Manda (Naruto) vs Shukaku (Naruto)

[Bob74h]

Setting/Location: Sannin Deadlock

Victory Conditions: Death of the opponent

Motivation: Morals off/Motivated to kill

Equipment: N/A

Preparation N/A

Continuity/Canon: Anime/video games

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[Troi]

Shukaku mid diff, Manda II would be better.

 

[Infant]

Sand vs physical attacks . . .

Perhaps Manda could bait a TBB attempt and disrupt that to kill Shukaku, but nothing else can work, imo.

 

[Uverdore9]

^I don't think Shikaku is manifested of literal pure sand tbf. Like that makes no sense in the grand scheme of things where everything is implicitly made of magical energy.

Shikaku likely might be composed of magical energy sand (chakra) that has been significantly empowered and evolved to the point that it emulates real life sand. Ergo, Tailed Beasts are literal chakra manifestations manifested from Hagoromo's COAT applied on the Juubi's Chakra.

Definitely implies that, it's a significantly more intricate complex existence, rather than simply being literal pure sand.

Manda needs enough venom in his bite to incapacitate a biju comparable in size to Perfect Kurama, in a single bite, which is a stretch seeing as it's significantly more potent Chakras in proportion to its size makes it exponentially difficult to accomplish that seeing as big targets are comparatively less susceptible to poisoning with thier gargantuan blood vessels, with the time it consumes to reach or fill thier collateral blood vessels.

Shikaku wins mid difficulty.

 

[Infant]

^I don't think Shikaku is manifested of literal pure sand tbf. Like that makes no sense in the grand scheme of things where everything is implicitly made of magical energy.

Shikaku likely might be composed of magical energy sand (chakra) that has been significantly empowered and evolved to the point that it emulates real life sand. Ergo, Tailed Beasts are literal chakra manifestations manifested from Hagoromo's COAT applied on the Juubi's Chakra.

Definitely implies that, it's a significantly more intricate complex existence, rather than simply being literal pure sand.

Manda needs enough venom in his bite to incapacitate a biju comparable in size to Perfect Kurama, in a single bite, which is a stretch seeing as it's significantly more potent Chakras in proportion to its size makes it exponentially difficult to accomplish that seeing as big targets are comparatively less susceptible to poisoning with thier gargantuan blood vessels, the time it consumes to reach or fill thier collective blood vessel pathways.

Shikaku wins mid difference.

I agree on the composition of Shukaku, but Manda has other ways to win.

See this?

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A good hit when Shukaku is in his animal form could incapacitate.

 

[Uverdore9]

I agree on the composition of Shukaku, but Manda has other ways to win.

See this?

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A good hit when Shukaku is in his animal form could incapacitate.

Can't see the image bro. I'm presuming you mean him coiling across his body? If so, why would that matter seeing as it's still pure chakra? True, bijuu can feel pain which exemplifies that chakra can be encoded to feel pain but how do we know that it's powerful enough to incapacitate?

It lacks the features to substantiate that supposition.

 

[Infant]

Can't see the image bro. I'm presuming you mean him coiling across his body? If so, why would that matter seeing as it's still pure chakra? True, bijuu can feel pain which exemplifies that chakra can be encoded to feel pain but how do we know that it's powerful enough to incapacitate?

It lacks the features to substantiate that supposition.

After Manda coiled around Katsuyu, he did a tail slam move that had impressive output. Chapter 170.

The physical shockwave of that hit could destroy the energy that Shukaku is composed of, in his animal form.

 

[Bob74h]

The physical shockwave of that hit could destroy the energy that Shukaku is composed of, in his animal form.

I mean if gamabunta could cut off shukaku's arm then it stands to reason that someone like manda do something similar

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[Troi]

^I don't think Shikaku is manifested of literal pure sand tbf. Like that makes no sense in the grand scheme of things where everything is implicitly made of magical energy.

Shikaku likely might be composed of magical energy sand (chakra) that has been significantly empowered and evolved to the point that it emulates real life sand. Ergo, Tailed Beasts are literal chakra manifestations manifested from Hagoromo's COAT applied on the Juubi's Chakra.

Definitely implies that, it's a significantly more intricate complex existence, rather than simply being literal pure sand.

Manda needs enough venom in his bite to incapacitate a biju comparable in size to Perfect Kurama, in a single bite, which is a stretch seeing as it's significantly more potent Chakras in proportion to its size makes it exponentially difficult to accomplish that seeing as big targets are comparatively less susceptible to poisoning with thier gargantuan blood vessels, with the time it consumes to reach or fill thier collateral blood vessels.

Shikaku wins mid difficulty.

I don’t even think Manda could poison him to be honest.

 

[Infant]

I don’t even think Manda could poison him to be honest.

If they can feel pain, then their physical structure should be close enough to normal mortals to allow for something like poison to work.

Again, in his animal form. If he turns to sand, then he'd just disperse and recollect with different grains.

 

[Troi]

If they can feel pain, then their physical structure should be close enough to normal mortals to allow for something like poison to work.

Again, in his animal form. If he turns to sand, then he'd just disperse and recollect with different grains.

All Shukaku is, is animated sand. He has no organs I am aware of. The tailed beasts are all constructs of chakra so I’m not sure if they have organs or not. Can’t poison something that has nothing to poison.

 

[Infant]

All Shukaku is, is animated sand. He has no organs I am aware of. The tailed beasts are all constructs of chakra so I’m not sure if they have organs or not. Can’t poison something that has nothing to poison.

All?

Sand can't talk, take shape, have limbs, bind people to trees, use seals, become a sealing chamber and so on.

Technically, you can poison the thing itself. Poison isn't some anti-organ magic potion. Its a chemical compound with microscopic effects. The only question is whether those effects can apply on some materials or not.

 

[Troi]

All?

Sand can't talk, take shape, have limbs, bind people to trees, use seals, become a sealing chamber and so on.

Technically, you can poison the thing itself. Poison isn't some anti-organ magic potion. Its a chemical compound with microscopic effects. The only question is whether those effects can apply on some materials or not.

Manda is a snake and adheres to the venom a snake is capable of producing. The venom a snake is capable of producing has no effect on sand neither short term or long term. It will just be venom on sand until the venom dissipates.

And yes, all. You're trying to legitimize the situation by comparison, but Sasori was a puppet that could talk. All he had was a heart which was sealed. No brain, no lungs, nothing. The chakra did the rest. Puppets can be autonomous and work on their own, through chakra. Which is what the clan who made the tailed beasts specialize in. Some of the shinobi and tailed beasts can talk without their oral anatomy being able to really do so. Such as Katsuyu, Kakuzu when he releases his threaded tongue, so the point you are making are not good ones, in my honest opinion. There is also telepathy at play (in the series) as well as several other things so yes I believe Shukaku does all of that while simply being a construct of sand, no lungs, heart or anything of the sort.

 

[Infant]

Manda is a snake and adheres to the venom a snake is capable of producing. The venom a snake is capable of producing has no effect on sand neither short term or long term. It will just be venom on sand until the venom dissipates.

And yes, all. You're trying to legitimize the situation by comparison, but Sasori was a puppet that could talk. All he had was a heart which was sealed. No brain, no lungs, nothing. The chakra did the rest. Puppets can be autonomous and work on their own, through chakra. Which is what the clan who made the tailed beasts specialize in. Some of the shinobi and tailed beasts can talk without their oral anatomy being able to really do so. Such as Katsuyu, Kakuzu when he releases his threaded tongue, so the point you are making are not good ones, in my honest opinion. There is also telepathy at play (in the series) as well as several other things so yes I believe Shukaku does all of that while simply being a construct of sand, no lungs, heart or anything of the sort.

Eyes, mouth, arms . . .

Sticky limbs which can be cut off . . .

Sasori was originally a person who could talk etc. Sasori crafted body parts, as you say, to facilitate these functions.

Manda is a giant snake, which necessitates some differences in anatomy (the thing which limits every species to its size), who talks and uses natural energy. He is more than just a snaks. I dont think it matters to the poison point, but to note.

 

[Troi]

Eyes, mouth, arms . . .

Sticky limbs which can be cut off . . .

Sasori was originally a person who could talk etc. Sasori crafted body parts, as you say, to facilitate these functions.

Manda is a giant snake, which necessitates some differences in anatomy (the thing which limits every species to its size), who talks and uses natural energy. He is more than just a snaks. I dont think it matters to the poison point, but to note.

Not sticky, chakra is keeping them together.

Sasori was originally a person, yes. Not anymore. He had mechanics to facilitate this, sure. And thankfully shukaku was formed as such to have things like a functioning mouth. The same thing could be said about black Zetsu. A creation that can talk, see, etc. but is a mere malleable creation.

Just because Sasori had things to facilitate such functions does not mean he should have been able to do them, by your logic. He had no lungs and no voicebox. How could he breathe. No brain. How could he do anything?

I understand. But we were specifically talking about the venom as when you said he could possibly poison Shukaku and I said no because that is obviously worth debating lol. My point still stands. Shukaku lacks such anatomy to succumb to venom. Size being of minimal matter when talking about the venom. A beach shark and a great white shark still swim the same, eat the same and bite the same, the size if the only difference. Same with your snake reference.

 

[Infant]

Not sticky, chakra is keeping them together.

Sasori was originally a person, yes. Not anymore. He had mechanics to facilitate this, sure. And thankfully shukaku was formed as such to have things like a functioning mouth. The same thing could be said about black Zetsu. A creation that can talk, see, etc. but is a mere malleable creation.

Just because Sasori had things to facilitate such functions does not mean he should have been able to do them, by your logic. He had no lungs and no voicebox. How could he breathe. No brain. How could he do anything?

I understand. But we were specifically talking about the venom as when you said he could possibly poison Shukaku and I said no because that is obviously worth debating lol. My point still stands. Shukaku lacks such anatomy to succumb to venom. Size being of minimal matter when talking about the venom. A beach shark and a great white shark still swim the same, eat the same and bite the same, the size if the only difference. Same with your snake reference.

Keeping them together . . . so sticky? We are discussing Shukaku here, so what his energy does is part of him.

Mechanics fo facilitate actions . . .

Insects, mushrooms, plants have no brains . . .

Your logic is excellent, but that only applies upon information. The science is lacking. You're equating falsely too many things.

you have to take into considerations teh fiction parts in anime