[VS] Mihawk vs Issho(Fujitaro) speculation thread

[straightup]

The marines and the shichibukai exist to counter balance all four yonko not just one. I agree the emperors would probably gain advantage over "marines and the shichibukai", if they amalgamate their forces. But, there is noway an emperor along with his forces matching the might of the allied forces of "the marines and the shichibukai"

I remember when shanks met with whitebeard the marines almost shit themselves. I think the whole marine oranization is counting on the fact that the yonkou refuse to work together. And during the war of the greatest the marines mustered up all of their troops just to fight 1 yonkou. Look at it like this. What would have to happen for the American military to pull all of their resources together? It would have to be something absolutely insane. I guess at this moment it's just a matter of opinion but my opinion is that the marines plus the shichibuki equal one yonkou fleet!(aside from Blackbeard who's whole crew pissed themselves at the thought of akainu). I mean whitebeard really whooped what we would consider one of the strongest people in the world (akainu) and honestly he's typically the deciding factor on which side is strongest. Aside from the admirals and a couple shichibuki the rest of the marines are fodder

 

[Punk Hazard]

I remember when shanks met with whitebeard the marines almost shit themselves. I think the whole marine oranization is counting on the fact that the yonkou refuse to work together. And during the war of the greatest the marines mustered up all of their troops just to fight 1 yonkou. Look at it like this. What would have to happen for the American military to pull all of their resources together? It would have to be something absolutely insane. I guess at this moment it's just a matter of opinion but my opinion is that the marines plus the shichibuki equal one yonkou fleet!(aside from Blackbeard who's whole crew pissed themselves at the thought of akainu). I mean whitebeard really whooped what we would consider one of the strongest people in the world (akainu) and honestly he's typically the deciding factor on which side is strongest. Aside from the admirals and a couple shichibuki the rest of the marines are fodder

It wasn't every Marine, it was every Marine available. There were still Marines stationed elsewhere. Marines like Fujitora and Vergo, for example.

They amassed all of their forces and the end result was Akainu and Sengoku being mildly injured, while Jozu and Marco were almost killed, Ace and WB were killed, and the WB pirates were being pushed back after WB's death. The Marines were having an overwhelming victory until Shanks showed up, and they only stopped for the sake of image.

 

[arv993]

Mihawk is stronger than every admiral period. Yonko > admirals individually, yonko had guys like shanks, WB, and kaido who all outmatch akainu(strongest admiral). And BB is probably stronger than him as well. Stop with the admiral = yonko or Marines = all yonko concept the manga clearly shows that it is not true and they have schibukai to even the odds. Mihawk is portrayed on shanks level which means he is above akainu and Fujitora.

 

[Punk Hazard]

Mihawk is stronger than every admiral period. Yonko > admirals individually, yonko had guys like shanks, WB, and kaido who all outmatch akainu(strongest admiral). And BB is probably stronger than him as well. Stop with the admiral = yonko or Marines = all yonko concept the manga clearly shows that it is not true and they have schibukai to even the odds. Mihawk is portrayed on shanks level which means he is above akainu and Fujitora.

Akainu was matching Whitebeard's power. Kizaru held down his swing with one leg and injured him. Akainu took the strongest Quake WB produced and was only moderately damaged by the end of it. Admirals and Yonko are on the same level.

 

[arv993]

Akainu was matching Whitebeard's power. Kizaru held down his swing with one leg and injured him. Akainu took the strongest Quake WB produced and was only moderately damaged by the end of it. Admirals and Yonko are on the same level.

Matching a guy who took significant wounds, Akainu wanted to get every advantage on WB thats why he used squardo. It wasnt in vain. And all the other damage he took added up as well. luffy can match ppl swings doesnt mean hes better or even lol what terrible logic as usual. Also he isnt close to his prime where he can easily dodge attacks and didnt have to tank quite as much making him much more deadly. WB > akainu. shanks got the superior portrayal and was shown as an absolute equal to healthy old uninjured WB. Kaido > all. there itself your argument goes to shit. so far yonko get the better hype not admirals. admirals like kizaru match with guys like marco who can stalemate him, a healthy yonko is above marco. BB also has incredible hype and looks to be a threat to all of reolutionaries, and his hype is great considering he also beat Wb remnants in a crushing victory. Even big mam is getting hype above average admirals.

fujitora does not seem to be anywhere closely hyped. Yonko> admirals until otherwise shown. The yonko lead the hype game. The marines have the numbers and can beat any one yonko crew due to large firepower nothing more nothing less. marco couldnt be easily dealt even being injured and ppl like beckam seem to get similar level hype to kizaru sure all these top tiers can challenege each other but yonko gets the better hype all day. I to this day dont see ppl hyped like garp, roger, WB in prime and kaido.

 

[Punk Hazard]

Matching a guy who took significant wounds, Akainu wanted to get every advantage on WB thats why he used squardo. It wasnt in vain. And all the other damage he took added up as well. luffy can match ppl swings doesnt mean hes better or even lol what terrible logic as usual. Also he isnt close to his prime where he can easily dodge attacks and didnt have to tank quite as much making him much more deadly. WB > akainu. shanks got the superior portrayal and was shown as an absolute equal to healthy old uninjured WB. Kaido > all. there itself your argument goes to shit. so far yonko get the better hype not admirals. admirals like kizaru match with guys like marco who can stalemate him, a healthy yonko is above marco. BB also has incredible hype and looks to be a threat to all of reolutionaries, and his hype is great considering he also beat Wb remnants in a crushing victory. Even big mam is getting hype above average admirals.

fujitora does not seem to be anywhere closely hyped. Yonko> admirals until otherwise shown. The yonko lead the hype game. The marines have the numbers and can beat any one yonko crew due to large firepower nothing more nothing less. marco couldnt be easily dealt even being injured and ppl like beckam seem to get similar level hype to kizaru sure all these top tiers can challenege each other but yonko gets the better hype all day. I to this day dont see ppl hyped like garp, roger, WB in prime and kaido.

Significant wounds? The only wound Whitebeard took by that point was the stab to Squard, which he himself laughed off later. Other than that, there was no damage to WB when he and Akainu were matching each other. Even with his illness and general sickness, not once was it ever stated or implied that the potency of Newgate's DF decreased, only his stamina and reflexes. There is zero evidence that WB's Quakes were any weaker at Marineford than they were in his prime. Considering that Law's Devil Fruit is the only one in the series that has ever been stated to rely on stamina, plus the fact that Sengoku spoke of WB's Devil Fruit as being as dangerous as ever, it's actually very much indicated that WB's Quakes were just as strong as they ever have been. Shanks' portrayal with Whitebeard wasn't any better than Akainu's.

 

[arv993]

Significant wounds? The only wound Whitebeard took by that point was the stab to Squard, which he himself laughed off later. Other than that, there was no damage to WB when he and Akainu were matching each other. Even with his illness and general sickness, not once was it ever stated or implied that the potency of Newgate's DF decreased, only his stamina and reflexes. There is zero evidence that WB's Quakes were any weaker at Marineford than they were in his prime. Considering that Law's Devil Fruit is the only one in the series that has ever been stated to rely on stamina, plus the fact that Sengoku spoke of WB's Devil Fruit as being as dangerous as ever, it's actually very much indicated that WB's Quakes were just as strong as they ever have been. Shanks' portrayal with Whitebeard wasn't any better than Akainu's.

a strike to the chest and Wb is a tough guy and dude who loves his son hes not going ***** about it. And akainu planned it, it wasn't just for fun no to get an advantage, they dont play fair and this was shown for a reason. The guy has heartattacks so maybe a wound to the chest while his guard down might lead to complications later on... oh yea it did. LOL i like how u say only stamina and reflexes and brush that aside how dumb are you. If someone has better stamina means they last way longer in a fight and WB is already a monster in stain while being sick and old and better reflexes mean he doesnt get hit by easy attacks which also helps you because your stamina doesnt decrease from hard hits and near fatal blows.

let me break it down for you even further imagine a pokemon game where you have HP, if you have better reflexes you avoid fatal injuries and thus live longer and when you have more HP it only makes you that much more deadly. Those are key parts of battle not just attack power.

I'll also give you OP examples Doffy was such a pain in the ass for luffy to beat cuz he was a tank with incredible stamina even though G4 luffy had more raw power on paper. So imagine Wb with this strength and much harder to hit with better ken haki, reflexes and can tank more the guy would be a much bigger threat.

Also aside from Df his physical power decreases so the strength of his bisento chop would be weaker and easier to counter. So all those factors point at prime WB>> akainu.

so shanks was shown as an absolute stalemate or equal power with WB old and relatively healthy. but akainu never got the same treatment.

 

[ssjelf]

a strike to the chest and Wb is a tough guy and dude who loves his son hes not going ***** about it. And akainu planned it, it wasn't just for fun no to get an advantage, they dont play fair and this was shown for a reason. The guy has heartattacks so maybe a wound to the chest while his guard down might lead to complications later on... oh yea it did. LOL i like how u say only stamina and reflexes and brush that aside how dumb are you. If someone has better stamina means they last way longer in a fight and WB is already a monster in stain while being sick and old and better reflexes mean he doesnt get hit by easy attacks which also helps you because your stamina doesnt decrease from hard hits and near fatal blows.

let me break it down for you even further imagine a pokemon game where you have HP, if you have better reflexes you avoid fatal injuries and thus live longer and when you have more HP it only makes you that much more deadly. Those are key parts of battle not just attack power.

I'll also give you OP examples Doffy was such a pain in the ass for luffy to beat cuz he was a tank with incredible stamina even though G4 luffy had more raw power on paper. So imagine Wb with this strength and much harder to hit with better ken haki, reflexes and can tank more the guy would be a much bigger threat.

Also aside from Df his physical power decreases so the strength of his bisento chop would be weaker and easier to counter. So all those factors point at prime WB>> akainu.

so shanks was shown as an absolute stalemate or equal power with WB old and relatively healthy. but akainu never got the same treatment.

Don't bother too much. This argument has been done to death with Riker. He doesn't think the entire chapter or two dedicated to squardo and WB had any meaning in the outcome of the battle despite it having clearly effected WB. He doesn't understand the snowball effect and he doesnt understand that akainu got his salad tossed in the second fight even if he took off half WB's face and that if the ground didnt let akainu escape he would have been finished even if it costed WB his life.

 

[Punk Hazard]

a strike to the chest and Wb is a tough guy and dude who loves his son hes not going ***** about it. And akainu planned it, it wasn't just for fun no to get an advantage, they dont play fair and this was shown for a reason. The guy has heartattacks so maybe a wound to the chest while his guard down might lead to complications later on... oh yea it did. LOL i like how u say only stamina and reflexes and brush that aside how dumb are you. If someone has better stamina means they last way longer in a fight and WB is already a monster in stain while being sick and old and better reflexes mean he doesnt get hit by easy attacks which also helps you because your stamina doesnt decrease from hard hits and near fatal blows.

let me break it down for you even further imagine a pokemon game where you have HP, if you have better reflexes you avoid fatal injuries and thus live longer and when you have more HP it only makes you that much more deadly. Those are key parts of battle not just attack power.

I'll also give you OP examples Doffy was such a pain in the ass for luffy to beat cuz he was a tank with incredible stamina even though G4 luffy had more raw power on paper. So imagine Wb with this strength and much harder to hit with better ken haki, reflexes and can tank more the guy would be a much bigger threat.

Also aside from Df his physical power decreases so the strength of his bisento chop would be weaker and easier to counter. So all those factors point at prime WB>> akainu.

so shanks was shown as an absolute stalemate or equal power with WB old and relatively healthy. but akainu never got the same treatment.

You misunderstand me. I never said Whitebeard's ability to do battle never decreased between his prime and the war, I said the potency of his Quakes received no indication that they decreased in any capacity between his prime and the war, so all that Pokemon shit is irrelevant.

The point of my post was that Akainu and Whitebeard's methods of offense are on par with each other. The fact that they were using their powers through physical movement and still matched each other showed their speed and reflexes were on par until WB's illness hit. Akainu has shown he has the ability to cleave through Whitebeard's body, so he can bypass his durability, and vice versa. Intelligence doesn't play that large a role in either of their fighting styles, so that covers pretty much all of the bases.Meaning they're much closer than you think they are.

Don't bother too much. This argument has been done to death with Riker. He doesn't think the entire chapter or two dedicated to squardo and WB had any meaning in the outcome of the battle despite it having clearly effected WB. He doesn't understand the snowball effect and he doesnt understand that akainu got his salad tossed in the second fight even if he took off half WB's face and that if the ground didnt let akainu escape he would have been finished even if it costed WB his life.

The reason they had so much time is because One Piece is, above all else, a story. Every arc that Oda does always has hefty story to it in one way or another. Marineford wasn't just a war and action, it was the story of Whitebeard, hence why it was all called the Whitebeard Saga. The focus between WB and Squard is just part of the overall story of Whitebeard and his most defining trait: His love for his children. There was focus on Squard not because his blow significantly caused WB's ability to do battle to decline, but because Oda was telling the story of Whitebeard's love for his children.

In the second fight, Akainu got jumped and was able to spring back up and take half of Whitebeard's head as though the attack didn't even hit him. Whitebeard then destroyed the ground, Akainu fell, and resurfaced with the strength to take on countless pirates without missing a single beat. It could not be more clear that the second bout between WB and Akainu didn't affect him as much as you think it does. Otherwise, that just makes WB's crew weak as shit if Akainu really was severely injured, and he could fend off their top fighters and dozens of them all at once without gaining more injuries.

It's also important to note that Akainu was caught by surprise. By your logic, Caesar is far stronger than Luffy and the Scotch Brothers are far stronger than Zoro because the formers defeated the latters through surprise attacks.

 

[arv993]

You misunderstand me. I never said Whitebeard's ability to do battle never decreased between his prime and the war, I said the potency of his Quakes received no indication that they decreased in any capacity between his prime and the war, so all that Pokemon shit is irrelevant.

The point of my post was that Akainu and Whitebeard's methods of offense are on par with each other. The fact that they were using their powers through physical movement and still matched each other showed their speed and reflexes were on par until WB's illness hit. Akainu has shown he has the ability to cleave through Whitebeard's body, so he can bypass his durability, and vice versa. Intelligence doesn't play that large a role in either of their fighting styles, so that covers pretty much all of the bases.Meaning they're much closer than you think they are.



The reason they had so much time is because One Piece is, above all else, a story. Every arc that Oda does always has hefty story to it in one way or another. Marineford wasn't just a war and action, it was the story of Whitebeard, hence why it was all called the Whitebeard Saga. The focus between WB and Squard is just part of the overall story of Whitebeard and his most defining trait: His love for his children. There was focus on Squard not because his blow significantly caused WB's ability to do battle to decline, but because Oda was telling the story of Whitebeard's love for his children.

In the second fight, Akainu got jumped and was able to spring back up and take half of Whitebeard's head as though the attack didn't even hit him. Whitebeard then destroyed the ground, Akainu fell, and resurfaced with the strength to take on countless pirates without missing a single beat. It could not be more clear that the second bout between WB and Akainu didn't affect him as much as you think it does. Otherwise, that just makes WB's crew weak as shit if Akainu really was severely injured, and he could fend off their top fighters and dozens of them all at once without gaining more injuries.

It's also important to note that Akainu was caught by surprise. By your logic, Caesar is far stronger than Luffy and the Scotch Brothers are far stronger than Zoro because the formers defeated the latters through surprise attacks.

dont beat around the bush Wb reflexes in prime and his stamina is better that is a fact and even u agree on that. his ken haki especially was much better according marco. This means akainu cant give nearly as many devastating blows and this is while in prime Wb can tank more. Those two add up to akainu losing quite handily I'd guess low level of high diff would be my prediction but none the less wb looks superior when taking them at their best or any higher version than near death wb at MF.

 

[ssjelf]

You misunderstand me. I never said Whitebeard's ability to do battle never decreased between his prime and the war, I said the potency of his Quakes received no indication that they decreased in any capacity between his prime and the war, so all that Pokemon shit is irrelevant.

The point of my post was that Akainu and Whitebeard's methods of offense are on par with each other. The fact that they were using their powers through physical movement and still matched each other showed their speed and reflexes were on par until WB's illness hit. Akainu has shown he has the ability to cleave through Whitebeard's body, so he can bypass his durability, and vice versa. Intelligence doesn't play that large a role in either of their fighting styles, so that covers pretty much all of the bases.Meaning they're much closer than you think they are.



The reason they had so much time is because One Piece is, above all else, a story. Every arc that Oda does always has hefty story to it in one way or another. Marineford wasn't just a war and action, it was the story of Whitebeard, hence why it was all called the Whitebeard Saga. The focus between WB and Squard is just part of the overall story of Whitebeard and his most defining trait: His love for his children. There was focus on Squard not because his blow significantly caused WB's ability to do battle to decline, but because Oda was telling the story of Whitebeard's love for his children.

In the second fight, Akainu got jumped and was able to spring back up and take half of Whitebeard's head as though the attack didn't even hit him. Whitebeard then destroyed the ground, Akainu fell, and resurfaced with the strength to take on countless pirates without missing a single beat. It could not be more clear that the second bout between WB and Akainu didn't affect him as much as you think it does. Otherwise, that just makes WB's crew weak as shit if Akainu really was severely injured, and he could fend off their top fighters and dozens of them all at once without gaining more injuries.

It's also important to note that Akainu was caught by surprise. By your logic, Caesar is far stronger than Luffy and the Scotch Brothers are far stronger than Zoro because the formers defeated the latters through surprise attacks.

Fair point about the story, but it also put WB on one knee. In contrast, he refused to fall when stabbed by multiple marines at once. The man died standing and after taking hundreds of wounds and dealing with BB's crew attacking him all at once he still refused to fall. Being put on a knee is a big deal. Only one other time that I can recall was he put to his knees and that was when he had his heart attack while staring down akainu. I wont say that he had a heart attack when squardo stabbed him, but having one being the only other time WB went to his knees is is pretty good evidence that squardos attack was vital in WB's downfall.

Says something about akainus observation haki and or about WB's speed that he got jumped. It doesnt really matter that he did or didnt but it did happen and I was commenting on that. Luckily for akainu he is a logia, if you dont have the haki, you cant hurt him and you wont win. This is also pretty strong evidence that akainu is better than the other admirals because they got hurt from the squad captains, akainu didnt. My opinion on this is that akainu is the only admiral that can fight the yonkou as well as he did, the others cant.

In some other thread we were comparing Jozu having his arm frozen while caught off guard to doffy not being frozen and people used that as evidence that doffy>jozu, so.... Whatever though, that doesnt matter too much with my point. The point was that Akainu really did get manhandled that second time, good on akainu for recovering and counterattacking the first time, shame he didnt the second time. We have seen several times that even a momentary gap in defense is enough to end a battle, that second attack left akainu momentarily defenseless, akainu even let the reader know WB got the better of him by cursing WB. Once again, akainu got lucky it ended there. The squad captains doesnt pertain to much to the outcome of WB's fight mif it had continued. WB was also already dead at this point, losing half his face didnt even slow him, more props to WB TBH.

 

[A v i]

Akainu was matching Whitebeard's power.

You don't fight a severely weakened to stalemate, When you're generally in the same ball park. I am not sure about the level, But the difference b/w strongest pirate and the so called strongest admiral is definitely vast.

I remember when shanks met with whitebeard the marines almost shit themselves. I think the whole marine oranization is counting on the fact that the yonkou refuse to work together. And during the war of the greatest the marines mustered up all of their troops just to fight 1 yonkou. Look at it like this. What would have to happen for the American military to pull all of their resources together? It would have to be something absolutely insane. I guess at this moment it's just a matter of opinion but my opinion is that the marines plus the shichibuki equal one yonkou fleet!(aside from Blackbeard who's whole crew pissed themselves at the thought of akainu). I mean whitebeard really whooped what we would consider one of the strongest people in the world (akainu) and honestly he's typically the deciding factor on which side is strongest. Aside from the admirals and a couple shichibuki the rest of the marines are fodder

They gathered all of their forces to increase the probability of victory with minimal effort and damages on their side. It's just tactical to overwhelm your enemy when you have advantage with numbers. Yes, The marines shit themselves whenever the emperors make a move. It's because they can potentially cause mass destruction and unimaginable civilian damage. The entire populace of Zou might have been wiped out of map if it weren't for SH's. And, it was the work just a henchman of of four emperors. That's how great their influence and power are; The marines defend civilians, so it's only natural for them to be apprehensive about the Emperors and their actions. It's no different from how the entire would will be concerned about it, when a country does something bad "Mass producing nuclear bombs for example".

What you're completely overlooking is that 98% of top fighters from marines faction hadn't done anything significant in the war. The bagged victory with minimal effort and no lasting damages. That's not being equal in slightest.

 

[Uzumaki Macho]

You misunderstand me. I never said Whitebeard's ability to do battle never decreased between his prime and the war, I said the potency of his Quakes received no indication that they decreased in any capacity between his prime and the war, so all that Pokemon shit is irrelevant.

The point of my post was that Akainu and Whitebeard's methods of offense are on par with each other. The fact that they were using their powers through physical movement and still matched each other showed their speed and reflexes were on par until WB's illness hit. Akainu has shown he has the ability to cleave through Whitebeard's body, so he can bypass his durability, and vice versa. Intelligence doesn't play that large a role in either of their fighting styles, so that covers pretty much all of the bases.Meaning they're much closer than you think they are.



The reason they had so much time is because One Piece is, above all else, a story. Every arc that Oda does always has hefty story to it in one way or another. Marineford wasn't just a war and action, it was the story of Whitebeard, hence why it was all called the Whitebeard Saga. The focus between WB and Squard is just part of the overall story of Whitebeard and his most defining trait: His love for his children. There was focus on Squard not because his blow significantly caused WB's ability to do battle to decline, but because Oda was telling the story of Whitebeard's love for his children.

In the second fight, Akainu got jumped and was able to spring back up and take half of Whitebeard's head as though the attack didn't even hit him. Whitebeard then destroyed the ground, Akainu fell, and resurfaced with the strength to take on countless pirates without missing a single beat. It could not be more clear that the second bout between WB and Akainu didn't affect him as much as you think it does. Otherwise, that just makes WB's crew weak as shit if Akainu really was severely injured, and he could fend off their top fighters and dozens of them all at once without gaining more injuries.

It's also important to note that Akainu was caught by surprise. By your logic, Caesar is far stronger than Luffy and the Scotch Brothers are far stronger than Zoro because the formers defeated the latters through surprise attacks.

So you believe that DD's decreased health weakened his strings, but WB's decease in health didn't weaken his quakes?

 

[Punk Hazard]

So you believe that DD's decreased health weakened his strings, but WB's decease in health didn't weaken his quakes?

There was on-panel indications that it had, while there were no indications of the sort to WB's power and Sengoku's words implied just the opposite.

 

[A v i]

There was on-panel indications that it had, while there were no indications of the sort to WB's power and Sengoku's words implied just the opposite.

It's the other way around. Sengoku basically said (that) "you're severely weakened, Yet you have this much power left in you".

 

[Punk Hazard]

It's the other way around. Sengoku basically said (that) "you're severely weakened, Yet you have this much power left in you".

When did he say that? I'm referring to when Sengoku and Tsuru both said he had the power to destroy the world.

 

[ssjelf]

When did he say that? I'm referring to when Sengoku and Tsuru both said he had the power to destroy the world.

Here ya go

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

 

[A v i]

When did he say that? I'm referring to when Sengoku and Tsuru both said he had the power to destroy the world.

My bad, I was talking about Sengoku's statement about Negate having enough power to split the ground, despite loosing half of his head. Irrc, Sengoku had no idea about Whitebeard's illness when he said that his power could destroy the world. Nonetheless, the statement directly implies his condition does have an impact on his devils fruit power.

 

[Punk Hazard]

Here ya go

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

This just confirms what I said even more. The fact that Sengoku is only surprised that WB can produce that much power once he lost his face and not at any time earlier indicates the illness didn't affect him at all. It also shows that injuries in all likelihood don't affect his powers.

 

[Love Cook]

Lol log off right now. And sanji is fodder.

Replying on a post from 9 months ago ? It's time for you to log off **** boy.

Also don't be salty that it is the year of Sanji, you will get to see him and his family plenty the coming months.