[Discussion] Rank the Yonko, Shichibukai and Admirals

Hijey

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So we agree that using Mihawk's past clashes with Shanks doesn't show he is currently on that level? Good, then I don't need to speak on that anymore.

So from what I see, you are basing this off Rayleigh's clash with Kizaru and hype. First of all, I'm guessing you believe Mihawk>Rayleigh because of the title, seeing as Rayleigh is a swordsman? Well, whilst fighting Kizaru Rayleigh says "its been a while since I have held a sword". So Mihawk most likely attained the title after Rayleigh was inactive as a pirate and stopped using his swords to become a Coating Mechanic shortly after Roger died. Meaning he wasn't counted when Mihawk became the WSS.
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Second, Rayleigh fighting with Kizaru or a short while doesn't mean his is on that level. Like you said with the Vista/Mihawk fight, it just means he is strong enough to at least give him a battle. That is the point I was trying to get across. So no, I wouldn't say current Rayleigh is Admiral level, probably just underneath Admiral level though we haven't seen much from him. This is also hinted when Rayleigh explains that he is getting old and tires easily. All other hype relating to Rayleigh refers to his prime days back when he was with Roger.

Again, you keep talking about Mihawk having hype which puts him at Admiral level when there is none. Then you say none of the other Warlords have hype that does when I just gave you some clear hype of Doflamingo's. Clearly Aokiji explains that Doflamingo's prowess as a pirate is unrivalled here:

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Aokiji also says that Akainu should immediately dispatch the Admirals (plural) to deal with him, and explains that he is the biggest threat to the new marines HQ.This should automatically puts him at Admiral level and above Mihawk as, Mihawk has no hype which can counteract it.

Against Aokiji he was panting… he had just come all the way from Dressrosa to PH and just finished fighting a VA and other marines then gets attacked whilst his back was turned… It is clear that Aokiji himself sees Dofla as a very big threat.

Read what Doflamingo says to Aokiji:

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"Ill take a rain check… but if that little turd there decides to flap his gums… well see this dance through to its conclusion."

It is also funny how you keep trying to foresee how the story will end up… you are not Oda. I believe Shilliew will defeat Mihawk and will be Zoro's biggest challenge. But obviously none of us know how the story will turn out.

Doflamingo wasn't worried about Fujitora strength… he was just surprised that Fujitora would use a large scale attack like that when he has his own men around, which is why he questioned what Fujitora was doing. The attack could have hurt anyone. Even Fujitora himself had to pull out his sword to block his own attack. Doflamingo easily uses his strings to cut the meteor up and guess what? He wasn't even panting.

Doflamingo did come on unscathed in the war. Are you really going to bring up a panel with dirt or something on his face to tell me he was harmed? Doflamingo is clearly seen with nothing on his face a few pages after:

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And like I said before, I put Kuma up there because of how well he has mastered his DF. He is far faster than those mentioned and has shown incredible reflexes being able to easilyly counter a close range bloodlust G2 puffy attack, making it extremely difficult for someone to hit him without being caught off guard. He has near enough limitless stamina being a Cyborg and obviously very high durability. He has island level destructive capacity and basically one touch from him and it is over. An out of breath Luffy managed to dodge point blank slashed from Mihawk… they shouldn't be a problem at all for Kuma.
Yes.

That argument never gets old. When or who Mihawk beat to get the title is irrelevant. Oda has stated Mihawk is the world's strongest swordsmen - it is a fact and it means he is stronger than Rayleigh. The point of Mihawk's character is to make whoever beats him the strongest swordsman.

Rayleigh was mentioned in the same breath as WB. Garp said the WG wouldn't be able to handle him while fighting WB. It doesn't matter wether his prime comes from the past - it's the same with Sengoku/Garp/WB as well. Prime or not, Rayleigh has as much hype as the big boys out there and was portrayed to be as strong as Kizaru. It is in no way comparable with Vista who we know for a fact is weaker than Mihawk and just one of the people who lack the hype but was able to prove he can fight the big boys for some time.

The ultimate obstacle Zoro (who has always been on the same level as the future PK throughout the series and only second to him) is going to fight someone who is not on that level? That's funny because being the guy one of the main characters want to surpass means you have to be super strong as we also see this with Shanks. He is at the top of all swordsmen which includes someone like Rayleigh and possible even Shanks if he doesn't have anything other than swordsmanship.

Like I said, that the translation you're using doesn't make any sense at all. Cnet/CCC have proven themselves to be the best and theirs make the most sense.

Cnet:
Kuzan: At any rate, you people should keep a close eye on Doflamingo. / He is both a Shichibukai and the current King of Dresrosa... // In a different way from the Hebihime of the Kuja, he is a special case to say the least. / You should contact Sakazuki and have the Admirals take action. // In the worst-case scenario, he could send a whole chain of gears running awry... // ...and cause the biggest incident... // ...since Sakazuki established his new Marine HQ.

CCC:
Kuzan: “Anyway… don’t take your eyes off of Doflamingo”
“He’s a Shichibukai and the current king of Dressrosa”
“But he’s different from the Snake Princess of the Kuja. A pirate who’s exceptional in more ways than one.”

“Contact Sakazuki and tell him to mobilize the Admirals”
“Things could go from bad to worse, and fast…”
“It could be the most dire situation…”
“That Sakazuki and his new Marine HQ have faced”

Doflamingo, who's prowess is supposedly unrivalled, is the guy that becomes scared at the thought of hearing Kaido's name? Doesn't make sense at all. We've seen how the likes of Akainu who are the counterpart of the top pirates deal with the likes of people like Ace/Iva/Jinbei who all are on the same level as Law and that is flat out destroy them, even when not heavily injured. Doflamingo who's prowess is supposedly unrivalled was not only fighting an injured and tired Law for some time but on top of that he got damaged. Law put up a low difficulty fight so that means it would be mid difficulty or so if he was injured.

Doflamingo is the biggest threat to the new marine HQ who are located in the New World because of his business - the SAD which everyone are interested in. (// In the worst-case scenario, he could send a whole chain of gears running awry... // ...and cause the biggest incident...) Akainu only sent one Admiral to deal with the situation so that obviously means an Admiral needs to be sent in order to guarantee a victory. Doflamingo doesn't have any hype that suggests he is on the same level as the man Zoro wants to surpass. He is however on the same level as the current Luffy who's going to defeat him this arc and this Luffy is on the same level as Ace which Kizaru who was portayed as strong as a man weaker than Mihawk could fodderize like his Fleet Admiral since he's slightly weaker than him(or slighty stronger, whichever you prefer).

Good one. There was no sign of him panting from the time he arrived to PH till the time Aokiji appeared. Only when he was casually frozen by an ex Admiral did he begin heavily panting. It was Doflamingo who underestimated the speed of an ex Admiral and figured the distance between them was enough to finish off a threat to his business before the ex Admiral can stop him and not that Aokiji saw Doflamingo as a threat.

That's not what people who are known to be consistent have translated. And again, this one makes much more sense given Doflamingo's action after this incident.

Cnet:
Doflamingo: I don't feel like fighting with you... Fuffuffu!!! / But if I won't be able to silence that man... // I suppose I'll have to take a different approach!! // ...Mind if I ask you something?

CCC:
DD: “I don’t much feel like fighting you… fuffuffu!!”
“But if I’m unable to silence that man here and now…”
“I’ll have to change my plans!!”

It's funny how you believe Shilliew is going to defeat Mihawk when there is absolutely nothing pointing towards that. Exactly what implies that's going to happen? Sometimes you don't need to be Oda to 'predict' these kinds of things and this is one of those things. It's been heavily foreshadowed Blackbeard will be the man Luffy will fight for his dream since Jaya arc but of course since he's not Mihawk it is going to happen, aye? There's as much chance the people implied to lose to Luffy will be replaced like the ones implied Zoro is going to defeat, but it is so small that you shouldn't put that over what is more likely to happen.

Easily? The only one who cut it easily was the same man who caused the attack - the blind Admiral. You can see by Doflamingo's and Law's facial expression they put in effort into getting out of that danger which an Admiral level opponent casually performed. He could have ran away like how the fodder marines had plently of time to but he trusted his own abilities which did work but with effort.

That would be blood and not dirt. Akainu was also seen completely fine after his battle with WB even though the page before and the page after shows he was not. It's the same with Doflamingo. He got an injury on a specific place but Oda forgot to have add it on that panel. It's funny because I just noticed it's on similar place Law damaged him. Perhaps someone of Law's calibre did it to him in the war.

He wasn't fast enough to finish off an exhausted and injured Zoro who was fighting for hours. In fact, he needed to use a named attack that was 100 of them which moved at the speed of light and not a single one of them touched Zoro in the sad state he was in. The one time he speed blitzed Zoro was when Zoro was getting back up from when Kuma deflected his attack because of not having haki. High durability? Sure. But no endurance. Being made of the same things as the Pacifista's which the M3 can easily destroy with one move is bad. Enel is extremely fast, can finish off people with one move, bad endurance and island DC just like Kuma but that doesn't mean he's stronger than the people you placed below Kuma. Mihawk was testing Luffy's strength and he was able to damage Luffy from a far distance without hitting anyone in between them so that tells how how accurate his long ranged attacks are. Rayleigh is 100 stronger than Luffy and that means it's more for Mihawk since he's stronger than Rayleigh so they basically barely need to flex their muscles to get rid of the likes of Luffy. Oh and Mihawk casually and by mistake cut that iceberg in half from a far distance without the use of devil fruit and only Admiral level people have done stuff like these(Kizaru in SA). Kuma looking good in those situations doesn't put him above Mihawk, Doflamingo, Boa, and Law because we know for a fact they would also look good as well. They have much better feat for defeating Vice Admirals or being strong enough to stalemate an Admiral(Mihawk) and those are many times stronger than the SH combined so until Kuma proves he can do the same, you have no right putting him above them. Like I said, we have good indication were how strong the normal Kuma was which is on the same level as Ivankov who implied he was stronger than Kuma. Could that have changed, since it was in the past? Absolutely. However, not by a signifcant amount because never points to that and Oda left it ambigous so the difference is small. What we can deduce is that they are on the same level, regardless who is stronger. What happens to people at that said level? They get destroyed by the Admiral level people as we've seen Akainu do so with three different people of that level while people like Rayleigh who is weaker than Mihawk was shown to be as strong as Kizaru who is slightly weaker than Akainu(or slightly stronger, if you will). If I'm not mistaken, Rayleigh was confident he could protect the SH from both Kizaru and Kuma if he was at his peak which again means Kuma was far off Admiral level because it's simple math that two from same level > one from same level.
 

iSpeak

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Yes.

That argument never gets old. When or who Mihawk beat to get the title is irrelevant. Oda has stated Mihawk is the world's strongest swordsmen - it is a fact and it means he is stronger than Rayleigh. The point of Mihawk's character is to make whoever beats him the strongest swordsman.

Rayleigh was mentioned in the same breath as WB. Garp said the WG wouldn't be able to handle him while fighting WB. It doesn't matter wether his prime comes from the past - it's the same with Sengoku/Garp/WB as well. Prime or not, Rayleigh has as much hype as the big boys out there and was portrayed to be as strong as Kizaru. It is in no way comparable with Vista who we know for a fact is weaker than Mihawk and just one of the people who lack the hype but was able to prove he can fight the big boys for some time.

The ultimate obstacle Zoro (who has always been on the same level as the future PK throughout the series and only second to him) is going to fight someone who is not on that level? That's funny because being the guy one of the main characters want to surpass means you have to be super strong as we also see this with Shanks. He is at the top of all swordsmen which includes someone like Rayleigh and possible even Shanks if he doesn't have anything other than swordsmanship.

Like I said, that the translation you're using doesn't make any sense at all. Cnet/CCC have proven themselves to be the best and theirs make the most sense.

Cnet:
Kuzan: At any rate, you people should keep a close eye on Doflamingo. / He is both a Shichibukai and the current King of Dresrosa... // In a different way from the Hebihime of the Kuja, he is a special case to say the least. / You should contact Sakazuki and have the Admirals take action. // In the worst-case scenario, he could send a whole chain of gears running awry... // ...and cause the biggest incident... // ...since Sakazuki established his new Marine HQ.

CCC:
Kuzan: “Anyway… don’t take your eyes off of Doflamingo”
“He’s a Shichibukai and the current king of Dressrosa”
“But he’s different from the Snake Princess of the Kuja. A pirate who’s exceptional in more ways than one.”

“Contact Sakazuki and tell him to mobilize the Admirals”
“Things could go from bad to worse, and fast…”
“It could be the most dire situation…”
“That Sakazuki and his new Marine HQ have faced”

Doflamingo, who's prowess is supposedly unrivalled, is the guy that becomes scared at the thought of hearing Kaido's name? Doesn't make sense at all. We've seen how the likes of Akainu who are the counterpart of the top pirates deal with the likes of people like Ace/Iva/Jinbei who all are on the same level as Law and that is flat out destroy them, even when not heavily injured. Doflamingo who's prowess is supposedly unrivalled was not only fighting an injured and tired Law for some time but on top of that he got damaged. Law put up a low difficulty fight so that means it would be mid difficulty or so if he was injured.

Doflamingo is the biggest threat to the new marine HQ who are located in the New World because of his business - the SAD which everyone are interested in. (// In the worst-case scenario, he could send a whole chain of gears running awry... // ...and cause the biggest incident...) Akainu only sent one Admiral to deal with the situation so that obviously means an Admiral needs to be sent in order to guarantee a victory. Doflamingo doesn't have any hype that suggests he is on the same level as the man Zoro wants to surpass. He is however on the same level as the current Luffy who's going to defeat him this arc and this Luffy is on the same level as Ace which Kizaru who was portayed as strong as a man weaker than Mihawk could fodderize like his Fleet Admiral since he's slightly weaker than him(or slighty stronger, whichever you prefer).

Good one. There was no sign of him panting from the time he arrived to PH till the time Aokiji appeared. Only when he was casually frozen by an ex Admiral did he begin heavily panting. It was Doflamingo who underestimated the speed of an ex Admiral and figured the distance between them was enough to finish off a threat to his business before the ex Admiral can stop him and not that Aokiji saw Doflamingo as a threat.

That's not what people who are known to be consistent have translated. And again, this one makes much more sense given Doflamingo's action after this incident.

Cnet:
Doflamingo: I don't feel like fighting with you... Fuffuffu!!! / But if I won't be able to silence that man... // I suppose I'll have to take a different approach!! // ...Mind if I ask you something?

CCC:
DD: “I don’t much feel like fighting you… fuffuffu!!”
“But if I’m unable to silence that man here and now…”
“I’ll have to change my plans!!”

It's funny how you believe Shilliew is going to defeat Mihawk when there is absolutely nothing pointing towards that. Exactly what implies that's going to happen? Sometimes you don't need to be Oda to 'predict' these kinds of things and this is one of those things. It's been heavily foreshadowed Blackbeard will be the man Luffy will fight for his dream since Jaya arc but of course since he's not Mihawk it is going to happen, aye? There's as much chance the people implied to lose to Luffy will be replaced like the ones implied Zoro is going to defeat, but it is so small that you shouldn't put that over what is more likely to happen.

Easily? The only one who cut it easily was the same man who caused the attack - the blind Admiral. You can see by Doflamingo's and Law's facial expression they put in effort into getting out of that danger which an Admiral level opponent casually performed. He could have ran away like how the fodder marines had plently of time to but he trusted his own abilities which did work but with effort.

That would be blood and not dirt. Akainu was also seen completely fine after his battle with WB even though the page before and the page after shows he was not. It's the same with Doflamingo. He got an injury on a specific place but Oda forgot to have add it on that panel. It's funny because I just noticed it's on similar place Law damaged him. Perhaps someone of Law's calibre did it to him in the war.

He wasn't fast enough to finish off an exhausted and injured Zoro who was fighting for hours. In fact, he needed to use a named attack that was 100 of them which moved at the speed of light and not a single one of them touched Zoro in the sad state he was in. The one time he speed blitzed Zoro was when Zoro was getting back up from when Kuma deflected his attack because of not having haki. High durability? Sure. But no endurance. Being made of the same things as the Pacifista's which the M3 can easily destroy with one move is bad. Enel is extremely fast, can finish off people with one move, bad endurance and island DC just like Kuma but that doesn't mean he's stronger than the people you placed below Kuma. Mihawk was testing Luffy's strength and he was able to damage Luffy from a far distance without hitting anyone in between them so that tells how how accurate his long ranged attacks are. Rayleigh is 100 stronger than Luffy and that means it's more for Mihawk since he's stronger than Rayleigh so they basically barely need to flex their muscles to get rid of the likes of Luffy. Oh and Mihawk casually and by mistake cut that iceberg in half from a far distance without the use of devil fruit and only Admiral level people have done stuff like these(Kizaru in SA). Kuma looking good in those situations doesn't put him above Mihawk, Doflamingo, Boa, and Law because we know for a fact they would also look good as well. They have much better feat for defeating Vice Admirals or being strong enough to stalemate an Admiral(Mihawk) and those are many times stronger than the SH combined so until Kuma proves he can do the same, you have no right putting him above them. Like I said, we have good indication were how strong the normal Kuma was which is on the same level as Ivankov who implied he was stronger than Kuma. Could that have changed, since it was in the past? Absolutely. However, not by a signifcant amount because never points to that and Oda left it ambigous so the difference is small. What we can deduce is that they are on the same level, regardless who is stronger. What happens to people at that said level? They get destroyed by the Admiral level people as we've seen Akainu do so with three different people of that level while people like Rayleigh who is weaker than Mihawk was shown to be as strong as Kizaru who is slightly weaker than Akainu(or slightly stronger, if you will). If I'm not mistaken, Rayleigh was confident he could protect the SH from both Kizaru and Kuma if he was at his peak which again means Kuma was far off Admiral level because it's simple math that two from same level > one from same level.
Do you honestly take everything in the manga literally from Oda's POV? Kaido was stated as the strongest creature/thing, why is he not #1 on your emperors list?

Im going to keep telling you this because it seems like you just dont get it. You cant read Oda's mind and do not know his intentions for the story. You do not know the backstory of how or when Mihawk got the title. What we do know is that Rayleigh put down his sword a few years after roger died (24 years ago) to become a coating mechanic. This is backed up by his statement whilst fighting kizaru. We know Rayleigh has been inactive as a swordsman and pirate altogether for many years meaning it is highly likely that Mihawk gained the title during this time.

Honestly you just keep contradicting yourself which is the problem. You say current Rayleigh is "portrayed" as strong as Kizaru (even though he himself admitted he gets warn out easy), then you say Vista is "obviously" weaker than Mihawk when they have the same feat. This is what I mean about fans making up their own hype and trying to dictate which feats are valid. Unlike Garp, Segoku and WB, Rayleigh has been inactive for about 20+ years. Understand this. He fought Kizaru for a short period, this does not mean his is Admirals level.

The translation does make sense… the whole subject of Aokiji's speech seems to be based specifically around the Warlords. Aokiji starts with "He is only a Shichibukai but he's parlayed that into becoming royalty of dressrosa", explaining what Doflamingo has been able to achieve as a Warlord. He then compares him to another warlord but states that his prowess is unrivalled (to the other Warlords).

Ill accept that things do get mistranslated and it could be a mistake, but I'm not going to take another persons interpretations against the one more widely used. I would rather want to see what the official Viz translations say about it, but I can't get it…

Anyway, my point is that Doflamingo has shown many times that he isn't scared of any Admiral… he even threw the first attack when Fujitora tried to approach him with hostility. He "walked away" from Aokijij because he saw no use in fighting all of them when his main targets are Luffy and Law. Doflamingo isn't stupid enough to get himself into a pointless fight which will more than likely end with heavy injuries on both sides. That fact that he ignored what Aokiji said, turned his back and proceeded to attack Smoker shows he has no fear of Aokiji.

Okay, you say it has been "heavily foreshadowed" that BB will be the man Luffy fights for his dream. You also say it was foreshadowed that BB and shanks will fight. For both of these to happen, it would mean BB would fight Shanks and win, then be Luffy's final obstacle for One Piece. So tell me why you have Shanks over BB? BB should be #1 on your list according to you. Obviously like I keep saying, there is no telling what can happen in a story will go. A good narrative will always have twists etc in their work. Do you know what a plot twist is? Robin formally working for Crocodile to being a straw hat. Plot twist. Ace being such an important character for Luffy and in the series, first non flash back main death in the story. Plot twist. Sabo thought to originally be dead but makes return. Plot twist. Garp, Sengoku and Aokiji left the Marines. Plot twist. Ect. No matter what you think, you need to understand that not everything happens how you would have originally believed.

Like I said before, Doflamingo was shocked that the Admiral would use such I wide scale attack which would hit everyone there. Doflamingo is clearly not afraid of either Fuji or Aokiji. Don't really understand how you cannot even see that.

Ohhhhhh I see, Oda "forgot" to have added it on the panel. Yes of course it all makes sense now. I would have to believe you on that one right? No. clearly it wasn't intended to be an injury otherwise it would have been shown and made clearer. Look at the other panels no the page. They are blood. What is on Doflamingo's face is obviously not blood.

Mihawk cut the iceberg which is cool, but he missed his target which was standing right in front of him… then he continued to miss more slashes aimed at Luffy straight afterwards. Mihawk only managed to hit puffy because he wasn't expecting it at that point. If PTS Luffy is dodging them point blank ease, Kuma is dodging them with no problems at all. Mihawk cutting an Iceburg means nothing to Kuma…. he can deflect anything. Mihawk has never even fought an Admiral let alone stalemated one. If any of the Warlords have, it would be Doflamingo.
Ivan implied she was stronger than Kuma yet Ivans trademark move did 0 damage to PX-0 from point blank range. Ivan says she is going all out on Kuma, yet we see Kume later on no harm done. Just because she "implies" something, doesn't mean it was true. Crocodile "implied" he could kill WB, does that mean it is true?
Yawn, you keep saying Mihawk > Rayleigh which is not necessarily true. I have already explained why. Plus, Rayleigh isn't admiral level just because he fought Kizaru for a short while. Like I said before, he himself admitted that he gets warn out easily. If Rayleigh was "portrayed" as strong as Kizaru then Vista was "portrayed" as strong as Mihawk and Doflamingo was "portrayed" stronger than Vista.
First of all none of us know how strong Rayleigh was in his peak. Infact, he probably was above Admiral level. Secondly, he didn't imply he could take on both Kizaru and Kuma in a 2v1. He implied he would be able to get past Kizaru and help out against Kuma.
From looking at both of their abilities and what they have show, Kuma beats Mihawk. The only thing you are using to try and disprove this are your own interpreted "implications and suggestions" which hold absolutely no weight at all, and indirect hype relating to other characters. This is why Mihawk is one of the most overrated characters in OP.
 
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BigBlade Master

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Yonko

1. Whitebeard
2. Blackbeard
3. Shanks
4. BigMom
5. Kaido


Shichibukai

1. Mihawk
2. Doflamingo
3. Jinbei
4. Hancock
5. Kuma
6. Law
7. Crocodile
8. Moriah
9. Buggy

Admiral

1. Akainu
2. Aokiji
3. Sengoku
4. Kizaru
5. Fujitora (??????)
6. Garp
 

Hijey

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Do you honestly take everything in the manga literally from Oda's POV? Kaido was stated as the strongest creature/thing, why is he not #1 on your emperors list?

Im going to keep telling you this because it seems like you just dont get it. You cant read Oda's mind and do not know his intentions for the story. You do not know the backstory of how or when Mihawk got the title. What we do know is that Rayleigh put down his sword a few years after roger died (24 years ago) to become a coating mechanic. This is backed up by his statement whilst fighting kizaru. We know Rayleigh has been inactive as a swordsman and pirate altogether for many years meaning it is highly likely that Mihawk gained the title during this time.

Honestly you just keep contradicting yourself which is the problem. You say current Rayleigh is "portrayed" as strong as Kizaru (even though he himself admitted he gets warn out easy), then you say Vista is "obviously" weaker than Mihawk when they have the same feat. This is what I mean about fans making up their own hype and trying to dictate which feats are valid. Unlike Garp, Segoku and WB, Rayleigh has been inactive for about 20+ years. Understand this. He fought Kizaru for a short period, this does not mean his is Admirals level.

The translation does make sense… the whole subject of Aokiji's speech seems to be based specifically around the Warlords. Aokiji starts with "He is only a Shichibukai but he's parlayed that into becoming royalty of dressrosa", explaining what Doflamingo has been able to achieve as a Warlord. He then compares him to another warlord but states that his prowess is unrivalled (to the other Warlords).

Ill accept that things do get mistranslated and it could be a mistake, but I'm not going to take another persons interpretations against the one more widely used. I would rather want to see what the official Viz translations say about it, but I can't get it…

Anyway, my point is that Doflamingo has shown many times that he isn't scared of any Admiral… he even threw the first attack when Fujitora tried to approach him with hostility. He "walked away" from Aokijij because he saw no use in fighting all of them when his main targets are Luffy and Law. Doflamingo isn't stupid enough to get himself into a pointless fight which will more than likely end with heavy injuries on both sides. That fact that he ignored what Aokiji said, turned his back and proceeded to attack Smoker shows he has no fear of Aokiji.

Okay, you say it has been "heavily foreshadowed" that BB will be the man Luffy fights for his dream. You also say it was foreshadowed that BB and shanks will fight. For both of these to happen, it would mean BB would fight Shanks and win, then be Luffy's final obstacle for One Piece. So tell me why you have Shanks over BB? BB should be #1 on your list according to you. Obviously like I keep saying, there is no telling what can happen in a story will go. A good narrative will always have twists etc in their work. Do you know what a plot twist is? Robin formally working for Crocodile to being a straw hat. Plot twist. Ace being such an important character for Luffy and in the series, first non flash back main death in the story. Plot twist. Sabo thought to originally be dead but makes return. Plot twist. Garp, Sengoku and Aokiji left the Marines. Plot twist. Ect. No matter what you think, you need to understand that not everything happens how you would have originally believed.

Like I said before, Doflamingo was shocked that the Admiral would use such I wide scale attack which would hit everyone there. Doflamingo is clearly not afraid of either Fuji or Aokiji. Don't really understand how you cannot even see that.

Ohhhhhh I see, Oda "forgot" to have added it on the panel. Yes of course it all makes sense now. I would have to believe you on that one right? No. clearly it wasn't intended to be an injury otherwise it would have been shown and made clearer. Look at the other panels no the page. They are blood. What is on Doflamingo's face is obviously not blood.

Mihawk cut the iceberg which is cool, but he missed his target which was standing right in front of him… then he continued to miss more slashes aimed at Luffy straight afterwards. Mihawk only managed to hit puffy because he wasn't expecting it at that point. If PTS Luffy is dodging them point blank ease, Kuma is dodging them with no problems at all. Mihawk cutting an Iceburg means nothing to Kuma…. he can deflect anything. Mihawk has never even fought an Admiral let alone stalemated one. If any of the Warlords have, it would be Doflamingo.
Ivan implied she was stronger than Kuma yet Ivans trademark move did 0 damage to PX-0 from point blank range. Ivan says she is going all out on Kuma, yet we see Kume later on no harm done. Just because she "implies" something, doesn't mean it was true. Crocodile "implied" he could kill WB, does that mean it is true?
Yawn, you keep saying Mihawk > Rayleigh which is not necessarily true. I have already explained why. Plus, Rayleigh isn't admiral level just because he fought Kizaru for a short while. Like I said before, he himself admitted that he gets warn out easily. If Rayleigh was "portrayed" as strong as Kizaru then Vista was "portrayed" as strong as Mihawk and Doflamingo was "portrayed" stronger than Vista.
First of all none of us know how strong Rayleigh was in his peak. Infact, he probably was above Admiral level. Secondly, he didn't imply he could take on both Kizaru and Kuma in a 2v1. He implied he would be able to get past Kizaru and help out against Kuma.
From looking at both of their abilities and what they have show, Kuma beats Mihawk. The only thing you are using to try and disprove this are your own interpreted "implications and suggestions" which hold absolutely no weight at all, and indirect hype relating to other characters. This is why Mihawk is one of the most overrated characters in OP.
What the hell? Of course. This isn't Naruto or some other garbage. We don't know if Kaido's title refers to the humans or not. He could have had that title while the man who had the strongest man title was alive so it could refer to people such as Bepo.

One does not need to read Oda's mind about something like this. For all we know, Mihawk could have sought out Rayleigh and beat him or beat someone stronger than Rayleigh - it does not matter whatsoever at all. Oda knows the manga better than you and I. He stated Mihawk is the strongest swordsman, it is a fact. End of story. Like I said, the existence of the strongst swordsman in the world is to be surpassed by someone - someone who is becoming stronger, one of our MC's or Blackbeard's strongest subordinate even though nothing really points to that as of now. Funny how someone who claims Mihawk is overrated is arguing against a fact stated by Oda.

Which he was. We don't know who would win in a fight between Rayleigh and Kizaru. We know Kizaru does not have a superior hype than Rayleigh so we go by the way they were portrayed. Mihawk is not only confirmed to be stronger than Vista but he also has superior hype. So what if he was inactive? That only speaks volumes about what kind of monster he was back in the day. He is so strong that even losing so much strength over the years, Garp mentions him in the same breath as Whitebeard of all people and how the marines can not handle him while fighting WB and Co. Not only did he damage an Admiral at the start of their fight but he was also strong enough to escape him. He is clearly an Admiral level fighter.

Aokiji was talking about Doflamingo's connection - that is what sets him apart from the other Warlords. Thanks to his lineage and business, Doflamingo is a man who is difficult to deal with. Aokiji never compared his prowess to the Warlords but to any pirate out there. So no, that translation doesn't make any sense at all. A pirate whos prowess is even above the Emperors who the Strawhats with their current level can't tackle isn't going to be their first real threat in the NW.

So, suddenly you want to see what Viz translated to? I don't see what difference it would make if what Viz said is exactly the same as the reliable ones I've direct you towards because I'm sure you're way too biased to change your mind.

As long as Doflamingo is a Warlord, Fujitora is unable to touch him - Doflamingo is aware of that. Who the hell are all of them? The only threat to Doflamingo was Aokiji. Smoker was done for and the G-5 are fodders. Doflamingo was bloodlusted at the time Aokiji approached him and he was a second away of getting rid of a near dead danger to his business which he spent 10 year on in order to become the king of the Pirates - it's excepted of him not to show "fear" and try one last time. One casual attack is all it took to stop him and that scene portrayed him to be a lot weaker than an Admiral who could possibly be weaker than Kizaru.

Blackbeard just became an Emperor. I don't think two years is enough for him to have gone from being someone a dead WB could crush to being the strongest Emperor. The time Oda hints at that it's time for him to fight Shanks and Co is when he'll have surpassed Shanks. I imagine the Blackbeard pirates and the Strawhat pirates will hit their peak around the same time, like an arc or two away.

I guess neither is Law? Doflamingo is afraid of Admiral level fighters like how Nami, Brook and Chopper are afraid of people like Doflamingo. He had all the time in the world to escape from the attack like his fodder companion CC and those marines were able to. Oda showcased the difference between an Admiral level fighter and two people on the same level.

Alrigt, it's ambigous. Either one of us could be right about this but I'll drop it.

Mihawk was testing Luffy. He wasn't trying to get rid of Luffy like how Oda showed Kuma was after an extremely injured, tired Zoro who is much slower than G2 speed. Kuma can deflect anything that doesn't have haki imbued like how Law can cut anything that isn't haki imbued, so having stronger haki would mean Mihawk's monstrous strength that can cut an iceberg in half would be trouble for Kuma. Doflamingo never fought an Admiral. He was embarrased by two different Admirals when he he had the chance to step up. Mihawk doesn't need to defeat/stalemate an Admiral as long as weaker swordsmen than him do it, e.g Rayleigh so Mihawk is capable of doing it. Luffy's tademark failed against a non white mode Hyouzo as well as was poisoned in the process. When he became white mode, he was so weak he couldn't even kill Zoro's boredom. I guess that means Luffy is weaker than Hyozou, eh? We know for a fact that Crocodile, who was on similar level as pre skip Luffy, was flat out lying because WB was A L O T stronger than him. We have no reason to believe it's the case with Iva/Kuma who are companions that know each other. Ivankov could be stronger or he could be weaker because the past is the past. I'm not picking one over the other. Unlike you, I'm not saying one is on another level than the other when nothing hints at that. They are on same level, meaning Kizaru can destroy someone like Kuma but not a guy weaker than Mihawk, Rayleigh. Mihawk>Rayleigh is true seeing as how the author, the one who knows the manga from the back of his head, stated it. Mihawk, Kizaru, Rayleigh, Vista are all on the same general level, but that doesn't mean one can't be stronger than the other. Rayleigh/Kizaru were portrayed as strong and we don't know who is stronger. Mihawk and Vista were portrayed as strong and we know that Mihawk is stronger. Point is, they are on the same level. If we look at Law's abilities, he beats Mihawk, Shanks, Rayleigh. Doesn't work that way, I'm afraid. Kuma having a hax ability means jack shit. As long as he is someone around Iva's strength, he isn't beating Mihawk/Rayleigh/Shanks who can play with Admiral while the former two get destroyed. Holding a man Zoro wants to surpass in high regard is overrated? By that logic, Shanks is also overrated because most people think he is the strongest alive right now since Luffy wants to surpass him. It's not even certain that Kuma or Ivankov are stronger the current M3, Law, Smoker etc since they're on the same level. While Zoro/Luffy will surpass the people they wanna surpass near the end of the serie
 
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Red Swag

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THIS:

Yonko

1.Shanks
2.Whitebeard
3.Kaido
4.Blackbeard
5.Big mam

Shichibukai

1.Dracule Mihawk
2.Doflamingo
3.Trafalgar Law
4.Kuma
5.Boa
6.Croco
7.Jinbei
8.Gekko Moriah
9.Captain Buggy

Admirals

1.Monkey D. Garp
2.Akainu
3.Kizaru
4.Fujitora
5.Sengoku
6.Aokiji
 

iSpeak

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What the hell? Of course. This isn't Naruto or some other garbage. We don't know if Kaido's title refers to the humans or not. He could have had that title while the man who had the strongest man title was alive so it could refer to people such as Bepo.

One does not need to read Oda's mind about something like this. For all we know, Mihawk could have sought out Rayleigh and beat him or beat someone stronger than Rayleigh - it does not matter whatsoever at all. Oda knows the manga better than you and I. He stated Mihawk is the strongest swordsman, it is a fact. End of story. Like I said, the existence of the strongst swordsman in the world is to be surpassed by someone - someone who is becoming stronger, one of our MC's or Blackbeard's strongest subordinate even though nothing really points to that as of now. Funny how someone who claims Mihawk is overrated is arguing against a fact stated by Oda.

Which he was. We don't know who would win in a fight between Rayleigh and Kizaru. We know Kizaru does not have a superior hype than Rayleigh so we go by the way they were portrayed. Mihawk is not only confirmed to be stronger than Vista but he also has superior hype. So what if he was inactive? That only speaks volumes about what kind of monster he was back in the day. He is so strong that even losing so much strength over the years, Garp mentions him in the same breath as Whitebeard of all people and how the marines can not handle him while fighting WB and Co. Not only did he damage an Admiral at the start of their fight but he was also strong enough to escape him. He is clearly an Admiral level fighter.

Aokiji was talking about Doflamingo's connection - that is what sets him apart from the other Warlords. Thanks to his lineage and business, Doflamingo is a man who is difficult to deal with. Aokiji never compared his prowess to the Warlords but to any pirate out there. So no, that translation doesn't make any sense at all. A pirate whos prowess is even above the Emperors who the Strawhats with their current level can't tackle isn't going to be their first real threat in the NW.

So, suddenly you want to see what Viz translated to? I don't see what difference it would make if what Viz said is exactly the same as the reliable ones I've direct you towards because I'm sure you're way too biased to change your mind.

As long as Doflamingo is a Warlord, Fujitora is unable to touch him - Doflamingo is aware of that. Who the hell are all of them? The only threat to Doflamingo was Aokiji. Smoker was done for and the G-5 are fodders. Doflamingo was bloodlusted at the time Aokiji approached him and he was a second away of getting rid of a near dead danger to his business which he spent 10 year on in order to become the king of the Pirates - it's excepted of him not to show "fear" and try one last time. One casual attack is all it took to stop him and that scene portrayed him to be a lot weaker than an Admiral who could possibly be weaker than Kizaru.

Blackbeard just became an Emperor. I don't think two years is enough for him to have gone from being someone a dead WB could crush to being the strongest Emperor. The time Oda hints at that it's time for him to fight Shanks and Co is when he'll have surpassed Shanks. I imagine the Blackbeard pirates and the Strawhat pirates will hit their peak around the same time, like an arc or two away.

I guess neither is Law? Doflamingo is afraid of Admiral level fighters like how Nami, Brook and Chopper are afraid of people like Doflamingo. He had all the time in the world to escape from the attack like his fodder companion CC and those marines were able to. Oda showcased the difference between an Admiral level fighter and two people on the same level.

Alrigt, it's ambigous. Either one of us could be right about this but I'll drop it.

Mihawk was testing Luffy. He wasn't trying to get rid of Luffy like how Oda showed Kuma was after an extremely injured, tired Zoro who is much slower than G2 speed. Kuma can deflect anything that doesn't have haki imbued like how Law can cut anything that isn't haki imbued, so having stronger haki would mean Mihawk's monstrous strength that can cut an iceberg in half would be trouble for Kuma. Doflamingo never fought an Admiral. He was embarrased by two different Admirals when he he had the chance to step up. Mihawk doesn't need to defeat/stalemate an Admiral as long as weaker swordsmen than him do it, e.g Rayleigh so Mihawk is capable of doing it. Luffy's tademark failed against a non white mode Hyouzo as well as was poisoned in the process. When he became white mode, he was so weak he couldn't even kill Zoro's boredom. I guess that means Luffy is weaker than Hyozou, eh? We know for a fact that Crocodile, who was on similar level as pre skip Luffy, was flat out lying because WB was A L O T stronger than him. We have no reason to believe it's the case with Iva/Kuma who are companions that know each other. Ivankov could be stronger or he could be weaker because the past is the past. I'm not picking one over the other. Unlike you, I'm not saying one is on another level than the other when nothing hints at that. They are on same level, meaning Kizaru can destroy someone like Kuma but not a guy weaker than Mihawk, Rayleigh. Mihawk>Rayleigh is true seeing as how the author, the one who knows the manga from the back of his head, stated it. Mihawk, Kizaru, Rayleigh, Vista are all on the same general level, but that doesn't mean one can't be stronger than the other. Rayleigh/Kizaru were portrayed as strong and we don't know who is stronger. Mihawk and Vista were portrayed as strong and we know that Mihawk is stronger. Point is, they are on the same level. If we look at Law's abilities, he beats Mihawk, Shanks, Rayleigh. Doesn't work that way, I'm afraid. Kuma having a hax ability means jack shit. As long as he is someone around Iva's strength, he isn't beating Mihawk/Rayleigh/Shanks who can play with Admiral while the former two get destroyed. Holding a man Zoro wants to surpass in high regard is overrated? By that logic, Shanks is also overrated because most people think he is the strongest alive right now since Luffy wants to surpass him. It's not even certain that Kuma or Ivankov are stronger the current M3, Law, Smoker etc since they're on the same level. While Zoro/Luffy will surpass the people they wanna surpass near the end of the serie

Kaido is known as the strongest creature, meaning he is the strongest living thing. Even if he had the title whilst WB was alive it wouldn't matter since he is more than likely non-human. So according to you, Kaido is currently the strongest being in OP. Placing anyone above him just shows you are contradicting yourself. If you accept Mihawk as the strongest swordsman, you accept Kaido > Everyone.

Rayleigh is not a swordsman anymore. He has retired.

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He is just an old man that owns a coating shop.

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These are Rayleighs own words. Rayleigh is not a swordsman anymore meaning he isn't included with Mihawks WSS title. Oda has never stated that Mihawk > Rayleigh.
Mihawk = Worlds Greatest Swordsman. Rayleigh = Not a Swordsman/pirate anymore

What hype has current Rayleigh got that puts him on Admiral level? All of his hype refers to him in his prime which he is obviously not at right now. You say he was mentioned in the same breath as WB, this is because he was from that Era and one of the prime figures of that Era. Vista was able to fight equally with Mihawk alone whilst an Admiral (Akainu) was able to take on the WB commanders (minus Ace and Jozu), Crocodile and Jimbei. ABC logic which you so love to use shows that Mihawk is far below admiral level. Rayleigh is weaker than Garp and WB (who in their old age were roughly around Admiral level). Rayleigh, originally being weaker than the two and being inactive for so many years obviously shows he isn't on Kizaru's level. He even hints at it himself. Garp never said the Marines can't handle the two of them… the marines beat the WB pirates with hardly any help from Garp or Sengoku. The marines would still win even with Rayleigh on their side. Garp just questioned if they want to fight the two of them, which there is obviously no reason to. Rayleigh got a free attack on Kizaru whilst he was trying to catch Luffy… and him escaping doesn't make him Admiral level. Every single Rookie escaped Kizaru. We don't know how their fight ended… maybe Kizaru got another phone call?

Viz translations are the official translations… I don't care how reliable you think this translations are, Viz are the official translations so that is what we go by. If there are the same as the ones you have supplied, then obviously I will have to accept it.

Doflamingo attacked Fujitora and admiral… that should be an automatic resignation from the Warlord position. Obviously he isn't scared of Fujitora. And like I said, Doflamingo's whole reason for coming down to PH was for Law and Luffy. There is no reason to get in a fight with Aokiji which would probably end with heavy injuries on both sides. Doflamingo was in no way "portrayed" as far weaker than Aokiji. WB casually got froze by Aokiji yet it doesn't mean anything. Doflamingo ignored what Aokiji said and proceeded to attack his friend in front of him. He walks past Aokiji with a smile on his face. Oda has made it clear that Doflamingo is not afraid of him.

BB gained WB's fruit and is the only know person in OP to have two fruits. Ofcuourse he is far stronger than what he was. Literally all you do is use speculation and contradicting yourself. Like you say you believe Mihawk will be Zoro's opponent, and BB will be Luffy's so he should be above Shanks. He has 2 DF's including the best Paramecia fruit and arguably the best Logia type and there is nothing saying that he is going to get anything else. Obviously you just try to look for excuses when your logic doesn't follow what you want.

Why would Doflamingo try and escape when he can easily cut the meteor with his strings? Its funny how you simply ignore the fact that Doflamingo attacked an Admiral (which should automatically take away your Schichibukai title) and smiled in his face. If Oda wanted to show that Doflamingo was scared, why would Oda do that? Clearly Oda's intention was to show that Doflamingo wasn't scared.

Well you say Mihawk was "testing" Luffy.
Mihawk himself states that he is not going to go easy on him.
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I think I'm going to believe Mihawk on this one. He was trying to hurt Luffy, showing no mercy with enough power to cut an iceberg yet Luffy was dodging everything. Mihawk won't be able to catch Kuma.
Zoro hit Kuma from behind… I can show you many similar examples with strong opponents. It means nothing.
My point from comparing them is just because Iva said he isn't going to go easy anymore, doesn't mean he is stronger than Kuma and I gave you a prime example. Ivan never stated he is stronger than Kuma and from what we say, he wasn't even able to scratch PX-0 when he stated he was going all out. So we can say Kuma is easily above Iva.
I have explained to you exactly why Kuma beats Mihawk. All you have done is try to bring in Rayleighs hype for Mihawk yet I have explained above why that doesn't work. So as of now, you have nothing to say Mihawk > Kuma.
 
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