Kakashi’s Pain
- Thread starter JENchuuriki
- Start date
I don't agree that he felt the greatest pain, but that he had many painful experiences throughout his life. If that makes sense.
Quantity over quality for Kakashi.
You also double-dipped in some ways for the characters mentioned after him (reworded the same instances to make it seem like they had more plights?) and then left out some for others.
But this is all subjective since some people think being lonely (Naruto/Sasuke) is worse than being a failure (Jiraiya/Kakashi) or having an intense superiority complex (Danzo) or being forced into something out of circumstance (Itachi) or losing a nation around you to war(Ame orphans)- it's all just about what you value.
Kakashi was never put into a situation where he would have to "turn bad" (if you just mean do something questionable or go against the village).
If you want some things that could be wrong:
>Tied Sasuke to a tree when he was threatening to leave the village and then just said "I lose people too" and left basically. Obviously, this didn't stop the kid. lol
>Neglected Naruto/Sakura for a while despite Sakura being a genjutsu type... could have taught her something.
Pretty minor, but as stated before he never had to do something questionable since he was never in a situation to do so or if he was (ex: kill Sasuke at the bridge), then someone like Naruto would come in for the save and he wouldn't have to.
ot: Despite Kabuto and Itachi having less instances of bad things happening to them, I think what did happen to them was the worst (having to see a loved one die is one thing but killing them? On another level). I don't think anyone else is comparable, but this is just personal opinion. And I don't think any person would want to choose killing a loved one themselves over seeing them die another way (though, obviously neither is wanted).
Quantity over quality for Kakashi.
You also double-dipped in some ways for the characters mentioned after him (reworded the same instances to make it seem like they had more plights?) and then left out some for others.
But this is all subjective since some people think being lonely (Naruto/Sasuke) is worse than being a failure (Jiraiya/Kakashi) or having an intense superiority complex (Danzo) or being forced into something out of circumstance (Itachi) or losing a nation around you to war(Ame orphans)- it's all just about what you value.
Danzo, Haku, Itachi, Toneri, and Zabuza didn't do that out of pain, they had other reasons. In fact, they never did anything out of "pain" but either out of loyalty to a person or emblem or jealousy (Danzo/Toneri) which isn't pain exactly.
Kakashi was never put into a situation where he would have to "turn bad" (if you just mean do something questionable or go against the village).
If you want some things that could be wrong:
>Tied Sasuke to a tree when he was threatening to leave the village and then just said "I lose people too" and left basically. Obviously, this didn't stop the kid. lol
>Neglected Naruto/Sakura for a while despite Sakura being a genjutsu type... could have taught her something.
Pretty minor, but as stated before he never had to do something questionable since he was never in a situation to do so or if he was (ex: kill Sasuke at the bridge), then someone like Naruto would come in for the save and he wouldn't have to.
ot: Despite Kabuto and Itachi having less instances of bad things happening to them, I think what did happen to them was the worst (having to see a loved one die is one thing but killing them? On another level). I don't think anyone else is comparable, but this is just personal opinion. And I don't think any person would want to choose killing a loved one themselves over seeing them die another way (though, obviously neither is wanted).
Last edited:
Claymantan
Active member
I'll concede that Itachi is a stretch. xD
But for Toneri and Haku, I interpreted at least part of their decisions being caused by being alone (I mean, Toneri's entire clain is dead as far as he knows), which is generally portrayed as painful for people in the manga. I mean, Naruto openly sympathizes with Haku, saying that Haku is like himself.
At least part of Zabuza's actions were because he regretted having treated Haku as though Haku was a tool. Regret is arguably a form of pain as well. He's evidently
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, since
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, Zabuza
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. And this implies that he never really believed in the idea of shinobi just being tools to begin with. He espoused that idea, that
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, and
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." And Zabuza states that you can only become a "true shinobi"
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. But I think this is just how he justified his experiences in his childhood, because of how Kirigakure's graduation system worked. It must have been painful. Reinforcing this idea is that even though Haku states that he has been unable to become a true shinobi because of his "kind heart," Zabuza himself is stated to have some similarity with Haku. Haku tells Zabuza when he first meets him that they have
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." The only thing Zabuza and Haku really have in common at that point is their experience of being alone due to having survived bloodbaths. So I think these are both characters who are motivated by being alone which, again, is a form of pain. I think Zabuza must have suffered some pain in internalizing an idea that forced him to distance himself from someone he actually cared about. And this is what I think motivated his last actions before his death.I don't think it's fair to say that Danzo's actions were only motivated by jealousy/loyalty. His pain was internal, because
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. An inferiority complex isn't jus about jealousy, and having low self-esteem (man, Danzo is a basket case xD) is probably pretty painful. Danzo was also dealing with the issue that he
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. I don't doubt that jealousy and loyalty motivated his actions, but I think also this ashamedness of being unable to sacrifice himself for his village also motivated him overcompensating by being draconian and brutal in responding to perceived threats to the clan. "I really am loyal to the village, even if I seemed weak that one time! Look how directly I deal with anything that could possibly harm this village! Even if Hiruzen was more willing to sacrifice himself than I was, it's only me that's willing to go this far to protect the village!"He was in ANBU for a while, and generally it's shown that everyone in ANBU becomes morally questionable as hell (Sai would have, but Naruto managed to influence him enough to prevent that from happening). He
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(I can't think of who he would specifically be referring to though...) In the anime, it's shown that KurenGai convinced Hiruzen ([insert potshot at Hiruzen's incompetence here]) to let Kakashi teach instead, in order to keep Kakashi from losing his humanity. I don't remember if this is ever shown in the manga, but I'm pretty sure it never is (pretty sure everything related to Team Ro is anime-only). So in the context of the manga, Kakashi managed to maintain his ideals even while working for an organization that traditionally challenged and suppressed such ideals. Maybe he was hoping it'd work the same way it did when he tied Naruto to a tree, and Naruto and Sakura would show up and teach him the true meaning of friendship. xD
But seriously, he didn't tie Kakashi to a tree to keep him from fleeing the village. It was just
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without Sasuke ignoring what he was saying. He
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as soon as he was done talking to Sasuke. And he did actually get through to Sasuke; Sasuke quiets down and starts thinking about what his friends mean to him. It's just that
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. If the Sound Four hadn't shown up, it would have probably been fine (the tree is like, right there near the village, but apparently Konoha just has no guards). xD But yeah, it's still pretty dumb.Well I mean, yeah. This isn't because of pain though. This is because of dumb. xD Or Kakashi is afraid of cooties or something.
Doesn't Gaara fall into this category, then?
Sasuke tyeezy
Active member
It clearly says that's my opinion, honestly dumbass members like you shouldn't even be here.