madara had more than obtio did, so that doesn't really make sense, it would make sense maybe if they were the two descendants, to have different ends but no theyre not.
Madara is Indra's transmigrant and got the Yin staff, Obito had half his body covered in mokuton cells, he got the Yang staff. Although they're juts symbols, nothing special.
madara is indra's transmigrant and got the yin staff, obito had half his body covered in mokuton cells, he got the yang staff. Although they're juts symbols, nothing special.
Everything is better than JJ Madara. Even non JJ Madara.
Given the actual use of the Shakujo (or is is Khakkara) is so that Priests can avoid stomping on insects, i could probably make some metaphor about Obito actually wanting the best for everyone while Madara is just a powerhungry *******, but unfortunately Madara seems to have actually wanted peace too.
So i'm guessing that Kishi gave Obito the staff with Rings because every depiction of the sage up to then only had the Rings, and he retconned in the other half, possibly to give a bigger distinction between Obito and Madara as Juubi Jins.
Actually, isn't the whole Yin/Yang Moon/Sun thing spoiled because Naruto, who would obviously be Yang, and therefore have the ringed staff, had Sticks instead of a staff?
Actually, isn't the whole Yin/Yang Moon/Sun thing spoiled because Naruto, who would obviously be Yang, and therefore have the ringed staff, had Sticks instead of a staff?
well I don't think so wasn't narutos variation of having the sages chakra different since he didn't absorb the ten tails I think the stick was just a cool add on
Actually, isn't the whole Yin/Yang Moon/Sun thing spoiled because Naruto, who would obviously be Yang, and therefore have the ringed staff, had Sticks instead of a staff?
Obito more dominant in yang. Because of that he can utilize TSB better than Madara as Juubi jin. He representing the body of Sage of Six Path.
While
Madara more dominant in Yin. Because of that he can utilize Rinnegan better than Obito as Juubi jin plus he is original owner. He representing the eye of Sage of Six Path that is Rinnegan.
And it supported by Obito having half of his body constructed with Hashirama's cells wheres Madara only piece of meat.
The power of Six Path will assimilated/combined with the most dominant part of each of Juubi jins body. And as the proof is on their Shokujo.
Hagoromo's inheritance is represented by the Sun Staff and the Moon Staff. The Sun Staff was inherited by Ashura and the Moon Staff was inherited by Indra.
On how the Staffs/Seals are connected, I made a theory and I think it's solid, at least for now :-
Dragonor tried to explain this with the theory of his.
This idea is based on the basis that in total there are three Gedo Mazou's in NV (There could be more). One is Hamura's shell (The Last), another is Hagoromo's Shell (Which was used in the Fourth Shinobi World War) and the third is the Original Daemonic Juubi's Shell.
The First Sealing
According to Dark Kuruma, there could be multiple Gedo Mazou's. The possibility is there that it could be a translation mistake.
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When Sasuke absorbed the Nine Bijuus, his Susanoo acted like a Gedo Mazou. I would assume that any medium which brings the Juubi's chakra together acts like a Gedo Mazou.
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Hagoromo and Hamura together fight and seal off the original Juubi.
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The idea that Hagoromo used the Sun Seal and Hamura used the Moon seal and later transferred it to Hagoromo does not sit well with me. It's because Hagoromo's staff (Both Sun and Moon at each ends) is a clear indicator that he had both Sun and Moon Seals.
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The Sun Leagacy is inherited by Ashura and the Moon Legacy is inherited by Indra, Hagoromo's sons.
Sun Legacy (Ashura).
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Moon Legacy (Indra).
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So what role did Hamura had in the Juubi's sealing ?
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This is where comes out a missing link, I believe is the existence of a third Seal.
The Ootsutsuki clan symbol, Chiba Mon, which is the representative of the Universe consists of three symbols.
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Star, Sun and Moon. Morning Star :
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More Info on Chiba Mon here :
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I believe Hamura had the Star Seal which was used in the sealing process.
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Since three seals (Star by Hamura and Sun and Moon by Hagoromo) were used, the resultant sealing caused a perfect seal creating the First Moon of NV.
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The chakra of the Juubi divided as happened in the sealing that we most recently saw. Hamura and Hagoromo divided the Leaking Juubi chakra and sealed it within them.
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The Original Juubi, I believe had three components : Shinju, Kaguya and the Demon. The Demon is what Hamura seals within himself and this is what causes the fall of Ootsutsuki. Hagoromo sealed the Shinju and Kaguya chakra components within himself.
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This sealing also lead to the birth of Black Zetsu, a part of the Demon (?).
A recent idea that I have is Black Zetsu is a corrupted Bijuu just Like Kaguya. Nine Bijuus + Kaguya + Shinju + Black Zetsu makes Twelve (Twelve Chinese Zodiac Signs, Lucky Number) Bijuus with Orochimaru, Satan as the Thirteenth Bijuu (Unlucky Number).
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The Second Sealing
While Hamura with his clan went to the moon to guard the Demon's shell; Hagoromo remained on Earth.
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The Demon did something with his army to cause the Fall of the Ootsutsuki.
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The Demon would infect Hamura and steal the Juubi Chakra within him turning him into a Shell, i.e; Hamura Gedo Mazou.
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And trapped his soul in the RDS Mask, along with all the Ootsutsuki's in the other masks. The Other Ootsutsuki's bodies were perhaps consumed by Hamura's shell and became White Zetsus (?).
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RDS : Hamura's spirit, cursed by the Demon.
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Hagoromo nearing his old age would divide the Juubi Chakra within him to create the Nine Bijuus.
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I think after this the Demon did something and caused Hagoromo to become a Juubi like what happened with Madara.
The Demon stabs Hagoromo.
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Infects him with Deamonic Juubi Chakra (Stolen from Hamura).
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And transforms him into a Juubi (Madara as a mini Juubi).
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The Hagoromo Juubi would cause chaos but be ultimately sealed away by Indra (Moon) and Ashura (Sun). They did cooperate but it did not last because of Black Zetsu's intervention.
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The resultant Chibaku Tensei would create the Second Moon of NV and the iconic Gedo Mazou of Hagoromo (His shell).
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The Two Moons of NV. One Moon is Full while the other is Crescent. Both Indra and Ashura are facing each other in Battle because of Black Zetsu's intervention. The Last movie also showed NV having Two Moons. I remember Minamoto going mad over it. Lol
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The Imperfect Seal
But during the Second Sealing only two seals were used, Sun (Ashura) and Moon (Indra). Such a seal would be imperfect because it lacks the Star Seal. The Chiba Mon would as such be incomplete.
Pain's Chibaku Tensei of Two Seals was prone to Fracture (Two hands joining, Two seals symbolism).
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Naruto and Sasuke's Third sealing followed the same concept. While Sakura is there as a third seal (Hidden Symbolism, Trio Punch).
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She disappears during the actual sealing Process. No Sakura .
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The Sun and Moon coming together was represented like such.
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Which is the symbol for in-yō, i.e; Yin-Yang.
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This symbol lacks the Star Component and thus is incomplete. Complete Chiba Mon.
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Because of the lack of the third seal, the sealing is Imperfect and is commented by Black Zetsu to fracture eventually anyways.
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The Second Moon were Hagoromo's shell was sealed by Indra and Ashura was bypassed by Madara by using Hagoromo's eyes (Rinnegan) :
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Toneri slashed the Second Moon (Where Hagoromo's Shell was sealed) in Half and I believe it was empty ? (I have not watched the Movie).
I think that Madara casted Mugen Tsukuyomi from the First Moon where the Original Juubi's shell i.e; Demon was sealed.
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The Missing Link
I believe that Orochimaru, The Demon is trying to release the Original Juubi's shell from the First Moon. In order to do so, he would need the Sun, Star and Moon seals to come together forming the Chiba Mon. (If the three can make a seal, they can break it also).
While Sasuke and Naruto did get the Sun and Moon Seals, there is no way they would ever cooperate with Orochimaru in achieving his goals. Orochimaru would manipulate Sasuke (?) to cause this.
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While Naruto did get a replacement White Zetsu Arm for the Sun Seal.
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What he doesn't know is that the White Zetsus and Hashirama's DNA as a catalyst came from Hagoromo's body infested by the Demon.
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At most, in Part 3; I believe Naruto's right arm would get hijacked by Orochimaru :
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Sasuke did not get a replacement arm,
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But Orochimaru has a preserved Daemonic Left hand for the Moon Seal waiting for him :
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To complete the Chiba Mon and break the Demon's seal, only one Seal, the Star Seal remains. Well, where can Orochimaru get it ?
This detail has being showcased in Part 1, During the Invasion of Konoha. Kabuto under the orders of Orochimaru does a test on Hinata. I will just link one of Rabbit Teth's post on this :
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Perhaps, through the test, Orochimaru knows that Hinata is the true heir to the Star Seal of Hamura's ?
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With the Three seals coming together, The Chiba Mon will be complete.
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And The Demon from the Moon will be unleashed.
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P.S: If a Part Three does happen, then by that point, NV will have only one moon where the Juubi was originally sealed (Hagoromo and Hamura's Chibaku Tensei), since the Second Moon (Indra and Ashura's Chibaku Tensei) was sliced in half by Toneri and destroyed in the Last Movie.
The Anomaly
If we assume that Orochimaru is a scientist wanting to create a Perfect and Supreme Body. I think he wanted to bring Star, Sun and Moon Together. Star - Shin, Moon - Reverse Kaballah and Sun - Kaballah.
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Which created the Shinju's Fruit and was eaten by Kaguya a test subject of Orochimaru and his wife (?).
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But then an anomaly occurred and Orochimaru's experiment failed. Kaguya was only intended to have one son to create the Ultimate Being (Star + Sun + Moon).
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But she had two sons.
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Hamura inherited the Star Seal and became an anomaly.
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Orochimaru knowing the Experiment's failure Caused Kaguya's corruption.
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And her transformation into the Juubi.
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So that Everything will become One, and Orochimaru can have a fresh start.
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Of course, this didn't happen and Orochimaru's plans became even more complicated (We have come full circle).
This is the second half of Dragonor's theory which didn't fit above because the character limit.
The Purging Of Hamura
What really doesn't make sense is why Hamura did not feature in Madara's Flashback.
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Hagoromo would not have removed the mention of his brother's existence from the Tablet.
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It's only later do we know that Black Zetsu changed the text on the tablet and could have removed Hamura's mention in the tablet.
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By purging the knowledge of Hamura's existence, Black Zetsu ensured that no one would realize the existence of a third (Star) seal.
Ensuring that Chibaku Tensei would never be complete.
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The Seals
Here, I will do a comparison of the Seals and Symbols of Chiba Mon.
This is Naruto's Sun Seal, A White Circle.
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The Chiba Mon Sun Symbol.
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Sun Symbolism.
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This is Sasuke's Moon Seal, A Crescent Moon.
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The Chiba Mon Moon Symbol.
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Moon Symbolism.
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This is the Star Symbol of Chiba Mon, A Black Sphere.
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The Star Seal has not being shown yet, but we got a glimpse (Symbolism) of it as Kaguya's Gudoudama (Big Bang).
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Even Hamura in the Databook page seems to have a circular mark (The Star Seal) on his hand (Quality of the scan is low as it's faded; so I am not really sure on this one).
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I hope that the Star Seal would get connected to the Hyuuga Clan, i.e; Hinata and will have a major role in Part 3.
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