One question for Itachi fans

[raiban]

I respect your opinion, but we don't use assumptions in debate. Hype can only be used for complete omnipotent beings like TOAA. Any hype that's not associated with the creator God of that multiverse can be considered fallacious and hyperbole.

Franklin Richards is strong not because some random nobody said so, he has shown the feat (creation of a universe). When you make statements about powers being on universal level, there has to be appropriate feats as evidence for backup.

Well then if we base it off of the feats it has shown then the debate was pointless to begin with. Superman has shown how superior his strength is a thousand times more than the mirror has displayed its ability to deflect anything. It doesn't mean that the mirror loses or Superman loses it means that due to the lack of info both sides cannot win. Which means Batman wins...

You must be registered for see images

 

[Narutofan4203]

Teleportation isn't spead!? GO BACK TO PHYSICS! Speed is the amount of distance covered over the course of time. Transportation is either a device or the act of going from one location to another. If you can teleport from your couch to your kitchen, then that is transportation and speed of instant since you went from your couch to your kitchen, which has distance between it, over a period of time.
Now back on topic, the effects of the Yata Mirror is to deflect anything. It is a spiritual item, NOT a scientific item. It follows the rules of its effects written for it. We are basing this off of the writing of what they are capable of doing. With this in mind we know that the Yata Mirror deflects ALL, and Superman punches really HARD. Since you want to base this all off an unrealistic character who is displaying time travel by going backwards in time, then I will base this off of the knowledge the mirror. Superman will not be able to punch the mirror as he loses his powers in the presence of Kryptonite. Kryptonite is an element found on the planet Earth, and the Yata Mirror is infused with all nature transformations. Earth is a nature transformation, which means that the Yata Mirror is composed of Kryptonite as well as other elements that are found on earth. Superman dies, because everyone is waiting for him to punch. GG Superman 0 diff.

Teleportation is moving from one point to another. It isn't classified as speed in multiversal debates. Once again, proving that you're new to multiversal debates. Under speed in the outskirtsbattledome, vsbattles, or anything, do you see "teleportation?" No! Why? Because teleportation can't be measured in a mach, in C (the times faster than light), miles per hour, feet per second, meters per second, etc.
Show me how it is a spiritual item? If it was, it would not be materialized. It would be nonmaterial and thus noncorporeal/incorporeal. It was written that superman was omnipotent! It was written that hiruzen was the strongest! Hell, even enel from one piece was "written" as omnipotent! No feats. The only feats you can show of Yata Mirror deflecting physical attacks were multi-city block level. Just because it shows no exact limit, doesn't mean it has none just because of a fallacious hyperbole. Superman is millions to billions of times faster than light, he raced across the universe with the flash in seconds, far outsped the big bang, and went back in time to prehistoric ages. You think anything itachi can do can even harm this man? In this debate, do you wonder WHY planet busting was limited? Silver Age Superman sneezed away a solar system.

spiritual
1. of, relating to, or affecting the human spirit or soul as opposed to material or physical things.

Leave.

 

[Waltz]

About the you and truth, it's what has been established.

You're contradicting yourself (reality is, you're biased) : ​

Multiversal debates are based off of feats. Feats alone

--------------

You cannot prove yata meets up to being able to it's standards bro. Simple use of the no-limits-fallacy. I'll post this again and again for as long as I'll have to. Because yata mirror was stated to block "any physical attack" by the author, and he has shown your supposed "feats" of this by blocking two multi-city block level attacks, yata mirror can reflect planet and star level striking strength that superman has displayed. Your basic display of idiocy.

Argument from ignorance or argumentum ad ignorantiam in its most formal definition is a logical fallacy that claims the truth of a premise is based on the fact that it has not been proven false, or that a premise is false because it has not been proven true

Still failing to realize is that what is written about Yata-no-Kagami is the truth and history of the Shield and It's properties, not legend, folklore or here-say.

You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images

Apparently, you can't read as well xd. The no limits fallacy is based on " a poorly understood phenomenon " which is then extrapolated upon. Yata-no-Kagami cannot be applicable since the action of it negating attacks (the phenomenon) is already understood as it's history and function is to negate all attacks----being the purpose of it's existence. ​

And simply with your "yet" section, you proved yourself to be using the no-limits-fallacy once more. Let me tell you what your burden of "proof" lies on. Because itachi has shown to deflect two multi-city block level attacks with the yata mirror that were physical.. he can deflect planet level and star level physical attacks, all because it hasn't shown a limit. What does this sound like folks? *yawn* Way too easy.

Narutofan4203, I want to be clear before I respond once more:

you're saying that since the hyped-indestructible Cosmic cube hasn't endured a galaxy level blast and has been hyped indestructible by the author, then superman's sneeze would destroy it.

Do you agree to this?

You must be registered for see images

​

 

[raiban]

Teleportation is moving from one point to another. It isn't classified as speed in multiversal debates. Once again, proving that you're new to multiversal debates. Under speed in the outskirtsbattledome, vsbattles, or anything, do you see "teleportation?" No! Why? Because teleportation can't be measured in a mach, in C (the times faster than light), miles per hour, feet per second, meters per second, etc.
Show me how it is a spiritual item? If it was, it would not be materialized. It would be nonmaterial and thus noncorporeal/incorporeal. It was written that superman was omnipotent! It was written that hiruzen was the strongest! Hell, even enel from one piece was "written" as omnipotent! No feats. The only feats you can show of Yata Mirror deflecting physical attacks were multi-city block level. Just because it shows no exact limit, doesn't mean it has none just because of a fallacious hyperbole. Superman is millions to billions of times faster than light, he raced across the universe with the flash in seconds, far outsped the big bang, and went back in time to prehistoric ages. You think anything itachi can do can even harm this man? In this debate, do you wonder WHY planet busting was limited? Silver Age Superman sneezed away a solar system.

spiritual
1. of, relating to, or affecting the human spirit or soul as opposed to material or physical things.

Leave.

Sorry, but I ignore the vsbattle threads. I guess I can kind of understand their being "rules" and such to disqualify teleportation as speed in a forum debate. All of which I brought to this debate was based on my experiences and what I learned. Yet I stated before that this debate was pointless, because if something is not supported in facts in comparison to what is being opposed to then it is pointless to make an argument about the two contending with each other. The facts shown by Superman's strength has been shown a thousand times more, but Itachi's shield has only been shown in combat once. 1 fact vs many makes it a pointless debate to have if that fact does not deliver the same quality that the others are showing. Also I already stated that Itachi was not even near the level of Superman, I just stated that his mirror is able to defend itself from him. Yet we will never know unless it actually happens. Also yes it is a spiritual item in the sense that it is not a fricken mirror he carries around in his pockets. He just whips it out when ever he has susanoo out.

 

[Narutofan4203]

You're contradicting yourself (reality is, you're biased) : ​

--------------

Still failing to realize is that what is written about Yata-no-Kagami is the truth and history of the Shield and It's properties, not legend, folklore or here-say.






Apparently, you can't read as well xd. The no limits fallacy is based on " a poorly understood phenomenon " which is then extrapolated upon. Yata-no-Kagami cannot be applicable since the action of it negating attacks (the phenomenon) is already understood as it's history and function is to negate all attacks----being the purpose of it's existence. ​

Narutofan4203, I want to be clear before I respond once more:

you're saying that since the hyped-indestructible Cosmic cube hasn't endured a galaxy level blast and has been hyped indestructible by the author, then superman's sneeze would destroy it.

Do you agree to this?

You must be registered for see images

​

Can't show me how I'm contradicting myself. Point 2.

That scan was it's hype, simple as that. Have you not been reading what I have been saying? No? Point 3. Again, just because something has shown no limit, doesn't mean it does not have one. This is a simple compound sentence. This isn't even that hard to understand.

Apparently, you can't read as well xd. The no limits fallacy is based on " a poorly understood phenomenon " which is then extrapolated upon. Yata-no-Kagami cannot be applicable since the action of it negating attacks (the phenomenon) is already understood as it's history and function is to negate all attacks----being the purpose of it's existence.

Lol, kid, do you not know the definition of contradicting? Here, let me get it for you.
contradict
1. deny the truth of (a statement), especially by asserting the opposite.
LOL. And what does the purpose of existence have to do with anything here? What is the no limits fallacy also based on you say? Re-read it. It doesn't matter if it is already understood. You don't seem to get it.

For a gross example, observing that a shield can easily withstand an attack from a particular weapon, one might illogically conclude that the shield could withstand fire from an unlimited number of those weapons at the same time, or that it could withstand fire from a similar weapon that was much more powerful.

Because it has no set limit. Here's what you did wrong, you used two words. Very simple and common mistake in debates. "negate attacks." Right there, contradiction. With the definition of the no limits fallacy that I gave you that you do not seem to be able to read, here's what I'll explain.

1st. Yata mirror's databook and quote from Zetsu
2nd. "Feats" of this are shown, only blocking two multi-city block level attacks.
3rd. Finally, resolved. Because of this and the "hype" behind it, it has no limit, and you give it no limit. Because it can "deflect" attacks and has shown to deflect only two multi-city block level attacks, it can now deflect country level, continent level, planet level, and the list goes on of striking strength.

About your last "argument", I never even said that, and it is irrelevant to the situation. The fact is, because the author says it does not make it true. You're doin' this A. It is established he blocks physical attacks. B. I will now show you the feats of him doing this, deflecting two attacks (multi-city block level) C. It is now established that it can withstand all physical attacks, including planet level, star level, galaxy level, etc. CDE logic. But wait! You failed once more! This time you used straw man logic. Let me give you another lesson in debating. Because you just failed again.

This is when one person corrupts an opponent's argument into something different, a "straw man" that they set up just to knock it down.

Example:

Person A: Luffy is so fast due to Gear 2, he would easily blitz Naruto.

Person B: Luffy isn't light speed! You're wrong.

Person A never said Luffy was light speed, person B is making that up to make Person A's argument look bad.

NOTE: This is a very simple example, usually straw men are much harder to spot than this.

You've done this so far. Contradict yourself. Point 4. Ignore sense or logic. Point 5. Go on in a sense of repetition, thus proving no argument. Point 6 and 7. Used multiple fallacies. The no limits fallacy, CDE logic, and straw man. Points 8, 9, and 10. Ding ding ding!

And LOL, did you read your last argument? Read your last argument with the irrelevant cube and read 2 of my previous. Please. This is way too funny, and way too easy. Continue to live in the delusion that your argument is even remotely credible, though. ROFLMAO! Sorry, maybe next time?

 

[Narutofan4203]

A little advice for Waltz, though. If he even chooses to reply with the utter stomp my last post was.

The general rule is that if a claim is made that is completely out of league of anything ever shown in said universe (for example, if someone claimed to be a planetbuster in a verse where the strongest feats were citybuster), it's probably hyperbole. In universes with a wide range of characters on different tiers of power (such as Marvel and DC), this has to be evaluated on an individual character basis, instead of on the verse as a whole. For example, if someone in One Piece claimed they could destroy an island, it's reasonable to consider it a possibility, since other people in the verse have done comparable things (of course it still has to be evaluated based on the feats and powerscaling of the actual character).

 

[Waltz]

Stopped reading at the first line.

I do not intend to waste anymore posts here. The mere fact that your arrogance and biased has made you fail to see that you contradicted yourself: Initially stating that multiverse matches are based solely on feats, then going on to say that 'certain establishments are acceptable' even when they lack sufficient feats to triumph a scenario----added to this you avoided my last question, refused to acknowledge that Yata was a perfect shield designed to negate all attacks and this has never been discredited, and continue to apply an argument (no limits) which really is inapplicable, really shows that you're no longer worth a response.

​

 

[Narutofan4203]

Stopped reading at the first line.

I do not intend to waste anymore posts here. The mere fact that your arrogance and biased has made you fail to see that you contradicted yourself: Initially stating that multiverse matches are based solely on feats, then going on to say that 'certain establishments are acceptable' even when they lack sufficient feats to triumph a scenario----added to this you avoided my last question, refused to acknowledge that Yata was a perfect sheild designed to negate all attacks and this has never been discredited, and continue to apply an argument (no limits) which really is inapplicable, really shows that you're no longer worth a response.

​

At least you admit you were truly wasting posts -- everything was getting refuted and logically countered and due to your ego that is almost as big as mine, you chose not to admit that. I disproved that yata was a "perfect shield to negate all attacks" (LMAO) with fallacies and logic in multiversal debates that you choose not to understand, and at this point, it's wank. You did not give evidence on how it was inapplicable, and even if you believe you did, I quickly disproved it. Really, you weren't worth a response with the low amount of knowledge you displayed in the second post, and really, the first post one-shotted this thread. But your constant adhering religious belief caused you to consistently reply, even though you were clearly outmatched. And also, a TON of your posts were sig-worthy. Nuff said.

The diffrence between the nardo verse and the other verse is that the cosmic cube has already shown character in their verse performing insane feats, hyperboles in these verses are very hard to detect, while in the nardo verse, the simple example is here, you can't say for certain or adore the fact that itachi suddenly posses the power to block universal level punches or guren Lagans punches just cause in their own verse, the higher tiers have done nothing as impressive which even slightly signifies that Yata can be deemed invincible, as it's shown no such feats within its own verse and suddenly he does, whilst he does not compare to the top tiers, via your logic, itachi is undefeatable even within his verse
[8:15:05 PM] Australian-Awake: It's a hyperbole, the fact is simple, higher tiers are planet level, and that means Yata is now invincible and itachi defies the nardo verse law by becoming the most powerful defence even by other manga standards

Good to know that you admit defeat though. I win. I'd say good game, but this was a stomp.

 

[Joseph Gomes]

Naruto hyperbole statement proved wrong...Yata Mirror statement is the same as this statement of Madara

You must be registered for see images

Unless you believe Madara can destroy all creation...Lol

 

[Conspirator.]

The Itachi fapboys on this site are disgraceful. It seems they don't understand the concept of the no limits fallacy, nor do they understand what hyperboles are. For example in the databook Kabutowari is said to "crush any and all defences". So what happens when it clashes with the yata mirror?(it's still a defence) Exactly, you get left with a massive contradiction either way, as there's no such thing as a strongest shield or the strongest offence. Itachi fapboys need to drill these relatively simple concepts into their thick skulls.

 

[Waltz]

Naruto hyperbole statement proved wrong...Yata Mirror statement is the same as this statement of Madara

You must be registered for see images

Unless you believe Madara can destroy all creation...Lol

Bad example wich is also inapplicable..Madara's statement was descredited the moment it took several sword swipes infused with Bijū-dama to match Shin-shuusenju assult. If what he said was true, one would have done the job effortlessly. ​

 

[Narutofan4203]

Naruto hyperbole statement proved wrong...Yata Mirror statement is the same as this statement of Madara

You must be registered for see images

Unless you believe Madara can destroy all creation...Lol

Lmao.

The Itachi fapboys on this site are disgraceful. It seems they don't understand the concept of the no limits fallacy, nor do they understand what hyperboles. For example in the databook Kabutowari is said to "crush any and all defences". So what happens when it clashes with the yata mirror?(it's still a defence) Exactly, you get left with a massive contradiction either way, as there's no such thing as a strongest shield or strongest attack. Itachi fapboys need to drill these relatively simple concepts into their thick skulls.

Exactly.

Bad example wich is also inapplicable..Madara's statement was descredited the moment it took several sword swipes infused with Bijū-dama to match Shin-shuusenju assult. If what he said was true, one would have done the job effortlessly. ​

Yet it can be applicable that because Yata Mirror simply reflects two multi-city block level attacks and has "accepted hype" it can't be destroyed by planet and star level striking strength? The IQ of this one is very low.. watch how I owned him 2 pages straight xD

 

[P3ĮÑ]

This debate, much wow. Such adrenaline. Very stupendous, much whimsical, wow, laudable, and wow.

 

[Narutofan4203]

The energy it requires to destroy earth is 2x10^36J..

With e=mc2
E = 50*1015 kg * (3*108m/s)2
= 50*1015 kg * 9*1016 m2/s2
= 450*1031 kg·m2/s2
= 450*1031 J
= 450*1031 J / 4.1844*109 J/megaton (energy)
= 107.5*1022 megatons (energy)

More than 40 entire exatons. This waltz kid is saying Itachi can tank this.. yeah. He lost pretty badly. I just love overkill.

 

[Joseph Gomes]

Bad example wich is also inapplicable..Madara's statement was descredited the moment it took several sword swipes infused with Bijū-dama to match Shin-shuusenju assult. If what he said was true, one would have done the job effortlessly. ​

XD XD I don't know what to say to you XD Man you failed so hard XD

 

[Conspirator.]

The energy it requires to destroy earth is 2x10^36J..

With e=mc2
E = 50*1015 kg * (3*108m/s)2
= 50*1015 kg * 9*1016 m2/s2
= 450*1031 kg·m2/s2
= 450*1031 J
= 450*1031 J / 4.1844*109 J/megaton (energy)
= 107.5*1022 megatons (energy)

More than 40 entire exatons. This waltz kid is saying Itachi can tank this.. yeah. He lost pretty badly. I just love overkill.

LOLOLOL! Nice work using simple physics to show how ridiculous the notion that Itachi can tank it is. I would rep you again but I need to spread.

 

[Joseph Gomes]

Bad example wich is also inapplicable..Madara's statement was descredited the moment it took several sword swipes infused with Bijū-dama to match Shin-shuusenju assult. If what he said was true, one would have done the job effortlessly. ​

I wouldn't have made this thread if all the Itachi fan were genuine trolls looking for entertainment...you can see that Waltz posted huge replies back to our comments, he's truly taken the databook hyperbole by heart. Even though Naruto statements has been retconned in many cases

 

[Waltz]

The Itachi fapboys on this site are disgraceful. It seems they don't understand the concept of the no limits fallacy, nor do they understand what hyperboles are. For example in the databook Kabutowari is said to "crush any and all defences". So what happens when it clashes with the yata mirror?(it's still a defence) Exactly, you get left with a massive contradiction either way, as there's no such thing as a strongest shield or the strongest offence. Itachi fapboys need to drill these relatively simple concepts into their thick skulls.

You missed my point. Not because their hypes conflict means that neither true if it is the case that one of the two hypes are false---- the only possible way determine this is:

1) Highlighting a portion in the Manga where either of the hyperbole's were contradicted.

2) If #1 cannot be sourced, pit both items against one another.


As you've already stated, the outcome of #2 cannot be determined. However, that is not the point of this thread. If superman's punches where hyped to breach any defenses and has lived up to this hype throughout Comics then I would give ear the Narutofans and the OP's argument, however that is not the case. ​

 

[ComplexCity]

When I arrived here to seek a new nardo forum after NF, the versus battles on NB killed me, where your average debater thinks via powerscaling itachi's Yata resists all attacks, which includes atomisation and reality warping well, if it's a crossoverses debate, and! I here by aver the authors words! you can't deny it homie "kishi words, denying manga, how ignoramus of yu, lulz derp" and the prime example which can be applied here is simple, now going by NB's logic of the "ohh so impervious Yata" I fail to see the fact how itachi can even counter a punch which can grab galaxies (Anit spiral-STTGL from guren Lagan can throw galaxies, he's broken) and is above 50+ million (or billion? I don't remember) light years tall, can counter the dudes punch, I'd cry tears of laughter if anyone even audaciously stated his punch is meaningless against Yata.

I remember a guy saying his Sheild is of omnipotence level, he was a troll, or not, idk, but he was being reasoned with, Gawd I was done.

That was Owajri

 

[Narutofan4203]

You missed my point. Not because their hypes conflict means that neither true if it is the case that one of the two hypes are false---- the only possible way determine this is:

1) Highlighting a portion in the Manga where either of the hyperbole's were contradicted.

2) If #1 cannot be sourced, pit both items against one another.


As you've already stated, the outcome of #2 cannot be determined. However, that is not the point of this thread. If superman's punches where hyped to breach any defenses and has lived up to this hype throughout Comics then I would give ear the Narutofans and the OP's argument, however that is not the case. ​

Notice how this guy avoids my posts because he is scared to be exposed and owned again. God I am amazing. Anyways, the manga wasn't contradicted, you were! You're saying because it was said and it reflected two multi-city block level attacks, using your no-limits-fallacy, it can defend from planet and star level destructive attacks. Just because it is accepted it can reflect all physical attacks. This is a fallacy. A no limits fallacy.
The estimated calc of a supernova.. is 1–2×1044J. A foe. You're saying itachi can defend from this, when the only feat it has shown is blocking two multi-city block level attacks. Just to not use the straw man fallacy, I'll use the word technically. You're TECHNICALLY saying that Itachi would be punched into outerspace, and stay there. Yata mirror would not be destroyed.