[VS] Kakashi (no MS) vs Minato (no FTG)

[Narutimate Storm]

Condition: Kakashi with 3 tomoe vs Base Minato without hiraishin.

Restriction: summoning jutsu, mangekyou, hiraishin, senjutsu

Distance: kakashi vs itachi part 2

Scenario 2:
3 tomoe itachi vs tobirama (no ftg)

 

[Chaosmark101]

Food Cart Destroyer GG

 

[Omar19992010]

Minato blitzes

 

[V h o]

Minato wins

S2: tobirama especially if edo bombs is allowed

 

[Eng nawashi]

So basically minato with rasengan and shadow clones vs 3t war arc kakashi ? Kakashi wins ,he can do anything minato can do ,his reactions and arm movements were on par with kcm minato putting it right above base minato ,his arsenal is much stronger than this restricted minato ,his CQC and taijutsu is also above minato with feats ,minato may be only faster when it comes shunshin but he is nowhere fast enough to blitze someone like war arc 3t kakashi.

Tobirama beats itachi on the other hand ,his suiton counters itachi katon ,with tobirama experience in fighting uchiha ,genjutsu isnt factor either.

 

[Raykyryn]

As much of a Minato fan i am, i am well aware only databook hype can give the victory to Minato.

 

[BenjerminGaye]

Kakashi beats him if we disregard hype.

 

[Char Aznable]

Kakashi never reached his master's level in anything. Not ninjutsu, taijutsu, or fuinjutsu.

Tobirama eats Uchiha for breakfast. Without his MS, Itachi is nothing special.

 

[Selan]

So basically minato with rasengan and shadow clones vs 3t war arc kakashi ? Kakashi wins ,he can do anything minato can do ,his reactions and arm movements were on par with kcm minato putting it right above base minato ,his arsenal is much stronger than this restricted minato ,his CQC and taijutsu is also above minato with feats ,minato may be only faster when it comes shunshin but he is nowhere fast enough to blitze someone like war arc 3t kakashi.

Tobirama beats itachi on the other hand ,his suiton counters itachi katon ,with tobirama experience in fighting uchiha ,genjutsu isnt factor either.

This, basically. Kakashi has the same level of physical speed that Minato has plus Sharingan precognition and Raikiri that is at the very least on par with Minato's Odama like Rasengan. Kakashi's taijutsu is far better and Minato has no answer if the gets caught in a Sharingan genjutsu, Kakashi's genjutsu has proven to be on par with Obito's. Kakashi can fool him with a Raiton Kage Bunshin and his ninjutsu arsenal is far better, more versatile and just better overall. Minato's summons aren't doing much, Preta Path of all people was dancing around Gamabunta, Kakashi was fighting multiple Bijuu, come on, he dodges the toads and cuts their limbs off with Raiden. It's a good fight because both are fast and smart, but Kakashi is definitely more complete than Minato. Hiraishin is Minato's bread and butter, Mangekyo is Kakashi's trump card. That's the difference.

Tobirama wins against Itachi mid diff. Faster, better reflexes, Suiton that overpowers Katon, sensing, and so on.

 

[Great Master Minato]

Form this distance Minato blitzes.
:lol@ Kakashi being physically faster & better in Taijutsu than Minato.
Also if Minato's Rasengan clashes with Raikiri Kakashi's arm will blow up.
Wait, did someone say Kakashi has equal reflexes & striking speed to KCM Minato? ****ing PLEASE :lol

 

[NarutoX28]

3T Kakashi takes this. He's already displayed superior reflexes as he managed to match the level of V2 Jin's which had Shared Vision from 5 other users with the Rinnegan on top of Precognition while Minato displayed inferior reflexes compared to Young Obito due to Obito's superior strike speed.

Minato's not touching 3T Kakashi. He gets paralyzed by Raiton Bushin Feint and then gets his head chopped off.

 

[Bogard]

Minato should win. Kakashi has great bunshin feats, but infront of a sensor, it won't work especially someone as cunning as Minato. Kakashi lacks jutsus with large area of effect and he is still faster than Kakashi, so he'd eventually take him down with a rasengan combo

This, basically. Kakashi has the same level of physical speed that Minato has plus Sharingan precognition and Raikiri that is at the very least on par with Minato's Odama like Rasengan. Kakashi's taijutsu is far better and Minato has no answer if the gets caught in a Sharingan genjutsu, Kakashi's genjutsu has proven to be on par with Obito's. Kakashi can fool him with a Raiton Kage Bunshin and his ninjutsu arsenal is far better, more versatile and just better overall. Minato's summons aren't doing much, Preta Path of all people was dancing around Gamabunta, Kakashi was fighting multiple Bijuu, come on, he dodges the toads and cuts their limbs off with Raiden. It's a good fight because both are fast and smart, but Kakashi is definitely more complete than Minato. Hiraishin is Minato's bread and butter, Mangekyo is Kakashi's trump card. That's the difference.

Tobirama wins against Itachi mid diff. Faster, better reflexes, Suiton that overpowers Katon, sensing, and so on.

Sometimes i really wonder why after all these years, you keep quoting yourself :/

 

[EZQ]

Scenario 1 is taken by kakashi, if we look after Minato's no FTG feats, he can't win against 3 tomoe war arc kakashi who kept up with 4 v2 jins at the same time, and also beat kamui'less Obito. Minato's taijutsu and ninjutsu are just hype, because we haven't seen him fight without his FTG. All his taijutsu feats are linked to having used FTG to make a speedblitz.

Scenario 2 is taken by Tobirama. Itachi can't do nothing against Tobirama's strongest atack (edo tensei explosion) without susano. Tobirama takes this high diff

 

[EZQ]

Minato should win. Kakashi has great bunshin feats, but infront of a sensor, it won't work especially someone as cunning as Minato. Kakashi lacks jutsus with large area of effect and he is still faster than Kakashi, so he'd eventually take him down with a rasengan combo
Sometimes i really wonder why after all these years, you keep quoting yourself :/

Base minato's speed is > kakashi's by a short gap, minato isn't wining with a rasengan combo here, since kakashi's reaction speed an sunshin are good enough to keep up with minato (just to keep up with him), that closes any possibility for minato to make a speedblitz. Also Kakashi's kage bunshin and raiton bunshin feats >>> Minato's kage bunshin feats,Kakashi even outsmarted itachi with one kage bunshin, and kakashi has jutsus like Lightnining running beast and lightining chain, both of them are really dangerous if minato doesn't have FTG to dodge. Hell kakashi even has rasengan himself. Minato would be the one with problems here, since kakashi can use clone feints and his pretty much wide arsenal to distract him and land a final blow.

 

[Great Master Minato]

Kakashi is gonna beat Minato with what?
Bunshin feint ain't gonna happen & Kakashi won't land a Genjutsu on Minato either.
Kakashi's best offence is Raikiri & Minato's Rasengan counters that hard.
Kakashi's reflexes & striking speed aren't on Minato's level & this makes Taijutsu suicide for Kakashi.
Aside from all this Minato can potentially blitz him...3T is not gonna track V2 Ay's level Shunshin when MS failed to do.

 

[EZQ]

Kakashi is gonna beat Minato with what?
Bunshin feint ain't gonna happen & Kakashi won't land a Genjutsu on Minato either.
Kakashi's best offence is Raikiri & Minato's Rasengan counters that hard.
Kakashi's reflexes & striking speed aren't on Minato's level & this makes Taijutsu suicide for Kakashi.
Aside from all this Minato can potentially blitz him...3T is not gonna track V2 Ay's level Shunshin when MS failed to do.

Okey here's when we all realize you are a hardcore fanboy.

1- Bunshin feints aren't workind? Based on what? Kakashi's bunshin feints are one of the best of the manga, having outsmarted Pein and Itachi between others. The gap between minato's base speed and kakashi's bases speed became a lot smaller during the war arc. You saying Kakashi's feints aren't working is totally biased, bunshins are the key for kakashi winning this match. I'll give you the genjutsu thing tough.

2- Kakashi's raikiri has two variants that can't be countered with rasengan, lightining chain (that covers a pretty big area) and lightining running beast. Kakashi using those atacks combined with clones as distractions can give him the victory, since using those techniques he could blitz 4 v2 jins, so why not minato? Without FTG his speed is not that far from Kakashi's, and he doesn't have great defence techniques to block kakashi's atacks.

3- Minato's striking speed is really fast due to FTG, show me a panel of his striking speed without FTG. Minato's base striking speed is fast but not one another level, Kakashi can keep up with him. And Kakashi's taijutsu feats > Minato's. Also, Kakashi has great reflexes feats too, he reacted to susano arrows that are really fast. Lol at "taijutsu suicide" for kakashi, since Minato without FTG has no taijutsu prowess at all, and Kakashi has one of the best taijutsu techniques of the manga.

4- Oh lol, now minato has v2 Ay's striking level speed with just sunshin? Minato needed FTG to keep up with Ay's speed, don't make me laugh. Minato's sunshin is not even close to v2 Ay's sunshin. Minato is not speed blitzing kakashi without FTG

 

[Great Master Minato]

Okey here's when we all realize you are a hardcore fanboy.

1- Bunshin feints aren't workind? Based on what? Kakashi's bunshin feints are one of the best of the manga, having outsmarted Pein and Itachi between others. The gap between minato's base speed and kakashi's bases speed became a lot smaller during the war arc. You saying Kakashi's feints aren't working is totally biased, bunshins are the key for kakashi winning this match. I'll give you the genjutsu thing tough.

2- Kakashi's raikiri has two variants that can't be countered with rasengan, lightining chain (that covers a pretty big area) and lightining running beast. Kakashi using those atacks combined with clones as distractions can give him the victory, since using those techniques he could blitz 4 v2 jins, so why not minato? Without FTG his speed is not that far from Kakashi's, and he doesn't have great defence techniques to block kakashi's atacks.

3- Minato's striking speed is really fast due to FTG, show me a panel of his striking speed without FTG. Minato's base striking speed is fast but not one another level, Kakashi can keep up with him. And Kakashi's taijutsu feats > Minato's. Also, Kakashi has great reflexes feats too, he reacted to susano arrows that are really fast. Lol at "taijutsu suicide" for kakashi, since Minato without FTG has no taijutsu prowess at all, and Kakashi has one of the best taijutsu techniques of the manga.

4- Oh lol, now minato has v2 Ay's striking level speed with just sunshin? Minato needed FTG to keep up with Ay's speed, don't make me laugh. Minato's sunshin is not even close to v2 Ay's sunshin. Minato is not speed blitzing kakashi without FTG

Call me a fanboy when you could counter my posts, during our previous discussion you didn't/couldn't counter my last post.

1- Kakashi outsmarting Minato is nothing but a joke & good luck with surprising one of the best sensors in the entire series.
By the time Kakashi uses his Bunshin Minato can sense that there are multiple Kakashis in the battlefield & he'll continue fighting with caution or he can use Kage Bunshin to fool Kakashi who is not a sensor. (Simply if Kakashi uses Bunshin & hide Minato can sense him & his Bunshin while Kakashi will easily get fooled by Kage Bunshins)

2- V2 Jin is nowhere near Minato in speed so blitzing them means shit, by feats & portrayal Minato is on a whole different level in speed compared to the likes of Kakashi.

3- Flicking a Kunai to V2 Ay's blind spot when his punch was in front of Minato's face should tell you something...Minato's striking speed is underrated.
Susanoo arrows are fast for Kakashi, SM Kabuto who couldn't avoid getting tag by Itachi was able to casually dodge Susanoo Arrows.
When it comes to reflexes Kakashi has no hope of reacting to V2 Ay while Minato did it in canon.
Kakashi having great reflexes & striking speed means shit while he's still inferior to Minato, in CQC he can't tag Minato before Minato tag him so yeah Taijutsu isn't a good choice for Kakashi.

4- Stationary Minato's striking speed was above Ay even though he was using his fastest Shunshin :lol Also Minato has better reflexes.
DB4 said Minato & Ay are equal in speed...unless you think V2 Ay = FTG then their Shunshins are equal.
Minato's base speed without FTG is heavily underrated that's why you think 3T Kakashi can keep up with him but the truth is Minato can potentially blitz MS Kakashi.

 

[NarutoX28]

Call me a fanboy when you could counter my posts, during our previous discussion you didn't/couldn't counter my last post.

All right fanboy.

1- Kakashi outsmarting Minato is nothing but a joke & good luck with surprising one of the best sensors in the entire series.
By the time Kakashi uses his Bunshin Minato can sense that there are multiple Kakashis in the battlefield & he'll continue fighting with caution or he can use Kage Bunshin to fool Kakashi who is not a sensor. (Simply if Kakashi uses Bunshin & hide Minato can sense him & his Bunshin while Kakashi will easily get fooled by Kage Bunshins)

This just proves your ignorance. Kakashi bushin feinted Nagato despite Deva Path having Shared Vision. We also should take into account Nagato being one of the most skilled sensors in the manga as he detected the pressure build up within Itachi's eye before Naruto could even detect it along with the fact that he was the only user in the manga to sense Kabuto's location which Muu was incapable of doing so. Ignoring that is sheer ignorance, so Minato being a sensor ninja is an invalid argument.

2- V2 Jin is nowhere near Minato in speed so blitzing them means shit, by feats & portrayal Minato is on a whole different level in speed compared to the likes of Kakashi.

When we take into consideration that Base Jin can pressure KCM Naruto and receive massive improvements in speed as shown against Kisame, it actually does. Minato doesn't have physical speed comparable to users with Bijuu enhancements. Furthermore, Kakashi tango'd against V2 Jin with Precognition and assistance from 6 Rinnegan users which meant their reflexes were significantly enhanced thanks to Shared Vision. That's a superior feat that Minato has never replicated. Kakashi's performance in this match was placed to be on par of 6th Gate Gai's with just his 3 Tomoe. There's no way Minato's even touching him.

3- Flicking a Kunai to V2 Ay's blind spot when his punch was in front of Minato's face should tell you something.
Kakashi having great reflexes & striking speed means shit while he's still inferior to Minato, in CQC he can't tag Minato before Minato tag him so yeah Taijutsu isn't a good choice for Kakashi.

Except Ei had no knowledge of how FTG worked. Afterwards, Ei admitted he could anticipate where he warps and just crush him with sheer speed, hence why he relied on warping behind an inexperienced Bee which failed as he reacted to him. That's a poor display of Minato's reflexes. Don't even get me started with Minato having inferior strike speed compared to Young Obito. Weakened Kakashi actually managed to overpower War Arc Obito in a Taijutsu match which puts a dump on Minato's performance.

4- Stationary Minato's striking speed was above Ay even though he was using his fastest Shunshin :lol Also Minato has better reflexes.
DB4 said Minato & Ay are equal in speed...unless you think V2 Ay = FTG then their Shunshins are equal.

Better reflexes?

You have yet to prove that. Everything points towards Minato having inferior reflexes. He solely relied on a mental reaction to evade the attack and Ei even implied he could crush him with his full speed after he detects where Minato would warp to. This isn't even taking into account C's statement where Base Raikage's synapses were stated to be on a similar level to Minato's.

Hell, are you going to tell me that Rikudou Obito is just as reflexive as Juubidara as he could evade his attacks with a simple S/T ninjutsu? Please don't go there.

 

[RedRobin]

I am sorry but what taijustu feats does Minato have without FTG that allows him to keep up with Kakashi?

 

[NarutoX28]

Wow, I'm honestly surprised that more people are giving Kakashi credit than I initially expected.