[Discussion] Kotoamatsukami is fake hype

[CenarX]

Kotoamatsukami is the most disappointing genjutsu of them all, especially since it was hyped to be the "ultimate genjutsu".

It is the only genjutsu that can be broken simply by being aware of it. You can be aware that you are in Tsukuyomi or even in a normal sharingan genjutsu, yet you still have to overpower thorugh it in order to break free. However, the first time it was used on screen, as soon as Mifune was aware that he is being controlled, he instantly broke free from it. The second time Kotoamatsukami was used, Itachi used it on himself willingly, so of course it would work.
Not to mention that you have to be creative when using this genjutsu. If you cast it upon your opponent and give him absurd suggestions like trying to make him your slave, the enemy will clearly realise something is off and break from the genjutsu once again, so it is not the overhyped 1 shot jutsu either.

Conclusion: Kotoamatsukami's hype was fake. It can be a good strategical and/or supplementary jutsu, but its combat oriented feats are nonexistent.

 

[HowDidIGetPrem]

The genjutsu itself makes you unaware you're being controlled though. If casted on an enemy mid-battle with the command "kill yourself," the victim wouldn't question why they're killing their self; they'd understand the order as something they their self wants. Same reason why Mifune didn't question his own words. It's arguable that Mifune's genjutsu wasn't actually broken too.

 

[Punk Hazard]

The genjutsu itself makes you unaware you're being controlled though. If casted on an enemy mid-battle with the command "kill yourself," the victim wouldn't question why they're killing their self; they'd understand the order as something they their self wants. Same reason why Mifune didn't question his own words. It's arguable that Mifune's genjutsu wasn't actually broken too.

Not necessarily. Mifune said he would have probably chosen Danzo even without the Kotoamatsukami. As OP pointed out, the other time we saw it work was Itachi who already had a desire to fulfill the order given.

To the Genjutsu’s credit, they do say the caster can create false memories and sensations, so a skilled user may be able to do so to make the order inconspicuous. Itachi and Mifune’s cases indicate that if the caster isn’t wary enough to do so, however, that the target can ignore the order. It’s not automatic, proven by how Mifune simply ignored the order once it was pointed out it was a Genjutsu.

 

[minamoto]

Not necessarily. Mifune said he would have probably chosen Danzo even without the Kotoamatsukami. As OP pointed out, the other time we saw it work was Itachi who already had a desire to fulfill the order given.

To the Genjutsu’s credit, they do say the caster can create false memories and sensations, so a skilled user may be able to do so to make the order inconspicuous. Itachi and Mifune’s cases indicate that if the caster isn’t wary enough to do so, however, that the target can ignore the order. It’s not automatic, proven by how Mifune simply ignored the order once it was pointed out it was a Genjutsu.

Nice fanfic..

 

[CenarX]

Another point I want to make is that Kotoamatsukami also suffers from No Limit Fallacy. A lot of fans argue that once you're caught in it, it's game over unless someone else helps you break free.
I saw threads were people argued that if Danzo was to defeat Sasuke and fight Obito next, he would've insta-won via Koto, yet that would make no sense. Not only that Obito has every sharingan skill maxed out to the extreme, but his genjutsu feats are insane: controlled Kurama when he was 14 yo with just 1 eye using only 3 tomoe, then he controlled a perfect jin still with just a 3 tomoe, that genjutsu being so strong that its effects could've been compared to Koto itself. Also, we all know that having a sharingan gives you the ability to see through visual genjutsu much more effectively.
Everything suggests that Obito would've broke through Kotoamatsukami with minimal difficulty.

 

[Sethitkick]

Sorry for my english, i'm pretty bad at it, but the technique Danzo uses on Mifune is not the same technique that Itachi uses on himself using the crow.
Danzo doesn't have Shisui's good eye for using the Koto. Just like the other Uchiha, Shisui had two techniques specific to his two eyes, the first is powerfull and passive genjutsu working whitout eyes contact and the victim can come out if he understands it, the second (koto) is brutal and inevitable, with, of course, eyes contact. The victim will never realize it, even if someone told him. You can't escape from Kotoamatsukami. That's why it's called the ultimate genjutsu.
Itachi had the Koto, not Danzo.

 

[minamoto]

Sorry for my english, i'm pretty bad at it, but the technique Danzo uses on Mifune is not the same technique that Itachi uses on himself using the crow. It is said in the manga that the Koto takes ten years to regenerate.
So Danzo doesn't have Shisui's good eye for using the Koto. Just like the other Uchiha, Shisui had two techniques specific to his two eyes, the first is powerfull and passive genjutsu working whitout eyes contact and the victim can come out if he understands it, the second (koto) is brutal and inevitable, with, of course, eyes contact. The victim will never realize it, even if someone told him. You can't escape from Kotoamatsukami. That's why it's called the ultimate genjutsu.
Itachi had the Koto, not Danzo.

with senju harishama cells amont of time can be less then 10 years....tanzo had harishama cells...

 

[Sethitkick]

with senju harishama cells amont of time can be less then 10 years....tanzo had harishama cells...

Ok but that was not the point of my reply anyway. It was about the fact that Danzo did'nt used Koto on Mifune

 

[minamoto]

Ok but that was not the point of my reply anyway. It was about the fact that Danzo did'nt used Koto on Mifune

but u r talkin about kamaratsukami so????..

 

[Sethitkick]

but u r talkin about kamaratsukami so????..

Are you trolling or something ?

 

[CenarX]

Sorry for my english, i'm pretty bad at it, but the technique Danzo uses on Mifune is not the same technique that Itachi uses on himself using the crow. It is said in the manga that the Koto takes ten years to regenerate.
So Danzo doesn't have Shisui's good eye for using the Koto. Just like the other Uchiha, Shisui had two techniques specific to his two eyes, the first is powerfull and passive genjutsu working whitout eyes contact and the victim can come out if he understands it, the second (koto) is brutal and inevitable, with, of course, eyes contact. The victim will never realize it, even if someone told him. You can't escape from Kotoamatsukami. That's why it's called the ultimate genjutsu.
Itachi had the Koto, not Danzo.

It was Koto tho. It was stated that unlike the others Uchihas, Shisui had the exact jutsu in both eyes. So, he had 2 Kotoamatsukamis basically.

 

[Sethitkick]

It was Koto tho. It was stated that unlike the others Uchihas, Shisui had the exact jutsu in both eyes. So, he had 2 Kotoamatsukamis basically.

Can you please give me a link of that statement, thanks. And please, don't give it to me if it's from a game

 

[minamoto]

Are you trolling or something ?

wtf...

 

[Infant]

Its hype was about knowledge, so when that gets directly countered, that shouldn't negate it.

Is it not more a case of fans misunderstanding the hype?