Malasyan Airlines problem solved

LED ZEPPELIN

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There has been a lot of speculation about Malaysia Airlines Flight 370. Terrorism, hijacking, meteors. I cannot believe the analysis on CNN; it’s almost disturbing. I tend to look for a simpler explanation, and I find it with the 13,000-foot runway at Pulau Langkawi.
We know the story of MH370: A loaded Boeing 777 departs at midnight from Kuala Lampur, headed to Beijing. A hot night. A heavy aircraft. About an hour out, across the gulf toward Vietnam, the plane goes dark, meaning the transponder and secondary radar tracking go off. Two days later we hear reports that Malaysian military radar (which is a primary radar, meaning the plane is tracked by reflection rather than by transponder interrogation response) has tracked the plane on a southwesterly course back across the Malay Peninsula into the Strait of Malacca.
When I heard this I immediately brought up Google Earth and searched for airports in proximity to the track toward the southwest.


The left turn is the key here. Zaharie Ahmad Shah was a very experienced senior captain with 18,000 hours of flight time. We old pilots were drilled to know what is the closest airport of safe harbor while in cruise. Airports behind us, airports abeam us, and airports ahead of us. They’re always in our head. Always. If something happens, you don’t want to be thinking about what are you going to do–you already know what you are going to do. When I saw that left turn with a direct heading, I instinctively knew he was heading for an airport. He was taking a direct route to Palau Langkawi, a 13,000-foot airstrip with an approach over water and no obstacles. The captain did not turn back to Kuala Lampur because he knew he had 8,000-foot ridges to cross. He knew the terrain was friendlier toward Langkawi, which also was closer.
Take a look at this airport on Google Earth. The pilot did all the right things. He was confronted by some major event onboard that made him make an immediate turn to the closest, safest airport.
For me, the loss of transponders and communications makes perfect sense in a fire. And there most likely was an electrical fire. In the case of a fire, the first response is to pull the main busses and restore circuits one by one until you have isolated the bad one. If they pulled the busses, the plane would go silent. It probably was a serious event and the flight crew was occupied with controlling the plane and trying to fight the fire. Aviate, navigate, and lastly, communicate is the mantra in such situations.
There are two types of fires. An electrical fire might not be as fast and furious, and there may or may not be incapacitating smoke. However there is the possibility, given the timeline, that there was an overheat on one of the front landing gear tires, it blew on takeoff and started slowly burning. Yes, this happens with underinflated tires. Remember: Heavy plane, hot night, sea level, long-run takeoff. There was a well known accident in Nigeria of a DC8 that had a landing gear fire on takeoff. Once going, a tire fire would produce horrific, incapacitating smoke. Yes, pilots have access to oxygen masks, but this is a no-no with fire. Most have access to a smoke hood with a filter, but this will last only a few minutes depending on the smoke level. (I used to carry one in my flight bag, and I still carry one in my briefcase when I fly.)
What I think happened is the flight crew was overcome by smoke and the plane continued on the heading, probably on George (autopilot), until it ran out of fuel or the fire destroyed the control surfaces and it crashed. You will find it along that route–looking elsewhere is pointless.
lang-660
Ongoing speculation of a hijacking and/or murder-suicide and that there was a flight engineer on board does not sway me in favor of foul play until I am presented with evidence of foul play.
We know there was a last voice transmission that, from a pilot’s point of view, was entirely normal. “Good night” is customary on a hand-off to a new air traffic control. The “good night” also strongly indicates to me that all was OK on the flight deck. Remember, there are many ways a pilot can communicate distress. A hijack code or even transponder code off by one digit would alert ATC that something was wrong. Every good pilot knows keying an SOS over the mike always is an option. Even three short clicks would raise an alert. So I conclude that at the point of voice transmission all was perceived as well on the flight deck by the pilots.
But things could have been in the process of going wrong, unknown to the pilots.
Evidently the ACARS went inoperative some time before. Disabling the ACARS is not easy, as pointed out. This leads me to believe more in an electrical problem or an electrical fire than a manual shutdown. I suggest the pilots probably were not aware ACARS was not transmitting.
As for the reports of altitude fluctuations, given that this was not transponder-generated data but primary radar at maybe 200 miles, the azimuth readings can be affected by a lot of atmospherics and I would not have high confidence in this being totally reliable. But let’s accept for a minute that the pilot may have ascended to 45,000 feet in a last-ditch effort to quell a fire by seeking the lowest level of oxygen. That is an acceptable scenario. At 45,000 feet, it would be tough to keep this aircraft stable, as the flight envelope is very narrow and loss of control in a stall is entirely possible. The aircraft is at the top of its operational ceiling. The reported rapid rates of descent could have been generated by a stall, followed by a recovery at 25,000 feet. The pilot may even have been diving to extinguish flames.
But going to 45,000 feet in a hijack scenario doesn’t make any good sense to me.
Regarding the additional flying time: On departing Kuala Lampur, Flight 370 would have had fuel for Beijing and an alternate destination, probably Shanghai, plus 45 minutes–say, 8 hours. Maybe more. He burned 20-25 percent in the first hour with takeoff and the climb to cruise. So when the turn was made toward Langkawi, he would have had six hours or more hours worth of fuel. This correlates nicely with the Inmarsat data pings being received until fuel exhaustion.
The now known continued flight until time to fuel exhaustion only confirms to me that the crew was incapacitated and the flight continued on deep into the south Indian ocean.
There is no point speculating further until more evidence surfaces, but in the meantime it serves no purpose to malign pilots who well may have been in a struggle to save this aircraft from a fire or other serious mechanical issue. Capt. Zaharie Ahmad Shah was a hero struggling with an impossible situation trying to get that plane to Langkawi. There is no doubt in my mind. That’s the reason for the turn and direct route. A hijacking would not have made that deliberate left turn with a direct heading for Langkawi. It probably would have weaved around a bit until the hijackers decided where they were taking it.
Surprisingly, none of the reporters, officials, or other pilots interviewed have looked at this from the pilot’s viewpoint: If something went wrong, where would he go? Thanks to Google Earth I spotted Langkawi in about 30 seconds, zoomed in and saw how long the runway was and I just instinctively knew this pilot knew this airport. He had probably flown there many times.


Fire in an aircraft demands one thing: Get the machine on the ground as soon as possible. There are two well-remembered experiences in my memory. The AirCanada DC9 which landed, I believe, in Columbus, Ohio in the 1980s. That pilot delayed descent and bypassed several airports. He didn’t instinctively know the closest airports. He got it on the ground eventually, but lost 30-odd souls. The 1998 crash of Swissair DC-10 off Nova Scotia was another example of heroic pilots. They were 15 minutes out of Halifax but the fire overcame them and they had to ditch in the ocean. They simply ran out of time. That fire incidentally started when the aircraft was about an hour out of Kennedy. Guess what? The transponders and communications were shut off as they pulled the busses.
Get on Google Earth and type in Pulau Langkawi and then look at it in relation to the radar track heading. Two plus two equals four. For me, that is the simple explanation why it turned and headed in that direction. Smart pilot. He just didn’t have the time.
 

Tarinth

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dat wall of text. too long.
 

LED ZEPPELIN

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basically the landing gear was damaged and it caused a fire right after the plane took off.
before the crew noticed the smoke the fire burnt some wires and when the crew noticed it they had to turn all of them off to check the problem. and then they diverted west for the nearest airstrip. before they actually landed the plane sinked deep into the ocean because the fire ****ed up with everything.
 

Raxido

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So they all died:|
 

Yatori

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Well it somehow makes sense.. so your logic they didnt made to landed in pulau langkawi and go straight to indian ocean?

Have u studied the airport next to pulau langkawi ? :snick:
 

ShishaMastah420

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Ironic or not that this plane incident comes about when Russian is currently on the verge of exercising some immense imperialism and America is responding with "Sanctions"
 

Aim64C

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The sequence of events, triple and quadruple redundant systems, and the fact that the engines remained operational hours after the incident all steer the rational mind away from fires as an explanation.

Many modern aircraft do not have specific control boxes. Most aircraft today have a bus network that links processor arrays around the aircraft together. Damage to one particular portion of the aircraft will degrade the function of non-essential systems (the in-flight movie) while preserving essential systems.

This allows, say, catastrophic damage to the cabin to not affect the altitude hold and automated navigation functions.

Depending upon the models, there are both primary and secondary hydraulic controls for surfaces - all under the control of these distributed systems.

While I'm not privy to the innards of the 777, specifically, but it is exceptionally unlikely for a fire to have affected the systems it did.

Notably, the climb and descent patterns - which indicates altitude hold being turned off. This is a manual action. Then, the altitude hold is restored, and the aircraft's engines continue to operate for a minimum of four hours afterward.

As an Aviation Electronics Technician - I find the "Fire Theory" exceptionally far-fetched.

Alien abductions are more likely to be the explanation than fire. Spontaneous folding of space-time from some yet-to-be-discovered anomaly that sent the thing to Mars, in my opinion, is more plausible.

If we're going to explore the 'ridiculous' - let's entertain the plausible ridiculous before the implausible ridiculous. Fires that leave a plane mute but operational don't happen. Fires that render a plane without any kind of radio, navsat, commsat, etc do happen - but they also tend to obliterate the plane (these fires are usually very fast - supersonic, in fact, and are commonly known as explosions).

The most plausible theory that I've reviewed is that the plane has been hijacked and landed somewhere. Several governments likely know more than they are saying - but it's a sensitive political issue as to where the aircraft is.

There is also the theory that it was hijacked and destined for a target in China - and China blew it out of the sky. Other entities that know what happened do not want to point fingers at China without evidence, and China does not want to admit it has a problem with Muslim extremists.

The reality is, however, that we are unlikely to ever know for certain what happened. Any outcome where the aircraft did crash into the ocean leaves us with a very low likelihood of discovering any of its remains, to begin with. A low-velocity impact where the aircraft largely held together would leave little floating debris to be found. Even if there were floating debris found, it is unlikely that any of it will lead to a reasonably sized search area.

The current efforts to locate the 'black box' radio will likely turn up null. It's a vast search area and water attenuates radio frequencies to such a degree that it's very unlikely anything will be found, even if they had a well refined search area. At this point - it's a Hail-Mary in the dark.

Unless the plane turns up as being landed following a hijacking, or a miracle happens and they discover the wreckage - it is unlikely we will be able to know much of anything about what happened.

And even if we did... it's quite possible that what we find will only bring up more questions that will never be answered.
 

Yatori

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Latest news : PM Najib announced during the PC earlier, says #MH370 ended in the Southern Indian Ocean. Another PC tomorrow.

:(
 

Gunjan

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But Why in the Ocean ? Atleast they Must have Landed on land.... Some People Might Be saved /.
 

Yatori

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But Why in the Ocean ? Atleast they Must have Landed on land.... Some People Might Be saved /.

ocean here means they wont have any possible landing area.. they not confirm it yet but its likely to crash in hindi ocean :(

i doubt there are any survivor.. we all know how deep and dangerous hindi ocean right ?
 

Zee Seh

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RIP people u.u Poor fellas U_U
 

Aim64C

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Latest news : PM Najib announced during the PC earlier, says #MH370 ended in the Southern Indian Ocean. Another PC tomorrow.

:(

There are.... reasons..... I doubt the accuracy of Prime Minister Najib's statements regarding the deposition of MH370.

He's getting tired of other governments sticking their nose into his agencies and administrations (which are corrupt and dysfunctional). He just wants the ordeal to be over, and he's betting that the media will gobble up the explanation and let it drop.
 

Yatori

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There are.... reasons..... I doubt the accuracy of Prime Minister Najib's statements regarding the deposition of MH370.

He's getting tired of other governments sticking their nose into his agencies and administrations (which are corrupt and dysfunctional). He just wants the ordeal to be over, and he's betting that the media will gobble up the explanation and let it drop.

well then wait until they found the black box.. but you know how indian ocean looks like right?
 

Aim64C

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well then wait until they found the black box.. but you know how indian ocean looks like right?

I would be surprised if they find the 'black box.' Or, more precisely, one of the several flight data recorders.

It is a massive search area we are talking about. Ocean currents are somewhat variable, and the area is a mess for sonar based searches - which will only be useful in the moderately deep regions. The trenches may as well be the moon, and your shallower regions are such a mess that an aircraft carrier can confound sonar operators (it's like a hall of mirrors combined with a disco while tripping acid with a wobbling floor).

I'm exaggerating a tad - but it's less than an ideal environment for sonar operations of any kind.

It's a lesson in the limitations of our capabilities. It sounds simple - "Find the plane. Surely we can do that, we can go to the moon, access nearly limitless information from a device that fits in the palm of our hand, and order a pizza for a friend in another country. ... WTF do you mean 'It's lost'!?"

We live under the illusion that we know more than we do, and that we can easily obtain the information want - particularly when it is a government committing resources to the endeavor.

But the reality is that there are millions upon millions of square miles where the only thing watching is a set of eyes. Most of the time, those aren't human eyes. When they are - eyewitness testimony is notoriously unreliable or misses the importance of what they saw in the first place.

So it's exceptionally unlikely that the flight data recorders will be found.

If they are looking in the right spot.

If they aren't, archeologists three thousand years from now will probably pull the thing up from the bottom of the ocean and be amazed that we had such refined technology in this day and age:

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Like the Antikythera Mechanism.

Someone wondered what the hell happened to the ship that was carrying it. Probably a whole lot of someones. Apparently, they never found it. We happened across it, and said: "Holy crap! They had technology!"

It would be quite humorous to learn that is the fate of MH370's flight data recorders.
 

Yatori

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I would be surprised if they find the 'black box.' Or, more precisely, one of the several flight data recorders.

It is a massive search area we are talking about. Ocean currents are somewhat variable, and the area is a mess for sonar based searches - which will only be useful in the moderately deep regions. The trenches may as well be the moon, and your shallower regions are such a mess that an aircraft carrier can confound sonar operators (it's like a hall of mirrors combined with a disco while tripping acid with a wobbling floor).

I'm exaggerating a tad - but it's less than an ideal environment for sonar operations of any kind.

It's a lesson in the limitations of our capabilities. It sounds simple - "Find the plane. Surely we can do that, we can go to the moon, access nearly limitless information from a device that fits in the palm of our hand, and order a pizza for a friend in another country. ... WTF do you mean 'It's lost'!?"

We live under the illusion that we know more than we do, and that we can easily obtain the information want - particularly when it is a government committing resources to the endeavor.

But the reality is that there are millions upon millions of square miles where the only thing watching is a set of eyes. Most of the time, those aren't human eyes. When they are - eyewitness testimony is notoriously unreliable or misses the importance of what they saw in the first place.

So it's exceptionally unlikely that the flight data recorders will be found.

If they are looking in the right spot.

If they aren't, archeologists three thousand years from now will probably pull the thing up from the bottom of the ocean and be amazed that we had such refined technology in this day and age:

You must be registered for see images


Like the Antikythera Mechanism.

Someone wondered what the hell happened to the ship that was carrying it. Probably a whole lot of someones. Apparently, they never found it. We happened across it, and said: "Holy crap! They had technology!"

It would be quite humorous to learn that is the fate of MH370's flight data recorders.


I know it closely to impossible to find the black box in indian ocean.. but thats the only hope to solve the mystery of flight mh370..

There are so many questions about it.. why it turn back ? why the transponder and acars being turn off? and why it ended very far from the original route which is indian ocean..

I think the "ghost plane" theory is most likely plausible theory one ever made compared to those hijacked/sabotage theory..

yeah but still they didnt find any debris yet.. just according to AAIB data they have concluded it ended in indian ocean.. however finding the evidence in indian ocean is like find needle in the haystack..

[video=youtube;imqW_g-5S0I]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=imqW_g-5S0I[/video]

a video of SAR operation in indian ocean..
 
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