Looking back over Kakashi Gaiden, My analysis of Obito as Tobi

mikeeozua

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I just read back over the Kakashi chronicles and man even though Obito was the best choice plot wise from the options Izuna, elder son etc.... It still doesn't feel right to me.

Now since I see more cons than pros at the moment of Obito being Tobi I will start from the Pros.

Pros:
-It sparked a reaction from Naruto and co:
One of the things I was most looking forward to from the reveal was what the reaction of what Naruto and Co. would be like. Say it were to be Izuna or Kagami or the Elder son, the reaction would not be very significant. In fact they would probably still have the same looks on their faces that they did when he still had the mask on.

-Obito has relations to members on the battlefield:
Obito has relations with Kakashi, Gai, Minato, Sasuke and Naruto in being effectively the 'dark' version of him. This prolongs the story allowing more events to happen in the battle and does add quite a bit of drama to the story.

-It explains how Rin died:
So after Obito's motivational speech of protecting her, she suddenly disappears off the face of the Earth? I didn't buy it.

-Gives Team Minato more similarities of Team 7:
From these flashbacks we can see how Minato actually felt towards Obito treating him almost like a son, how Kakashi felt towards Obito, treasuring him as a hero, and how Obito felt towards Rin. It also gives Minato more of an personality.

-He has a long standing purpose
Let's face it, Kagami and the Elder Son's relevance would have died out pretty quickly.



Now that I've delved into the pros now it's time for my personal cons:
-Obito's change seemed too forced:
At least with Madara, his personality began changing already when Izuna died but he didn't snap immediately. Same with Nagato, when his parents died he didn't snap immediately. But with Obito, the guy still had his ever so enthusiastic attitude when going to aid Kakashi and Rin, but when he saw Kakashi stabbing Rin, he just snapped. Yes, the experience itself is traumatising but Obito never seemed like the kind of person to slaughter a whole division.

-What Obito stood for:
Reading through Kakashi Gaiden, I cannot believe this is the same guy. Obito in Kakashi Gaiden was a kid who helped old ladies had a bit of a temper, but was someone you could feel sympathy towards. Now the moment, Obito said that speech to Kakashi, he became one of my favourites in the whole series. Brave enough to defy everything a shinobi stands for, he was easily an inspiring role model. And at the end, the heroes of the sharingan reference had me in tears. Everything that he stood for was shattered so quickly.

-His motives:
They're not as simple as everybody makes out to be, but compared to many others it's still too weak.

His 'Personality change' when the mask came off:
As 'Madara' he was a highly perceptive, intelligent, cunning and mysterious man who struck fear into your very body. He's still somewhat like that but he's lost the 'fear' factor and his cunningness pales to Madara's.

Overuse of Rin's flashbacks:
As an Obito fan, I'm pleading with Kishi to stop them, please.

The nerfing of his abilities:
This isn't a fault with the character himself, just how Kishi is leaving out a lot of his abilities.

And there you have it ladies and gentlemen, my analysis of Obito being Tobi. I don't care what anybody else says this guy:
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Will always be my beloved Obito Uchiha :happy:
 

Invsblphntm

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Sasuke went from a guy living only to kill his brother, to calling his brother perfect. Drastic change occurs in this manga often, I'm surprised you think that Obito should've slowly turned evil... Nagato also went through an extremely similar point where he turned from his naive viewpoint.

Also the fact that Obito turned from everything he stood for... that is the point of why it's so ludicrous that someone like Obito could turn into 'Tobi'. Seriously, that is the point Kishimoto is making, even a guy like Obito can turn bad and it adds that much more to the shock value.

Decent review, but some problems persist in the thread.
 

Mypower

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Yeah I agree he snapped too fast.
 

Οdin

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Invisible Phantom made a good post. u-u
 

oShux

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Extreme changes happens alot in this manga Nagato did a extreme change when Yahiko died. Sasuke did two extreme changes from loving his brother to hating him to loving him again. Etc I agree with the rest though but Kishi doesn't even show rin flashbacks that much. He only showed a couple and all except for one were used to explain their past.
 

oShux

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Yeah I agree he snapped too fast.

What about Nagato when Yahiko died? Or Sasuke, changing multiple times from loving his brother to hating him, to loving him again, from wanting to live in konoha, to leaving it, to wanting him to destroying it, to now wanting to protect it. Out with that bs
 

Super7

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It's already been explained, the curse of hatred, Obito wasn't/isn't strong willed enough to control his hatred, he gave into it and let it take over him.
 

mikeeozua

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...

Sasuke went from a guy living only to kill his brother, to calling his brother perfect. Drastic change occurs in this manga often, I'm surprised you think that Obito should've slowly turned evil... Nagato also went through an extremely similar point where he turned from his naive viewpoint.

Also the fact that Obito turned from everything he stood for... that is the point of why it's so ludicrous that someone like Obito could turn into 'Tobi'. Seriously, that is the point Kishimoto is making, even a guy like Obito can turn bad and it adds that much more to the shock value.

Decent review, but some problems persist in the thread.

You make a good point about the shock value.
 

mikeeozua

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What about Nagato when Yahiko died? Or Sasuke, changing multiple times from loving his brother to hating him, to loving him again, from wanting to live in konoha, to leaving it, to wanting him to destroying it, to now wanting to protect it. Out with that bs

I agree with you about Sasuke, but Nagato didn't really snap too drastically when his parents were killed. He was still afraid of killing anybody.
 

Nous

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I agree with many of your points. I agree with all your points in the Pro-Section and Obito was the only reasonable selection. Had it been Izuna, Kagami, Elder Son, Rikudō Sennin etc. in most, if not all cases, Kakashi/Gai/Naruto/Killer B would have absolutely no idea who they are. It wouldn't be an "..Obito?" 0.0 Reaction, but a "Who in the world are you?" Reaction. He's relevant and explains quite a lot..

I also agree with all your points in the Con-Section. Mostly, the Quick-Change aspect. Obito should have slowly became evil, not Rin dies, turns evil. I think his reasoning to change evil should have been stronger.. Nagato got mad and killed a few people, which Obito did as well. Then Nagato over a branch of time becomes mroe and more sinister but Obito instantly becomes as evil as he's gonna get there. Possibly, Kishimoto is trying to resemble Star Wars with Obito=Anakin but not doing it as well as he could?

The personality change, I think is because the Mask represented Obito as Madara. When the mask came off, Obito lost the Madara act and became himself again. The Mask was symbolism basically.. or I'm over-thinking this. And the last point, yes.. Why did Obito never use the Rinnegan..?

And when Obito "died".. dem feels.. :'(
 

Renpatsu Dei

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Obito is literally Harvey Dent from the Dark Knight. One of the best parts of Obito's character which you forgot is his contrast to Naruto. There is so mush symbolism here which makes him a good choice.

Firstly there's Obito's original line, Obito saying he will crush all shinobi, that was foreshadowing IMO, as soon as Tobi was introduced he was going to be Obito in Kishi's mind, Obito already wasn't happy with the shinobi world, so while it was abrupt, he was already considering the way the shinobi world works as wrong

Obito died and give his eye to Kakashi to save Rin, and that was his symbol of hope. That same eye he saw that hope crushed and he gave up that hope, it became hollow (chap 597). Rin had to die for the sake of others, that hatred was born to protect love, the way I see it, he has sort of melded his and Madara's beliefs together and doesn't value his friends because he plans to create a new world, remember he was in a cave listening to Madara's drivel for months, the only hope he had to drive him was his wish to protect his friends.

Another thing, one of the key messages in this arc is a shinobi's ability to endure. When Naruto lost Neji, he had his friends around him to stop him losing hope and to help him endure by allowing them to live on in his heart. Obito in contrast gave up on hope and didn't endure, like a 'real shinobi' which he desired to crush and instead used Rin to fuel his hatred as all he had was an old man telling him there is no hope. This sort of contrast wouldn't work with another character because they wouldn't have started from the same place so as much as I agree with most of the thread, Obito is a better choice than people know.
 

Murasame

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You guys focus too much on Rin when he also has Minato and Kakashi in his flashbacks as well.. everyone is different in emotional level as well so you can't expect Obito to be as strong as others in that department. Madara was trained to fight and kill even as a kid.. his emotions would be more hardened than Obito. Anyways I don't see a problem with the Rin flashbacks at all when other characters like Naruto and Sasuke have them as well with other peopel Naruto with sasuke and sasuke with itachi.
 

Blinkie Uchiha

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there wasn't even a building up to it ... it was good... BOOM! evil!
 

Murasame

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Also if you want a more detailed explanation look at this thread
 

SeriousDogg

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Kakashi's technique and Tobi was too similar, the eyes location, the hair of Tobi and kid Obito is also the same, the crushed half with the Mangekyou...

I knew it all the time, I just waited for the confirm from Kishi and to see what really happened...
 

Flawž

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Obito was the perfect choice.

Kishi's way of saying that Even the Nicest and Incredible people can also turn evil, be effected by the curse of hatred.
 
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