Naruto vs Nagato

[KidGamer65]

So quick question about this senjutsu stuff. You turn into a statue if your body has too much "natural energy" compared to regular chakra, right?

Well, the jutsu that a ninja uses in Sage Mode is augmented by natural energy, but it's not entirely natural energy. The whole point of controlling Sage Mode is for the user to do all the work balancing the Nature:Spiritalhysical energy ratio themselves. By absorbing a senjutsu enhanced Rasengan for example, Nagato wouldn't be absorbing pure natural energy, but a Rasengan with an already balanced ratio. Wouldn't that make it impossible to absorb too much natural energy? It worked in the Preta path case because Naruto was channeling natural energy directly, with the intention to absorb more than necessary.

The only flaw I can see to this is if a SM user can intentionally pack a lot of natural energy into their jutsu.

1. Yes.

2. Not quite. The ratio of the jutsu is balanced, but that doesn't mean that the user's chakra will be able to balance that Nature Energy when it enters their body. Nagato absorb FRS easily because FRS doesn't contain enough Nature Energy on it's own to cause him to turn to stone. The same can't be said with a max charged Bijuu Dama and Naruto's Kurama Avatar itself.

And Nagato never absorbed pure NE. That's impossible. When it enters Naruto's body it merges with his chakra and becomes Senjutsu chakra, which Preta Path then absorbed from his body.

 

[Oblivionx]

No nagato can beat BSM naruto because naruto has a high level shunshin plus senjutsu. He can simply engage nagato in taijutsu and destroy him at it. We saw what SM did to pain in taijutsu. Add the power of kurama and he stomps. Nagato cannot absorb pure senjutsu from naruto directly either. And if preta dies in close combat so does nagato.

 

[BLAZE]

This guy

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

Oops. :lol Meant this guy

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

Oh wait no, this is definitely Madara Rules/Edogawa/Bronze :lol

lmfao my sides

 

[TRE MERCER]

Naruto stomps.

 

[Cahya]

1. Yes.

2. Not quite. The ratio of the jutsu is balanced, but that doesn't mean that the user's chakra will be able to balance that Nature Energy when it enters their body. Nagato absorb FRS easily because FRS doesn't contain enough Nature Energy on it's own to cause him to turn to stone. The same can't be said with a max charged Bijuu Dama and Naruto's Kurama Avatar itself.

And Nagato never absorbed pure NE. That's impossible. When it enters Naruto's body it merges with his chakra and becomes Senjutsu chakra, which Preta Path then absorbed from his body.

You're ignoring much of what he's already explained. The user absorbing the technique doesn't need to balance it when it's already been balanced. You turn to stone after absorbing too much unbalanced natural energy, not from absorbing too much natural energy if it's already been balanced.

 

[Antdog]

Naruto nukes Nagato to hell and back

 

[KidGamer65]

You're ignoring much of what he's already explained. The user absorbing the technique doesn't need to balance it when it's already been balanced. You turn to stone after absorbing too much unbalanced natural energy, not from absorbing too much natural energy if it's already been balanced.

No, you aren’t properly understanding what I’m saying. The NE in the tech being balanced doesn’t mean that once mixed with the absorbers chakra the balance will remain as the amount of chakra in the jutsu and the amount of chakra the absorber has are different.

You turn to stone from absorbing too much NE. Period. Not “unbalanced NE”. That phrase doesn’t even make sense.

 

[Cahya]

No, you aren’t properly understanding what I’m saying. The NE in the tech being balanced doesn’t mean that once mixed with the absorbers chakra the balance will remain as the amount of chakra in the jutsu and the amount of chakra the absorber has are different.

You turn to stone from absorbing too much NE. Period. Not “unbalanced NE”. That phrase doesn’t even make sense.

Why is the amount of chakra the absorber has when compared to the amount the technique with NE has relevant to the NE remaining balanced once absorbed?

I was only trying to be specific ...

 

[Lord Tywin]

Naruto destroys

 

[KidGamer65]

Why is the amount of chakra the absorber has when compared to the amount the technique with NE has relevant to the NE remaining balanced once absorbed?

I was only trying to be specific ...

Example (not meant to be taken literal obviously):

1 Bijuu Dama has 30 NE. Nagato's chakra is equal to 150. 75 Physical energy, 75 Spiritual Energy.

If Naruto fires 3 BD and Nagato absorbs them, he's taken in 90 NE, which is not balanced with 75 and 75 Spirit and Physical energy.

This:

The user absorbing the technique doesn't need to balance it when it's already been balanced.

Is obviously wrong because that is exactly how Preta turned to stone. Naruto takes in Nature Energy, balances it with his chakra, creates Senjutsu chakra and enters Sage Mode. Preta then absorbs that chakra, but absorbs too much of it. There is no such thing as absorbing Nature Energy as Preta absorbs chakra. NE is not chakra.

 

[Darth AniCetuS]

BSM Naruto stomps.

 

[Edogawa]

Why is the amount of chakra the absorber has when compared to the amount the technique with NE has relevant to the NE remaining balanced once absorbed?

I was only trying to be specific ...

That question will be answered by mere speculations, like Biju Dama carrying more Chakra than Nagato's own, but it a mere speculation and backed by nothing. The manga established that to turn to a stone, you overload your own reserves with NE and fail in balancing it, which is what canonically happened. Facts don't need questions, so you should ignore other ridiculous assertions like what that kid is trying to say.

 

[Lord Tywin]

Jesus Christ Pain couldn’t even hold back an eight tail Naruto with CT. Now he takes on something much more powerful?

 

[-Akuma-]

You must be registered for see images

People think Nagato stands a chance? What a joke.

 

[Eng nawashi]

All projectiles get redirected with ST .the avatar itself can be sent flying miles away at any moment like what Deva did with the boss toads who have comparable size with 360 ST not even a focused one so we can probably forget about Naruto charging any BD bigger than standard as he would get easily interrupted .Nagato has three ways to take the avatar and Naruto down .1-BT drags the avatar or Nagato simply engages it in CQC then Preta absorbs the majority of the avatar causing its deterioration .2-ST Knocks the avatar down then gedo chains seal it .if someone argues that he can't absorb the BSM avatar or can't use the Gedo's chains thing then 3-CST or even a considerable fraction of it pushes the avatar down on the ground destroying it to nothing and killing Naruto in the process as a far weaker impact has destroyed it already .Naruto's only chance is to expose the 5 secs cooldown of ST by an attack that Nagato possibly cant absorb but he needs to stay palanced in place after the last ST and be able to charge that attack in time .not happening if Nagato made sure to reflect both Naruto's projectiles and avatar away .As for absorbing senjutsu avatar ,Preta pein whose chakra is nowhere close to Nagato's was able to absorb almost the max amount of senjutsu base Naruto can have .cloaked Naruto has much more chakra than Base Naruto but Nagato has much more chakra than pein's preta .the avatar itself is only mixed with a part of the senjutsu chakra that Naruto got so absorbing it is mostlikey possible.Nagato mid-high or high diff.

 

[Edogawa]

All projectiles get redirected with ST .the avatar itself can be sent flying miles away at any moment like what Deva did with the boss toads who have comparable size with 360 ST not even a focused one so we can probably forget about Naruto charging any BD bigger than standard as he would get easily interrupted .Nagato has three ways to take the avatar and Naruto down .1-BT drags the avatar or Nagato simply engages it in CQC then Preta absorbs the majority of the avatar causing its deterioration .2-ST Knocks the avatar down then gedo chains seal it .if someone argues that he can't absorb the BSM avatar or can't use the Gedo's chains thing then 3-CST or even a considerable fraction of it pushes the avatar down on the ground destroying it to nothing and killing Naruto in the process as a far weaker impact has destroyed it already .Naruto's only chance is to expose the 5 secs cooldown of ST by an attack that Nagato possibly cant absorb but he needs to stay palanced in place after the last ST and be able to charge that attack in time .not happening if Nagato made sure to reflect both Naruto's projectiles and avatar away .As for absorbing senjutsu avatar ,Preta pein whose chakra is nowhere close to Nagato's was able to absorb almost the max amount of senjutsu base Naruto can have .cloaked Naruto has much more chakra than Base Naruto but Nagato has much more chakra than pein's preta .the avatar itself is only mixed with a part of the senjutsu chakra that Naruto got so absorbing it is mostlikey possible.Nagato mid-high or high diff.

Exactly this.

Even if Senjutsu is what overloaded Pain and not Natural Energy, it only overloaded Gakido Pain who receives 1/6 of Nagato's Chakra. Weakened depraved 1/6 of Nagato's Chakra > SM + Base Naruto's Chakra reserves, and that's only because Nagato had already used up so much Chakra prior. Naruto would need to create a lot more than Senjutsu 8 Tails worth of Chakra to overload Nagato's own, and he isn't doing that since there are no feats for it.

I don't actually even think interval time Deva's power applies to Nagato himself. He used Deva's power twice at the same time.

 

[Eng nawashi]

Exactly this.

Even if Senjutsu is what overloaded Pain and not Natural Energy, it only overloaded Gakido Pain who receives 1/6 of Nagato's Chakra. Weakened depraved 1/6 of Nagato's Chakra > SM + Base Naruto's Chakra reserves, and that's only because Nagato had already used up so much Chakra prior. Naruto would need to create a lot more than Senjutsu 8 Tails worth of Chakra to overload Nagato's own, and he isn't doing that since there are no feats for it.

I don't actually even think interval time Deva's power applies to Nagato himself. He used Deva's power twice at the same time.

Yes it is not about of how much chakra the TTB or the avatar made ,it is about how much senjutsu is mixed with them which is limited to the senjutsu chakra that cloaked Naruto can have at a time .

You mean when he BT'ed both Naruto and the rock .I think it was 1 BT directed at two different directions like when tendu pushed both Naruto and his clone away .

 

[Edogawa]

Yes it is not about of how much chakra the TTB or the avatar made ,it is about how much senjutsu is mixed with them which is limited to the senjutsu chakra that cloaked Naruto can have at a time .

You mean when he BT'ed both Naruto and the rock .I think it was 1 BT directed at two different directions like when tendu pushed both Naruto and his clone away .

That can be another way, but Nagato turning to a stone when absorbing Senjutsu is false and not happening. That's the main point. He absorbs everything Naruto can throw at him.

That would be impossible by what Kakashi deduced. 5 interval seconds happens after per usage; Nagato used BT twice - one hand to pull Naruto and another hand to pull the meteor. So he used Deva twice simultaneously, which would nullify the 5 interval seconds. I think the 5 seconds interval seem to be an effect from Chakra transmitting rather than the Jutsu itself.

You can think of it like a Wi-Fi signal; when you're further from the Wi-Fi, the signal becomes slower and weaker. Same thing applies to Pain, since Nagato transmits large Chakra every second to each Pain, Deva's power gets slower and weaker hence the 5 seconds interval. That won't apply to his real body, though as all that massive Chakra is in one body. Naruto himself noted the power and speed of his Jutsu is on a different league than Pain receiving Chakra from Nagato.

The last bit you said wasn't really directed. It was a 360 ST.

 

[Eng nawashi]

That can be another way, but Nagato turning to a stone when absorbing Senjutsu is false and not happening. That's the main point. He absorbs everything Naruto can throw at him.

That would be impossible by what Kakashi deduced. 5 interval seconds happens after per usage; Nagato used BT twice - one hand to pull Naruto and another hand to pull the meteor. So he used Deva twice simultaneously, which would nullify the 5 interval seconds. I think the 5 seconds interval seem to be an effect from Chakra transmitting rather than the Jutsu itself.

You can think of it like a Wi-Fi signal; when you're further from the Wi-Fi, the signal becomes slower and weaker. Same thing applies to Pain, since Nagato transmits large Chakra every second to each Pain, Deva's power gets slower and weaker hence the 5 seconds interval. That won't apply to his real body, though as all that massive Chakra is in one body. Naruto himself noted the power and speed of his Jutsu is on a different league than Pain receiving Chakra from Nagato.

The last bit you said wasn't really directed. It was a 360 ST.

I see your point and it could be right but I 'd rather still consider the 5 secs cool down because of lack of conclusive feats or statements .Tendu have aimed his hands at two different directions before using his power more than once And it wasn't always 360 ST .for example when he ST'ed choji and choza ,he aimed one hand to each and it wasn't exactly 360 ST as Kakashi wasn't pushed away .

You must be registered for see links

 

[Tyrance sasuke]

Nagato summons gedo mazou and kills naruto , sucking his soul out . He has no defense against that . Nagato can bexome invisible with his chameleon and attack naruto from nowhere . No defense there .

Asura laser cannons destroys naruto .