Proof of how Danzo was a disgrace to Konoha and Sarutobi:

[markdabomb22]

Danzo is a good guy.........he enjoys sunsets,long walks on the beach and frisky woman

 

[Exaar]

Wrong again.. If it was acceptable. Hashirama wouldn't have made the whole treaty with the Uchiha.... Sarutobi wouldn't have wanted to talk to the Uchiha. Sorry, but killing innocent people for your own goal is never acceptable. Sorry but a shinobi is someone who protects his loved ones.. atleast thats what a Konoha shinobi is. If someone threatens then he kills... but he/she does not kill because a country is in they way of their goal. That is idiocy.

Sorry, but kishimoto has made this clear through Kakashi.. those desert their friends are worse then Scums.. even if they are shinobi. ;].

Kisame: was a idiot who was told to kill his village.

Itachi : was a kid who was told to either be killed or kill and save 1 person .

True Shinobi are Naruto Uzumaki, SO6P, Hashirama Senju, Jiraya, Tsunade, to a certain extent Kisame because he didn't betray his friends, Raikage, Onoki..redeemed himself, Gaara..... =]

Here we go .. "shinobi are tool".. and etc.. Sorry but that is going against the philosophy of the first hokage and the rest of the hokages. Those men didn't believe they were "tools".. only power hungry dictators treat human beings like tools.

Hitler was a hero to his people?. His people.. as in his "Fake-aryan" clan? Or Germany?.. If your talking about Germany.. he killed many germans... and many even their didn't like him.. Nazi considered him a "Hero".. but don't speak for all germans.

Good and Evil is written down in books. There is a definition for evil.. and definition for good.

Hashirama didn't create shinobi, he didn't create the shinobi system, Just because he doesn't find it acceptable doesn't mean anything.


In the world of shinobi killing innocents for the sake of your village is acceptable, Every village (Pre-shinobi alliance) wanted to wipe each other/Steal their tailed beasts out to further their own villages Goals/Power.
Shinboi are weapons for their villages to use, Nothing more. They fight for their village they die for their village
If they pose a threat to Their mission/Village they Kill them, Simple as that.

Oh and you think kakashi hasn't done "Evil" things?, Killing Rin, Killing Many shinobi through out his life time, also kakashi Agree with what i'm saying

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If the world of shinobi was all "Friends/sunshine/rainbows and happiness" there wouldn't of been so many shinobi wars. Some times shinobi have to make hard decisions, Their "Friends" or their village, If everyone was like naruto the leaf would simply not survive, He would allow his village to be destroyed because of his "Friends". You cannot save both It's childish to think you can, Like naruto thinks.

Current Naruto is trying to "Save" sasuke, A person who poses a massive threat to his village and tsunade is allows him to live also.
The decisions to allow naruto to keep chasing this criminal and allowing him to live is pathetic, If sasuke attacks naruto will "Stop him without killing him", So childish.

Danzo's orders to kill sasuke was the right one to make, Yet naruto keeping chasing him and everytime he fails to kill him/Refuses to kill him the more the leaf is in danger. True shinobi my ass.

Even Gaara gets it,

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The Village comes First.

 

[Nikashu]

Danzo was pretty messed up but in the end he tried to repent by sealing sasuke and Obito. But once a failure always a failure.

I agree, once a failure always a failure. like, remember that one fodder? what was his name... Naru-something?

 

[Exaar]

.. should've paid attention.. his reason for killing the "Jew" was to protect the country. Just like Danzo did it to the "Uchiha".
He killed the people of his own country.. which contradicts him protecting the village.. and also, lets the village be destroyed while just sitting underground.. and letting the hokage take care of everything.. but then goes behind the hokage's back to ruin the Leaf's reputation. Sorry, me killing your family is fine.. if I think it protects the country?

Tsunade was trying to retrieve the "last Uchiha".. who Naruto believed he could save.. you know who Naruto is?? oh yea the guy he has already done more for the village then Danzo.. The reason leaf even standing after the pain attack is due to her... otherwise MOST shinobis who survived would've been dead. . ;]

The uchiha were planning to betray the village, thats why he had them killed, The moment they started plotting against their village was the moment they stopped being part of it.
They died as traitors of the Leaf, Not as leaf shinobi.

In Killing the uchiha Protected not only the leaf, But the whole fire country

 

[KingHashirama]

Hashirama didn't create shinobi, he didn't create the shinobi system, Just because he doesn't find it acceptable doesn't mean anything.


In the world of shinobi killing innocents for the sake of your village is acceptable, Every village (Pre-shinobi alliance) wanted to wipe each other/Steal their tailed beasts out to further their own villages Goals/Power.
Shinboi are weapons for their villages to use, Nothing more. They fight for their village they die for their village
If they pose a threat to Their mission/Village they Kill them, Simple as that.

Oh and you think kakashi hasn't done "Evil" things?, Killing Rin, Killing Many shinobi through out his life time, also kakashi Agree with what i'm saying

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If the world of shinobi was all "Friends/sunshine/rainbows and happiness" there wouldn't of been so many shinobi wars. Some times shinobi have to make hard decisions, Their "Friends" or their village, If everyone was like naruto the leaf would simply not survive, He would allow his village to be destroyed because of his "Friends". You cannot save both It's childish to think you can, Like naruto thinks.

Current Naruto is trying to "Save" sasuke, A person who poses a massive threat to his village and tsunade is allows him to live also.
The decisions to allow naruto to keep chasing this criminal and allowing him to live is pathetic, If sasuke attacks naruto will "Stop him without killing him", So childish.

Danzo's orders to kill sasuke was the right one to make, Yet naruto keeping chasing him and everytime he fails to kill him/Refuses to kill him the more the leaf is in danger. True shinobi my ass.

Hashirama didn't create it.. well Danzo didn't either.. and you didn't either.. A "shinobi" is someone who can use ninjutsu. Hence why SO6P is the God of Shinobi. So where does it say its acceptable.. If you want to go on to the person who created shinobi.. then that person believed in what Naruto believes in.. and which is against what you and Danzo believe in.

Shinobi are military. Military is made of people who serve to protect the village.. again ONLY dictators think of them as tools.. What Kakashi said is understandable.. he was after all from the Anbu himself.. and there are hard/strict teachings like those in the world.. But keeping in mind the scan you posted by Kakashi saying Ninjas are tools of the village.... look at this quote:

"In the ninja world, those who break the rules are trash, that's true, but those who abandon their comrades are worse than trash."

Another Kakashi quote: "The people from this village are different from your average village. Even if it means dying, there's not a single one of us, who would sell out a comrade."

Danzo abandoned his comrades who were getting segregated because of him..and that makes him a trash. And then he had his comrades killed.. instead of trusting them.. =]

If they world was sunshines and rainbows.. it would be a better place.. and there would be no hard decisions.. but it because of people like Danzo and the Raikage (his attitude before).. that people can't have sunshines and rainbows. Naruto, Jiraya, Hashirama , and SO6P died happily for trying to get those sunshines and rainbows.

Naruto is already done with saving him.. Hes already told Itachi that if sasuke attacks the village he will find a way to stop him.. and what Naruto said was more about their powers and their battle "they will bot die" not a suicide thing lmao.. I bet him talking to Nagato was childish also right?..

Tsunade allowed sasuke to live before he became a threat.. ;]. Otherwise it would've been "send the anbu and capture him".. But hey at least her and Naruto dedicated their life to protect konoha in the pain arc.. while Danzo was chilling underground. ;]

So I can kill your family and friends , because I think it will protect the country.? Please answer this question.

 

[DonS]

HURR DURR lets post obvious shit

 

[Hipster Madara]

He was a douche.

 

[Exaar]

Hashirama didn't create it.. well Danzo didn't either.. and you didn't either.. A "shinobi" is someone who can use ninjutsu. Hence why SO6P is the God of Shinobi. So where does it say its acceptable.. If you want to go on to the person who created shinobi.. then that person believed in what Naruto believes in.. and which is against what you and Danzo believe in.

Shinobi are military. Military is made of people who serve to protect the village.. again ONLY dictators think of them as tools.. What Kakashi said is understandable.. he was after all from the Anbu himself.. and there are hard/strict teachings like those in the world.. But keeping in mind the scan you posted by Kakashi saying Ninjas are tools of the village.... look at this quote:

Military are nothing but a bunch of tools, If not what are they?, They're trained to Kill/Lie/deserve/Put their mission above all else/Put their village above all else.

Kakashi states it clearly, This is the way of shinobi "Becoming the countrys tool is most important", Naruto is to naive to accept this, So was obito when he made his statement.

Those to abandon their mission/village become useless to their village, Like Kakashi's dad when he risked his life for his friends, The village doesn't need people that put their Friends above their missions.

Another Kakashi quote: "The people from this village are different from your average village. Even if it means dying, there's not a single one of us, who would sell out a comrade."

Danzo abandoned his comrades who were getting segregated because of him..and that makes him a trash. And then he had his comrades killed.. instead of trusting them.. =]

Well duh, No village would betray their own shinobi if it would do harm to their village, This would be betraying their village.
They would only if he Poses a threat to their village.

The people under danzo knew the Risks, Danzo's underlings did what they had to do and did what Danzo/The village asked from them, As tools.

If they world was sunshines and rainbows.. it would be a better place.. and there would be no hard decisions.. but it because of people like Danzo and the Raikage (his attitude before).. that people can't have sunshines and rainbows. Naruto, Jiraya, Hashirama , and SO6P died happily for trying to get those sunshines and rainbows.

Naruto is already done with saving him.. Hes already told Itachi that if sasuke attacks the village he will find a way to stop him.. and what Naruto said was more about their powers and their battle "they will bot die" not a suicide thing lmao.. I bet him talking to Nagato was childish also right?..

Tsunade allowed sasuke to live before he became a threat.. ;]. Otherwise it would've been "send the anbu and capture him".. But hey at least her and Naruto dedicated their life to protect konoha in the pain arc.. while Danzo was chilling underground. ;]

Danzo did send Sai to kill Sasuke because he knew he would be a threat to the leaf in the future, and he was right, Tsunade's fault for not doing anything about it beforhand or after.

Danzo stayed hidden because he was trying to stop naruto returning, He knew if Pain caught him, the shinobi world would be doomed and he couldn't risk it, Also the leaf without a bijuu would of been a weak and easy target for other villages to finnish of the remainder of the leafs forces, It was only by sheer luck/Plot no jutsu that tsunade got away with letting naruto come back.

The reason the Nv is what it is, is because of shinobi, naruto is a shinobi, Being a shinobi goes against everything he stands for.
Unless naruto single handedly destroys the shinobi stystem, He will change nothing.

So I can kill your family and friends , because I think it will protect the country.? Please answer this question.

Sure go for it.

If a country thinks a Family or what ever poses a threat to them, Their soldiers/Secret forces will deal with them. Happens all the time in the real world.

 

[KingHashirama]

That, I believe, is everyone's point. The Hokage is in charge of the ANBU and the shinobi of Konoha, Danzo is in charge of ROOT. Or, how Danzo puts it: "you are the leaves bathing in the sun. I…am the roots that grow in the dark." Danzo does all of the dirty work because he's in charge of ROOT. For all we know, Danzo might've founded ROOT due to wanting to keep the dirty affairs/politics seperate from everything else considered conventional to make Konoha seem better than it was, with ROOT being a faction of ANBU and whatnot. He had to be the sneaky, methodical, under-handed character that represents a true shinobi. Root carries out missions that Danzō believes will benefit Konoha because of its core views as "the unseen ones who support the great tree of Konoha from the depths of the earth".

Also, the Elders knew that Danzo was in charge of ROOT, so it's crazy to think Hiruzen didn't know.

but the point of the story is DIRTY WORK ISN'T NEEDED.... Dirty work only leads to hatred.. like Sasuke, Nagato, or Kabuto. Why was he not helping while people were dieing ??? or when the village was getting destroyed???. Root is not a faction of the Anbu.. They are Danzo's own personal ninjas. A true shinobi??? wth are you talking about?? A true shinobi lets his comrades die. and does nothing .. and chills underground?.. that was a true shinobi does?? wth is wrong with you dude. He already said for "his plan to work" the deaths of konoha citizens are ok.. fine.. as long as he becomes hokage.

Kakashi describes Danzo as trash. . ;].

 

[KingHashirama]

Military are nothing but a bunch of tools, If not what are they?, They're trained to Kill/Lie/deserve/Put their mission above all else/Put their village above all else.

Kakashi states it clearly, This is the way of shinobi "Becoming the countrys tool is most important", Naruto is to naive to accept this, So was obito when he made his statement.

Those to abandon their mission/village become useless to their village, Like Kakashi's dad when he risked his life for his friends, The village doesn't need people that put their Friends above their missions.

Military is bunch of people who protect their country. If you think the other way then you are a power hungry guy... period. They put their comrades ABOVE ALL ELSE. Their village is their village because of their comrades. Buildings do not make a village PEOPLE DO. Yet Kakashi also stated if you abandon your comrades your trash. . His father was the same way. He thought of his comrades first.. before the mission. And Kakashi respects him for that ;].

Also, Chiyo already admit their ways were wrong. And hopes Naruto and Gaara make a better place ;]

Well duh, No village would betray their own shinobi if it would do harm to their village, This would be betraying their village.
They would only if he Poses a threat to their village.

The people under danzo knew the Risks, Danzo's underlings did what they had to do and did what Danzo/The village asked from them, As tools.

Yet Danzo and the elders decided to segregate the uchiha.. and when they were about to say something back.. he decided to shut them up.. maybe because they knew too much about him ;]. Some people under Danzo were forced.. just like Kabuto's "mother".

Danzo did send Sai to kill Sasuke because he knew he would be a threat to the leaf in the future, and he was right, Tsunade's fault for not doing anything about it beforhand or after.

So Sasuke was more dangerous then Oro?... you know the guy who Danzo had been working with ;]. Its because of Danzo that hes a threat you dummy. -_-. Tsunade already protected the village, while Danzo was just chilling and waiting for the hokage to die, so he can be the new one. Yea a great shinobi. :sy:

Danzo stayed hidden because he was trying to stop naruto returning, He knew if Pain caught him, the shinobi world would be doomed and he couldn't risk it, Also the leaf without a bijuu would of been a weak and easy target for other villages to finnish of the remainder of the leafs forces, It was only by sheer luck/Plot no jutsu that tsunade got away with letting naruto come back.

The reason the Nv is what it is, is because of shinobi, naruto is a shinobi, Being a shinobi goes against everything he stands for.
Unless naruto single handedly destroys the shinobi stystem, He will change nothing.

Danzo killed the frog for that.. Him hiding had nothing to do with Naruto coming back.. lmao. wth are you on about mate. Its cause of luck and plot no jutsu that Nagato even had the rinnegan.. soo your point of bring the plot into this is??. Minato , and Kurama were inside Naruto... so yea. naruto straight up beat Pain.

I like how you think the Danzo way is the shinobi way. . Yet the GOD OF SHINOBI.. the creator of shinobi.. stood for peace.. You tell me. who is right?. Konoha way is the will of fire.. not Danzo's will.

Sure go for it.

If a country thinks a Family or what ever poses a threat to them, Their soldiers/Secret forces will deal with them. Happens all the time in the real world.

You sicken me..... for this statement. You would have your own family killed just cause I THINK that they pose a great threat.. wth.

 

[KingHashirama]

He created his own personal group

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the Hokage-controlled ANBU.

And yes, that's exactly what a shinobi would do.



A ninja is underhanded, and only looks out for himself. He has no sense of honor or moral code. He will do anything to get his job done.

I completely understand where you're coming from, don't think I don't, but your viewpoint is coming from a strictly Naruto-based viewpoint, while mine isn't. In the Narutoverse, what Danzo's doing is wrong, I suppose, which makes him look like trash and scum and a disgrace. But in actuality, it's what a shinobi would do. With that in mind, Naruto is to ninjas as Edward is to vampires.

Sorry.. but uh there is no group within the Anbu.. its only the Anbu.. the Hokage has no control over the ROOT. . it was banned by the Hokage.. but Danzo (selfishly).. kept it open.


Are you going by the "Naruto" definition.. or the real definition? If your going by the real.. then lets only talk about people who are close to real ninjas..... people like the Anbu.. not a political guy with powers.

If your going by the Naruto definition.. "The clearest characteristic of a shinobi is their ability to manipulate chakra to create and use techniques.".. thats the reason SO6P was the GOD of Shinobis..... Not because he was the best mercenary. But we are talking about Naruto ninjas.... not real life ninjas.....

 

[KingHashirama]

I think this is why when people call him realistic everyone argues that point. I, for one, was explaining that Danzo is the definition of a real life shinobi and was the closest thing Kishimoto had to one. In the Narutovers, though, he was a huge douche.

For the most part, I think everyone's debating about a huge misconception/misunderstanding...

No.. Danzo was the definition of a corrupt politician.... He was a politician more .. rather then a ninja. Soo.. not even close to a realistic ninja. There are alot of politicians like him.. so I suppose they are close to ninjas also then aye?

We are going by the Naruto definition.. And even if you were going by the real definition.. he doesn't fit it either.. Ninjas don't dress in robes and walk around.. they attack from the shadows and etc. And not all ninjas were like the way it is described in the definition at wikipedia.

 

[KingHashirama]

The politician aspect comes from the fact that the Narutoverse is a society of ninja. Politics have to come in to play at some point, espcially with one leader governing over a huge system, and Danzo was effectively a cabinet member. He had the ideals of a realistic ninja and over time it progressed into a warhawk mentality.

If it's by look that you're referring to, if that's the case, then both ANBU and ROOT are realistic ninjas. And before Danzo became an old man, he was probably more like that.

All-in-all, it's a matter of ethics and what you believe. I once dated a girl who was a child of divorce. She believes that even if she gets married, her happiness won't last because it might/probably will end in divorce. Is she wrong or crazy for that? No, not necessarily. Because she grew up with that, it's her viewpoint and it's what she'll always think. Likewise, Danzo even said when he was young that both his father and grandfather died in battle and that self-sacrifice is a ninja's duty. He's not wrong for saying that because he had to grow up with that experience and it's what he had to believe in, it became his mentality. Do you think Danzo's ideals and morals are wrong? Of course you do, your viewpoints and morals growing up oppose everything that Danzo stands for. Do I believe that it's wrong? Yeah, I do. I grew up with morals that oppose Danzo's as well, it's just that I sympathize with him and can understand where he's coming from. I don't agree with it, but then again I don't hate Atheists despite them not believing in what I believe. A matter of ethics.

O-o there you go.. So in which case does Danzo fit the literal definition of the word "ninja"??.

Madara was born in a era of war.. So i suppose he is good to? his ideals and morals are wrong.. if everyone started saying "its the prespective".. on everything we do.. we would be in chaos.

Why are you bringing religion to this??

Dude. believing and killing are 2 different things. You can be a atheist or religious.. it wouldn't matter to me.. but if due to that religion or belief you start killing people you don't see fit.. then we have a problem.

The problem with this.. no NINJAS SELL OUT THEIR COMRADES. (in Naruto)..

If you go by "real life ninjas".. then same aspect applies.. they were also taught not to give up on their comrades. Should read into the ninja stories of the olden times.

 

[metallica9565]

Danzo was willing to be a jackass for the good of the village. Its called "tough love"
that being said, despite his ways, I think he was an exceptional shinobi!

 

[KingHashirama]

Danzo was willing to be a jackass for the good of the village. Its called "tough love"
that being said, despite his ways, I think he was an exceptional shinobi!

But the village didn't want a jackass. so there was no need.. He wanted to be a jackass. Its not called "tough love" when you kill your own comrades smart ass. Also, me and HiddenSound are cool with each other.. soo yea

 

[TruthLover19]

Back in the day where the REAL ninjas existed aka shinobi. Danzo is the closest as it can get to that and that's how the real shinobi acts and would do anything for their hidden village but its true he was shown as a shitty character and that's how the true ninjas were. But naruto has different massages

 

[TruthLover19]

The politician aspect comes from the fact that the Narutoverse is a society of ninja. Politics have to come in to play at some point, espcially with one leader governing over a huge system, and Danzo was effectively a cabinet member. He had the ideals of a realistic ninja and over time it progressed into a warhawk mentality.

If it's by look that you're referring to, if that's the case, then both ANBU and ROOT are realistic ninjas. And before Danzo became an old man, he was probably more like that.

All-in-all, it's a matter of ethics and what you believe. I once dated a girl who was a child of divorce. She believes that even if she gets married, her happiness won't last because it might/probably will end in divorce. Is she wrong or crazy for that? No, not necessarily. Because she grew up with that, it's her viewpoint and it's what she'll always think. Likewise, Danzo even said when he was young that both his father and grandfather died in battle and that self-sacrifice is a ninja's duty. He's not wrong for saying that because he had to grow up with that experience and it's what he had to believe in, it became his mentality. Do you think Danzo's ideals and morals are wrong? Of course you do, your viewpoints and morals growing up oppose everything that Danzo stands for. Do I believe that it's wrong? Yeah, I do. I grew up with morals that oppose Danzo's as well, it's just that I sympathize with him and can understand where he's coming from. I don't agree with it, but then again I don't hate Atheists despite them not believing in what I believe. A matter of ethics.

Awesome answer bro I feel the same way.
*****

 

[synkross]

well, i guess this is a hate on danzo thread but well everyone has their own opinion.....yes Danzo was harsh and his methods of preserving and strenghtening his village could be argued but he was a true patriot and he did not want the world for himself (you are wrong at this point).the 3rd hokage knew his methods were effictive ,if anything.
yes danzo was kinda extremist at this but hey if eveyone was like naruto(which i totally deny that such people can exist in real world).you really wouldn't be watching naruto...lolz

There can be no Heros without Villains.....

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But there can be Villains without Heros

 

[Your Creepy Stalker]

Danzo was a huge *******? You should have put spoilers infront.

 

[rollin]

i didn't read this thread entirely so I'm not sure if this is mentioned
but he was suspected to be behind the attack on konoha that resulted in the hokage's death

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he just wants to be hokage and doesn't care who dies
he wouldn't even let his anbu help during pain's invasion

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