[Discussion] Men shouldn't talk about abortion
- Thread starter Punk Hazard
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Jazzy Stardust
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So the sarcasm wasn't, "You don't need experience to be knowledgeable"? If so then yes I missed it and will take that L.
If that was in fact the sarcasm then I nailed it. Not only did I explain it in the second part, but I explained my reasoning in the last and kept the joke going with the first sentence. So those who didn't read the OP would miss it.
Sigh..
Talking about it =/= giving the ultimate decision on it.
The deal is the people who give decisions on this matter are mostly men since they make up the majority of decision makers in pretty much anywhere... They can have opinions but the ultimate decision is up to people who have to face the certain problem.
And when it comes to those number of analogies... Yeah, to put it blantly the people who experienced the listed problems (or have to deal with consequences of those experiences because of a reason like heritage) are the people whose words should be counted for.
I can not say how a Holocaust survivor should feel or react for his situation. Other people can not make a decision for slave, hence the slavery is someone being stripped from freedom and others making decison for them which is the wrong part to begin with. I can defend these people and their rights accordingly to their perspectives but i can not speak over them about how they should feel or the price they should pay. I can be pro-lgbt but i can not know exactly how they feel, i am not lgbt and never dealt with social and emotional burden of being so.
When it comes to abortion yes people without uterus will not experience the pregnancy. Even if a person with uterus never experienced pregnancy they may someday and it may be outside of their will. The existence of possibility burdens them unlike people who do not have required body parts. So when a man without uterus speaks for right to abort and giving the ultimate decision his voice comes from a place that deep down knows he will never experience pregnancy and its consequences.
"X should not talk" usually means "X is not the recieving end in this matter thus as someone who won't be burdened with said problem they should not speak over people who might actually experience it".
Oh and men and women do not have 50/50 of "work" when it comes to procreation of living being with their bodies. That ratio gets tipped towards women right after intercorse ends and it is pretty obvious why.
The deal is the people who give decisions on this matter are mostly men since they make up the majority of decision makers in pretty much anywhere... They can have opinions but the ultimate decision is up to people who have to face the certain problem.
And when it comes to those number of analogies... Yeah, to put it blantly the people who experienced the listed problems (or have to deal with consequences of those experiences because of a reason like heritage) are the people whose words should be counted for.
I can not say how a Holocaust survivor should feel or react for his situation. Other people can not make a decision for slave, hence the slavery is someone being stripped from freedom and others making decison for them which is the wrong part to begin with. I can defend these people and their rights accordingly to their perspectives but i can not speak over them about how they should feel or the price they should pay. I can be pro-lgbt but i can not know exactly how they feel, i am not lgbt and never dealt with social and emotional burden of being so.
When it comes to abortion yes people without uterus will not experience the pregnancy. Even if a person with uterus never experienced pregnancy they may someday and it may be outside of their will. The existence of possibility burdens them unlike people who do not have required body parts. So when a man without uterus speaks for right to abort and giving the ultimate decision his voice comes from a place that deep down knows he will never experience pregnancy and its consequences.
"X should not talk" usually means "X is not the recieving end in this matter thus as someone who won't be burdened with said problem they should not speak over people who might actually experience it".
Oh and men and women do not have 50/50 of "work" when it comes to procreation of living being with their bodies. That ratio gets tipped towards women right after intercorse ends and it is pretty obvious why.
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Jazzy Stardust
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On the subject of abortion, I partially agree. Partially only because the a significant proportion of guys comment harshly without any forethought.
Whilst men will understand the emotional side of abortion as much as women understand the physical side of being kicked in the nuts, they could, and can try to sympathize with their situation, or learn from a woman with first hand experience.
Whilst men will understand the emotional side of abortion as much as women understand the physical side of being kicked in the nuts, they could, and can try to sympathize with their situation, or learn from a woman with first hand experience.
Reading through this thread it feels like people aren't using heads, instead they want op to be wrong so they can be right, or rather need. Egoistics. But to the point we can still express our opinions just not say we are the only ones who can do that or are correct. That was sufficiently sarcastic for anyone 'not blinded by petty arrogance' to easily understand imo.
While I agree, I still think it sucks that if the woman chooses to have an abortion the man doesn't get a child. Or, if the woman chooses to not have an abortion the man is forced to pay child support.
Punk Hazard
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I think if the man wants the child and the woman doesn't, he can take the child after childbirth and either raise it on his own, getting full custody, or he can get full custody and she can pay child support.
HiddenSound
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Nice thread white knight!!
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I've seen relationships fall because of this topic. For instance, a man and a woman have a stable relationship. One day she gets pregnant, but at the same time she's going to school and she knows she won't be able to both. She contemplates on abortion, instead of going with it (or giving it up for adoption).
However the man (biological father of the unborn child), wants her to keep the baby. Not for selfish reasons, but because that's his child. He should have a say in whether or not it dies, right?
It's such a difficult topic though, and it's heartbreaking too.
However the man (biological father of the unborn child), wants her to keep the baby. Not for selfish reasons, but because that's his child. He should have a say in whether or not it dies, right?
It's such a difficult topic though, and it's heartbreaking too.
What the heck? Of course I have the right to give my opinion about abortion, slavery and the holocaust despite not being a woman, black man or Hebrew.
Abortion my be considered murder by some, but it has been statistically proven that allowing abortions actually decreases crime rates. This is mostly because many couples getting abortions would be otherwise unfit parents. Unfit parents are more likely to produce children that might end up resorting to crime. Moreover, if a happy couple is considering an abortion, of course the man's voice has a role in the matter because its his child too. If the couple is happy and capable, it should be a co-op decision, not made by the woman alone.
Of course slavery and the Holocaust were terrible acts of humanity, but just because I didn't share in those terrible experiences does not mean I can't talk about them. Is this thread even for real?
Abortion my be considered murder by some, but it has been statistically proven that allowing abortions actually decreases crime rates. This is mostly because many couples getting abortions would be otherwise unfit parents. Unfit parents are more likely to produce children that might end up resorting to crime. Moreover, if a happy couple is considering an abortion, of course the man's voice has a role in the matter because its his child too. If the couple is happy and capable, it should be a co-op decision, not made by the woman alone.
Of course slavery and the Holocaust were terrible acts of humanity, but just because I didn't share in those terrible experiences does not mean I can't talk about them. Is this thread even for real?
Uzumaki Macho
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Punk Hazard
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Having a say =/= giving the final decision. That's all there is.
You can speak about these issues but you can not speak over people who have gone through those issues and dictate how they should feel and act.
PS: Lol @ "it takes two" guys. Men don't get through shit during procreation other than several minutes of sticking and jizzing. It is like 2 people starting to writing a book, writing the few pages of intro together then one of them writing the hundreds of page alone. Can other guy claim he had contribution as much as other guy because he was there for writing intro with him? Nah.
Did people even read my first post btw?
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