[Discussion] Reason Luffy is Fifth Emperor

kiiro · Jun 1, 2018

Hello Base.

I bring this thread since many think that Luffy is only consider to be a new Emperor due the fact he defeated two Sweet Commanders of Big Mom, while this is a reason, it is not the whole.

In chapter 903 it is describe and summarized the reason he is consider to be the fifth Emperor. I would explain all this and prove it is true.

Part 1

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Staw Hat Grand Fleet

An army of 5600 Nakama's under

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lead by powerful Captain Pirate's such as

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,

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,

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(Chinjao),

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,

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,

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( an Elbaf) and

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all these a together add more than 1 Billion Bounty. These powerful Divisions had already started to fight pirates and save islands in the name of Luffy according to the

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of the manga.

Luffy already counts with these powerful Nakamas and we are not counting his allies, showing to have Military force and not only that, he as shown to have great influence in the pirate world. To be a Yonkou, power and influence is needed and Luffy has already shown it.

Made Germa 66, Sun Pirates and Fire tank fight his side?

The first time I saw this I found it funny, but it is true. As Morgan's said, he did this possible with his leadership and Charisma. I need to clear that Luffy planned to rescue Sanji and save Germa 66 but also destroyed her tea party in a single shot. He had the balls not only save them, but to challenge and humiliate her.

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After all, Luffy challenged her and said he was gonna be the one laughing in the end.

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Thanks to Luffy's charisma and leadership, Jimbei joined his crew. Being a Crew mate, Jimbei hearing Luffy's plan, he suggested to join with Bege to also defeat Big Mom:

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Bege's plan was to break Mother Caramel picture and then one shot big mom. We dont know how he planned this but he definitely was gonna break the picture in an accidental way. This plan not only failed but, if it was not for Luffy's plan to save Germa 66,

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, be it Bege or even Straw Hats crew. Let me explain.

Luffy's plan was to destroy the Wedding Cake, save Germa and Sanji and this was on his own:

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Above Luffy completed the first part which is destroying the cake. But then he saved Germa 66 and returned to them their battle suits which were taken in the entrance, Bege never would had saved Germa in his plan:

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The plot of saving Germa 66 doesnt finish here, after the Castle was blown down, Big Mom Pirates divided two crews. One after Bege's Crew and Straw Hats Crew and the other to defeat Germa 66 with an army of 10,000 soldiers to get their hands over the cloning Technology which was

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since the beginning but her plans did not work thanks to Luffy saving them so he indirectly defeated more than 10,000 soldiers.

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Destroyed the Queen's Castle?

Even though Luffy did not plan this, it all happen because

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and decisions he made. In the main battle, Big Mom Pirates

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that destroyed Big Mom Castle, but they still consider the possibility that Luffy might have planned

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But more important is that fact that Morgans discover this and that is why the said in the news that Luffy planned this all which would just clear Big Mom Pirates their doubts from who did it:

They saw the explosion and wondered why the Tamatebako exploded, later it was revealed who gifted them the treasure.

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Part 2

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Defeated two commanders of Big Mom. But not only defeated 2 commanders of Big Mom. Thanks that Jimbei entered his crew and thanks that he saved Sanji's family and thanks to save Lola, Sun Pirates, Tank Pirates and Germa 66 joined forces with him during the time he was in Big Mom Territory and defeated more than 10,000 soldiers, more than half fleet of ships, sabotage the communications and humaliate her title of Emperor in her own place which the civilians even questioned if they could be safe

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Big Mom in rage was even destroying and killing her own people and Morgan witnessested all this.

Defeat of two Sweet Commanders

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Defeat of half fleet and more pirates

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Recognized the threat of Straw Hats and were Humiliated

All their military force was brought to battle and civillians felt they were no longer safe with Big Mom and acknowledge Luffy as responsable for destroying the castle destroying the pride of a Yonkou

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And the Morgas saw it all in the front line:

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So please dont say defeating a mere First Mate or Commander of a Yonkou gives you an Emperor Title, I am not evening including possible territories Luffy might have, so dont underestimate an Emperor title and acknowledge Luffy's accomplishments.

Rikudou Tobi · Jun 1, 2018

If that was the case, then Blackbeard wouldn't be a Yonko. I forgot to reply to your last post but Luffy cannot gain a title by the feats of his crew and his alliances.
It's not what gave Luffy the super rookie title and it's not what gave him the Yonko titel. You said so yourself that Morgas saw and reported the whole thing so Luffy's personal feats is what gave him the 5th Yonko seat.

kiiro · Jun 1, 2018

Rikudou Tobi said:
If that was the case, then Blackbeard wouldn't be a Yonko. I forgot to reply to your last post but Luffy cannot gain a title by the feats of his crew and his alliances.
It's not what gave Luffy the super rookie title and it's not what gave him the Yonko titel. You said so yourself that Morgas saw and reported the whole thing so Luffy's personal feats is what gave him the 5th Yonko seat.

Ok. Leave Luffy alone and make him do the same, and lets see if he would get the Yonkou Title or die.

Rikudou Tobi · Jun 1, 2018

kiiro said:
Ok. Leave Luffy alone and make him do the same, and lets see if he would get the Yonkou Title or die.

Leave Blackbeard alone in the same situation and he'll also still die. Still, Blackbeard didn't become a Yonko by having an alliance assassination against a Yonko did he?
What gave Blackbeard the title of a Yonkou?

kiiro · Jun 1, 2018

Rikudou Tobi said:
Leave Blackbeard alone in the same situation and he'll also still die. Still, Blackbeard didn't become a Yonko by having an alliance assassination against a Yonko did he?
What gave Blackbeard the title of a Yonkou?

He gained power? Territories? Defeated Whitebeard crew? Search for the One piece?

Of course he did not only defeat Marco but all the crew, stole his territories, got stronger, had a bigger fleet.

And yes, Teach would also die. That is what I am saying. Being an emperor is rule over the seas, and non is alone.

ArabianLuffy · Jun 1, 2018

Well, I personally won't consider Luffy a Yonkou. Not until one of the fantastic 4 dies. Then, Luffy can become a Yonkou.

Rikudou Tobi · Jun 1, 2018

kiiro said:
He gained power? Territories? Defeated Whitebeard crew? Search for the One piece?

Of course he did not only defeat Marco but all the crew, stole his territories, got stronger, had a bigger fleet.

And yes, Teach would also die. That is what I am saying. Being an emperor is rule over the seas, and non is alone.

1. Searching for Onepiece does not give you a yonko title, or do anything for that matter because that's what every pirate is doing.
2. Gaining power isn't going to give him a yonko title either because he didn't become yonko right after the paramount war
3. Ruling territories doesn't make you a yonko either otherwise the Warlord of the Seas would've been labelled one by now.

The manga made it clear that defeating a Yonkou First Mate is what gave Blackbeard the title.

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The blackbeard crew obviously fought the remnants of the whitebeard crew but it was the downfall of marco that gave him the title.
I don't know why you're denying this. So far two YFM was defeated by two powerful pirates and both of those individuals became Yonko because of it. Luffy didn't even have fisherman island territory yet before becoming yonko, it was shortly after.

Relostar Devil · Jun 1, 2018

Luffy has bounty now more than any younkou commander bcoz he defeated two of them and has bounty just directly below younkou and 5600 nakama under him. That's why he was stated 5th emperor

kiiro · Jun 1, 2018

Rikudou Tobi said:
1. Searching for Onepiece does not give you a yonko title, or do anything for that matter because that's what every pirate is doing.
2. Gaining power isn't going to give him a yonko title either because he didn't become yonko right after the paramount war
3. Ruling territories doesn't make you a yonko either otherwise the Warlord of the Seas would've been labelled one by now.

The manga made it clear that defeating a Yonkou First Mate is what gave Blackbeard the title.

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The blackbeard crew obviously fought the remnants of the whitebeard crew but it was the downfall of marco that gave him the title.
I don't know why you're denying this. So far two YFM was defeated by two powerful pirates and both of those individuals became Yonko because of it. Luffy didn't even have fisherman island territory yet before becoming yonko, it was shortly after.

The 3 steps you mention is what made Teach a Yonkou. Defeating Marco and his crew was the last thing to be known as a Yonkou. Gorosei said that Teach was one of the candidates to be Yonkou since he knew his territories.

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They talked about territories. They talked that he started to even defeat rookies. Before defeating Marco, he gained all the other requirements. If strong is enough to be a Yonkou, why isnt Dragon or Mihawk one?

I mean, they can clearly defeat a First Mate of a Yonkou. Not only is power, it has many thing to do and one of them is to have the goal to reach one piece.

Rikudou Tobi · Jun 1, 2018

kiiro said:
The 3 steps you mention is what made Teach a Yonkou. Defeating Marco and his crew was the last thing to be known as a Yonkou. Gorosei said that Teach was one of the candidates to be Yonkou since he knew his territories.

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They talked about territories. They talked that he started to even defeat rookies. Before defeating Marco, he gained all the other requirements. If strong is enough to be a Yonkou, why isnt Dragon or Mihawk one?

I mean, they can clearly defeat a First Mate of a Yonkou. Not only is power, it has many thing to do and one of them is to have the goal to reach one piece.

Searching for Onepiece does not make a yonko, seriously what the hell are you talking about? Every pirate is searching for onepiece.
And Blackbeard being familiar with Whitebeard's territories has nothing to do with it either.

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and yet Fisherman island became

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.

It was known world wide that as soon as Whitebeard died, all of his territories where up for grabs and majority of them were taken by other pirates:

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Dragon and Mihawk never defeated a Yonko First Mate before, the only thing remotely close is Shanks and Mihawk having daily duals with each other. That's it. It never stated that Shanks or Mihawk defeated each other during their matches.

Don't even get me started on the super rookie one either because the only one he defeated from the worse generation is Bonney, yet that didn't give him any yonko title whatsoever.

Rikudou Tobi · Jun 1, 2018

Nico Robin said so herself that it was after the fight with Marco w/ the crew that Blackbeard became Yonkou right after. There was nothing mentioned about territories, super rookies, or even looking for onepiece that made Blackbeard become yonko in the first place.

Why are you fighting the manga so hard right now? Nothing the Gorosei's said even implied that Blackbeard is becoming a Yonko. They just gave a list of people that would be able to stop him, that's it.

kiiro · Jun 1, 2018

Rikudou Tobi said:
Searching for Onepiece does not make a yonko, seriously what the hell are you talking about? Every pirate is searching for onepiece.
And Blackbeard being familiar with Whitebeard's territories has nothing to do with it either.
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and yet Fisherman island became
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.

It was known world wide that as soon as Whitebeard died, all of his territories where up for grabs and majority of them were taken by other pirates:

You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images

Dragon and Mihawk never defeated a Yonko First Mate before, the only thing remotely close is Shanks and Mihawk having daily duals with each other. That's it. It never stated that Shanks or Mihawk defeated each other during their matches.

Don't even get me started on the super rookie one either because the only one he defeated from the worse generation is Bonney, yet that didn't give him any yonko title whatsoever.

I never said that searching the one piece make a yonkou, I said it is one of the points. Dragon that is the most wanted person, not looking for one piece is not a Yonkou. A yonkou is one of the 4 pirates near to reach one piece. And no, not all pirates search for that.

Exactly, since WB is dead, everyone conquer his territories. Just as Big Mom, just as Teach. Why is it hard to understand this?

Do you seriously think that beating just Katakuri made Luffy the fifth emperor? They are known to rule over seas. I doubt Luffy can do that in his own.

Mihawk was tied with Shanks, why isnt he a Yonkou? Becuase his goals are not the same. That is why.

kiiro · Jun 1, 2018

Rikudou Tobi said:
Nico Robin said so herself that it was after the fight with Marco w/ the crew that Blackbeard became Yonkou right after. There was nothing mentioned about territories, super rookies, or even looking for onepiece that made Blackbeard become yonko in the first place.

Why are you fighting the manga so hard right now? Nothing the Gorosei's said even implied that Blackbeard is becoming a Yonko. They just gave a list of people that would be able to stop him, that's it.

Yes, that is what she said. But that doesnt mean that it was just because that. Teach always planned everything. Reason he run from Akainu and from Shanks. He clearly said "This isnt the time for it"

Rikudou Tobi · Jun 1, 2018

kiiro said:
I never said that searching the one piece make a yonkou, I said it is one of the points. Dragon that is the most wanted person, not looking for one piece is not a Yonkou. A yonkou is one of the 4 pirates near to reach one piece. And no, not all pirates search for that.

Dragon is a rebel that attacks the world government directly. Pirates don't attack the government, only Luffy was so dense enough to do that.
This still has nothing to do with being a yonko.

Exactly, since WB is dead, everyone conquer his territories. Just as Big Mom, just as Teach. Why is it hard to understand this?

Brownbeard and many other pirates conquer territoriess as well, it's still has nothing to do with becoming a yonko. Hence why I posted that scan of a weak worthless pirate (brownbeard) taking over Wb's Foodvalten territory, so what's so hard for you to understand?

It means absolutely nothing in gaining a title. Luffy became a Yonko by owning #0 territory (which I mentioned before) so your theory is flawed.

Do you seriously think that beating just Katakuri made Luffy the fifth emperor? They are known to rule over seas. I doubt Luffy can do that in his own.

Luffy didn't rule any sea, and he said so himself that he doesn't want to either. Only the original Yonko's rule the seas because they rule over territories closer to Onepiece. They have the red poneglyph.

Mihawk was tied with Shanks, why isnt he a Yonkou? Becuase his goals are not the same. That is why.

This doesn't make any sense. The whole purpose of Teech and Luffy gaining new positions is because they defeated some one powerful not stalemate them. Mihawk already holds a current title anyways, he does whatever he wants.

Sir Blades · Jun 1, 2018

Yeah, that's gonna be a no. :tea:
Rikudo has already more than made it clear.

kiiro · Jun 1, 2018

oK, lets make it easy.

Rikudou Tobi said:
Dragon is a rebel that attacks the world government directly. Pirates don't attack the government, only Luffy was so dense enough to do that.
This still has nothing to do with being a yonko.

What is the goal of a Yonkou?

Brownbeard and many other pirates conquer territoriess as well, it's still has nothing to do with becoming a yonko. Hence why I posted that scan of a weak worthless pirate (brownbeard) taking over Wb's Foodvalten territory, so what's so hard for you to understand?

It means absolutely nothing in gaining a title. Luffy became a Yonko by owning #0 territory (which I mentioned before) so your theory is flawed.

Did you know that in the new world, it is govern by the 4 emperors and not the WG? So why wont an Emperor not own some?

Luffy might not have declared some territories but we know he is gonna protect some where he defeated enemies already. Like I said, Luffy has put fight to places already conquer by Emperors such as Dressrosa or the gyojin Island. Even in chapter 903, the king said that Gyojin Island was gonna be put under the protection of Luffy.

Luffy didn't rule any sea, and he said so himself that he doesn't want to either. Only the original Yonko's rule the seas because they rule over territories closer to Onepiece. They have the red poneglyph.

And the red poneglyh are to fin the one piece. Luffy didnt want rule the seas just as Whitebeard only wanted a family, not even the one piece yet is called a Yonkou and for what reasons? Power is not only the reason, but of course it is very important.

That doesnt change the fact the he is ruling anywhere he goes even if he does not want to.

This doesn't make any sense. The whole purpose of Teech and Luffy gaining new positions is because they defeated some one powerful not stalemate them. Mihawk already holds a current title anyways, he does whatever he wants.

I know they defeated. But Mihawk having many battles and not dying doesnt show he is strong as a Yonkou in some terms?

Difference between them, Mihawks does not have a fleet, does not want the one piece, he might not even have a territories besides the one where he trained Zoro.

kiiro · Jun 1, 2018

Sir Blades said:
Yeah, that's gonna be a no. :tea:
Rikudo has already more than made it clear.

Clear what? Just defeating a first commander? Did you even see the news?

Defeating Katakuri was the last thing mentioned of all what Luffy did in Big Mom teritory and just because that he a Emperor?

You cant make blind people see. Luffy did more than defeating Katakuri.

Rikudou Tobi · Jun 1, 2018

kiiro said:
oK, lets make it easy.

What is the goal of a Yonkou?

There is no goal, it's just a title of feats. Whitebeard wanted to honor

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on behalf of of Roger's legacy in fact he wanted his blood son to become the Pirate King not he himself to become one.
Shanks was already part of the crew who conquered the seas and Linlin herself wanted to

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.

Everyone has a different purpose. Point is that Yonko is a title (at least pre timeskip) as the strongest pirates in the grand line.

Did you know that in the new world, it is govern by the 4 emperors and not the WG? So why wont an Emperor not own some?

Luffy might not have declared some territories but we know he is gonna protect some where he defeated enemies already. Like I said, Luffy has put fight to places already conquer by Emperors such as Dressrosa or the gyojin Island. Even in chapter 903, the king said that Gyojin Island was gonna be put under the protection of Luffy.

1. Brownbeard doesn't work for the WG, he's a pirate.

2. Regardless of what territories you think Luffy will and will not own later down the road, it still wasn't responsible for making Luffy to become a yonko

And the red poneglyh are to fin the one piece. Luffy didnt want rule the seas just as Whitebeard only wanted a family, not even the one piece yet is called a Yonkou and for what reasons? Power is not only the reason, but of course it is very important.

This doesn't make any sense. Whitebeard wanted a family but he still wanted to conquer some of the land underneath his own domain. He just labelled those people under his rule as his children.

That doesnt change the fact the he is ruling anywhere he goes even if he does not want to.

But luffy's not, so I don't get your point here. It was just recently that the fisherman island shifted over to Luffy's side for the sake of Jimbei.

I know they defeated. But Mihawk having many battles and not dying doesnt show he is strong as a Yonkou in some terms?

Difference between them, Mihawks does not have a fleet, does not want the one piece, he might not even have a territories besides the one where he trained Zoro.

Mihawk has a territory just like every other pre-timeskip Warlord does. The rest is not a fact but a speculation. Why don't know what Mihawk's true goal is in the first place.

Rikudou Tobi · Jun 1, 2018

I'm just gonna stop here, you've already made up your mind and you're very strongly opinionated about this matter. I already said what I needed to anyways.

kiiro · Jun 1, 2018

Rikudou Tobi said:
I'm just gonna stop here, you've already made up your mind and you're very strongly opinionated about this matter. I already said what I needed to anyways.

You twist the things to try to sound right.

But beating someone wont make you an Emperor.

[Discussion] Reason Luffy is Fifth Emperor

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