Obito's genjutsu control is comparable to Shisui's KA

[6thpathsage]

I would agree this, he definitely has apowerful genjutsu up his sleeve, if you can look at when he took the kyuubi, he controlled it from inside kushinas belly!

 

[Bogard]

The color of the chakra that controlled Yagura was the same as the color of Shisui's eye. Danzo and Itachi were the only people in possession of those eyes. It's quite probable to me that Danzo and Obito used each others services before, the Kyuubi attack as an exchange for Yahiko's murder. So it's possible that Danzo helped Obito out with this as well.

But Danzo is not on my pic. We only see Obito there, and he is the one controlling Yagura. Proof of it is that he even controlled Yagura to talk to Kisame, then later came out himself

 

[Unbiased King]

Just because Yagura was a perfect jinchuriki doesn't mean that the Sanbi would be willing to knock him out of genjutsu. Being a perfect jinchuriki only means that you have full control over the power of the bijuu, not the mind and will.

Gyuki pokes Bee out of his own will, not because Bee forced or instructed him to.

 

[Flawž]

Great thread, I agree with the hint's kishi gave us when Obito's genjutsu was compared to KA.

 

[Space Cowboy]

I personally think that Danzo played a part in that for exchange for Obito's help in the Uchiha massacre. Also weakened the mist, so it would benefit Konoha as well
@Bogard KA also probably has the ability to last well beyond the jutsu first being cast. The KA caster may only need to use it once to permanently alter the other person's mind, unless they realize it like Mifune of course. I say this because Shisui was planning on using it to end the Uchiha's plans of a coup, and it wouldnt have done much if the jutsu was only going to last for a limited period

 

[Bogard]

I personally think that Danzo played a part in that for exchange for Obito's help in the Uchiha massacre. Also weakened the mist, so it would benefit Konoha as well

Obito under Madara's disguise said the last time they met was during Uchiha massacre, so when did he give him the eye back then if your reasonment is true?

 

[Space Cowboy]

Obito under Madara's disguise said the last time they met was during Uchiha massacre, so when did he give him the eye back then if your reasonment is true?

He may have never needed to borrow the eye in the first place. He couldve had Danzo do it himself somehow. If Obito was capable of controlling a perfect jin so easily, why isnt Naruto under his control? Lets not forget MS sharingans usually only have one special ability. I really doubt Kishi would make Obito the exception by giving him Kamui and an OP genjutsu as well. Especially when you consider Kakashi doesnt have a second ability in his eye either

Edit: i added more to the last post by the way, if you didnt see it

 

[Bogard]

He may have never needed to borrow the eye in the first place. He couldve had Danzo do it himself somehow. If Obito was capable of controlling a perfect jin so easily, why isnt Naruto under his control? Lets not forget MS sharingans usually only have one special ability. I really doubt Kishi would make Obito the exception by giving him Kamui and an OP genjutsu as well. Especially when you consider Kakashi doesnt have a second ability in his eye either

Edit: i added more to the last post by the way, if you didnt see it

Concerning the MS ability that Kishi should give that is just speculation and it's another debate, so i'm not sure if it's that relevant with what i'm trying to say. Because MS has an ability doesn't stop MS user to be able to also have the ability to control Kyubi for example, it doesn't remove the ability to use genjutsu. Sasuke has kagutschi and sharingan genjutsu on the same eye for example. Like Zetsu said, it depends on skills, so maybe Obito was simply too skilled with his genjutsus as well.

Concerning your reasonment, even if we admit Danzo did it himself somehow, the fact remain that he said they never met after the Uchiha massacre, which means that after giving his order with his KA on Yagura(if we suppose it's what happened), he went away and didn't see Obito and Yagura again since on the pic i posted on the OP we actually see Obito behind Yagura(meaning Danzo wasn't there anymore since they never met after the massacre). And if it's the case, then it doesn't explain how Obito(who we see on the pic) is able to order Yagura what to say to Kisame exactly and even control his movements and everything else with such precision and exactly like he want

 

[Space Cowboy]

Concerning the MS ability that Kishi should give that is just speculation and it's another debate, so i'm not sure if it's that relevant with what i'm trying to say. Because MS has an ability doesn't stop MS user to be able to also have the ability to control Kyubi for example, it doesn't remove the ability to use genjutsu. Like Zetsu said, it depends on skills, so maybe Obito was simply too skilled with his genjutsus as well.

Concerning your reasonment, even if we admit Danzo did it himself somehow, the fact remain that he said they never met after the Uchiha massacre, which means that after giving his order with his KA on Yagura(if we suppose it's what happened), he went away and didn't see Obito and Yagura again since on the pic i posted on the OP we actually see Obito behind Yagura(meaning Danzo wasn't there anymore since they never met after the massacre). And if it's the case, then it doesn't explain how Obito(who we see on the pic) is able to order Yagura what to say to Kisame exactly and even control his movements and everything else with such precision and exactly like he want

Skill alone shouldnt be able to control supposedly genjutsu-immune jinchuriki. But like you said, that may be a debate for another time. And we do not know much of KA at all. Although clearly it can be used as a long-term jutsu as Shisui was planning on changing the minds of the Uchiha elders concerning their coup. He could have very well used KA to make Yagura completely submissive to Obito's demands. This is just too big of a glaring plot-hole for Kishi to overlook. Which is even more reason to believe there is an explanation behind it all

 

[Space Cowboy]

The thing you're missing, Bogard, is that Yagura was never a perfect host.

Once controlled by Obito, the Sharingan was used to control Sanbi.

Otherwise, Obito would have just controlled Bee or Naruto.

But he can't, because his genjutsu is nowhere near the level of Kotoamatsukami.

He was said to have been one of the few with full control over their tailed-beast by Danzo. Other than that, i agree with you

 

[Lilt]

The thing you're missing, Bogard, is that Yagura was never a perfect host.

Once controlled by Obito, the Sharingan was used to control Sanbi.

Otherwise, Obito would have just controlled Bee or Naruto.

But he can't, because his genjutsu is nowhere near the level of Kotoamatsukami.

-

Or Danzō may have helped way back when.

But suggesting Obito's base Sharingan genjutsu resembles KA is preposterous.

 

[Bogard]

Skill alone shouldnt be able to control supposedly genjutsu-immune jinchuriki. But like you said, that may be a debate for another time. And we do not know much of KA at all. Although clearly it can be used as a long-term jutsu as Shisui was planning on changing the minds of the Uchiha elders concerning their coup. He could have very well used KA to make Yagura completely submissive to Obito's demands. This is just too big of a glaring plot-hole for Kishi to overlook. Which is even more reason to believe there is an explanation behind it all

But were is it stated that KA could control a Perfect Host to begin with. Even that is just a speculation since we've never seen KA against a Perfect Jinchuriki. The more i think about it, the more i think it's impossible that Danzo helped. Because like i've said, Obito said they never met since the massacre, massacre that happened in Konoha, not in Kiri. So how could they have met in kiri to put Yagura in a genjutsu with Danzo going back with the eye?

The thing you're missing, Bogard, is that Yagura was never a perfect host.

Once controlled by Obito, the Sharingan was used to control Sanbi.

Otherwise, Obito would have just controlled Bee or Naruto.

But he can't, because his genjutsu is nowhere near the level of Kotoamatsukami.

Yagura was perfect Host:

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[Space Cowboy]

But were is it stated that KA could control a Perfect Host to begin with. Even that is just a speculation since we've never seen KA against a Perfect Jinchuriki. The more i think about it, the more i think it's impossible that Danzo helped. Because like i've said, Obito said they never met since the massacre, massacre that happened in Konoha, not in Kiri. So how could they have met in kiri to put Yagura in a genjutsu with Danzo going back with the eye?

Yagura was perfect Host:

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Im going to assume the strongest genjutsu in the entire manga has the capability of controlling even a perfect jin. And if youre suggesting that KA cant, you think Obito's 3T sharingan did? Seems a bit far-fetched. And no, its not that crazy to think he may have asked Danzo to travel out and carry out a mission of some sort to put him in KA. Keep in mind nobody around would even know what Danzo did. Obviously i have no idea, but i doubt this plot-hole will remain unresolved