Negative Knight
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I just realized that Tobi's identity being revealed is going to be anti-climatic if he turns out to be any single one person.
If he turns out to be Obito, they'll be people complaining about Kishi going for the easy and obvious option with 100s of plot holes
If he turns out to be Kagami, all the well thought out, speculative members of NB won't have a full reaction as they already anticipated it
If he turns out to be Izuna/Zetsu then we'll just feel like its too boring and has no real impact e.g. Zetsu is not a real villain and Izuna and Madara won't be rivals any longer ?
Honestly the magic of Tobi is that he had so much potential to be literally anyone (yes even the ramen guy for those theorists xd ) but if he's revealed as one person then Kishi will have to give him a pretty elaborate back story to come along with it.
Either Tobi should be someone completely new that fits into the story, has to have a awesome back story or be more than one person
What do you guys think ?
This is basically a thread which aims to put an end to the order of strength in Akatsuki by showing the general power hierarchy, certain exceptions to the actual ranking system and alternative arguments posed by other people (though are only 50/50 chances of being true) on why individual Akatsuki members could beat another member who is a higher rank than them.
Contents and Ordering of this Thread
--1)Ranking System of Akatsuki Members
-Why Pain is Stronger than Itachi ?
-Why Itachi is Stronger than Kisame ?
-Why Kisame is Stronger than Kakuzu ?
-Why Kakuzu is Stronger than Sasori ?
-Why Sasori is Stronger than Deidara ?
-Why Deidara is Stronger than Konan ?
-Why Konan is Stronger than Zetsu ?
-Why Zetsu is Stronger than Hidan ?
-Why Hidan is Stronger than No-one ? xd
--2) Certain Exceptions to the Ranking System
-Why Sasori is Stronger than Kisame ?
-Why Deidara is Stronger than Kakuzu ?
--3) Alternative Arguments on Individual Match ups
-Is Sasori Stronger than Itachi ?
-Is Itachi Stronger than Pain ?
-Is Kakuzu Stronger than Kisame ?
-Is Kisame Stronger than Itachi ?
-Is Deidara Stronger than Kisame ?
1) Pain - Six Paths of Pain
Pain is undoubtely the strongest member in Akatsuki both stated by Tobi himself and demonstartated through the abilites given to him by the Rinnegan.
Why Pain is Stronger than Itachi ?
In a fight between both Pain and Itachi, he would win due to several reasons mainly due to his three most powerful paths (Preta, Animal and Deva) and outnumbering Itachi 6 to 1
The Preta path renders almost all ninjutsu useless meaning Itachi's Great Fire Ball Jutsu and all of his mid scale techniques are render useless. His Susanno could arguably be countered by the Preta Path however his blade of Totsuka ensures against this by sealing away the body containing the path before he completely absorbs Susanno. This is shown in the spoilered image below which depicts that it takes time to absorb chakra via the Preta path depending on the amount of chakra wanting to be absorbed. Due to Itachi's Susanno being quite large in size and argubably is maintained by continuously expelling chakra then he has plenty of time to seal the Preta Path in his gourd.
Overall the Preta Path means all ninjutsu used by Itachi is close to useless apart from Amaretsu and Susanno which are both extremely chakra taxing techniques which doesn't seem like a viable option to be used continuously against an opponent as durbale as the 6 Paths of Pain due to one of the pains being capable of reviving the others once they are "dead".
Jiriaya's Odama Rasengan being absorbed by the Preta Path
The use of the Animal Path is essential in forcing Itachi to Susanno or over use Amaretsu (severely depleting his stamina either way) due to his lack of summons and for an actual counter to "Pain's Cerberus". Itachi using any of these two techniques early on to counter the Animal Path means it simply becomes a battle of attrition where the Pain's simply gradually wear down Itachi till his stamina causes his performance to drop below the satisfactory level to survive.
The Deva Path which is the greatest Pain due to its versatility in its ability to be both a defensive and offensive maneuver simultaneously.
It is a counter to both the jutsus neither of the other 5 Pains could tackle, Amaretsu and Susanno. Amaretsu could be protected against using Shinra Tensei whether any of the pains have been caught with the Jutsu or as a defense against being caught. Susanno can also be kept at a distance or Itachi could be pulled in with Universal Pull, either could be used for the same effect.
Nagato using Shinra Tensei to expel the Amaretsu flames off his body
Finally the Deva Path could use Chibaku Tensei as a final trump card against Itachi's Susanno by pulling him into the massive structure subsequently crushing him, also due to Itachi having no actual counter to destroy Chibaku tensei then it is a inevitable occurrence.
*Note Amaretsu does not count as a way of destroying Chibaku Tensei due to the core being an actual force rather than a tangible object.
2) Itachi - The Silent Avenger
Itachi due to his extremely versatile move pool, unparalleled intelligence, the nature of his techniques needing very specifc counters and possessing the rare mangekyou Sharingan makes him place 2nd in Akatsuki.
Why Itachi is Stronger than Kisame ?
As i said earlier due to the nature of Itachi's attacks needing very specific counters to neutralize and even more rarely render useless all together.
Itachi's Mangekyou Sharingan bestows him three almost over powered abilites which allow for him to be stronger than Kisame, which are:
-Powerful Genjutsu (Tsukymoni)
-Susanno (Chakra Spectre)
-Amaretsu (Unquenchable Flames)
Itachi's Genjutsu will act as his primary counter to Kisame due to him not having to engage in a direct physical confrontation with him (which would most likely go in Kisame's favour) as Samehada's unqiue trait of absorbing chakra would act both as a disadvantage to Itachi with his already low stamina and as a advantage to Kisame due to him gaining in chakra whatever amount Itachi loses.
Amaretsu even though a fire technique takes away Kisame's general Elemental Advantage in this battle due to Amaretsu being able to overcome all 5 of the main elements. With this technique he can counter all but one of Kisame's Water Release techniques.
Itachi's Amaretsu Elemental Strengths and Weakness
Strengthened by Wind Techniques simply because the air adds more fuel for the fire to burn with making the flames more intense and allowing it to burn for longer
Immunity to Fire Techniques because the superior fire release technique eventually overwhelms and consumes the inferior one, in this case Amaretsu is always the superior one
Immunity to Water Techniques as the unquenchable flames quickly evaporates the technique no matter how large a body of water is.
Immunity to Earth Techniques due to the flames quickly burning through the land itself
Weakness for Lightning Techniques due to the flames of being at such a heat intensity and temperature that the overall electrical resistivity increases to such a point that electrical conduction becomes to weak to be useful.
However the nature of Genjutsu allows for all of this to be avoided due to the one-shotting nature of the attack which is more of a mentally attacking approach to a physical one which would undoubtedly favour Kisame. It also helps that Itachi has shown himself to be extremely proficient with Genjutsu, along with it being Kisame's natural weakness (he possess no real counter to (Tskuyomni) then this approach alone could give Itachi the match.
Susanno is Itachi's trump card in a losing or long winded fight to swiftly gain the upper hand. With the Totsuka Blade and the Yata Mirror, Itachi is able to defend against almost any attack whilst simultaneously seal the opponent with one successful hit from the sword. This would be very dangerous against Kisame however for this particular technique he has the perfect counter. Using his
3) Kisame - The Tailess Tailed Beast
Kisame using his Suiton Daikoudan (Great Shark Bullet Technique)
4) Kakuzu - The Earth Grudge Monster
5) Sasori - The Human Puppet
6) Deidara - Sublime Artist
7) Konan - The Origami Woman
8) Zetsu - The Yin and Yang Being
9) Hidan - The Grim Reaper
If he turns out to be Obito, they'll be people complaining about Kishi going for the easy and obvious option with 100s of plot holes
If he turns out to be Kagami, all the well thought out, speculative members of NB won't have a full reaction as they already anticipated it
If he turns out to be Izuna/Zetsu then we'll just feel like its too boring and has no real impact e.g. Zetsu is not a real villain and Izuna and Madara won't be rivals any longer ?
Honestly the magic of Tobi is that he had so much potential to be literally anyone (yes even the ramen guy for those theorists xd ) but if he's revealed as one person then Kishi will have to give him a pretty elaborate back story to come along with it.
Either Tobi should be someone completely new that fits into the story, has to have a awesome back story or be more than one person
What do you guys think ?
Akatsuki Rankings - Strongest to Weakest
This is basically a thread which aims to put an end to the order of strength in Akatsuki by showing the general power hierarchy, certain exceptions to the actual ranking system and alternative arguments posed by other people (though are only 50/50 chances of being true) on why individual Akatsuki members could beat another member who is a higher rank than them.
Contents and Ordering of this Thread
--1)Ranking System of Akatsuki Members
-Why Pain is Stronger than Itachi ?
-Why Itachi is Stronger than Kisame ?
-Why Kisame is Stronger than Kakuzu ?
-Why Kakuzu is Stronger than Sasori ?
-Why Sasori is Stronger than Deidara ?
-Why Deidara is Stronger than Konan ?
-Why Konan is Stronger than Zetsu ?
-Why Zetsu is Stronger than Hidan ?
-Why Hidan is Stronger than No-one ? xd
--2) Certain Exceptions to the Ranking System
-Why Sasori is Stronger than Kisame ?
-Why Deidara is Stronger than Kakuzu ?
--3) Alternative Arguments on Individual Match ups
-Is Sasori Stronger than Itachi ?
-Is Itachi Stronger than Pain ?
-Is Kakuzu Stronger than Kisame ?
-Is Kisame Stronger than Itachi ?
-Is Deidara Stronger than Kisame ?
Ranking System of Akatsuki Members
1) Pain - Six Paths of Pain
Pain is undoubtely the strongest member in Akatsuki both stated by Tobi himself and demonstartated through the abilites given to him by the Rinnegan.
Why Pain is Stronger than Itachi ?
In a fight between both Pain and Itachi, he would win due to several reasons mainly due to his three most powerful paths (Preta, Animal and Deva) and outnumbering Itachi 6 to 1
The Preta path renders almost all ninjutsu useless meaning Itachi's Great Fire Ball Jutsu and all of his mid scale techniques are render useless. His Susanno could arguably be countered by the Preta Path however his blade of Totsuka ensures against this by sealing away the body containing the path before he completely absorbs Susanno. This is shown in the spoilered image below which depicts that it takes time to absorb chakra via the Preta path depending on the amount of chakra wanting to be absorbed. Due to Itachi's Susanno being quite large in size and argubably is maintained by continuously expelling chakra then he has plenty of time to seal the Preta Path in his gourd.
Overall the Preta Path means all ninjutsu used by Itachi is close to useless apart from Amaretsu and Susanno which are both extremely chakra taxing techniques which doesn't seem like a viable option to be used continuously against an opponent as durbale as the 6 Paths of Pain due to one of the pains being capable of reviving the others once they are "dead".
Jiriaya's Odama Rasengan being absorbed by the Preta Path
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The use of the Animal Path is essential in forcing Itachi to Susanno or over use Amaretsu (severely depleting his stamina either way) due to his lack of summons and for an actual counter to "Pain's Cerberus". Itachi using any of these two techniques early on to counter the Animal Path means it simply becomes a battle of attrition where the Pain's simply gradually wear down Itachi till his stamina causes his performance to drop below the satisfactory level to survive.
The Deva Path which is the greatest Pain due to its versatility in its ability to be both a defensive and offensive maneuver simultaneously.
It is a counter to both the jutsus neither of the other 5 Pains could tackle, Amaretsu and Susanno. Amaretsu could be protected against using Shinra Tensei whether any of the pains have been caught with the Jutsu or as a defense against being caught. Susanno can also be kept at a distance or Itachi could be pulled in with Universal Pull, either could be used for the same effect.
Nagato using Shinra Tensei to expel the Amaretsu flames off his body
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Finally the Deva Path could use Chibaku Tensei as a final trump card against Itachi's Susanno by pulling him into the massive structure subsequently crushing him, also due to Itachi having no actual counter to destroy Chibaku tensei then it is a inevitable occurrence.
*Note Amaretsu does not count as a way of destroying Chibaku Tensei due to the core being an actual force rather than a tangible object.
2) Itachi - The Silent Avenger
Itachi due to his extremely versatile move pool, unparalleled intelligence, the nature of his techniques needing very specifc counters and possessing the rare mangekyou Sharingan makes him place 2nd in Akatsuki.
Why Itachi is Stronger than Kisame ?
As i said earlier due to the nature of Itachi's attacks needing very specific counters to neutralize and even more rarely render useless all together.
Itachi's Mangekyou Sharingan bestows him three almost over powered abilites which allow for him to be stronger than Kisame, which are:
-Powerful Genjutsu (Tsukymoni)
-Susanno (Chakra Spectre)
-Amaretsu (Unquenchable Flames)
Itachi's Genjutsu will act as his primary counter to Kisame due to him not having to engage in a direct physical confrontation with him (which would most likely go in Kisame's favour) as Samehada's unqiue trait of absorbing chakra would act both as a disadvantage to Itachi with his already low stamina and as a advantage to Kisame due to him gaining in chakra whatever amount Itachi loses.
Amaretsu even though a fire technique takes away Kisame's general Elemental Advantage in this battle due to Amaretsu being able to overcome all 5 of the main elements. With this technique he can counter all but one of Kisame's Water Release techniques.
Itachi's Amaretsu Elemental Strengths and Weakness
Strengthened by Wind Techniques simply because the air adds more fuel for the fire to burn with making the flames more intense and allowing it to burn for longer
Immunity to Fire Techniques because the superior fire release technique eventually overwhelms and consumes the inferior one, in this case Amaretsu is always the superior one
Immunity to Water Techniques as the unquenchable flames quickly evaporates the technique no matter how large a body of water is.
Immunity to Earth Techniques due to the flames quickly burning through the land itself
Weakness for Lightning Techniques due to the flames of being at such a heat intensity and temperature that the overall electrical resistivity increases to such a point that electrical conduction becomes to weak to be useful.
However the nature of Genjutsu allows for all of this to be avoided due to the one-shotting nature of the attack which is more of a mentally attacking approach to a physical one which would undoubtedly favour Kisame. It also helps that Itachi has shown himself to be extremely proficient with Genjutsu, along with it being Kisame's natural weakness (he possess no real counter to (Tskuyomni) then this approach alone could give Itachi the match.
Susanno is Itachi's trump card in a losing or long winded fight to swiftly gain the upper hand. With the Totsuka Blade and the Yata Mirror, Itachi is able to defend against almost any attack whilst simultaneously seal the opponent with one successful hit from the sword. This would be very dangerous against Kisame however for this particular technique he has the perfect counter. Using his
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he would be able to drain Susanno of all of its chakra thus deactivating it whilst also growing stronger proportionally to the amount of chakra it drained from Itachi giving it a secondary use other than deactivating Susanno, making it both a counter and a powerful offensive.3) Kisame - The Tailess Tailed Beast
Kisame using his Suiton Daikoudan (Great Shark Bullet Technique)
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4) Kakuzu - The Earth Grudge Monster
5) Sasori - The Human Puppet
6) Deidara - Sublime Artist
7) Konan - The Origami Woman
8) Zetsu - The Yin and Yang Being
9) Hidan - The Grim Reaper
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