Nagato can not defeat Hashi of Madara

[Strict]

Can you explain how he counters all of Nagato's techniques?

Sure.

Chibaku Tensei. Attracts the surroundings in its direction and forms into a huge sphere. How Hashirama can counter this? Quite easily.

Spoiler

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Do you see Madara coming out from this huge tendril? He merged with this tendril and was hiding in there. If Chibaku Tensei begins to attract the surroundings, Hashirama, who is the user of the Mokuton, can simply cover and merge himself with his trees, what giving him a perfect hideout from being crushed by Chibaku Tenseis attractions. Now we have Owarij who claims that the attraction would release the power to literally splinter the trees and thus render Hashiramas hideout useless. But by that logic, Chibaku Tensei wouldn't even consist out of huge, compressed stones but would pulverize all matters it has attracted.

Spoiler

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Here you can even see trees being attracted by Chibaku Tensei without rendering into splinters. Considering, that Hashiramas trees are not only way huger, Chibaku Tensei itself will consist largely out of trees Hashirama created before. So in this case this will be a perfect hideout for Hashirama to avoid from being crushed. Sounds may simple for you as Nagato fans, but a good counter don't have to be always spectacular.

Shinra Tensei. Isn't even worth talking about. It blows away objects but don't really cause damage. While the toads were knocked down by their own weight, a normal sized and weighted person would tank this very well

Spoiler

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Bee is getting pushed away without any caused damage on him. And as for Hashiramas tree world, which is claimed to be repel by the Shinra Tensei, Hashirama is able to cover the whole landscape with his trees, not even Konohagakure, where a large scale Shinra Tensei with a long interval was needed, is comparable in size. The little forest that Nagato pushed away with his Shinra Tensei is also no comparison, since a single tendril is at least 20 times bigger than a tree. Furthermore, Hashirama has a direct counter for the Shinra Tensei, too.

Spoiler

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Narutos Chakra explosion was comparable to a large scale Shinra Tensei but was countered by Yamato by this way quite easily, though his Mokuton is not even a comparison to Hashiramas.

Bansho Tenin. Can be countered by many ways. Kakashi used a Bunshin, Hashirama can also.
Naruto countered Bansho Tenin by using his Chakra arm; Hashirama has a similar option.

Spoiler

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This Jutsu allows Hashirama to counter Bansho Tenin, it can crush the rock Nagato is using and can above crush Nagato - Bansho Tenin is more suicide for him than a help.

Jutsu-Absorption. You said, Preta can absorb the Mokuton, but this is wrong. Preta Path cannot absorb any kind of Ninjutsu, this is a mistake. It allows you to ban Chakra in big amounts. Furthermore it allows you to create a barrier in order to stop Ninjutsus. And here is your fault by comparing Jiraiyas oil with the Mokuton. Here, it does not matter from which matter the oil is, the technique itself is Chakra and cannot pass through the barrier - Here I would even agree that Preta can absorb Susanoo, since it consists out of Chakra, too. The Mokuton on the other hand does not consist out of Chakra, it is in fact a natural and physical matter which is created and controlled by using Chakra. Therefore Preta Path have to touch the wood in order to absorb its Chakra. But the trees of the Mokuton doesn't consist out of Chakra. Here, Hashiramas woods don't even differ from a human. Both are living beings which are living due to their Chakra. Absorb its Chakra and you leave dead wood, absorb all of a humans Chakra to 0 and he will die as well. What my point is, since Preta can't repel the Mokuton by its barrier but have to come into contact with it, the impact will simply crush him. If I am wrong, we have to see at least one example were Preta Path is absorbing in fact a natural matter.

Ningendou. It have to touch its target in order to remove his soul. This is kinda difficult, since a close combat would be a suicide as well for Nagato. In his battle against Jiraiya, s single kick was needed in order to stop Ningendou from coming close to him and during the whole battle Ningendous soul removal technique wasn't even useful. Now we have Ryuu who is claming that Hashirama will be caught by Nagatos Chameleon, whereby Nagato could take out his soul quite easily. First of all I doubt that Nagato would have taken his soul if Naruto had acted smarter (crushing the chameleon with his Rasengans instead of attacking Nagato). For Hashirama, the Chameleon isn't a problem, too. After being caught, all Hashirama has to do is to use his Mokuton in order to crush the Chameleon and Nagato as well.

Spoiler

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Do you see the huge stone Golem being crushed? This will await Nagato and his Chameleon as well. By a closer look, many of Nagatos techniques are more suicide for him than a help.

Asura Path. Isn't even worth talking about. Its physical strength is not comparable with the Mokuton and I think here we both agree. Against its rockets and lasers, Hashirama can simply cover himself with his Mokuton. Sasuke by himself covered himself with mere snakes in order to avoid Deidaras explosions.

What is to say about Naraka Path? Not useful.

Nagato can use all 5 elements but yet we haven't seen any of them. Hashirama can also use the Doton and Suiton to an unknown extent, but its extent is also a mere assumption.

Here you see, all of Nagatos techniques are countered. I could go on and show you how Hashirama could overrun Nagato with his techniques, but I think I'll make a break here.

 

[Ryuu..]

Sure.

Chibaku Tensei. Attracts the surroundings in its direction and forms into a huge sphere. How Hashirama can counter this? Quite easily.

Spoiler

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Do you see Madara coming out from this huge tendril? He merged with this tendril and was hiding in there. If Chibaku Tensei begins to attract the surroundings, Hashirama, who is the user of the Mokuton, can simply cover and merge himself with his trees, what giving him a perfect hideout from being crushed by Chibaku Tenseis attractions. Now we have Owarij who claims that the attraction would release the power to literally splinter the trees and thus render Hashiramas hideout useless. But by that logic, Chibaku Tensei wouldn't even consist out of huge, compressed stones but would pulverize all matters it has attracted.

Spoiler

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Here you can even see trees being attracted by Chibaku Tensei without rendering into splinters. Considering, that Hashiramas trees are not only way huger, Chibaku Tensei itself will consist largely out of trees Hashirama created before. So in this case this will be a perfect hideout for Hashirama to avoid from being crushed. Sounds may simple for you as Nagato fans, but a good counter don't have to be always spectacular.

Shinra Tensei. Isn't even worth talking about. It blows away objects but don't really cause damage. While the toads were knocked down by their own weight, a normal sized and weighted person would tank this very well

Spoiler

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Bee is getting pushed away without any caused damage on him. And as for Hashiramas tree world, which is claimed to be repel by the Shinra Tensei, Hashirama is able to cover the whole landscape with his trees, not even Konohagakure, where a large scale Shinra Tensei with a long interval was needed, is comparable in size. The little forest that Nagato pushed away with his Shinra Tensei is also no comparison, since a single tendril is at least 20 times bigger than a tree. Furthermore, Hashirama has a direct counter for the Shinra Tensei, too.

Spoiler

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Narutos Chakra explosion was comparable to a large scale Shinra Tensei but was countered by Yamato by this way quite easily, though his Mokuton is not even a comparison to Hashiramas.

Bansho Tenin. Can be countered by many ways. Kakashi used a Bunshin, Hashirama can also.
Naruto countered Bansho Tenin by using his Chakra arm; Hashirama has a similar option.

Spoiler

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This Jutsu allows Hashirama to counter Bansho Tenin, it can crush the rock Nagato is using and can above crush Nagato - Bansho Tenin is more suicide for him than a help.

Jutsu-Absorption. You said, Preta can absorb the Mokuton, but this is wrong. Preta Path cannot absorb any kind of Ninjutsu, this is a mistake. It allows you to ban Chakra in big amounts. Furthermore it allows you to create a barrier in order to stop Ninjutsus. And here is your fault by comparing Jiraiyas oil with the Mokuton. Here, it does not matter from which matter the oil is, the technique itself is Chakra and cannot pass through the barrier - Here I would even agree that Preta can absorb Susanoo, since it consists out of Chakra, too. The Mokuton on the other hand does not consist out of Chakra, it is in fact a natural and physical matter which is created and controlled by using Chakra. Therefore Preta Path have to touch the wood in order to absorb its Chakra. But the trees of the Mokuton doesn't consist out of Chakra. Here, Hashiramas woods don't even differ from a human. Both are living beings which are living due to their Chakra. Absorb its Chakra and you leave dead wood, absorb all of a humans Chakra to 0 and he will die as well. What my point is, since Preta can't repel the Mokuton by its barrier but have to come into contact with it, the impact will simply crush him. If I am wrong, we have to see at least one example were Preta Path is absorbing in fact a natural matter.

Ningendou. It have to touch its target in order to remove his soul. This is kinda difficult, since a close combat would be a suicide as well for Nagato. In his battle against Jiraiya, s single kick was needed in order to stop Ningendou from coming close to him and during the whole battle Ningendous soul removal technique wasn't even useful. Now we have Ryuu who is claming that Hashirama will be caught by Nagatos Chameleon, whereby Nagato could take out his soul quite easily. First of all I doubt that Nagato would have taken his soul if Naruto had acted smarter (crushing the chameleon with his Rasengans instead of attacking Nagato). For Hashirama, the Chameleon isn't a problem, too. After being caught, all Hashirama has to do is to use his Mokuton in order to crush the Chameleon and Nagato as well.

Spoiler

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Do you see the huge stone Golem being crushed? This will await Nagato and his Chameleon as well. By a closer look, many of Nagatos techniques are more suicide for him than a help.

Asura Path. Isn't even worth talking about. Its physical strength is not comparable with the Mokuton and I think here we both agree. Against its rockets and lasers, Hashirama can simply cover himself with his Mokuton. Sasuke by himself covered himself with mere snakes in order to avoid Deidaras explosions.

What is to say about Naraka Path? Not useful.

Nagato can use all 5 elements but yet we haven't seen any of them. Hashirama can also use the Doton and Suiton to an unknown extent, but its extent is also a mere assumption.

Here you see, all of Nagatos techniques are countered. I could go on and show you how Hashirama could overrun Nagato with his techniques, but I think I'll make a break here.

Not bad, but how does he escape Gedo Mazo's soul dragon? Moreover, alot of what you've said hinges on Hashirama having prior info, something which he wouldn't have. For example, how would he know to hide in the trees when Chibaku Tensei is used? He is not known to have Itachi-level intellect. How is he to know what Gedo Mazo soul dragon can do? If he is within 10m of Nagato, trying to counter Banshou Tenin is futile.

 

[TrollingSage]

This guy must be insane

There is no possible way, hashirama counters Nagato's techniques..

All he's doing is typing a load of bs


I can list hashirama's technoques, and list nagato's counters to them
Yet if I list Nagato's techniques, hashirama has nothing to survive many of them

I would LOVE to see his take argument on how hashirma wins this

WTF??:flaw::flaw: Arguably the most durable(or 2nd durable) cant SURVIVE most of nagato's tech?

 

[Strict]

Not bad, but how does he escape Gedo Mazo's soul dragon? Moreover, alot of what you've said hinges on Hashirama having prior info, something which he wouldn't have. For example, how would he know to hide in the trees when Chibaku Tensei is used? He is not known to have Itachi-level intellect. How is he to know what Gedo Mazo soul dragon can do? If he is within 10m of Nagato, trying to counter Banshou Tenin is futile.

Well. It depends on which knowledge possesses both about each other. From the ground out shooting pales would be also hard to counter, especially without any knowledge.

Hiding in his trees will become quite easy. I think it is common sense since you are getting attracted to a sphere jointly from tons of rocks. Some are going to attack Chibaku Tensei as the last option (for exampe the Kyuubi) others, like Hashirama coud use their own possibilitys. And to be honest, Chibaku Tenseis attraction isn't very fast. During it, Itachi hold a talk with Naruto and Bee, explained them how Chibaku Tensei works and created a plan. I expect from the first Hokage, Senju Hashirama, to create a reasonable plan with his options as well.

 

[Ryuu..]

Well. It depends on which knowledge possesses both about each other. From the ground out shooting pales would be also hard to counter, especially without any knowledge.

Hiding in his trees will become quite easy. I think it is common sense since you are getting attracted to a sphere jointly from tons of rocks. Some are going to attack Chibaku Tensei as the last option (for exampe the Kyuubi) others, like Hashirama coud use their own possibilitys. And to be honest, Chibaku Tenseis attraction isn't very fast. During it, Itachi hold a talk with Naruto and Bee, explained them how Chibaku Tensei works and created a plan. I expect from the first Hokage, Senju Hashirama, to create a reasonable plan with his options as well.

Interesting. But another point I forgot to raise about Chibaku Tensei is that Nagato is able to focus on the sphere and up the strength of the gravitational field at a particular point. Remember when the 6 tailed Kyuubi first hit the rock? Nagato proceeded to focus the majority of the rocks onto that particular part, so that the 6 tailed Kyuubi would sustain alot more damage.

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(The anime shows this process clearer). If he chose to do this whilst Hashirama was on his way up, Hashirama would have alot less time to make a decision, because he'd be drawn up alot faster. I still don't see what he can do about Soul Dragon, however.

 

[Owarij]

Sure.

Chibaku Tensei. Attracts the surroundings in its direction and forms into a huge sphere. How Hashirama can counter this? Quite easily.

Spoiler

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Do you see Madara coming out from this huge tendril? He merged with this tendril and was hiding in there. If Chibaku Tensei begins to attract the surroundings, Hashirama, who is the user of the Mokuton, can simply cover and merge himself with his trees, what giving him a perfect hideout from being crushed by Chibaku Tenseis attractions. Now we have Owarij who claims that the attraction would release the power to literally splinter the trees and thus render Hashiramas hideout useless. But by that logic, Chibaku Tensei wouldn't even consist out of huge, compressed stones but would pulverize all matters it has attracted.

Spoiler

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Here you can even see trees being attracted by Chibaku Tensei without rendering into splinters. Considering, that Hashiramas trees are not only way huger, Chibaku Tensei itself will consist largely out of trees Hashirama created before. So in this case this will be a perfect hideout for Hashirama to avoid from being crushed. Sounds may simple for you as Nagato fans, but a good counter don't have to be always spectacular.

Shinra Tensei. Isn't even worth talking about. It blows away objects but don't really cause damage. While the toads were knocked down by their own weight, a normal sized and weighted person would tank this very well

Spoiler

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Bee is getting pushed away without any caused damage on him. And as for Hashiramas tree world, which is claimed to be repel by the Shinra Tensei, Hashirama is able to cover the whole landscape with his trees, not even Konohagakure, where a large scale Shinra Tensei with a long interval was needed, is comparable in size. The little forest that Nagato pushed away with his Shinra Tensei is also no comparison, since a single tendril is at least 20 times bigger than a tree. Furthermore, Hashirama has a direct counter for the Shinra Tensei, too.

Spoiler

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Narutos Chakra explosion was comparable to a large scale Shinra Tensei but was countered by Yamato by this way quite easily, though his Mokuton is not even a comparison to Hashiramas.

Bansho Tenin. Can be countered by many ways. Kakashi used a Bunshin, Hashirama can also.
Naruto countered Bansho Tenin by using his Chakra arm; Hashirama has a similar option.

Spoiler

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This Jutsu allows Hashirama to counter Bansho Tenin, it can crush the rock Nagato is using and can above crush Nagato - Bansho Tenin is more suicide for him than a help.

Jutsu-Absorption. You said, Preta can absorb the Mokuton, but this is wrong. Preta Path cannot absorb any kind of Ninjutsu, this is a mistake. It allows you to ban Chakra in big amounts. Furthermore it allows you to create a barrier in order to stop Ninjutsus. And here is your fault by comparing Jiraiyas oil with the Mokuton. Here, it does not matter from which matter the oil is, the technique itself is Chakra and cannot pass through the barrier - Here I would even agree that Preta can absorb Susanoo, since it consists out of Chakra, too. The Mokuton on the other hand does not consist out of Chakra, it is in fact a natural and physical matter which is created and controlled by using Chakra. Therefore Preta Path have to touch the wood in order to absorb its Chakra. But the trees of the Mokuton doesn't consist out of Chakra. Here, Hashiramas woods don't even differ from a human. Both are living beings which are living due to their Chakra. Absorb its Chakra and you leave dead wood, absorb all of a humans Chakra to 0 and he will die as well. What my point is, since Preta can't repel the Mokuton by its barrier but have to come into contact with it, the impact will simply crush him. If I am wrong, we have to see at least one example were Preta Path is absorbing in fact a natural matter.

Ningendou. It have to touch its target in order to remove his soul. This is kinda difficult, since a close combat would be a suicide as well for Nagato. In his battle against Jiraiya, s single kick was needed in order to stop Ningendou from coming close to him and during the whole battle Ningendous soul removal technique wasn't even useful. Now we have Ryuu who is claming that Hashirama will be caught by Nagatos Chameleon, whereby Nagato could take out his soul quite easily. First of all I doubt that Nagato would have taken his soul if Naruto had acted smarter (crushing the chameleon with his Rasengans instead of attacking Nagato). For Hashirama, the Chameleon isn't a problem, too. After being caught, all Hashirama has to do is to use his Mokuton in order to crush the Chameleon and Nagato as well.

Spoiler

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Do you see the huge stone Golem being crushed? This will await Nagato and his Chameleon as well. By a closer look, many of Nagatos techniques are more suicide for him than a help.

Asura Path. Isn't even worth talking about. Its physical strength is not comparable with the Mokuton and I think here we both agree. Against its rockets and lasers, Hashirama can simply cover himself with his Mokuton. Sasuke by himself covered himself with mere snakes in order to avoid Deidaras explosions.

What is to say about Naraka Path? Not useful.

Nagato can use all 5 elements but yet we haven't seen any of them. Hashirama can also use the Doton and Suiton to an unknown extent, but its extent is also a mere assumption.

Here you see, all of Nagatos techniques are countered. I could go on and show you how Hashirama could overrun Nagato with his techniques, but I think I'll make a break here.

I'll start with preta and work my way up

1) Moukoton is being controlled by chakra, and has chakra running through it, thus the chakra in it would be absorbed.. You say he needs to touch It to absorb it? Nagato would disagree

Spoiler

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Once the moukuton comes close to him, it will be drained of all its chakra


As for your chibaku tensei counter, What good would it do him once he's trapped inside of layers of rock???, He would then not be able to get out since he's covered by layers and layers of rock.....That isn't really a defense to it whatsoever ...


As for shinra tensei, you're wrong.. .It has potential to be dangerous once there are things that the person being pushed away can slam into , such as walls etc.... This is what killed alot of people in Konoha when it was used.... Considering hashirama covers the battlefield in trees, Slamming into a tree can still deal decent damage than slamming into nothing...

But the point of shinra tensei imo wasn't to attack, but to use as defense for any of his attacks..

Imo it is a joke to compare the the Konoha damage of the village to what 4 tailed kyuubi did.. They weren't anywhere similar in size.. And the small portion of the forest was not the same size of Konoha.. that's a rediculous statement..
Also hashirama HAS NEVER made a forest using moukoton, the size of Konoha, or what pain has shinra tensei'd away



Now what else do we have, As for basho tenin , hashirama can possibly use his wood arm to latch onto something, but now you have to remember, that hashirama will also be going up against many summons such as his bird, chameleons who are invisible, The splitting dog who can't be held back byy his moukoton since they will just split more and more and more... Etc..


Now we can talk about the big guns such as Nagato's summoning gedo mazo... Which hashirama has 0 ways to counter.. Count them 0...
7 bijuu's are stored in it prior to nagato's death, and it is capable of killing someone with 1 hit..... An ethereal dragon, that can't be touched by physical attacks..

The problem here is.. If Nagato uses basho tennin, Hashirama uses his chakra arm, but for that moment he's stuck in 1 place countering the pull.. which leaves him wide open to the dragon attack... Which in turn is a gg...

WTF??:flaw::flaw: Arguably the most durable(or 2nd durable) cant SURVIVE most of nagato's tech?

Join the argument and post something of meaning instead of being one of the people who come in and say

hashi > nagato, or nagato > hashi

If you think he can survive it, go ahead and prove it by all means

 

[TobisPawn]

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Mind you, its not that great of a thread.

 

[Midday]

Spoiler

Sure.

Chibaku Tensei. Attracts the surroundings in its direction and forms into a huge sphere. How Hashirama can counter this? Quite easily.

Spoiler

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Do you see Madara coming out from this huge tendril? He merged with this tendril and was hiding in there. If Chibaku Tensei begins to attract the surroundings, Hashirama, who is the user of the Mokuton, can simply cover and merge himself with his trees, what giving him a perfect hideout from being crushed by Chibaku Tenseis attractions. Now we have Owarij who claims that the attraction would release the power to literally splinter the trees and thus render Hashiramas hideout useless. But by that logic, Chibaku Tensei wouldn't even consist out of huge, compressed stones but would pulverize all matters it has attracted.

Spoiler

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Here you can even see trees being attracted by Chibaku Tensei without rendering into splinters. Considering, that Hashiramas trees are not only way huger, Chibaku Tensei itself will consist largely out of trees Hashirama created before. So in this case this will be a perfect hideout for Hashirama to avoid from being crushed. Sounds may simple for you as Nagato fans, but a good counter don't have to be always spectacular.

Shinra Tensei. Isn't even worth talking about. It blows away objects but don't really cause damage. While the toads were knocked down by their own weight, a normal sized and weighted person would tank this very well

Spoiler

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Bee is getting pushed away without any caused damage on him. And as for Hashiramas tree world, which is claimed to be repel by the Shinra Tensei, Hashirama is able to cover the whole landscape with his trees, not even Konohagakure, where a large scale Shinra Tensei with a long interval was needed, is comparable in size. The little forest that Nagato pushed away with his Shinra Tensei is also no comparison, since a single tendril is at least 20 times bigger than a tree. Furthermore, Hashirama has a direct counter for the Shinra Tensei, too.

Spoiler

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Narutos Chakra explosion was comparable to a large scale Shinra Tensei but was countered by Yamato by this way quite easily, though his Mokuton is not even a comparison to Hashiramas.

Bansho Tenin. Can be countered by many ways. Kakashi used a Bunshin, Hashirama can also.
Naruto countered Bansho Tenin by using his Chakra arm; Hashirama has a similar option.

Spoiler

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This Jutsu allows Hashirama to counter Bansho Tenin, it can crush the rock Nagato is using and can above crush Nagato - Bansho Tenin is more suicide for him than a help.

Jutsu-Absorption. You said, Preta can absorb the Mokuton, but this is wrong. Preta Path cannot absorb any kind of Ninjutsu, this is a mistake. It allows you to ban Chakra in big amounts. Furthermore it allows you to create a barrier in order to stop Ninjutsus. And here is your fault by comparing Jiraiyas oil with the Mokuton. Here, it does not matter from which matter the oil is, the technique itself is Chakra and cannot pass through the barrier - Here I would even agree that Preta can absorb Susanoo, since it consists out of Chakra, too. The Mokuton on the other hand does not consist out of Chakra, it is in fact a natural and physical matter which is created and controlled by using Chakra. Therefore Preta Path have to touch the wood in order to absorb its Chakra. But the trees of the Mokuton doesn't consist out of Chakra. Here, Hashiramas woods don't even differ from a human. Both are living beings which are living due to their Chakra. Absorb its Chakra and you leave dead wood, absorb all of a humans Chakra to 0 and he will die as well. What my point is, since Preta can't repel the Mokuton by its barrier but have to come into contact with it, the impact will simply crush him. If I am wrong, we have to see at least one example were Preta Path is absorbing in fact a natural matter.

Ningendou. It have to touch its target in order to remove his soul. This is kinda difficult, since a close combat would be a suicide as well for Nagato. In his battle against Jiraiya, s single kick was needed in order to stop Ningendou from coming close to him and during the whole battle Ningendous soul removal technique wasn't even useful. Now we have Ryuu who is claming that Hashirama will be caught by Nagatos Chameleon, whereby Nagato could take out his soul quite easily. First of all I doubt that Nagato would have taken his soul if Naruto had acted smarter (crushing the chameleon with his Rasengans instead of attacking Nagato). For Hashirama, the Chameleon isn't a problem, too. After being caught, all Hashirama has to do is to use his Mokuton in order to crush the Chameleon and Nagato as well.

Spoiler

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Do you see the huge stone Golem being crushed? This will await Nagato and his Chameleon as well. By a closer look, many of Nagatos techniques are more suicide for him than a help.

Asura Path. Isn't even worth talking about. Its physical strength is not comparable with the Mokuton and I think here we both agree. Against its rockets and lasers, Hashirama can simply cover himself with his Mokuton. Sasuke by himself covered himself with mere snakes in order to avoid Deidaras explosions.

What is to say about Naraka Path? Not useful.

Nagato can use all 5 elements but yet we haven't seen any of them. Hashirama can also use the Doton and Suiton to an unknown extent, but its extent is also a mere assumption.

Here you see, all of Nagatos techniques are countered. I could go on and show you how Hashirama could overrun Nagato with his techniques, but I think I'll make a break here.

It was a good arguement. A lot better than the usual "Hashirama beat Madara and Kyuubi, can x do that? Hashirama > all"

Chibaku tensei. I don't think merging with the roots would save him. Since the roots would get drag into the sphere as well and they would be crushed with Hashirama inside them, also would he even be able to move freely in them with the gravity pull? Chibaku tensei is also big enough to get rid of the forest.

Spoiler

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For shinra tensei you've said it only blows away objects but doesn't really cause damage to people but that's not true. The second image some survived but only due to Tsunades summon.

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I liked the counter(Yammato's thing) for shinra tensei, but that depends on the knowledge has on Nagato. If Nagato raises his hand I don't think he'll expect a shinra tensei and be able to react fast enough also Yammato was a lot further away by the bridge then the usual area Nagato uses Shinra tensei.

Banshou tennin. Naruto didn't counter banshou tennin with chakra arms his attack got absorbed. Mokuton would either be absorbed or repelled. As for the Kakashi point that was just deva path, Nagato can use his paths simultaneously so what if he uses assura path to fire missles at the same time or that gedo mazo dragon technique.

Petra can absorb any ninjutsu according to the databooks meaning there are no exceptions there's no mistake unless you're calling the author wrong. My rule of thumb would be if the technique is created from just chakra like Jiriya's oil or Hashirama's mokuton attacks it'll be absorbed. If he's just manipulating existing trees it wont be absorbed but made redundant since it'll remove the chakra controlling them.

Nagato and his path which got kicked by Jiriya are two different things. Close combat is suicide for Hashirama.

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Also it's not just going to be Nagato throwing attacks one at a time he does several to overwhelm the opponent. I don't think Hashirama can handle gedo mazo, the other 8 summons and Nagato at the same time.

Also people don't usually mention this but Nagato still has his paths which can be summoned, you could argue that they're destroyed but he could resummon them and restore them with Nakara(?) path quite easily.

 

[Uzumaki Hyuga]

Nagato is not on the level of Hashi or Madara. Still kinda crazy that people believe this.... I think again people think of Nagato as Edo Nagato and not the real Nagato in the wheelchair.

Madara
Nagato could not take on Madara/Madara andthe 9 tails. Look at the issues the fox gave him with 8 tails. Nagato himself aid he did not expect the 9 tails to be so powerful and fighting it sapped a huge portion of Nagato's chakra.These are faqs not just my opionion. Would be very interesting If you put Nagao in Hashi's place and had Madara + 9 tails fight Nagato. There would be no chance for Nagato to win.Madara did take some of Hashi's cells when he was alive so we don't know the exstint but we know that he could use mokuton.Madara did unlock the Rinnegan when he was alive also and has the same paths as Nagato+Ems abilities and from what we have seen now a perfect sasuno.There is no way Nagato to win this battle. And were not talkingabout Edo Madara or Edo Nagato. Either EMS Madara w/9tails or Madara Rinnegan/Mokuton/EMS

Hashirama
Now On to Hashi. It's very hard to compare him when we have seen so little about the man. But seeing the power of Mokuton coupled with his feats: Establishing Konoha,Capturing "Multiple" tailed beast and distributing them to various nations, Becoming the 1st Hokage by defeating Madara, and when you look up Hashirama Senju it also tells you as Hokage he came across a Scroll filled with among other skills,various Kinjutsu which he sealed to keep the techs a secret.So we really don't even know what the man s capable of and he was already amazing. This is the same man who defeated Madara and the 9 tails at the same time.Nagato had issues just fighting the fox with 6 tails.Kishi also made it very clear how powerful he was through Kabuto.

Nagato
I think some of you people need to either go back and re-read the manga because you forget that the real Nagato Used the paths because summoning the Gedo Maza left him with chakra rods embedded him his back , and fighting Honzo injured his legs crippling his mobility.Pain was in a wheelchair.....He had issues fighting SM Naruto and a 6 tailed fox.People say he could have won the fight if he wanted but forget the condition that Nagato was actually in when Naruto found him.He was almost depleated of Chakra and energy.Nagato uses his life energy for his techs which leaves him in almost dead from using his ability to many times.Nagato is amazing still but there is a common misconception that Edo Nagato was the real Nagato and thats Bs. That's Fanboys wanting to make themselves and there arguments right. We also have to remember Nagato followed Tobi before Tobi was as strong as he is today.Tobi was always the True leader of the akatsuki which he means was most likely the stronger.

Other people Nagato Can't defeat are: Naruto,Tobi,Kabuto,and Maybe Minato and EMS Sasuke
Would say Itachi if he had more chakra.

Lovely write up, but there is sumfing i have to point out; you do want to accept Nagato's strength. edo Nagato was Nagato's true strength and although i think hashirama and madara are still stronger, The other people you mentioned are overesteemated relative to Nagato, think is well. Nagato sacrificed his body because of anger(yahiko), The real Nagato is Nagato before fighting hanzo or edo Nagato

 

[Strict]

Interesting. But another point I forgot to raise about Chibaku Tensei is that Nagato is able to focus on the sphere and up the strength of the gravitational field at a particular point. Remember when the 6 tailed Kyuubi first hit the rock? Nagato proceeded to focus the majority of the rocks onto that particular part, so that the 6 tailed Kyuubi would sustain alot more damage.

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(The anime shows this process clearer). If he chose to do this whilst Hashirama was on his way up, Hashirama would have alot less time to make a decision, because he'd be drawn up alot faster. I still don't see what he can do about Soul Dragon, however.

He got crushed by the stones which were flying right behind him. Nagato used his Chibaku Tensei twice and in both scenarios it took a while to attract the persons (in this case the Kyuubi, Itachi, Naruto and Bee). Chibaku Tensei attracts the whole surroundings, the human is followed by tons of rocks, there is no way Nagato can focus on a single target, consider that he won't even see Hashirama by the disorder of attracted rocks and trees.

The soul dragon can be countered, too.
None good Shinobi is running towards an unknown technique, except fodders. Therefore Devas Bansho Tenin attracted a mere Bunshin instead of Kakashi. If Nagato will use Gedo Mazo, Hashirama would send out clones while hiding himself in his woods. At this point there would be no chance for Nagato to figure out where the real Hashirama is. Secondly the Soul Dragon can't pass through all matters, 'cause it would have passed through the ground otherwhise, after missing Hanzou. Apart from that, the soul dragon leaves Nagato crippled. Would be a suicide as well for him.

It is a pity that you don't see the strategic part from fights but only think that it would end up in a Ninjutsu spam.

 

[3MESSIAH]

Celestial Terra Blast?

Preta path absorbing every technique they have?

Chou Shinra Tensei?

5 elements?

Flying in the air?

Asura path armour?

Gedo and Ceberus?

They cant do anything to Nagato because all of their techniques are ninjutsu and they cant try Taijutsu as Shinra Tensei would blow them away.Asura path would be shooting missles as well as spamming rivers of water at them.This is assuming Nagato plays fair and stays on the ground as he can just fly in the air spamming attacks

Sorry guys,i know that a lot of you are pointing out that those two are stronger,but you just presume it on hype. but i have to say that this post makes sense.nagato is definitely stronger

 

[TobisPawn]

He got crushed by the stones which were flying right behind him. Nagato used his Chibaku Tensei twice and in both scenarios it took a while to attract the persons (in this case the Kyuubi, Itachi, Naruto and Bee). Chibaku Tensei attracts the whole surroundings, the human is followed by tons of rocks, there is no way Nagato can focus on a single target, consider that he won't even see Hashirama by the disorder of attracted rocks and trees.

I'm not sure what you're trying to say here. If you're implying that Nagato wont be able to focus the flying rocks/stones onto Hashirama, that's false. No matter what, Hashirama will be hit by the rocks, unless he's the last thing to fly up through Chibaku Tensei. In that unlikely scenario, Hashirama would still be crushed deep within Chibaku Tensei, or attracted by its gravitational pull. I don't see one man easily escaping that pull, and that'd give Nagato an opening to hit him with Asura missiles and/or flying summons.

The soul dragon can be countered, too.
None good Shinobi is running towards an unknown technique, except fodders. Therefore Devas Bansho Tenin attracted a mere Bunshin instead of Kakashi. If Nagato will use Gedo Mazo, Hashirama would send out clones while hiding himself in his woods. At this point there would be no chance for Nagato to figure out where the real Hashirama is. Secondly the Soul Dragon can't pass through all matters, 'cause it would have passed through the ground otherwhise, after missing Hanzou. Apart from that, the soul dragon leaves Nagato crippled. Would be a suicide as well for him.

First of all, we don't know how many clones Hashirama can make. Second of all, Gedo Mazo has the ability to dispatch those clones with some difficulty. And you forget that Nagato can clear the whole field with a Shinra Tensei in order to uncover the real Hashirama. Hashirama can't really hide forever and let his clones do the work, when Nagato has summons with shared vision attacking, Asura Path missiles attacking, and Shinra Tensei clearing the field.

Agreed on Soul Dragon leaving Nagato crippled, unless we're talking Gedo Mazo with the Bijuus (which is unnecessary for Nagato to defeat Hashirama). All of the Rinnegan techs working together should eventually give Nagato an opening to rip Hashirama's soul, if Hashirama isn't already dead by then.

It is a pity that you don't see the strategic part from fights but only think that it would end up in a Ninjutsu spam.

I haven't read your other posts, but you have to realize that the Rinnegan techs can work hand-in-hand with eachother, creating deadly combinations, which at one point, only another Rinnegan user can counter [hence why I put Nagato third on my list behind Tobi and Kabuto (Edo Madara)]

 

[Strict]

I'll start with preta and work my way up

1) Moukoton is being controlled by chakra, and has chakra running through it, thus the chakra in it would be absorbed.. You say he needs to touch It to absorb it? Nagato would disagree

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Once the moukuton comes close to him, it will be drained of all its chakra


As for your chibaku tensei counter, What good would it do him once he's trapped inside of layers of rock???, He would then not be able to get out since he's covered by layers and layers of rock.....That isn't really a defense to it whatsoever ...


As for shinra tensei, you're wrong.. .It has potential to be dangerous once there are things that the person being pushed away can slam into , such as walls etc.... This is what killed alot of people in Konoha when it was used.... Considering hashirama covers the battlefield in trees, Slamming into a tree can still deal decent damage than slamming into nothing...

But the point of shinra tensei imo wasn't to attack, but to use as defense for any of his attacks..

Imo it is a joke to compare the the Konoha damage of the village to what 4 tailed kyuubi did.. They weren't anywhere similar in size.. And the small portion of the forest was not the same size of Konoha.. that's a rediculous statement..
Also hashirama HAS NEVER made a forest using moukoton, the size of Konoha, or what pain has shinra tensei'd away



Now what else do we have, As for basho tenin , hashirama can possibly use his wood arm to latch onto something, but now you have to remember, that hashirama will also be going up against many summons such as his bird, chameleons who are invisible, The splitting dog who can't be held back byy his moukoton since they will just split more and more and more... Etc..


Now we can talk about the big guns such as Nagato's summoning gedo mazo... Which hashirama has 0 ways to counter.. Count them 0...
7 bijuu's are stored in it prior to nagato's death, and it is capable of killing someone with 1 hit..... An ethereal dragon, that can't be touched by physical attacks..

The problem here is.. If Nagato uses basho tennin, Hashirama uses his chakra arm, but for that moment he's stuck in 1 place countering the pull.. which leaves him wide open to the dragon attack... Which in turn is a gg...



Join the argument and post something of meaning instead of being one of the people who come in and say

hashi > nagato, or nagato > hashi

If you think he can survive it, go ahead and prove it by all means

For Preta Path, I explained its effect aready. The barrier holds back chakra and absorbs chakra. This goes for Jiraiyas oil, for a Rasenshuriken and even for the solid Susanoo which consists out of Chakra. The barriere has the sense to keep this chakra away. But this goes not for natural matters such as the wood. I agree that Nagato would leave dead wood by absorbing its chakra, but since the wood by itself is not chakra but is controlled with, Nagato will have to touch it, this is fact. If I'm wrong you should at least post one comparable scenario. Here I have a scenario, where even a chakra technique managed to pass almost through the barrier:

Spoiler

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Do you see the Rasenshuriken passing through the barrier? (sound instruction: SFX: getting through)

For the Chibaku Tensei part, it does not matter whether he would be trapped inside of Chibaku Tensei, since he is in safe there. Nagato would be the only one who will have to fit Chibaku Tensei with Chakra in order to maintain the gravitation. Above he won't even get the idea that Hashirama has survived.

Well, and now you are comparing fodders with Hashiramas, who were killed by the Shinra Tensei. None of the stronger Shinobis, like Tsunade, the Anbus, the Clans such as the Inuzuka clan, Shikamaru (etc.) were seriously damaged by it. Only fodders were getting killed by it.

For your Preta Path again I said my statement already.

@Rul You just contradicted yourself. You said that any Jutsu can be absorbed, yet there are exceptions in your opinion. Basically Mokuton is just what you described; it uses already existing trees. Chakra, that is converted into a source of life, is flown into the earth and drastically increases the growth of already existing trees. In the end it's nothing but an incredibly strong dung. If Hashirama/Yamato uses it from their own body, without already existing trees in the earth, they firstly transform their cells into wood and then again increase their growth. And as far as I remember, Fujutsu: Kyuin merely absorbs people's Chakra but not their cells. That's also what makes Moku Bunshin that durable, by the way. Unlike Kage Bunshin they're not based on Chakra but real, human cells, hence they won't disappear after being hit.

Those things are not just made up by me, but rather taken from the third databook, where Mokuton is also called the most many-sided technique, by the way.



And are you seriously going to compare Konohagakure with the forest Madara has created?

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Take a look on how huge only a part of this forest is, Susanoo, Madaras Katon and even the meteors are no comparison in size. And here you can't go to compare Hashirama with Madara, Hashirama is the orginal Mokuton user with the cells all the others are seeking for.

The summonings are also no problem, they are not really resistant and got killed by Jiraiyas Katon or simply his hair - Just like Sakura on shot one of them. The Mokuton will be able to crush them quite easily as well. If not crush, he could do this:

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Now I am tired and will return tomorrow. Answer me and I will give you my response tommorow.

 

[Frikid]

Im not tryna be rude but what the **** does that have to do with what i just said?lmao

Madara may have said that but my point is he only know the 1st as being strong. He's never met nagato(a waaaaaaaaaay more expeirenced rinnegan user than madara) or even heard of him. Or even itachi, not to say itachi would beat madara although i wouldnt be surpised if he did.

he is having rinnegan + EMS still he says hashi can stop him.
so how can nagato who only have rinnegan can beat him ?

and i never saw nagato throwing 2 HUGE meteors, with help of his rinnegan :shrug:

the point is , madara knows almost everything about rinnegan and he also have EMS, still he says hashi can stop him... so i repeat again : so how can nagato who only have rinnegan can beat him ?

 

[Owarij]

For Preta Path, I explained its effect aready. The barrier holds back chakra and absorbs chakra. This goes for Jiraiyas oil, for a Rasenshuriken and even for the solid Susanoo which consists out of Chakra. The barriere has the sense to keep this chakra away. But this goes not for natural matters such as the wood. I agree that Nagato would leave dead wood by absorbing its chakra, but since the wood by itself is not chakra but is controlled with, Nagato will have to touch it, this is fact. If I'm wrong you should at least post one comparable scenario. Here I have a scenario, where even a chakra technique managed to pass almost through the barrier:

Spoiler

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Do you see the Rasenshuriken passing through the barrier? (sound instruction: SFX: getting through)

For the Chibaku Tensei part, it does not matter whether he would be trapped inside of Chibaku Tensei, since he is in safe there. Nagato would be the only one who will have to fit Chibaku Tensei with Chakra in order to maintain the gravitation. Above he won't even get the idea that Hashirama has survived.

Well, and now you are comparing fodders with Hashiramas, who were killed by the Shinra Tensei. None of the stronger Shinobis, like Tsunade, the Anbus, the Clans such as the Inuzuka clan, Shikamaru (etc.) were seriously damaged by it. Only fodders were getting killed by it.

For your Preta Path again I said my statement already.

@Rul You just contradicted yourself. You said that any Jutsu can be absorbed, yet there are exceptions in your opinion. Basically Mokuton is just what you described; it uses already existing trees. Chakra, that is converted into a source of life, is flown into the earth and drastically increases the growth of already existing trees. In the end it's nothing but an incredibly strong dung. If Hashirama/Yamato uses it from their own body, without already existing trees in the earth, they firstly transform their cells into wood and then again increase their growth. And as far as I remember, Fujutsu: Kyuin merely absorbs people's Chakra but not their cells. That's also what makes Moku Bunshin that durable, by the way. Unlike Kage Bunshin they're not based on Chakra but real, human cells, hence they won't disappear after being hit.

Those things are not just made up by me, but rather taken from the third databook, where Mokuton is also called the most many-sided technique, by the way.



And are you seriously going to compare Konohagakure with the forest Madara has created?

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Take a look on how huge only a part of this forest is, Susanoo, Madaras Katon and even the meteors are no comparison in size. And here you can't go to compare Hashirama with Madara, Hashirama is the orginal Mokuton user with the cells all the others are seeking for.

The summonings are also no problem, they are not really resistant and got killed by Jiraiyas Katon or simply his hair - Just like Sakura on shot one of them. The Mokuton will be able to crush them quite easily as well. If not crush, he could do this:

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Now I am tired and will return tomorrow. Answer me and I will give you my response tommorow.

Internet is giving problems, so I won't be posting alot of pics
I'll start of with preta path once again, seeing that that's one of the biggest deciding factors in this match up

Once the wood passes through the barrier and starts getting its chakra Drained, yes the dead chakra less wood would get through.. I'm not saying Preta will absorb the wood as a whole, No, I'm saying that he can drain the chakra OUT of the wood, and cause it to be normal wood..

You see gaara attached some sand to Madara's sand, he sucked the chakra out of it and the sand just fell to the ground. .This is exactly what will happen to the wood, it will be completely useless in the fight, and since the wood is normally connected to all the others, the draining process will take place on a wide scale, If you check the sand , They were all connected, and all got drained



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You can't use that as an excuse, claiming that only fodder died from it etc.. That my friend is called Plot no jutsu.. Kishi has no reason to kill off any main or important side characters of the konoha 11 like that..
But he did show how dangerous it is when it killed SEVERAL anbu and other ninja easily.. It's no difference..
You should know that plot no jutsu isn't a factor what so ever in a hypothetical versus thread

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Of course Nagato will know if Hashirama survived , As i've said already he's a sensor, and you are underestimating what he's capable of, He'll know what Hashirama does the moment he did it


_________________________________________________________

Once again, the Forest was large, but it was NOT the size of an entire village.. Just look at Madara's Katon, Look how large it is, and the sheer area it covered..... The entire drawing there just looks large, But madara's katon would have never covered even half of konoha...

_________________________________________________________

My point of mentioning the summons was that they would play a part in this fight.. But you are underestimating them totally.. This is summons + nagato + Gedo mazo ( with a purple dragon flying around doing his swoops)
And hashirama has to defend against them ALL...He can't escape the dragon if he's being pulled in by deva..Let's not forget the many homing rocket missiles that will also becoming at him

 

[Shirou Emiya]

Nagato is not on the level of Hashi or Madara. Still kinda crazy that people believe this.... I think again people think of Nagato as Edo Nagato and not the real Nagato in the wheelchair.

Madara
Nagato could not take on Madara/Madara andthe 9 tails. Look at the issues the fox gave him with 8 tails. Nagato himself aid he did not expect the 9 tails to be so powerful and fighting it sapped a huge portion of Nagato's chakra.These are faqs not just my opionion. Would be very interesting If you put Nagao in Hashi's place and had Madara + 9 tails fight Nagato. There would be no chance for Nagato to win.Madara did take some of Hashi's cells when he was alive so we don't know the exstint but we know that he could use mokuton.Madara did unlock the Rinnegan when he was alive also and has the same paths as Nagato+Ems abilities and from what we have seen now a perfect sasuno.There is no way Nagato to win this battle. And were not talkingabout Edo Madara or Edo Nagato. Either EMS Madara w/9tails or Madara Rinnegan/Mokuton/EMS

Hashirama
Now On to Hashi. It's very hard to compare him when we have seen so little about the man. But seeing the power of Mokuton coupled with his feats: Establishing Konoha,Capturing "Multiple" tailed beast and distributing them to various nations, Becoming the 1st Hokage by defeating Madara, and when you look up Hashirama Senju it also tells you as Hokage he came across a Scroll filled with among other skills,various Kinjutsu which he sealed to keep the techs a secret.So we really don't even know what the man s capable of and he was already amazing. This is the same man who defeated Madara and the 9 tails at the same time.Nagato had issues just fighting the fox with 6 tails.Kishi also made it very clear how powerful he was through Kabuto.

Nagato
I think some of you people need to either go back and re-read the manga because you forget that the real Nagato Used the paths because summoning the Gedo Maza left him with chakra rods embedded him his back , and fighting Honzo injured his legs crippling his mobility.Pain was in a wheelchair.....He had issues fighting SM Naruto and a 6 tailed fox.People say he could have won the fight if he wanted but forget the condition that Nagato was actually in when Naruto found him.He was almost depleated of Chakra and energy.Nagato uses his life energy for his techs which leaves him in almost dead from using his ability to many times.Nagato is amazing still but there is a common misconception that Edo Nagato was the real Nagato and thats Bs. That's Fanboys wanting to make themselves and there arguments right. We also have to remember Nagato followed Tobi before Tobi was as strong as he is today.Tobi was always the True leader of the akatsuki which he means was most likely the stronger.

Other people Nagato Can't defeat are: Naruto,Tobi,Kabuto,and Maybe Minato and EMS Sasuke
Would say Itachi if he had more chakra.

I stopped after reading this okay you keep giving madara all these power ups that he didn't have (not the way your saying anyways) lets get some stuff straight madara didn't have hashi cells while he had the 9 tails under his control so he didn't have mokuton or increased healing 2 Nagato fights naruto in kyuubi mode which is way better than 8 tailed mode and Nagato does pretty good so really what I'm saying is ether pick madara with the 9 tails or pick him with hashi cells not both also we don't know what is needed for perfect susanoo yet soo.....

 

[Frikid]

My point of mentioning the summons was that they would play a part in this fight.. But you are underestimating them totally.. This is summons + nagato + Gedo mazo ( with a purple dragon flying around doing his swoops)
And hashirama has to defend against them ALL...He can't escape the dragon if he's being pulled in by deva..Let's not forget the many homing rocket missiles that will also becoming at him

i don't think gedo mazo can summon soul eating dragon on his own...
nagato have to be fused with gedo mazo for that to happen,

also, from where did u get the idea that he is a sensor?
he just sensed the pressure and told naruto that itachi is going to use amaterasu which was also a wrong assumption.

also hashirama can create lots and lots of wood clones...'
nagato would not be able to differentiate them,
even gaara is a sensor, he even sensed Muu (i think )
he didn't came to know that the madara he sealed was just a clone..

how would nagato know it ??

also, hashirama will use his flower tree world jutsus and there would be poison in the air...'
all his summons would get poisoned/paralyzed with it.

so poison in the air, moving tress on the ground,carbon copy wood clones,and also self healing abillity of em.

not to forget even hasji possessed bijjus at one point of time but i don't know if he could control them like tobi did, so i can't say anything about it.

 

[Munboy]

On what basis can we say Nagato can't summon the whole Gedo Mazo?

 

[Owarij]

i don't think gedo mazo can summon soul eating dragon on his own...
nagato have to be fused with gedo mazo for that to happen,

also, from where did u get the idea that he is a sensor?
he just sensed the pressure and told naruto that itachi is going to use amaterasu which was also a wrong assumption.

also hashirama can create lots and lots of wood clones...'
nagato would not be able to differentiate them,
even gaara is a sensor, he even sensed Muu (i think )
he didn't came to know that the madara he sealed was just a clone..

how would nagato know it ??

also, hashirama will use his flower tree world jutsus and there would be poison in the air...'
all his summons would get poisoned/paralyzed with it.

so poison in the air, moving tress on the ground,carbon copy wood clones,and also self healing abillity of em.

not to forget even hasji possessed bijjus at one point of time but i don't know if he could control them like tobi did, so i can't say anything about it.

K i'll handle everything in sections
First off- Gedo mazo , The only reason it attached to nagato was for a chakra source.. You immediately see him get drained of chakra afterwards and it casts the jutsu..
Before Nagato died, he had 7 bijuu sealed in it, and it can of course run off of that chakra.. Which is exactly what tobi is doing now

2ndly, how do I know Nagato is a sensor? Itachi basically told kabuto he was... Itachi said Nagat was the one who sensed Kabuto from miles away and told him where he was..


Gaara sensed Muu because of his sand, Muu is almost on sensible due to him hiding his chakra perfectly.. (The invisible man), As muu stepped on Gaara's sand , he sensed his prescence.. This has nothing to do with the clone he pulled in the end.. since he wasn't using his technique there I believe..

However you are right in one sense... If moukoton clones operate in the same way as shadow clones, Then there would be No real way to differentiate between real and fake.. since Chakra is split evenly between the clones and the real..
The problem with this however is that the clones aren't nearly as durable as the real person, and if nagato uses a big shinra tensei he could get rid of a good few of them..


I've already told you my counter for flower world, Shinra tensei can not only blow the "polen" which is a physical thing away, he can also blow down the entire flower world itself... If you want another counter, Nagato can fly above the polen..

Another counter? he can use his wind jutsu, 1 of which he has shown to also destroy it..

 

[~Uzumaki~]

Wood is ninjutsu
Wood is made totally from chakra
Wood was never said to be anything apart from chakra.
Wood will be absorbed, not absorbed to leave dead wood but totally absorbed. People think because Hashi's trees can later grow means there not jutsu anymore but ask yourself, if Sasuke shoots a fireball at a forest and the fire is capable of spreading and burning down the whole forest, does that mean Sasuke's fireball wasn't a jutsu? If he shoots the same fireball at Nagato, would it or would it not get absorbed? In the same vein, just because Hashirama's wood was capable remaining and forming the landscape of Konoha doesn't mean its not a jutsu, it would still be easily absorbed. Another argument is because it is 'chakra converted to life force' that it can't be absorbed, well fire techniques are chakra transformed into fire and they get absorbed, you know why? Because according to the Databook, Pain absorbs jutsu 'regardless of transformation'

Conclusion: Mokuton on Nagato is just about as good as Naruto continually attacking Nagato will Rasengan and Sasuke continually attacking Nagato with fireballs: it's a pointless waste of chakra.

Without Mokuton, Hashirama's only other known jutsu is genjutsu of darkness, Nagato is a sensor so its also another fruitless waste of chakra as Nagato will ever be able to locate him.

As for Nagato's attacks: Shinra Tensei would be of much use as Hashirama has healing techniques that don't require seals and he can grow wood from his body to take the impact much like Katsuyu protected Konoha's citizens, however Bansho Ten'n will pull him in without fail, holding on to something with Mokuton is pointless as Kakashi tried that and still got pulled in, plus Nagato can launch missiles to destroy the Mokuton he's holding on to or destroy him while he's motionless between Bansho Ten'n pull and Mokuton's hold or have one of his summons destroy him.
Gedo Mazo is a level of destructive power I deem unnecessary but if Nagato feels like a quick battle, he can use this. The sealing dragon would be able to evade Mokuton and take Hashi's soul. Another option is Chibaku Tensei which would crush Hashirama to dust. He has no defense whatsoever



EMS Madara is an even worse match up.
Susanoo, Yasaka Magatama, Perfect Susanoo, Kyubi's attacks, large fire techs can ALL be absorbed. Nagato would get loads of chakra from his own attacks then kill him by drawing him in with Bansho Ten'n then ripping out his soul, while he's being drawn in he has no options as fire techs, Susanoo and its attacks would be easily absorbed. Madara's genjutsu is visual only and Nagato's not an idiot, he'll avoid eye contact.



Peace.