and thats not true. Anyone who is fast enough can evade it and the idea that someone will sit around like Sakura (who didn't even attempt to dodge) and let themselves get hit is foolish. Darui outran V2 Kinkaku who not only was colossal in size but so was the size and range of his attacks yet Darui evaded them all no difficulty while carrying two large weapons and despite Kinkaku getting the tremendous speed boost V2 Jins receive.




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You can see, his tails were huge in width, depth, and length and extended from the sea to the shore cliffs where Choza stopped it. That distance is much more than the range of World Order.



So the way Darui repeatedly evaded Kinkakus tails I don't see how World Order will get him. He runs back from its range while firing Laser Circus to bend around and hit the puppet to destroy it.

World method is from the two big constructs but as I explained above Sasori still has access to the sand spikes he shot before, those can be used to protect himself and the 3rd puppet by creating a shield.
Except he can't use all that at once. He can cut the World Order short to defend or use it fully and be open for attack. Addressed this several times I think now about the limit to his Iron Sand.

Laser circus is slowed down big time because it needs to bend and twist around first before making its way to Sasori who will have the time to put up defenses.

If Darui uses Black Panther to shield himself then he is still trapped after and is completely vulnerable an attack from the 3rd or an Iron sand attack.
It wouldn't be slowed down big time since most of the space between World Order is open for the lasers to travel smoothly and even with a defense, too many lasers will still pierce it. The lasers already had to bend around Samui and Ginkaku still called them fast but nonetheless their numbers will make up for it easily.

Actually no, Darui can control the Black Panther and can have it attack multiple enemies. Here is the Databook 4 translation.

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万雷集い吶喊す漆黒の雷豹!! Thunderous battlecry of the pitchblack thunder leopard !!
体から放出する無数の雷を結集し、黒き豹を創出。耳をつんざく咆哮の如き雷鳴を響かせ、敵めがけ次々と襲いかかる。暇無き連撃は、瞬く間に的集団を殲滅。その速さたるや、まさに電光石火。。。!!

THE black leopard, a creation made of thousands of thunders expelled from the body. Its rumbling like deafening roar shakes the earth and it charges at the enemy, attacks one after another. The enemy herd will be annihilated within a second by its continuous non-stop attack. That speed, truly is as quick as lightening…!!

希少忍術ゆえ忍界広しと言えど、扱える者はダルイを含めた少数のみ。身動きさえ奪う漆黒の雷が、とらえし者に与える未来は「敗北」の二文字だ。。。!
Although the world of Ninja is said to be big, only a few with scarce ninjutsu can handle the thunder leopard (Includes Darui). What future holds for those whose paralysed by the pitch black thunder? One word…Defeat…!

水を媒介に雷を一気に拡散!!通電力を活かせば通常射程の何倍にも渡る広範囲の敵を一瞬で感電させられる。
Use water as the medium and diffuse the thunder all at once!! It can even electrocute enemies at a distance (wider than the normal range) in the blink of an eye when utilizes its electric conducting power.

Now you know that Black Panther is similar to Laser Circus in that it can be continuous and non stop to an extent so on release he can manipulate it and make it run through to Third Kazekage or his 100 puppets if they're out. It'll run through all of them while shrouding/defending Darui at the same time from attacks behind him, which a Raiton shroud is capable of, except Darui will have way more Raiton around him (see Black Panther pic) than one below to easily defend their little claw swipes and sword swings while cooking the ones that come in contact with it simultaneously.



Yes Chiyo having 10 puppets helping her still got cut. Darui is by himself and wont have his sword because it would have been destroyed by the 3rd Magnet's release. Suiton + raiton combo is ineffective because the puppets float in the air which allows them to move much faster than zestu run on feet. He got hit because he was using laser circus and , same thing will happen here as he is firing at a bunch of puppets more will come from all sides, he simply gets overwhelmed.
Black Panther man. Black Panther. Doesn't matter if they float, they'll get chased down. The 100 puppets have to come to Darui to attack him, them just floating means they're idle. All of them wield swords or some sword of scythe/blade so they need to come close to attack him and when they do he'll answer with a Water Wall to lock them in place like he did Sasuke then shoot Black Panther or channel Inspiration Wave into it to destroy them. All sides mean nothing, already addressed that with Black Panther.


First off Darui has no idea what Hiruko can do so again he wont risk trying to get to the water source when he knows about the poison. If he tries then Sasori just shoots needles in the direction he is running stopping him from moving forward, forcing him to fight. All he has is formation wall which simply creates a wall of water around himself, his suitons wont be reaching new heights especially not heights the puppets can go.

Now if some chance Darui reaches the the water source then Sasori uses the . The spear causing a big shock wave then it quickly turns horizontal and breaks through the cave, Darui has absolutely nothing to defend against that since it cut through the rock no water will stop it, he will need to dodge, wherever he does dodges to then the hammer and if he was quick enough then Sasori activates a smaller scale world method from the hammer block which will be near Darui, he doesnt need to fuse them to use it, all he needs is to .
No. Sakura evaded all that again, again, and again without even shunshin, just foot speed. No way are those constructs touching Darui but I do agree he'd have to evade but he can still use moves on the run.

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And no this was not Chiyo helping her, just Sakura with her own abilities.




Magnet release uses doton and fuuton. Fuuton beats raiton.
And this is where counterbalancing comes in. If enough chakra is put into the weaker of two natures, it will overpower the stronger. Enough lasers will pierce through Iron Sand defenses just like Katons with more chakra behind them will overpower a Suiton of the same level. Thats why I said Darui will really let it go (love that song from Frozen btw) on the Ranton because too many lasers or even a super charged Black Panther will break through an Iron Sand defense and he doesn't need to worry about chakra because he has big quantities of it. The chakra in Iron Sand is from Third Kazekage and that puppet doesn't have as much and cant use as much as Darui can at one time. Saosri merely controls the way it uses its chakra with his own chakra and Darui can hyper charge a strong Raiton (with more chakra than Iron Sand construct) to bust through it and kill the puppet.

Water wall wont be able to touch the 3rd for reasons already stated and Black Panther is defended against with the wall of arms. The 3rd will get into CQC with Darui who will need to draw his sword to match the 3rd's weapons, a puppet can make moves much faster than a human can as all it takes is for fingers to move which is where you get the shown. Now Darui will have more strength behind his kenjustu then a puppet with strings but the plan isnt to beat him in kenjustu but to set him up for the trap.
Black Panther can be manipulated to run around the arms of the puppet and destroy it. Still, as previously stated the Third engaging in CQC is a very bad idea because Darui can flow Raiton through his weapons and chop it to pieces. Darui formed several the hand seals and intercepted Sasukes blitz on Ay and the puppet isnt faster than Sasuke so Daruis hand speed will be enough to deal with it. He cut Kinkakus arm off while stationary when he tried to blitz him despite his guard being down at first.



Theres just no way Darui will have problems in CQC with this puppet when he can throw up Water Walls, shoot Raiton everywhere at any give time, and flow his weapons.


I dont think Sasori will need to use anything farther than the 3rd Kazekage, Iron Sand is simply too versatile for Darui's arsenal:

  • Suitons become useless due to flight/floating
  • Darui's cleaver is gone once IS comes out along with his kenjustu
  • And Darui cannot win this match with just Laser circus due to its lack of fire power
I disagree. The Third Kazekage has no real answer for Laser Circus or Black Panther, neither does Sasori himself. His only hope is to sphere himself in Iron Sand but a strong enough Raiton or Ranton that Darui is well capable of using will bust through and end it. I've shown how Iron Sand is easily evaded by someone tiers and tiers above Sakura and Chiyo in all things speed related and its range was just inside that crater on the cliff, which V2 Kinkakus tails easily reach beyond that, crushing all hope of Iron Sand catching him.

  • Laser Circus is too fast to evade and bends around defenses to nail his heart.
  • Black Panther acts as a offense and a defense while mowing down large crowds (puppets)
  • Speed is well above what Sasori is accustomed to and nothing in his arsenal will hit a speedster, Sakura is example.

Good shit bro. Now I can delete all these scans I saved. Struggle out here for a nicca with only 32GB of space. U_U
 
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Actually no, Darui can control the Black Panther and can have it attack multiple enemies. Here is the Databook 4 translation.

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万雷集い吶喊す漆黒の雷豹!! Thunderous battlecry of the pitchblack thunder leopard !!
体から放出する無数の雷を結集し、黒き豹を創出。耳をつんざく咆哮の如き雷鳴を響かせ、敵めがけ次々と襲いかかる。暇無き連撃は、瞬く間に的集団を殲滅。その速さたるや、まさに電光石火。。。!!

THE black leopard, a creation made of thousands of thunders expelled from the body. Its rumbling like deafening roar shakes the earth and it charges at the enemy, attacks one after another. The enemy herd will be annihilated within a second by its continuous non-stop attack. That speed, truly is as quick as lightening…!!

希少忍術ゆえ忍界広しと言えど、扱える者はダルイを含めた少数のみ。身動きさえ奪う漆黒の雷が、とらえし者に与える未来は「敗北」の二文字だ。。。!
Although the world of Ninja is said to be big, only a few with scarce ninjutsu can handle the thunder leopard (Includes Darui). What future holds for those whose paralysed by the pitch black thunder? One word…Defeat…!

水を媒介に雷を一気に拡散!!通電力を活かせば通常射程の何倍にも渡る広範囲の敵を一瞬で感電させられる。
Use water as the medium and diffuse the thunder all at once!! It can even electrocute enemies at a distance (wider than the normal range) in the blink of an eye when utilizes its electric conducting power.
So this is what you were getting translated? Damn, if only I had this for my Darui analysis thread. Good stuff.

Is it possible for you to get a hold of other 4th Databook scans and have them translated? If so, can you have Mei's entry translated? It'd be much appreciated. I also would appreciate it if you had the entries for Kitsuchi/Kurotsuchi's Earth Release techniques and Kurotsuchi's quicklime congealing tech translated. :cool:

Anyways, I'm just going to get straight to the point and judge this. It was a nice debate to read. Thank you both for your participation. Note that I'm posting my verdict solely based on the points that you two brought up.

As a final note, I'm not going to be entertaining any further argument/discussion after I've posted my ruling. If you have a problem with the verdict, please take it up with the tourney leaders and the other judges. If you don't have a problem with the verdict and just want to point some things out like IKratos did with Icelerate, well sorry to say but then it's kind of a waste of my time and your time. That's just how it is. Forgive me if I come off as too uptight but it is equally annoying trying to deal with this kind of stuff after a debate has been judged, especially when it doesn't have anything to do with the final verdict and it is not being questioned.


PawsX - 1st Post

You established that Hiruko will mainly be used to test Darui and observe his fighting style through the use of the former's weapons. You also pointed out that Hiruko's defensive features such as its shell and tail may allow him to withstand Black Panther due to the technique's lack of feats but conceded that a large version of Laser Circus may be enough to destroy the puppet. You used Chiyo's statement as backup for this claim given the fact that EP2 Sakura's punch is very strong.

InvisibleMan - 1st Post

You countered Paws' usage of the Chiyo statement by establishing that she merely meant that she didn't have the DC necessary to break through Hiruko, not that only Sakura had the DC to destroy the puppet but Paws already admitted that Laser Circus used on a large scale can destroy Hiruko. You then made a good point regarding Darui's ability to curve the lasers into the openings that Hiruko has. The attack's traveling speed was touched on when you outlined Ginkaku's statement and the fact that Sasori inside Hiruko may not be able to react. You also said that Sasori staying inside Hiruko for a prolonged period of time is going to put him in danger which is a valid statement given the fact that Hiruko is Sasori's weakest puppet in terms of offense and doesn't allot him much mobility. You finally touched on Darui's speed which is too much for Sasori to handle inside Hiruko.

PawsX - 2nd Post

Paws pointed out that Hiruko's main function is to absorb any attack damage directed right at Sasori so it doesn't matter if the puppet is destroyed if the latter is left alive as it means that Hiruko will have ended up accomplishing what he was made for. He backed this up by showing Sasori ejecting himself out of a destroyed Hiruko unaffected after the puppet was punched by someone as strong as EP2 Sakura.

He showed that Darui's regular Laser Circus didn't inflict much damage on Ginkaku and only pushed him back. He then stated that more lasers can destroy the shell but its DC won't be enough to kill Sasori since the puppet will receive all of the damage. Hiruko's tail was pointed out as having the ability to slow down the attack and/or weaken the damage that would be inflicted on the puppet.

Paws pointed out that while Darui is firing off Laser Circus, Sasori can fire off the shrapnel senbon from Hiruko's arm missile and Darui won't be able to dodge since his vision will be obstructed by all the light and his arms will be occupied by firing off the attack.

InvisibleMan - 2nd Post

InvisibleMan pointed out that Darui has the ability to make Laser Circus explode and that he didn't make it explode when he used it to push Ginkaku back because Samui was close to the attack. He also pointed out that the lasers were still capable of piercing Ginkaku's body anyway.

InvisibleMan then touched on the fact that Laser Circus is a stronger projectile attack than any other that Hiruko has faced in the manga in all aspects including speed and momentum. He also reminded Paws that Hiruko can't really lessen the attack because Darui will bend the lasers around its tail.

Darui's ability to move while using Laser Circus was touched on which helps him avoid Hiruko's attacks while simultaneously attacking Hiruko.



Third Kazakage/Iron Sand
PawsX - 1st Post

Paws gave a brief outline of the 3rd's abilites. He pointed out that Sasori can fly on an IS block which'll make Darui's job in trying to reach and hit the former more difficult, specifically with his raiton/water wall combination. Sasori can also create IS shields and shapes to protect himself from Darui's attacks, such as Black Panther and Laser Circus. He also showed Sasori manipulating and maintaining multiple IS shapes.

In terms of offense, Paws had a decent strategy that had Sasori firing IS bullets to force Darui to dodge one way, then he'd release more IS from the puppet and force Darui into going back to where he originally dodged where more IS is present for Sasori to manipulate. Can't say that this will be all that effective in such a wide open area like Unraikyo but the main point is to spread IS and leave less room for Darui to operate in and make it harder for the latter to reach Sasori.

Another means of spreading IS all over the place and attacking Darui is Satetsu Kaihou, as Paws later said. This technique has a wide range and is very difficult to avoid, and getting caught inside leaves Darui open to get rushed by the 3rd Kazekage puppet if he doesn't get scratched which would be fatal.

In CQC with the 3rd, Paws pointed out that Darui can't see Sasori finger movements so it'd be difficult to defend himself from the puppet's fast sword slashes. Sasori can also release the Third's hands within a moments notice and try to grab and reel Darui in with ropes, then cover him in poison gas. Again, it'd be difficult to anticipate for Darui since he'd be incapable of tracking Sasori's finger movements while the former is preoccupied with the 3rd.

Finally, Paws stated that Darui's cleaver will be useless if Sasori can destroy it with IS.

InvisibleMan - 1st Post
InvisibleMan started off addressing the 3rd Kazekage by pointing out the range and speed of Laser Circus, meaning that Darui doesn't have to stay so close to Sasori to attack him since the former has a powerful, ranged projectile attack. Therefore, flight also isn't the large of a problem to bypass if Darui can hit him with the lasers, which again have plenty of range. He can bend the lasers around Sasori's IS constructs and whatever else the latter chooses to protect himself with, so only an IS sphere will be capable of adequately protecting Sasori.

InvisibleMan later pointed out that Unraikyo is a very large, very wide open space which gives Darui plenty of escape routes. He took note of the fact that Sasori has a limited amount of IS to work with, especially relative to the area since being in an enclosed space and fighting two far slower opponents made it easier for Sasori to utilise IS.

From a distance (since he's utilising ranged attacks to deal with IS), InvisibleMan said that Darui will be capable of looking at and memorizing Sasori's finger movements and attack patters. Consequently, and due to his speed, Darui will have an easier time predicting and evading Sasori's attacks such as Satetsu Kaihou. Furthermore, InvisibleMan showed a nice reaction feat for Darui and said that he can utilise the sea around the area to form stronger water walls. Darui just found out about the Banana Fan's function, yet he managed to dodge its quick, large fire swing anyway.

To defend against Satetsu Kaihou, InvisibleMan stated that the Black Lightning that shrouds Darui while using Black Panther can protect him from being scratched by the IS spikes. Alternatively, Darui can use Laser Circus to interrupt the execution of this technique which could be too quick for Sasori to react to in time. Even if he were to try to dodge and/or move the 3rd, the lasers are guided and will follow them. Interrupting Sasori from using Satetsu Kaihou will end up in the IS shapes and spikes losing their shape.

InvisibleMan claimed that enough Ranton lasers can pierce IS since a component of Jiton is Doton.

IM took advantage of the area by having Darui shunshin over to the water source, so he won't be having to worry about IS underneath him. From here, Darui can execute all his attacks and defend himself with better water walls. In CQC, IM pointed out Darui's kenjutsu prowess and his ability to coat his weapons with the lightning element. Darui's weapons have better cutting prowess than the 3rd's while being shrouded by the element, and lightning shuriken can be thrown at the puppet to cut its arms and render its blades useless.

The puppet arms as well as the ropes summoned from the 3rd can be countered by Black Panther or sliced by Darui with his cleaver sword imbued with lightning. Darui is tiers above EP2 Sakura in reactions so he can avoid getting hit and stuck inside the poison cloud in any case, as IM said.

IM agreed that Darui's cleaver sword is useless, but his premise is to tag Sasori and the Third from long range anyway. His strategy is consistent with this as he's only used the cleaver sword to counter the 3rd's CQC tactics.

PawsX - 2nd Post
Paws claimed that since Sasori can manipulate multiple IS constructs at the same time, he can attack and fly at the same time. Flight can avoid raiton/suiton combination, so Sasori won't have to worry about getting hit with lightning enhanced to an even higher level which could be potentially devastating.

He said that Laser Circus doesn't pack a lot of power but this was countered in IM's 2nd post.

He showed that Sasori has enough IS for supply constraints to not be a problem.

Paws said that Darui won't be able to escape Satetsu Kaihou's range since it covers a wide area in all directions. He made good use of the IS on the ground again formed to use IS bullets in the beginning to form shields to protect himself and/or the 3rd Kazekage. He agreed with IM that Black Panther can protect Darui from being scratched but being inside of World Order leaves Darui with very little room to operate and vulnerable to get attacked by another IS shape or the 3rd Kazekage.

Paws countered the water wall by showing IS's feats of piercing through solid rock and destroying parts of a cave which should be more durable than just a regular water wall. He said that Laser Circus will be slowed down if they have to bend around constructs to hit Sasori which gives him enough time to formulate another means of defense.

Now Paws said something interesting. He claimed that Sasori can use a smaller scale of Satetsu Kaihou using a single IS block. I'll touch on this later on. He also said since Fuuton is also a component of Jiton, it will counter Ranton since one of its components is Raiton.

Paws said that the water wall be useless due to the Kazekage being capable of elevating itself out of the technique's range. Also, CQC is only part of Paws' strategy and is only meant to set up another, more important part of his strategy.

InvisibleMan - 2nd Post
IM showed that Sasori didn't control the spikes again after the hit the ground while he was forming other IS shapes, meaning that Sasori's limit in how much IS he's able to control at a time is lower than the amount of IS he has in supply. It also means that he can't just multitask seamlessly with large amounts of IS as Paws tried to prove.

IM reminded Paws that Darui can move and reposition himself while using Laser Circus so he can dodge IS and attack Sasori simultaneously.

IM outlined the range of Kinkaku's V2 chakra tail, which is something he dodged, to try and prove that he can evade Satetsu Kaihou whose range only covered a good part of an enclosed cave. This also means that it doesn't exactly go everywhere, only that it has a wide range so it's not totally inescapable.

IM proved that Sasori can't really manipulate and multitask with such large amounts of IS so if he opts to attack, he leaves himself vulnerable on defense since Darui can strike him quick quick Ranton beams. to protect himself means that he has to stop executing Satetsu Kaihou and form a shield.

IM showed that a much slower Sakura was capable of picking up on Sasori's attack patterns and was dodging IS shapes on her own at one point. A much faster Darui will do so with ease.

IM touched on the Ranton vs. Jiton debate by saying that if a weaker element has enough chakra poured into it to make a larger scale attack, then the weaker element will overpower the stronger element. Therefore, enough Ranton lasers will pierce through an IS defense. I agree with the first part of this claim but it seems that both of you were led astray in this part of the debate. I'll elaborate further.

IM stated that a fast Black Panther is also capable of countering the 3rd in CQC.



100 Puppets/Sasori himself
PawsX - 1st Post

100 puppets wasn't used much because Paws didn't think that Darui would make it past the Third Kazekage, and the latter puppet was the main part of his strategy. However, he did point out that the hundred puppets cover a great range and can overwhelm Darui.

He also used the 100 puppets tech and Sasori's flamethrowers as counters for Darui's ninjutsu.

InvisibleMan - 1st Post

IM pointed out that Darui's speed is far above Sakura's who was capable of fighting and evading hordes of puppets. Darui also has more range with his attacks and can cut down the puppets much easier with the help of his lightning imbued ninja tools. He also showed Darui fighting and taking out hordes of Zetsu who can be compared to 100 puppets since these puppets don't have any type of special ability or fighting power that would present such a large hindrance to Darui. Their strength comes in numbers.

As stated several times, Ranton lasers can bend around the puppets and the flamethrowers, or they can plow through the flamethrower since one of its components is suiton.

PawsX - 2nd Post

Paws pointed out that Darui won't have his cleaver sword avaliable to him if the fight ever reaches that far due to it being destroyed with IS. He also pointed out that Darui can't protect himself at short range adequately while using Laser Circus since he has his arms clasped together maintaining the technique. Also, a puppet master like Lady Chiyo with ten, high quality puppets created by Monzaemon Chikamatsu still ended up being cut.

InvisibleMan - 2nd Post

IM asserted that Black Panther can run circles around Sasori's 100 puppets and disable all of them while the black lightning that shrouds his body will protect him from the sword slashes.



Darui's Chakra Reserves
IM really hit the nail on the head for me here. He described how large Darui's chakra reserves are in detail and used the databook to further support the feats he layed out. This is important because Darui can fight on a high level for extended periods of time without losing any speed, reactions, or the quality of his attacks. However he used more lasers than Darui showed to be capable of using in the manga which is a fallacy because everyone in the manga has a limit to how much chakra they can release at a given time.

However, the amount of lasers used against Kinkaku should be sufficient to destroy any of Sasori's puppets.

Verdict
Based solely on the points both of you brought up, I have to give the win to PawsX. High difficulty, in my view, which is impressive for IM given the fact that he had the character disadvantage.

While IM got the better of Paws in a CQC battle, in the end, the impression I got was that Sasori and Darui would be fighting a mid to long ranged battle where both characters excel. However, PawsX more or less stuck to his strategy of mainly utilising IS to defeat Darui while the other weapons in the former's arsenal were merely side points. I don't think either of you expressed your views as to which technique would come out the victor in regards to the Ranton lasers vs. IS shields very adequately, but both of you made solid points nonetheless. Logically speaking, IS should protect Sasori from the explosions. IM is completely right that Sasori can only manipulate a limited a mount of IS relative to his supply, but Paws had Sasori spreading and utilising IS all over the place and maintaining a safe perimeter. Sasori also has great amounts of stamina as stated in the databook, and he doesn't feel physical fatigue due to having a puppet body, so he'll be capable of fighting a prolonged battle as well alongside Darui. Darui knows about Sasori's core but the latter will obviously choose to protect it with the greatest care given the fact that his puppet limbs and body are expendable. Eventually, Darui may end up getting scratched when he's running low on chakra and his speed/reactions have diminished, and he also has to be very careful not to get careless as Sasori can set him up for a trap like Paws explained.

Again, nice effort from you two. I wish that you two didn't have to meet in the first round as you both tend to choose fun characters to debate with. Though Sasori isn't a very interesting character IMO :cool:.
 
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Beans2

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Hiruko

InvisibleMan made better points regarding Darui battling Hiruko. He explained how the openings in the puppet's shell can be its weakness and laser circus beams can go through the openings and destroy the shell. I agree that the shell is not taking multiple lasers or black raiton panther; while Sakura's punch did not harm Sasori inside, that's not necessarily her strongest punch. However Hiruko is not a main factor in this battle and Paws pointed out that it would only be used to test out Darui's abilities, though if he stays inside Hiruko too long he might die.

Iron Sand

I found water wall to be a sound counter to iron sand bullets. PawsX argued that the bullets would go into the ground and can be reused for other iron sand structures which I also agree with but I don't see Sasori boxing Darui in with another iron sand attack, forcing Darui to return to his original position above the bullets, considering his level of speed.

I think magnetizing Darui's metal cleaver and rendering it useless is a perfectly valid claim based on the arguments that both debaters presented.

PawsX made better points regarding Iron Sand World Method. InvisibleMan's strategy is based off Darui using a black lightning shroud to defend against the attack as to not receive damage but Paws pointed out how Sasori can employ the strategy of Third Kazekage puppet using its hands to release poison gas into Darui, where he will already be trapped by the iron sand. As for using laser circus to navigate around ISO and nail the Third Kazekage, PawsX explained well how it would slow down laser circus a lot and Sasori can use either wooden hands or iron sand to shield the Kazekage from the laser beams, while this puts Darui in a disadvantageous position since his hands are occupied as long as he maintains laser circus.

I also liked the spear and hammer strategy that PawsX employed, and this well countered InvisibleMan's premise of Darui outright evading the AoE of ISWO, because the spear will nail him at the next point he shunshins to, and the hammer that Sasori uses as a follow up to the attack to the spear can be turned into ISWO to set up the right conditions for nailing Darui.

The explosion feats of laser circus seem a little sketchy. The explosion at the kage summit could be a result of four attacks combining and reacting to each other upon impact with Susanoo, and the many lasers hitting the water against Kinkaku and Ginkaku could just be the water being sprayed up and not necessarily an explosion. PawsX did well to show how the lasers did negligible damage to Ginkaku (or was it Kinkaku?) when they were used to separate him from Samui. I do think Iron Sand can block Laser Circus but enough lasers will plow through it. PawsX did well to emphasize on how Sasori can use multiple layers of defense to protect himself from lasers and black lightning.

The fact that Sasori can coat his iron sand with poison in addition to the stuff I said above makes me think that it will be hard for Darui to come out of this battle unscathed, and with one scratch he can be poisoned.

100 Puppets

InvisibleMan utilized suitons well in this area, showing that by blocking their attacks with water walls and then electrocuting the puppets he could wipe out many puppets this way especially since the location enhances his level of suiton. Black lightning shroud also works to protect himself from the puppets' attacks and I agree with him that black panther can hunt down puppets and wreck many at once.




Overall I think PawsX made better points in the areas that mattered most. To me it looks like iron sand was the game changer here. This post may seem a little brief for a judgment but I agree with what Ghost said as well, and he gave a much more in depth judgment. Good job to both debaters, this was enjoyable to read.
 
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