[Game] KINGDOM [ 킹덤 ] MAFIA GAME #25

[osieorb18]

@aa-dono @SoulKiller - Michelle has repeatedly expressed a scumread on Rej. I share that strong scumread. Do either of you have reasons to townread him, or do you also scumread him?

 

[Michelle]

@Michelle @SoulKiller Can we finally lynch Rej this phase? Please?

Yessir!
Rej was my lynch target too for today, but i wish first to see where SK are going with his ideas against me. At least until half day I will keep my vote on SK. I know is extremely late at him and i have to wait until he wakes up.

 

[aa-dono]

TSQ seems the most suspicious with his whole town perseverance vote, so for now I'm going to just go with this

I think self-perseverance is NAI. If he's town, it's always a good idea to save yourself and if he's scum he gets to vote the counter wagon.

Was there anything that he said that made you think his self perseverance scummy? Or just that?

 

[aa-dono]

@aa-dono @SoulKiller - Michelle has repeatedly expressed a scumread on Rej. I share that strong scumread. Do either of you have reasons to townread him, or do you also scumread him?

I don't mind a lynch on Rej. I have a scumlean on him but my only tiny tiny big problem is that he seems to share my reads. And that's concerning.
I'm also still not comfortable with Michelle as town to follow her reads.

 

[Michelle]

@Tigerrr in the woods how about you share your ideas too?

 

[Michelle]

I don't mind a lynch on Rej. I have a scumlean on him but my only tiny tiny big problem is that he seems to share my reads. And that's concerning.
I'm also still not comfortable with Michelle as town to follow her reads.

lack of confidence is mutual Aa, sorry about that, nothing from what you are posting are really AI.
but i never ask anyone to follow my reads. I am a teamwork player, i agree with the consensus usually when I have at least few town reads to make a town core and if my logic with everyone matches then the probability to find scum is higher.

 

[aa-dono]

@Michelle You don't have to be sorry for that ^^"

----
Anyway, with regards to Poison and SoulKiller.
I don't agree with most reads presented by Poison about SoulKiller (I do think most of them are overreaching. I like her read on Imperfection better), but SoulKiller reaction to it was over the top imo. I don't see why town would react so strongly. I'm just here wondering if that's a common thing to come from him.
I can somewhat reason to myself that SoulKiller reacts that strongly because he felt wrongly accused as town, but I think that's me overreaching because I don't agree with Poison's reads.
I think if he's town, it's better to just respond to the post and make sure no one followed the read instead of attacking it so vigorously.
(Though I'm worried that I'm projecting how I would play instead).

Conclusion, that reaction is worth looking into. I may not agree with Poison's read, but I think she's onto something.

 

[aa-dono]

Well, I guess I'm gonna take a leap of faith here.

Rej started to sound like he's getting into the game at post #31. Asking meaningless question in #39.And then more fluff. Pushes on Poison in #124 and #127 seems consistent.

Post #140 feels a little scummy. Like, if Poison was looking bad, he shouldn't be saying "else you look bad" but more like push her more for it, or vote her. This feels like TMI if Poison's town.

Something feels off about #202 as well. I can't quite put a finger on it though.

ISOing Rej up to post #324 and I don't find anything close to he pointed out her flaws. The way he said hinted his townreads feels really off. Like, why not just state it?

I have been defending Just_Red kinda, but this lame association lack depth. He's not trying to understand people here.

Post #415 doesn't feel consistent with how he "pushed" Poison. Like, he's backing away when TSQ does the same.

His attention towards neutral roles is unsettling.

I like his tone when defending Elmage though, and that he have TSQ and Michelle in scumlean.

@Rej Could you state again why you scumread TSQ?

Vote Lynch: Rej

 

[aa-dono]

Actually, I think SoulKiller response to votes on him now is pretty townie. I haven't read his interactions with Michelle though.
But I just realized he was leading the wagon, so it makes sense?
I don't like it, but I think it makes sense.

 

[SoulKiller]

I will try to keep it as shorter i can

this is humanly normal way of speaking, thank you very much.

I made a case on you in DP2. I never came out of no where to attack you. - your case in dp2 was when you didn't read the game. It's just not worthy to mention it. Make it again if you don't mind.

What makes you think i did not read the thread? when i made that post i was caught up with the thread.

Both you and PK switched your votes to rej last minute during DP1. No. I started the wagon on Rej after TSQ voted Tiger. Look better. See, i don't say here you are lying, i ask you to look again. This is the difference between a towny approach and scum approach, scum knows infos and have to force his ideas by any means.
I sheeped TSQ on Elmage to check who will join the wagon. The wagon remained low all day and this with Elmage's attitude made me think he is villager. Forcing a wagon to exist is useful to observe who joins it and who avoids it. Everyone who voted Elmage is villager i think, scum was affraid to vote him. At least this is my conclusion after seeing him night killed. He was spewed villager by the thread and became an unlynchable player.
Pretty much the same is to voting you, i wanted to see who joins the wagon and with what reason. Also, forcing you to play was easier like this, i missed your presence 2 days . My action is town motivated by the need to read you and the need to obtain infos from the other players.

Hmm, if that was your plan then i can see it from townie perspective. Certainly consistent behavior as well, hmm Michelle Michelle, okay this explanation makes your situation better. If you are townie indeed then i like the process that went behind it, if it's mafia then you doing very well defending yourself. I will have you back to null read for now.

you agreed with poison case which by itself is very suspicious, since it's full of manipulation. What if you are wrong about her? I know for sure you are wrong about me, so ...

I think your emotions, and your heart is speaking here. Unlike you i am more of a rational type, she is scummy, that will not change. As of you, we will see about that.

This tells me you are either not reading the game, or just scum who do not care who gets lynched. I keep a reserved attitude, because if i go emotional too i can't think logic and this is bad for the game. IF i were scum do you think i would post let me check... 200 posts full of content instead playing like Rej who btw is scum mark my words and you see just Poison and me in all game smh...

The thing with rej is i can't read him. But if he is scum then he is in a very comfortable position right now, and quite frankly dangerous.

I want to inform you i don't see your scum list being full of wolves, so this is one of the reasons i see you're scum.

By scum list you mean poison? we just have to agree to disagree there.

i don't see any vote on her except yours. How is it worse?

Shortly:

1. you voted just villagers, parked the vote on them and left the DP. Dragomir in day 1, and Red in day 2.
2. your lack of real reads except the town read on Hammock who you defend way too much. You talk about town core but you don't really work with your town core.
3. lack of sense of towniness in your posts, you attack more players than game ideas.
4. the way you handle your wagon, you have 'favorites' in it and this is fishy.
5. the way you read me, i don't trust town SK being so ferm in scum reading me.

I think i answered to all of these in one shape or another. So, not gonna bother again.

 

[Tigerrr in the woods]

Pfff, finally got to the end xD, &hei @Michelle
... though I kinda skimmed through the battle between SK& poison and SK& Michelle. I will go in depth though later maybe


Forgive my fixation. In actual maybe don't forgive it but pay attention to it! I think Elmage was killed because he got a good nose and did a good read.

I just meant that it seemed like you were faking that you wanted to save yourself for towns sake. You saw that you were about to be lynched and jumped on voting Just_Red at the last minute. You had some arguments against them, but I didnt see you vote them.until you were in danger of getting lynched yourself so thats what I find odd

Exactly my thoughts and in this situation he can just use the "they are framing me"card like Poison said, so I can't tell anymore but then I saw this post:

I'd expect some reasonable skepticism towards my slot right now but the fact she's flat out not even asking me anything and locked me town is just...weird.

The thing is I don't know how to interpret it because she could be a cop with a clear on me or a scum that's TMIng me.

REALLY?
You starting now to make people think Michelle is a cop x3?
She's been towning you since DP1- and if she did so she would naturally go read her suspects xD

Also maybe she's clear on a scum that's TMing you?[I don't know what TMing means by the way so I hope it does what I think it does ^^?]
REALLY?
oh well lets just go back and see who voted for you:
Me, Elmage, RED Hamock(?)
LEt's see who's left shall we: Elmage is dead, Red is dead so me and Hammock is left
So that would make either me or Hammock a possible scum
If everyone might think I am so bold as scum to bark and tunel you whole DP2 and even now THEN please, people go ahead and Lynch me cause it's frustrating really.
@osieorb18 and this is where I reply to you. While I want town to win, I do agree with the idea of sacrificing yourself as townie when it's a desperate situation. For example it's my second mafia game and I am not experienced in strong argumentation so it feels that being able to sacrifice yourself as townie when you seem the scummiest, can help the other clear their minds and put the energy into actual mafia

The TSQ post that I didn't like was because of that Michelle might be cop thing. If he thinks so, even by the smallest possiblity, I think he shouldn't have said it as town. You'd want your PR to be quiet, but he brought up the possibility and it just seems like he's trying so hard to appear town.

What's wrong with the other post?

^ exactly what I think also.

While I do agree with Red's other reads, I still think TSQ is scummy -.- and srry TSQ i Didn't read yet your other game play yet.

If I think about PK, he was pretty much absent the last day phase.

I think the vest is >>rand neutral actually? I don't think town gets a vest and instead, due to the number of villa flipped roles until now, I'd expect them to have some investigative and doctor / vigi maybe.

Which begs the question, if he's the neutral, then is Tiger town / scum?

He does seem more interested in the thread when he is being pushed, he immediately sided me and probably because I was town reading him.

I don't really think he's scum beyond that though? His D1 performance was fairly different from his scum game.

SK, I don't really have an opinion either way. With my focus on other slots and him being a good scum in general, he can make it easy to contribute. A lot of his reads mind melded with me which is why I barely paid any attention to him, and he just wasn't here, but when he was, he was being townie to me.

I think the one comment that irked me was about a push on me that never really turned into a push, just shading, and when I pressed him on it, I don't remember seeing a response.

I don't think the lack of activity is AI in any way because he's just NOT that player. I am testing out the waters based on a theory with my vote that I expect people to also get down to.

You can town read me or SCUM read me as much as you want...
Also WHEN did I side you? My vote was on you the whole DP yesterday and today you were and are still in my suspect list.

Using other games to back up your little argument is scummy as hell, you know people who use such tactics? scum. Ya know there is a term for what you are doing? and people get lynched for it. You focus on the current game and make reads based on what's going on and make reads based on it, but you see ya can't, you just look at past games which are not many by the way and come up with a conclusion based on previous games. Also, i lived alot of times past DP3 as townie, sorry not sorry but this argument of yours if you gonna stick to it, ya only digging your grave even further. Better start thinking of new ways for your mislynch scum.


I don't know how you are defending, not a single point you managed to defend successfully, you just making your situation worse.

I also don't agree with using other games to back up arguments

SK - I was leaning hard on SK being scum after REd turned town, but now I don't know. He had a good argument with Poison chan and with Michelle
-.- I cannot tell anymore

OSie- I would also take Red's word and push for Osie beeing a scum but then the play stile is nice and tries to contribute?

Rej- I am confused about him... If TSQ would be scum then why would he make a wagon against Rej,
If TSQ is not scum then Rej could be scum ofc

 

[SoulKiller]

@Michelle @SoulKiller Can we finally lynch Rej this phase? Please?

Hmm

@aa-dono @SoulKiller - Michelle has repeatedly expressed a scumread on Rej. I share that strong scumread. Do either of you have reasons to townread him, or do you also scumread him?

I will have one answer for both of these posts. Looking at rej i don't see any townie behavior, he is suspicious but the thing is that as i expressed earlier in the game. When it comes to rej, don't ask me what i think cause i can't read the guy. Let's say, I had an experience with him, a traumatic one. However, i am down to cooperate and lynch rej this dp if the majority of the players have rej on their red list. I was hoping a vig will maybe shoot him but it does not seem that vig exists. If he is indeed scum, then i will have to deal with him sooner or later, i don't mind lynching the dude instead of poison.

 

[osieorb18]

@Tigerrr in the woods:

Town's win condition is to eliminate mafia while town survives. Town does not know the alignments of other players. Therefore, Town increasing the likelihood of their own lynch over that of another player is playing against their win condition because they know that their alignment is town whereas the other player is not 100% town to them.

 

[Alice in Noodleland]

ANNOUNCEMENT
@Houtarou will subbed in for Poison Chan for the rest of the game

Don't talk about substitutions.

 

[osieorb18]

@Houtarou: Hi, there! Welcome to the game. We're talking about lynching Rej right now. I'd encourage you to reread there.

 

[Houtarou]

Reading all this will take me forever.... hope you guys cut me some slack here

You must be registered for see images

 

[Houtarou]

@Houtarou: Hi, there! Welcome to the game. We're talking about lynching Rej right now. I'd encourage you to reread there.

Why this guy getting lynch in every game I come across these days? Lol

Will see his post, if I find something suspicious I'll give my opinion on them

 

[SoulKiller]

@Houtarou my condolences to you. You received Poison chan role. Good luck climbing yourself out of the hole she dug for herself, i heard it was so deep, that if you drop something there, it will never land.

 

[aa-dono]

I just meant that it seemed like you were faking that you wanted to save yourself for towns sake. You saw that you were about to be lynched and jumped on voting Just_Red at the last minute. You had some arguments against them, but I didnt see you vote them.until you were in danger of getting lynched yourself so thats what I find odd

I like this observation.

 

[Houtarou]

@Houtarou my condolences to you. You received Poison chan role. Good luck climbing yourself out of the hole she dug for herself, i heard it was so deep, that if you drop something there, it will never land.

I do not need your sympathies already have em lot.... just to make it clear for you, I'm 100% town if you're good with this then let's start anew