Dan stated what he knew.... It is more valid.. and it also shows people didn't really think of Sarutobi as the "God" or w.e Iruka said. Hell even Tsunade doesn't.
Again.. why are you talking about the present?? When the thread is about people who existed in the past.. I really don't get that. It doesn't matter if Naruto can beat Ems Madara... But I would take Dan's word , rather then Iruka's word. Do you know why?? because Dan was alive during Sarutobi's prime. If Sarutobi's power was such a legend...he would've automatically past the Hashirama and Madara .. But to bad it wasn't.
Also.. I'm pretty sure Madara knew he was a Edo.. Other wise he would've went "hard" from the start.. lmaoo. And you mentioned a double team.. thats what surprises me. LMAO.
And you did twist it.. Muu was talking about people who were fighting him.. and Naruto wasn't there at that point. Onoki had the best chance at Muu....It still holds true.
Yes dan states what he knows, He knows hashirama defeat him in the past, While at the same time he Knows Nothing or hashirama/Madara's real power.
Hashirama was the only person to ever defeat Madara, so it's only logical Dan said "only hashirama can stop him".
He know he's edo, Nothing more, No rinnegan, No mokuton, No Perfect susanoo, No Ms techs. All he knows it hear say.
Due to Dan's lack of Info about Current shinobi and Hashirama/Madara his statement cannot be taken as fact.
I can Say minato is the only Hokage capable of defeating Sharingan Obito, Due FTG being the perfect counter to obito's overpowered tech.
This does not make Minato stronger than the others.
It's like a shinobi saying "no one can beat our kage", When they know nothing of shinobi outside their village, Nor know the true strength of that kage.
Yes dan states what he knows, He knows hashirama defeat him in the past, While at the same time he Knows Nothing or hashirama/Madara's real power.
Hashirama was the only person to ever defeat Madara, so it's only logical Dan said "only hashirama can stop him".
He know he's edo, Nothing more, No rinnegan, No mokuton, No Perfect susanoo, No Ms techs. All he knows it hear say.
Due to Dan's lack of Info about Current shinobi and Hashirama/Madara his statement cannot be taken as fact.
I can Say minato is the only Hokage capable of defeating Sharingan Obito, Due FTG being the perfect counter to obito's overpowered tech.
This does not make Minato stronger than the others.
How do you know hes knows nothing about their powers? how??.... Everyone knew he was a legend... I'm pretty sure he was scared cause he knew Madara's power.. Lmao. And it was higher then Sarutobi's. No, see now your trying to make that statement fit you.. Fact is a guy who lived during Sarutobi's time says Hashirama is the one that can stop Madara is more CREDIBLE then a guy wasn't even alive and stated a "rumor" or w.e about Sarutboi ;].
Sorry, but due to Dan's knowledge of Hashirama and Madara and Sarutobi the statement is valid. .This has nothing to do with the present ninjas. So why are bringing them in sir??.
And sure YOU can say that.. but does the manga even hint that?? nope. =].. And if he is the only one of taking down Obito.. then he is the strongest along with obito.
I love hiruzen threads because i can sit back, read the arguments and lol hard irl.
Its basically sarutobi/nagato fans who argue against hashirama/minato fans.
So on one side we have owarij, exaar, siyo, elite kakashi,ryuu. On the other, kinghashirama, hashiramadescendant, thesage. xd
Agreed.Hiruzen fan boys need to relise Kishi changed is mind.Sure Prime Hiruzen must of been strong...but compared to Hashiramas strength...nowhere close.
You havent noticed?, maybe its not as ripe here as it is somewhere else.
Ive noticed that nagato fans side with hiruzen because of hashirama fans getting nagato fans annoyed about hashirama > nagato.
Minato fans side with hashirama because they have basically admitted that hashirama is the strongest hokage so by dehyping hiruzen, minato takes 2nd strongest hokage title.
Thats just what ive noticed though. May be wrong xd
You havent noticed?, maybe its not as ripe here as it is somewhere else.
Ive noticed that nagato fans side with hiruzen because of hashirama fans getting nagato fans annoyed about hashirama > nagato.
Minato fans side with hashirama because they have basically admitted that hashirama is the strongest hokage so by dehyping hiruzen, minato takes 2nd strongest hokage title.
You havent noticed?, maybe its not as ripe here as it is somewhere else.
Ive noticed that nagato fans side with hiruzen because of hashirama fans getting nagato fans annoyed about hashirama > nagato.
Minato fans side with hashirama because they have basically admitted that hashirama is the strongest hokage so by dehyping hiruzen, minato takes 2nd strongest hokage title.
Thats just what ive noticed though. May be wrong xd
But the problem is, Minato has no hype to be even considered stronger ;p. Only reason there is Hashirama > Sarutobi, because Sarutobi's hype got busted.. and moved him to second rank. Otherwise he'd still be first place.
I love hiruzen threads because i can sit back, read the arguments and lol hard irl.
Its basically sarutobi/nagato fans who argue against hashirama/minato fans.
So on one side we have owarij, exaar, siyo, elite kakashi,ryuu. On the other, kinghashirama, hashiramadescendant, thesage. xd
Im not getting involved i told you. I like to sit back and enjoy these threads.
I consider these threads my resting theads. When its itachi/sasuke i put on my armour and ride to war. When it other's i chill out :scorps:
Im not getting involved i told you. I like to sit back and enjoy these threads.
I consider these threads my resting theads. When its itachi/sasuke i put on my armour and ride to war. When it other's i chill out :scorps:
i like how hiruzen fanboys attempt to downplay hashirama by claiming that everybody knew about hashiramas full power and still claimed that hiruzen was stronger despite it being stated that tales of hashiramas strength were a bedtime story, a fairytail and it was already stated by kabuto that people didnt believe in the shodai hokages power which voids hiruzens hype as people disregarded what they heard of hashiramas strength.
Alot of things said sometimes are proven to be either misread or wrong
Like byakugan > base sharingan that was before all the upgrades and shit
Now if someone reads everything and someone says base sharingan user loses to byakugan you could say bs since u can use izanagi and shit with them now .. And with that base sharingan is greater ( manga said byakugan > base sharingan at some point )
Now let look at the hashirama and hiruzen like that
The fact that it took hiruzens life to get rid of hashirama and Tobirama doesn't mean he was stronger he just did what he ha to do had little to no choice but to take them with him
Now hashirama vs hiruzen the best hiruzen could do is use rds
Hashirama has alot of techs that hiruzen wouldn't be able to counter or will had a hard time doing so
Like fighting blind Amgen won't know about the pollen coming and shit meaning its ko
I could also use the arguement at that point in the story hiruzen was stronger than hashirama but hashirama got his hype up to make madara look stronger since people wouldn't have thought madara was such a big threat .. But with hashiramas hype makes him look badass because its the powers of the legends mixed
But if we use manga as evidence using all techs hashirama > hiruzen
Also a question about hiruzen the people who called him a god .. How did they know hashiramas full power ..?
The reason he was called professor and god was his vast knowledge on jutsus and stuff
It's like me calling all senju gods and stuff because they are a clan of thousand jutsus also knowing about the jutsu doesn't mean he could use alot of them since hiruzen doesn't look like he had much chakra and in his prime he probably has abit more chakra than he had at his late years .. Hashirama has the upper hand in most of the things judging by the manga he should have mastered every fighting style since it says senju mastered every fighting style
I am interested in who iruka heard the god of shinobi thing from could have been a shinobi humor thing were they joke around and give him a nickname
Of course he's not that's how all anime's/manga's that sat this long have to do. The guys that are fighting in that point in time have to be the strongest until they die off and let the next villain, or good guy coming up rise above them. There's a huge difference between the fight scenes and the strength of jutsu's from Naruto to Naruto Shippuden. That's how it's been and that's how it's always gonna be.
I still participate however i like to see both sides just troll each other. Ill give my two cents though.
First is that both sides do not understand the manga, yep that is what i said. Both sides do not understand the manga.
Hiruzen was said to be the strongest and this echoed from the manga to the DB. Reason why Hiruzen was the strongest has nothing to do with the raw power that hashirama commands. Hiruzen was trained by both the 2 previous hokage's. Both were senju and this clan was said to be a clan with 1000 skills (or something like that). Hashirama/Tobirama passed on these skills to Hiruzen and that is why even at such an old age he is the only ninja in the series so far to command maximum stats in the 3 ninja arts. Secondly Hashirama left thousands of scrolls for the next generation of hokage's, most likely technique's from his clan (1000 skills by hype). Hiruzen was got his name the professor for leaning/understand all the technique's in these scrolls, something that i doubt even hashirama/tobirama couldve done because they didnt live to the age hiruzen did, but also the sarutobi clan were said to grasp technique's fairly quickly.
With the understanding of these technique's that were left in his possession he was quickly able to note the weaknesses of hashirama's bringer of darkness technique. Apart from blinding the opponent, all the others sense are not effected therefore smell, hear, touch and taste are the weaknesses of this technique and hiruzen took advantage of his understanding of his teacher's technique, which allowed him to overcome the technique and seal his previous teacher's.
You hear the quote "Knowledge is power". That is what hiruzen has over the previous hokage. Ill even give you a manga page, which might allow you to understand what im saying
Just read what jiraiya is thinking about here;
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That is basically why hiruzen is the strongest. It has not so much to do with raw power but years and years of knowledge which would allowed him to defeat either hokage's in a fight.
What dan said is rathe straight forward. I do know whether prime hiruzen can defeat ems madara or not, though i agree dan lived during prime hiruzen's time. What i do know is that hashirama is the best counter for ems madara so much that it makes sense why danosaid what he did. It would be extremely hard for anybody else to defeat madara without having counters for his abilities.
Example hashirama's bringer of darkness trolls sharingan based genjutsu. If it blinds the user so to speak and the user only see's pitch black. They obviously arent getting any eye contact to use genjutsu.
Secondly is the ability to create mokuton clones and we know the clones troll genjutsu
Thirdly, hashirama is a kage bunshin user and its his scroll that naruto scroll in part 1. Clones troll genjutsu
Mokuton allows the user the ability to fight from all ranges. Short/mid/long. By fighting mid/long range hashirama further trolls sharingan genjutsu because its short range.
He must be a very good suiton user and by hype he has a large chakra reserve to counter madara's very high katon jutsu's by himself.
He has the wood dragon, which as we know suppresses bijuu.
He is the husband of an uzumaki. Its very possible that mito thought hashirama uzumaki technique's just like how kushina thought minato. Its possible that its a similar contract technique that hashirama used to undo the genjutsu casted on the fox like what minato did to obito
Its possible that with the wood dragon he can also surpress chakra and not just bijuu chakra and this can cause madara trouble and perhaps limit his use of susano. Yamato has shown the ability to control to an extent kisame's chakra. Its possible that hashirama can do the same therefore further limiting madara.
Finally. Whilst Hiruzen is the strongest hokage due to him most likely being the most skilful/versatile overall because of experience with ninjutsu and other forms of ninja art, but more importantly because of the knowledge he has on the previous hokage's.
Hashirama is stronger than hiruzen if we were to pit them up against high level opponents i can see hashirama winning more fights than hiruzen, though its just hype. However if we were to revert this and put them back in their hokage position, hiruzen is above hashirama. Hashirama would have trouble facing his former student than any other random high level ninja
Haha, so deluded. Dan said this only because Hashirama is proven to have been able to stop Madara before. And Madara has never seen Hiruzen fight beforehand.
