Madara vs Hashirama.

[Solarmoth]

Restrictions: No Wood Buddha technique.
Knowledge: Manga.
Intel: Full.
Distance: 9m.
Hashirama has Sage mode and Kyuubi by his side. Madara is EMS with Gunbai.
Who will win?

 

[Heartpeace]

u best not be restricting MADARA here bro

 

[Rikudou Tobi]

Hashirama cannot use kyubi to fight, only suppress its powers. So the battle ends up like it did in VoTe. Both near death and then Hashirama stabs him

 

[Solarmoth]

Hashirama cannot use kyubi to fight, only suppress its powers. So the battle ends up like it did in VoTe. Both near death and then Hashirama stabs him

I took away SS, don't you think it'll end in a way favourable to Madara? I'm giving Hashirama a fanfic power of controlling tailed beasts for his lack of SS in this fight.

 

[Rikudou Tobi]

I took away SS, don't you think it'll end in a way favourable to Madara? I'm giving Hashirama a fanfic power of controlling tailed beasts for his lack of SS in this fight.

During the original VoTe battle, the kyubi was the key factor in that battle. It was the kyubi that destroyed emergency forest, wood dragon, and wood golem with a single explosion of 1 tailed beast bomb. This was already too much for Hashirama that he needed Sage Mode to remove Magic Garb Susano’o while bypassing some tailed beast bomb all at the same time with Artifacts of The Buddha.

After he freed kurama from his control, kurama’s tailed beast bomb already left Veritable 1,000 armed Kanon (Shinsu senju) completely destroyed that he couldn’t use it in his fight against Ems Madara anymore.


So the rest of the battle fought by Ems Madara (no kyubi) vs Sm Hashirama (no 1,000 armed kanon) off panel which lead to them being at a complete standstill. Madara was fatigued battered and hashirama was left fatigued with a burnt left arm.
Hashirama took that victory with a wood Doppler hanger feint stab.

This is where the senjus Tobirama, Hashirama, and even Naruto experience shines. When a Uchiha is fatigued or gloating in victory, the moment they deactivate their sharingan, take advantage of it and land the killing blow like Tobirama and Hashirama did (Naruto landed an uppercut).

This is why Hashirama wins. Give him the fanfic power to manipulate the biju bomb of a tailed beast powers then it’s a neg diff stomp.

 

[Solarmoth]

During the original VoTe battle, the kyubi was the key factor in that battle. It was the kyubi that destroyed emergency forest, wood dragon, and wood golem with a single explosion of 1 tailed beast bomb. This was already too much for Hashirama that he needed Sage Mode to remove Magic Garb Susano’o while bypassing some tailed beast bomb all at the same time with Artifacts of The Buddha.

After he freed kurama from his control, kurama’s tailed beast bomb already left Veritable 1,000 armed Kanon (Shinsu senju) completely destroyed that he couldn’t use it in his fight against Ems Madara anymore.


So the rest of the battle fought by Ems Madara (no kyubi) vs Sm Hashirama (no 1,000 armed kanon) off panel which lead to them being at a complete standstill. Madara was fatigued battered and hashirama was left fatigued with a burnt left arm.
Hashirama took that victory with a wood Doppler hanger feint stab.

This is where the senjus Tobirama, Hashirama, and even Naruto experience shines. When a Uchiha is fatigued or floating in victory, the moment they deactivate their sharingan, take advantage of it and land the killing blow like Tobirama and Hashirama did (Naruto landed an uppercut).

This is why Hashirama wins. Give him the fanfic power to manipulate the biju bomb of a tailed beast powers then it’s a neg diff stomp.

But is the Perfect susano'O capable of being destroyed by Kurama's beast Ball? I think susano'O's durability can resist the beast ball and catch it, then deflect it back to wood dragon and golem.

 

[Rikudou Tobi]

But is the Perfect susano'O capable of being destroyed by Kurama's beast Ball? I think susano'O's durability can resist the beast ball and catch it, then deflect it back to wood dragon and golem.

We don't have a clear measurement of Perfect Susano'o's durability except for the fact that Kaguya destroyed it and it stalemated Kurama mode Naruto's tail.

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Even if Perfect Susano'o catches one or two of Kurama's tailed beast bomb, it won't survive the bomb when it explodes right in front of its face. When it comes to tailed beast powers, they reign supreme of more destructive power and chakra, the only way to stop them is to suppress their powers with your kekkai genkai besides that fighting a biju in a one on one match will spell death for you. Only Six path powered people can probably stalemate a biju.
So if Hashirama is using tailed beast powers, then he wins unless Ems Madara can suppress kurama like Hashirama did at VoTe.

 

[Solarmoth]

We don't have a clear measurement of Perfect Susano'o's durability except for the fact that Kaguya destroyed it and it stalemated Kurama mode Naruto's tail.

Spoiler

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Even if Perfect Susano'o catches one or two of Kurama's tailed beast bomb, it won't survive the bomb when it explodes right in front of its face. When it comes to tailed beast powers, they reign supreme of more destructive power and chakra, the only way to stop them is to suppress their powers with your kekkai genkai besides that fighting a biju in a one on one match will spell death for you. Only Six path powered people can probably stalemate a biju.
So if Hashirama is using tailed beast powers, then he wins unless Ems Madara can suppress kurama like Hashirama did at VoTe.

Madara has stated in the War arc that his susanoo has a power comparable to Bijuu. Which means all the Bijuu considering the fact that Sasuke could fight the Ten tails mode of Kaguya.

By that fact, I think PS can survive the Bijuudama or catch one Bijuudama and push it back at the next bijuudama fired by kyuubi, effectively negating its beast ball with it's own beast ball.
Or the sword's force can cut through the Bijuudama upon contact. The Data book says the reason Hashirama's SS hands broke was because of the force it smashed it's target, not because of the Bijuudama's potency and destructiveness.

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[Rikudou Tobi]

Madara has stated in the War arc that his susanoo has a power comparable to Bijuu. Which means all the Bijuu considering the fact that Sasuke could fight the Ten tails mode of Kaguya.

Yeah because both Perfect Susano'o and a biju can both destroy a mountain with each move at a time. Sasuke fighting Ten tails is credited to his Rinnegan powers and his

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according to Sasuke.

By that fact, I think PS can survive the Bijuudama or catch one Bijuudama and push it back at the next bijuudama fired by kyuubi, effectively negating its beast ball with it's own beast ball.

If you clash a biju bomb with a solid object it would explode destroying anything around in its radius. That's what happened to Hashirama's wood golem and emergency forest.

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So Susano'o is just better off flying away then catching biju bombs. The fact that Tailed beast Curl was able to tank the jyubi's laser, it can handle its own bomb exploding in its face. But it would be severely damaged after a while.

Or the sword's force can cut through the Bijuudama upon contact. The Data book says the reason Hashirama's SS hands broke was because of the force it smashed it's target, not because of the Bijuudama's potency and destructiveness.

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So you believe that the biju bombs did nothing?

 

[Solarmoth]

Yeah because both Perfect Susano'o and a biju can both destroy a mountain with each move at a time. Sasuke fighting Ten tails is credited to his Rinnegan powers and his

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according to Sasuke.

Sasuke was fighting Kaguya + Bijuu Jubi. Madara claimed it was strong as All bijū combined. Ten biju combined power = Madara perfect Susano'O.

If you clash a biju bomb with a solid object it would explode destroying anything around in its radius. That's what happened to Hashirama's wood golem and emergency forest.

Spoiler

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So Susano'o is just better off flying away then catching biju bombs. The fact that Tailed beast Curl was able to tank the jyubi's laser, it can handle its own bomb exploding in its face. But it would be severely damaged after a while.

How about this scenario, Madara catches the bijuu bomb and and throws it back immediately at Hashirama and not the Kyuubi. It would conclude on whether Hashi can put up his Kyuubi to tank the hit before the bijuu dama hits him directly. Does Hashirama have reaction feats saying he can dodge or put up Nine tails in direction to tank Bijuu bomb, in time?

So you believe that the biju bombs did nothing?

I think so, Hashirama wasn't stressed in the least at all the biju bombs slamming into Buddha when smashing it, and the DB clears any doubts on whether if its hands were broken because of the damage of biju bomb.

 

[Rikudou Tobi]

Sasuke was fighting Kaguya + Bijuu Jubi. Madara claimed it was strong as All bijū combined. Ten biju combined power = Madara perfect Susano'O.

Kaguya is the Ten Tails my guy. When Obito became jinchuuriki, he separated the jubi into two. One transformed into the god tree and the other one was inside of his body as jinchuuriki.

Madara claimed that his Perfect Susano'o is comparable to a biju (one biju whether it be 1 tails, 5 tails, or 9 tails) not all of them combined. Ten tails combine power can destroy a whole country off the face of the map:

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Ten tails>>>Perfect Susano'o in power that it doesn't even compare. Even Hagormoo couldn't destroy the Ten tails power only divide it, so Madara himself doesn't stand a chance if Hagoromoo or Hamura couldn't kill it.

How about this scenario, Madara catches the bijuu bomb and and throws it back immediately at Hashirama and not the Kyuubi. It would conclude on whether Hashi can put up his Kyuubi to tank the hit before the bijuu dama hits him directly. Does Hashirama have reaction feats saying he can dodge or put up Nine tails in direction to tank Bijuu bomb, in time?

Hashirama's only feat of dodging a biju bomb is by hiding underground using wood expulsion jutsu

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But you'e scenario can work because he can't hide from two biju bombs.
The only thing Ems Madara needs to guarantee a win against Sm Hashirama would be to take away Kurama from him. Who ever is in possession of Kurama wins the battle.
So is there a way that Madara can steal Kurama away from Hashirama like Hashirama did to Madara at VoTe?

I think so, Hashirama wasn't stressed in the least at all the biju bombs slamming into Buddha when smashing it, and the DB clears any doubts on whether if its hands were broken because of the damage of biju bomb.

The databook was fan translated but its not exactly what you think happened. Most of those tailed beast bombs flew past the artifacts arms because the sword was cutting through them. If all of Hashirama's arms weren't destroyed by the biju blast then why did Madara used it against Hashirama? He could've just waited for Hashirama to through the arms then blast him with the tailed beast bomb afterwards?

 

[Solarmoth]

Kaguya is the Ten Tails my guy. When Obito became jinchuuriki, he separated the jubi into two. One transformed into the god tree and the other one was inside of his body as jinchuuriki.

Madara claimed that his Perfect Susano'o is comparable to a biju (one biju whether it be 1 tails, 5 tails, or 9 tails) not all of them combined. Ten tails combine power can destroy a whole country off the face of the map:

Spoiler

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Ten tails>>>Perfect Susano'o in power that it doesn't even compare. Even Hagormoo couldn't destroy the Ten tails power only divide it, so Madara himself doesn't stand a chance if Hagoromoo or Hamura couldn't kill it.

Tailed beasts cannot be killed. They can be suppressed like Shukaku was suppressed by Rasa. The force of the slash must be equal to jubī. Because Japanese people don't differentiate singular and plural. Even if they want to say bijuu's', they'll still say just the singular version like "Bijū". If Madara was exclaiming about a single tailed beast, he would've named the name of the beast. I'm not saying the destructiveness, but the power and force of the slash upon direct hit, are the same or near jubī power. As Madara said "comparable to the bijuu", so maybe near it's power.

Hashirama's only feat of dodging a biju bomb is by hiding underground using wood expulsion jutsu

Spoiler

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But you'e scenario can work because he can't hide from two biju bombs.
The only thing Ems Madara needs to guarantee a win against Sm Hashirama would be to take away Kurama from him. Who ever is in possession of Kurama wins the battle.
So is there a way that Madara can steal Kurama away from Hashirama like Hashirama did to Madara at VoTe?

The kyuubi's power or biju dama can either be sliced or thrown back to negate another bijudama coming his way.
But if we go by that method, Madara can win easily as he can control the tailed beast with eye contact, which would make this match a easy win for Madara, so I'm going for the pure battle type win. I think Madara can also repel the Bijuudama with his Gunbai, what do you say? He can also fly towards Hashirama while catching the bijuudama and throwing it continuously at Hashirama all the while getting near him to blast the bomb near his victinity.

The databook was fan translated but its not exactly what you think happened. Most of those tailed beast bombs flew past the artifacts arms because the sword was cutting through them. If all of Hashirama's arms weren't destroyed by the biju blast then why did Madara used it against Hashirama? He could've just waited for Hashirama to through the arms then blast him with the tailed beast bomb afterwards?

Is there proof that Hashirama fought Madara with SS in any other fight? Madara could've simply though it was like any other wood technique and fired it. The databook is from a good translator, though it could've errors, it's still going by canon, by the fact that Hashirama did think Madara cant beat him and proceeded confidently to destroy his Susano'O armor. There is also the fact madara claimed he fought that battle to get hashi's cells so he couldve acted like that to not blow up his cover on his real motive.

 

[Rikudou Tobi]

Tailed beasts cannot be killed. They can be suppressed like Shukaku was suppressed by Rasa. The force of the slash must be equal to jubī. Because Japanese people don't differentiate singular and plural. Even if they want to say bijuu's', they'll still say just the singular version like "Bijū". If Madara was exclaiming about a single tailed beast, he would've named the name of the beast. I'm not saying the destructiveness, but the power and force of the slash upon direct hit, are the same or near jubī power. As Madara said "comparable to the bijuu", so maybe near it's power.

The biju is singular not plural. He was talking about the tailed beasts that existed at the time, not the Ten tails. The ten tails is an aggregation of all 9 bijus so you cannot refer to an aggregation as a singular. Especially when Obito divided the two of them into a god tree and the other into his body as a jinchuuriki.
And Madara said its destructiveness of the blade rivals the biju and the Ten tails destructive powers were said to drink oceans and split the earth etc. Madara does not have that power at all, the Ten tails is way more powerful than his Susano'o will ever be and should never be compared in physical strength and projectile power.

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The kyuubi's power or biju dama can either be sliced or thrown back to negate another bijudama coming his way.
But if we go by that method, Madara can win easily as he can control the tailed beast with eye contact, which would make this match a easy win for Madara, so I'm going for the pure battle type win. I think Madara can also repel the Bijuudama with his Gunbai, what do you say? He can also fly towards Hashirama while catching the bijuudama and throwing it continuously at Hashirama all the while getting near him to blast the bomb near his victinity.

A bijus power can be redirected/deflected depending on how big it is, but it can never be negated unless you have a truth seeking orb.

If Madara takes control over Kurama with his sharingan than he needs to prevent Hashirama from using

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If you have counters then let me know, because Hokage's are known for breaking Uchihas control over bijus. Even Minato did that to 14 yo Tobi when they fought.
Return of the Uchiha can only deflect jutsus of the same size of Gunbai fan, but jutsus that are bigger than it would probably need Susano'o to be covered to stop it like it dud

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. But I don't know if it will stop the biju bomb from exploding.

Is there proof that Hashirama fought Madara with SS in any other fight? Madara could've simply though it was like any other wood technique and fired it. The databook is from a good translator, though it could've errors, it's still going by canon, by the fact that Hashirama did think Madara cant beat him and proceeded confidently to destroy his Susano'O armor. There is also the fact madara claimed he fought that battle to get hashi's cells so he couldve acted like that to not blow up his cover on his real motive.

He never used Veritable 1,000 armed kan'on against Ems Madara again after that fight. Madara was confident because he had the kyubi summoning to beat Hashirama because the Buddha was only able to strip Susano'o not beat the Kyubi. So if Madara still had the kyubi, Madara would just fire more Tailed Beast bomb to kill Hashirama. However Hashirama has enough battle smarts to strip the Kyubi from Madara's control leaving them to a complete deadlock with no chakra left.

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Madara claimed to of seen in then but I don't know how considering that Madara didn't even have enough chakra to activate the sharingan. Anyways like you said, he had alternative motives so if Madara can keep the kyubi away from Hashirama and fight at a distances then he can win but if not then it will just be a repeat of VoTe.