[New User] Tobirama Senju and Minato Namikaze are Related

[Uzumakisan]

Could be... Kishi is just not good on making these parents/child relations.
We can see that by
Naruto/Minato
Hashirama/???/Tsunade
Guy/Lee
Sakura Family (possible clan symbol relates do Hashirama's sage mode forehead)

 

[davidou]

Similarities between Minato's (jutsus+personality) and Tobirama's , could be explained by the fact that Minato was Hiruzen's student who was Tobirama's student.

If those 2 are similar , it's not shocking , they don't need to share some blood to be so similar.
Looking at Gai and Lee , I want t them to be of the same family , looking at Tobirama and Minato , I don't , but still possible.

 

[Hasisas]

what if Tobirama is father of Jiraiya and Jiraiya is father of Minato? Both Jiraiya and Tobirama have white hair and probably have weakness for woman so they had some affairs and just run away after inpregnating womans.

 

[Azurestealth]

First of all, after visiting and reading threads on Narutobase to finally be able to register and post my own thread is really awesome. Thank you for reopening the Registrations.

Now, onto my theory. I somehow believe that Tobirama is directly or indirectly related to Minato, now I will base this theory only on Character Designs - Visual, Personality & Ninjutsu Capabilities.

Spoiler

1. Visual Similarities

Spoiler

Tobirama and Minato look really similar with the Spiky Hair and two sides of the faces covered - Mask in case of Tobirama & Hair in case of Minato. Now I know this is a long-shot but writers do tend to do this, similar base sketches and changed props. Why would a writer relate two people without them having any connection? But as I said, this is a long shot.

Here are two images for comparison.

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Also, one more thing to notice is how Tobirama & Hashirama have totally different appearances besides being brothers. If we look at other examples from the manga this is an exception as Madara & Izuna looked alike, Itachi & Sasuke looked alike but these two brothers have really contrasting appearances and I think this is because Tobirama has a bigger role in a different direction - Minato being related to him and this being revealed later.

2. Personality

Spoiler

According to Naruto Wiki both Tobirama Senju and Minato Namikaze were composed individuals who always had a plan. Both were shrewd to the extent that they would assess each situation logically and not do anything without any reason. During battle both of them used Speed techniques but that is for the other section. Anyway here are links to their respective wikis and in the Personality section there are a lot of similarities which struck this idea actually.

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3. Ninjutsu Capabilities & Techniques

Spoiler

• Both are adept at Space-Time Ninjutsu - FTG.
• Both are Sensory Types.
• Both rely on Speed & Reflexes instead of large techniques.

I know this theory was really small but I tried my best to use all available information. You can vote if you like my theory on the Poll above.

Spoiler

Also, if you're wondering what was the main basis of this theory besides the similar character designs it was this scan from Chapter 462.

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What struck me is the word play, at one point Tobi says, he can see the Will of Fire in Naruto like Hashirama which is a simile like as White as Snow. But later he says, he sees Hashirama in Naruto which is metaphor. He again uses Metaphor in the next line which is Naruto and Sasuke directly being compared to Fire and Hatred and to Hashirama and Madara as if they are the exact opposites. Now we all know how Uzumaki are related to Senju and are distant cousins but to truly keep this page's meaning, Naruto should be a Senju not an Uzumaki so if Minato is related to Tobirama then it all makes perfect sense, Naruto had an Uzumaki mother and a Senju Father which makes him the exact opposite.

I hope you found this theory entertaining, if not plausible. Thank you for reading.

Respect to you for coming up with such an original topic as i have never seen it before or anything similar to it so good idea. Second of all welcome to narutobase like you i'm new as well so i think you made a good first thread. Next i think you were a little vague in some of your explanations but i do agree with you. I also think that tobirama and minato could be related in some way however distant and i think it is quite likely they could be uncle and nephew and your theory only assured me more so well done. Overall good first post and plus rep for the originality. Finally welcome to NB!

 

[Reboryushon]

Yeah, lol, weak theory I accept it.

Imo it is not weak. It is what it is and it actually makes sense if we look to similarities and adding to that there is no background on the Namikaze clan. It could be true..why not!?

 

[kageking]

Could well be, we don't know nearly enough to put forth a convincing argument though. I would say they do share many things in common and that it stories like naruto that is rarely ever done without reason.

 

[captainaruto]

Oh yeah! Hokage kids needs to be protected. Put Uzumaki instead of Namikaze, and naruto is safe from everything. Hmmm! Guess what? Tobirama married from a namikaze clan(lol), had a son, who they needed to protect. so instead of senju, they put his second name to be Namikaze. SO there we go... super genius Minato Namikaze, Son of Tobirama Senju and Kathrina Namikaze.....

 

[Drifter2410]

what if Tobirama is father of Jiraiya and Jiraiya is father of Minato? Both Jiraiya and Tobirama have white hair and probably have weakness for woman so they had some affairs and just run away after inpregnating womans.

Haha! Yeah, may be possible but I've never heard Tobirama having a weakness for women, he was pretty composed and attentive to the important things.

 

[Drifter2410]

Respect to you for coming up with such an original topic as i have never seen it before or anything similar to it so good idea. Second of all welcome to narutobase like you i'm new as well so i think you made a good first thread. Next i think you were a little vague in some of your explanations but i do agree with you. I also think that tobirama and minato could be related in some way however distant and i think it is quite likely they could be uncle and nephew and your theory only assured me more so well done. Overall good first post and plus rep for the originality. Finally welcome to NB!

Thank you so much. With the next theories I put up, I won't be this vague as it makes the theory less credible anyway. I'm glad that another user has thought about this too so that means I'm not alone. Uncle Nephew sounds better than a direct lineage, I guess. That would explain the different hair colour anyway. Thank you for commenting and appreciating.

 

[Drifter2410]

Imo it is not weak. It is what it is and it actually makes sense if we look to similarities and adding to that there is no background on the Namikaze clan. It could be true..why not!?

Yeah, I guess but in a way the theory is weak because of less proof available. Thank you for motivating, I guess.

 

[Drifter2410]

Could well be, we don't know nearly enough to put forth a convincing argument though. I would say they do share many things in common and that it stories like naruto that is rarely ever done without reason.

Yup, I share the same view. In Naruto, nothing is unexplained. Sometimes explanations are late and people call things asspulls but the explanations are given at the end so somehow I think we will get a background on Minato. But not so sure as Manga is ending soon. Thank you for reading.

 

[Drifter2410]

Oh yeah! Hokage kids needs to be protected. Put Uzumaki instead of Namikaze, and naruto is safe from everything. Hmmm! Guess what? Tobirama married from a namikaze clan(lol), had a son, who they needed to protect. so instead of senju, they put his second name to be Namikaze. SO there we go... super genius Minato Namikaze, Son of Tobirama Senju and Kathrina Namikaze.....

Yup, that's what I think. Also someone in this thread pointed out that both Minato & Naruto were under the Third Hokage's rule so maybe he used the same policy of hiding Minato as a baby on Naruto too. Like hiding and taking care of them and also naming them with their mother's name. It makes more sense if the same person is responsible for two almost same events.

 

[BlacLord™]

You don't have to be related to someone to be able to work well together.

The way I've always seen it is that Minato used Tobirama as a role-model for his advancement as a shinobi, and probably through Sandaime, was able to study and copy his fighting style to some extent.

Minato and Tobirama don't look anything alike whereas Tobirama has obviously inherited his mother's looks, as Hashirama looks like his father and Itama looked like

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and even had half black straight hair and half white spiky.

 

[Drifter2410]

You don't have to be related to someone to be able to work well together.

The way I've always seen it is that Minato used Tobirama as a role-model for his advancement as a shinobi, and probably through Sandaime, was able to study and copy his fighting style to some extent.

Minato and Tobirama don't look anything alike whereas Tobirama has obviously inherited his mother's looks, as Hashirama looks like his father and Itama looked like

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and even had half black straight hair and half white spiky.

I agree but then you could work well with someone if you're related. Brothers or Father-Son combinations don't need practice to make good teams, Minato and Tobirama immediately acted according to each other and coordinated almost perfectly with each other, a familial or bloodline connection would support that.

Otherwise, its hard to imagine Naruto and Sarutobi suddenly showing perfect Teamwork after meeting for the first time. (Hypothetical)

But I also agree that relation isn't necessary here. Minato trying to copy Tobirama and his style seems more plausible now, I guess.

P.S. - My Blog is called The Polymath. Even I am called The Polymath by my friends and family - because of my blog.

 

[valandil988]

I agree but then you could work well with someone if you're related. Brothers or Father-Son combinations don't need practice to make good teams, Minato and Tobirama immediately acted according to each other and coordinated almost perfectly with each other, a familial or bloodline connection would support that.

Otherwise, its hard to imagine Naruto and Sarutobi suddenly showing perfect Teamwork after meeting for the first time. (Hypothetical)

But I also agree that relation isn't necessary here. Minato trying to copy Tobirama and his style seems more plausible now, I guess.

P.S. - My Blog is called The Polymath. Even I am called The Polymath by my friends and family - because of my blog.

I suppose a bunch of people that are not Yamanaka's are learning Yamanaka jutsu, and a bunch of people are learning Inuzuka dog rearing techniques without being Inuzuka. Because that's basically what you are suggesting.

Its not as if the Senju clan was non existent in Minato's era, Tsunade and Nawaki were still around before that. So I doubt Tsunade would be pleased that the third was letting some random Genin/Chunin, no matter how talented look at the second Hokage notes (IE Senju clan techniques)??? No matter how "self styled" he was after him.

I just don't agree, access to the second hokage's notes, especially the Hiraishin (an S rank jutsu, and likely a village secret) should or even MAYBE only have been available to Minato -at the earliest- after he became elite jonin, its obvious he had access to them before that. Likely after he became chunin.

And even then what makes him more worthy to be granted access to the second Hokage's notes? Without the clan connection it sounds like BLATANT favoritism from the third for no apparent reason. Why help one of his many Jonin more than others? It is something I don't see him doing. He didn't grant access to Itachi for such jutsu, and the third trusted Itachi.

The fact that Minato was hailed as a "prodigy" means the third should have been more than pleased to leave minato to his own devices to create his own jutsu. He didn't need to second hokage's jutsu if he was a so called prodigy lol.

 

[Uchiha Samater]

Welcome to NB

As for the theory here are my problems with it.

1. To be related, [directly or indirectly], would make Minato at the minimum part senju, [not even the slightest hint or foreshadow at this]. The only thing that even sheds light on this is the lack of Minato's parents.

2. Similarities do not necessarily mean relation, [I agree mangaka's write parallels etc], in this case again unfortunately there is not one proof or even favourable foreshadow

3. You mentioned the following :

Yup. I do know that. But there are already mysteries surrounding the Tobi who attacked Konoha versus the Funny Tobi vs Obito.

How the voice changes and the type of speech they use change, people have already put up theories about Madara having controlled Obito for a while and using his body to carry himself & his will.

I somehow incline towards this because of this simple reason, someone like Madara won't rely on a Boy (Nagato) and another crushed boy (Obito) to carry on such an important mission, what if Nagato never revived Madara (as it happened) and Obito never carried out Tsuki No Me. I know he left Black Zetsu but there is something fishy here, a loophole perhaps but its all speculation I guess.

A - All mysteries regarding Tobi were clarified:

The change in voice was part of his ''Madara'' act and be seen in both change of outward behaviour and voice when zetsu informed ''Tobi' that Sasuke defeated Itachi:

Spoiler

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This also occured when he lost his mask against Naruto & co.

Another example was when he first made contact with Nagato under his ''Madara'' persona and imitated the real Madara.

Even during his battle against Minato, we saw the following indicating that he was well aware of his actions and in control:

Spoiler

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B - You are right, Madara did not just leave his plan up to Nagato and Obito, he placed that will of his for a reason, a fail safe if you will, and that time already came.

Seeing that he was not revived alive as intended due to Nagato's change of heart, and Obito being a nuisance towards him, Madara bided his time and waited for the perfect moment to use his will to over power Obito into ressurecting him:

Spoiler

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I like the idea of the Nidaime and Yondaime being related but there is literally no proof or hint or foreshadow.

They use similar jutsu, and have a ''similar look' and unfortunately that's as far as it goes

 

[BlacLord™]

I agree but then you could work well with someone if you're related. Brothers or Father-Son combinations don't need practice to make good teams, Minato and Tobirama immediately acted according to each other and coordinated almost perfectly with each other, a familial or bloodline connection would support that.

Natural affinities.

There are friends I could work better with than my own family so bloodline relevancies are far and few between.

 

[Drifter2410]

I suppose a bunch of people that are not Yamanaka's are learning Yamanaka jutsu, and a bunch of people are learning Inuzuka dog rearing techniques without being Inuzuka. Because that's basically what you are suggesting.

Its not as if the Senju clan was non existent in Minato's era, Tsunade and Nawaki were still around before that. So I doubt Tsunade would be pleased that the third was letting some random Genin/Chunin, no matter how talented look at the second Hokage notes??? No matter how "self styled" he was after him.

I just don't agree, access to the second hokage's notes, especially the Hiraishin (an S rank jutsu, and likely a village secret) should or even MAYBE only have been available to Minato -at the earliest- after he became elite jonin, its obvious he had access to them before that. Likely after he became chunin.

And even then what makes him more worthy to be granted access to the second Hokage's notes? Without the clan connection it sounds like BLATANT favoritism from the third. Something I don't see him doing. He didn't grant access to Itachi for such jutsu, and the third trusted Itachi.

You really made a brilliant comparison. Minato won't have access to the Second's jutsu even though he may copy his fighting style based on Speed & Reflexes still he won't acquire any Jutsu until he was related somehow. It's pretty obvious he had access before he became a Jounin because he was pretty adept at FTG when he was a Jounin, it must have took him time to practice.

I totally agree with you because this makes more sense than Minato trying to copy Tobirama, if he just copied his reflexes and speed that would be copying but a legendary secret jutsu cannot be copied just like no one except the Naras do Shadow Manipulations. It is more than possible that some connection does exist there.

I apologize for me leaning more towards the 'style-copy' view even though I created this thread myself. I do agree with you, something more lies with Minato I guess which will be revealed.

 

[valandil988]

Welcome to NB

As for the theory here are my problems with it.

1. To be related, [directly or indirectly], would make Minato at the minimum part senju, [not even the slightest hint or foreshadow at this]. The only thing that even sheds light on this is the lack of Minato's parents.

2. Similarities do not necessarily mean relation, [I agree mangaka's write parallels etc], in this case again unfortunately there is not one proof or even favourable foreshadow

3. You mentioned the following :




A - All mysteries regarding Tobi were clarified:

The change in voice was part of his ''Madara'' act and be seen in both change of outward behaviour and voice when zetsu informed ''Tobi' that Sasuke defeated Itachi:

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

This also occured when he lost his mask against Naruto & co.

Another example was when he first made contact with Nagato under his ''Madara'' persona and imitated the real Madara.

Even during his battle against Minato, we saw the following indicating that he was well aware of his actions and in control:

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

B - You are right, Madara did not just leave his plan up to Nagato and Obito, he placed that will of his for a reason, a fail safe if you will, and that time already came.

Seeing that he was not revived alive as intended due to Nagato's change of heart, and Obito being a nuisance towards him, Madara bided his time and waited for the perfect moment to use his will to over power Obito into ressurecting him:

Spoiler

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I like the idea of the Nidaime and Yondaime being related but there is literally no proof or hint or foreshadow.

They use similar jutsu, and have a ''similar look' and unfortunately that's as far as it goes

How does Minato know Hiraishin?

I have yet to see someone write a realistic explanation that makes sense.

Saying that "Oh the Third shared it with Minato because Minato was a total Tobirama fanboy!" Yeah....that makes sense. NO!

The third would never share such jutsu with even elite Jonin in my opinion.

Minato was a so called Prodigy....well doesn't that mean he would have been awesome without the thirds help? Did he need help to come up with awesome kick ass jutsu?

That's the hole in all the "The third let Minato see the second Hokage's notes!" theories. No other so called "prodigy" of the leaf has ever been granted access to a previous Hokage's jutsu. Not Itachi who was trusted by the third, not Orochimaru, not Kakashi etc. So why was Minato given "special" treatment? He was only considered for Hokage AFTER he routed the forces of Iwa, using YES you guessed it Hiraishin no jutsu. So the third wasn't grooming him.

The third who could be argued was soft on Naruto never shared jutsu or played favorites with Naruto. So why should Minato get special treatment from the third?

At most if Minato expressed an interest in Tobirama's space time ninjutsu the third would have described it. Thats all, this would have likely forced Minato to come up with a unique space time jutsu that while it would mirror the Seconds wouldn't be based upon the exact same principles. Ergo Minato wouldn't be running around with what amounts to as the second's jutsu lol.

The only thing different about Minato's Hiraishin is the jutsu Shiki that isn't the so called "Ninjutsu" part of the jutsu. The Hiraishin has two parts as near as I can tell.

Hiraishin hypothesis:

The jutsu Shiki, that which is applied to Kunai and other objects is a guide. Sort of like a light house that allows Minato to guide his Ninjutsu.

The Hiraishin ninjutsu is a jutsu that CAN be used without the sealing technique, however its incredibly dangerous without a jutsu shiki. It like going blind, you could teleport yourself into a rock or into the sky or deep into the ground.

Ergo only when both of these jutsu are used in tandem can Minato or Tobirama use this jutsu without killing themselves. The fact that the Ninjutsu is identical to the seconds own jutsu tells you its the same jutsu. Minato may have created his own jutsu shiki for his beacons but the rest is identical. Ergo Minato must have learned the jutsu from somewhere.

Question is where. For me its obvious = Clan technique.

Does that not sound funny? The foreshadowing...as you called it is the use of the same jutsu.

 

[Drifter2410]

Welcome to NB

As for the theory here are my problems with it.

1. To be related, [directly or indirectly], would make Minato at the minimum part senju, [not even the slightest hint or foreshadow at this]. The only thing that even sheds light on this is the lack of Minato's parents.

2. Similarities do not necessarily mean relation, [I agree mangaka's write parallels etc], in this case again unfortunately there is not one proof or even favourable foreshadow

3. You mentioned the following :




A - All mysteries regarding Tobi were clarified:

The change in voice was part of his ''Madara'' act and be seen in both change of outward behaviour and voice when zetsu informed ''Tobi' that Sasuke defeated Itachi:

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

This also occured when he lost his mask against Naruto & co.

Another example was when he first made contact with Nagato under his ''Madara'' persona and imitated the real Madara.

Even during his battle against Minato, we saw the following indicating that he was well aware of his actions and in control:

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

B - You are right, Madara did not just leave his plan up to Nagato and Obito, he placed that will of his for a reason, a fail safe if you will, and that time already came.

Seeing that he was not revived alive as intended due to Nagato's change of heart, and Obito being a nuisance towards him, Madara bided his time and waited for the perfect moment to use his will to over power Obito into ressurecting him:

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

I like the idea of the Nidaime and Yondaime being related but there is literally no proof or hint or foreshadow.

They use similar jutsu, and have a ''similar look' and unfortunately that's as far as it goes

But I think you should look at valandil's comment above yours. I think I agree that no one would have access to a secret jutsu just like that, no matter how talented they might be. That's contributes more to Minato being somehow a special/important.

I agree there haven't been foreshadows or hints but the hint that Naruto is so far directly compared to Hashirama/Senju is weird even after everyone being aware that Uzumakis are just distant cousins. The direct comparison in a way foreshadows that Naruto has Senju blood from both Mother & Father.