Uzumaki Macho
Active member
Luffy is a level higher than Ace. I don't see what feats Ace has that puts him on the same level as Luffy.
[Discussion] Kaido and his 3 Calamities
- Thread starter KenZoku Roshibo
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You're simply forcing things here. They were previously attacked by Scroch and he caused loads of destruction. [
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} So, It wasn't necessarily Drake who destroyed the stuff in the village. Even if it was him.I don't expect anything less form a battle b/w pirates. Drake ain't no Riku to be kind towards people who attacked his men and cause no destruction. At the same time, he's no Jack to destroy countries over no reason at all. Even Luffy causes destruction with every single battle he fights in but it certainly doesn't make him a savage. Oda didn't portray Drake as a cruel pirate for sure. Drake doesn't like getting involved in pointless battles and can even be seen preventing people from doing so before TS. He is calculative,calm and level headed even more so than Law if you ask me. It would be totally uncharacteristic for someone who calls himself a calamity in Kaido's crew considering how Oda has portrayed Jack "one of calamities". I am sure you already know this.You unintentionally added more evidence to the contrary of your point, it seems. For one, If you observe it carefully, you can see the old lady behind Drake being unharmed. I doubt one of Kaido's men much less a calamity would be kind enough to spare ones life just because the said individual is old.Secondly, Although he was wounded, Caribou was seemingly fine for someone who just fought one of top 3 men of a Yonko. I am sure if Drake is anywhere near as violent as Jack,he'd have at least severed his limbs or something since he went as far as attacking Kaido's underlings and apparently destroyed one of their factories. Furthermore, The factory doesn't seem to be that important given the fact that it wasn't being guarded by strong individuals"Scroch ain't no big deal". I doubt a calamity would be sent to deal with something as trivial as this. He didn't even seem to care that much about Doflamingo's defeat even though he's one of most important allies of their crew which isn't the kind of reaction you'd expect from one of Kaido's most trusted men. The way he do things is totally unlike what you'd expect of a calamity.
The reference with Whitebeard's crew doesn't make much sense either. They do things differently and follow completely different hierarchy. Whitebeard had like 16 commanders under his wing, When Kaido, on the other hand, has only 3. The calamities may likely be as strong as Marco more or less. I can see at least one of them being stronger than Marco tbh. I can totally see Luffy being one step head of Drake in terms of strength. He clearly set himself apart from Law, Someone who Oda portrayed to be one of Luffy's main rivals from worst generation. So, I don't see Drake receiving special treatment. The odds are totally against this theory except for the whole Zoan devils fruit reference which is the only legit thing you have to back this theory up. If it isn't for that, I'd be totally against this idea. For now, I'd say, it's not likely to happen.
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Lol it's not a theory. Its just things that are supposed to support that Drake is "possibly" a Calamity. I agree with some of your points, I'm not saying its set in stone or anything here. Just that the cover page and all that destruction shows Drake will cause chaos if he is asked to. The WB crew is the only yonkou crew so its used as a reference, power wise its not far fetched is all, the Luffy/Law point makes zero sense to me anyways. They are still on the same tier, thats the point they dont have to be exact equals.
I find it extremely and I mean extremely unlikely that 3 calamities are Marco level...that completely skews the power level of the crews in their favour. WB Pirates would get destroyed if that were true.
Dude seriously, stop it. You locked the idea that both Marco and Drake have to be a Calamity in your mind and then start interpreting everything in a twisted way just to convince yourself that it's like that. What you are doing is not giving arguments to back up your claims, you are finding excuses because you can't accept the truth that Drake in reality hasn't going that much for him and Marco doesn't even remotely make sense.
Fundamental basics of making a theory: you follow the path the sources lead you to and what you should never do is first dropping the statements and then start searching for arguments as then your objectivity is highly questionable. You are a prime example of that. You want that Marco and Drake are calamities, so you are seeing everywhere proof while discarding common sense and reason.
Absolute fact: rear admiral means nothing. You are also assuming again baselessly things. "Strawberry became a VC because of Fisher Tiger". Maybe, maybe not, but unproven on all fronts and is also completely irrelevant. I invalidated this statement completely in my previous post. Read it again. And you are saying Drake is that powerful. If he was as strong as you claim him to be, he would have done hell of a better job against the Pacifista and would at least put up more of a fight against Kizaru than a sack of potatoes. You can't even follow your own statements all the way through. You just take a turn halfway there and use another excuse an attempt to cover that up. You are going on about how powerful Drake is and how important his position was, so don't you think he already would know Kizaru's strength? In the NW you fight with or against the Yonkou, that's almost a law of nature there. The fact that he joined Kaidou indicates he didn't believe he was strong enough to take him on. So you are again contradicting yourself. If he was as strong as you say, he would have fought him.
Absolute fact: you don't get a 500m increase for joining another crew. I have already invalidated this likewise in my previous post, read it again. Luffy sacked the three major institutions of the WG and the marines. He beat three Shichibukai. He has the most outrageous bloodline in the world and he has a bounty of 500m. Capone also joined the crew of a Yonkou, his bounty is 300m. But no somehow Drake becomes worth 700m because he became a Yonkou's subordinate. And saying "if he became a calamity" is the most worthless of all the things you just said. You are assuming your statement is true to use it as proof for an argument you are using to prove your statement =/ that's not how it works. You are trying to prove something by using itself as proof. The hell?
And yes this is completely baseless and Oda hasn't showed the new bounties yet of the all Supernova. He has been releasing them sporadically nor did he show the bounties immediately when one of the Supernova's made an appearance. Despite showing Urogue and Bonney, he didn't state their new bounties and despite having showed Capone earlier, he waited till Zou. So following your logic here they're all also Calamities? That there are supposed to be only three I doubt is a problem for you in analogy with all the other stuff you seem to be ignoring. This is once again a prime example of you finding an excuse on top of an excuse to avoid admitting you are completely wrong.
Absolute fact: Mihawk is a completely different character than Kaidou. He showed already interest in Zoro all the way back in East Bleu and they are both swordsmen and have their own code. Kaidou is a vastly different character and personality. You completely disregard everything we know about these characters just so that it's convenient for you. Mihawk is not Kaidou. Zoro is not Drake. The relationship between Zoro and Mihawk is completely different than that of Kaidou and Drake or in the least there's nothing that point towards that it's the same. This is once again a prime example of you making up stories because yeah all Yonkou have dojo's for the less fortunate orphans to turn them into calamities ~_~
And yeah it's not hard making stories up that make no sense.
Absolute fact: Marco not holding hands with every single pirate WB was allied with, is not even remotely proof that he left. Again I already invalidated this argument completely in my previous post. Read it again. If you want to fool yourself in believing your own stories, be my guest. But if you want to argue about it, at least you could show the curtesy of reading the posts of other people that disprove your stories. There are hundreds of possibilities where Marco could be, but of course you go for the one that makes the least sense. Also read the series again. Weeble has only been shown once and that's when they mentioned Marco. They are taking down everyone related to WB's crew with Marco as the prime target. The fact that they described them as Marco and the other remaining members of the WB pirates and didn't mention Kaidou at all, says enough. If Marco was a Calamity, that would be shocking news and would mean Weeble is picking a fight with Kaidou. And the Strawhats were almost completely locked away from all news in the world for two years, this doesn't apply to Weeble or his mother. Again you are making illogical stories up, the next even more absurd than the previous, because you can't find any sensible proof. The Strawhats not recognizing Isshou and Weeble and his mother are two completely different situations and persons. Your reasoning become worse the more you write =/
Absolute fact: I said they were prepared to die, not that they were planning to die. They attacked marineford, they really didn't attack that with the idea that it was going to be some Sunday afternoon pick-nick. They were very well aware that every single one of them could possibly die. Also Ace died and WB died. Commander and captain =/ yeah no one died, now you are sounding like a child. And even if none of the other commanders died, which you don't know, many were severely injured.
The correct question is here why are you thinking Marco would have to hold a grudge? Read the entire series again. It has never been said Kaidou and Shanks fought each other, only that there was some skirmish. If those two actually did fight, the results would have been catastrophic. The fact that Shanks was unharmed and still made it on time, means barely anything happened between him and Kaidou. The WB pirates decided themselves to go to Marineford fully knowing they would have to face the entire might of the Marines and that many people could die. They were neither counting nor expecting Shanks, I mean why would they? Shanks decided to come on his own. Shanks and WB weren't friends, that was clearly stated, none of the Yonkou are and there has definitely been some issues in the past between Kaidou and BB, so Marco really is not going to hold a grudge for something extremely minor like a failed attempt of Kaidou to stop WB because that made Shanks arrive late. Also Shanks came to put an end to the war, not to fight in it. When he said that if anyone had a problem with ending it there, he aimed it everyone: pirate and marine alike.
Marco was the strongest fighter of the WB pirates, by default he's a heavyweight. What is wrong with you? You make it sound like he's some kind of an insecure teenager. And my point was that he doesn't have a reason to join Kaidou either, he doesn't have any business with him. You just made up a BS reason, but then it's extremely easy, however that's not how you make theories. And what the hell does it matter that there might have been someone in WB crew from Wano? Pekoms came from Zou. Does that now mean anything? No, as they're freaking pirates.
Why are you denying manga facts and trash common sense? Why are you so hellbent on either Marco and Drake being a Calamity while nothing supports it and many things even state the opposite? You just did it again. Previously it was "he is seeking revenge on Kaidou, BB etc." and now it's "he's moved on". How is it possible you don't even see your own inconsistencies? He's a pirate, as you just said, by definition that means they don't have anywhere to go as they go everywhere. That's the entire point of being a pirate. Buggy and Shanks were pirate trainees, meaning they were groomed to become pirates in their own right and this after Roger disbanded the crew. The WB pirates didn't got disbanded and Jinbei and Arlong are also bad examples as Arlong, Jinbei and Tiger were comrades and their lives were strongly intertwined with the fate of FI and their race. Their situations are vastly different. Yes they have to move on, but that seriously has nothing to do with joining Kaidou.
For crying out loud someone who keeps his mouth closed makes more sense than you. Instead of basing theories on the series, you are screwing the entire series just so it could fit your non-sensical stories. You are free to believe what you want to believe, but don't got massacring the series just for your own convenience because you want Drake and Marco be Calamities.
Do you know what is the most likeliest possibility? That the Drake pirates are a subordinate crew of Kaidou, which is the same concept of how Bartolomeo and Cavendish are subordinates of Luffy. They are not Strawhat pirates, they only acknowledge Luffy as their parent. People like Zoro however are real Strawhats. Jack is part of Kaidou's crew, he also wears his jolly roger. Drake doesn't. OP wiki also explains it like this and someone of a subordinate crew will not be part of the Calamities and Marco was in WB's crew for decades. He and the others considered WB as their father, but he's now gone. Joining someone like Kaidou and with extension almost everyone else, is something they likely would consider to be tarnishing the pride of the WB pirates. They really are not going to join another Yonkou and if they did, it really will not be Kaidou. Even Luffy is a better candidate as WB acknowledged him.
You mean the destruction these guys caused:
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The area was already destroyed against the time Drake arrived and it's going to be really laughable if you're going to say Scotch is also a Calamity, which you should if you want to be consistent with your own arguments.
And causing destruction is what pirates do...or have you forgotten what kind of destruction the Strawhats alone have already caused? The difference here is that Jack and Kaidou are violent, unstable, aggressive beasts with a short fuse while Drake has always showed a calm demeanor. What you just described as a calamity is a joke, almost everyone can do that. That's not a calamity. In the end the only thing Drake has going for him, is an ancient zoan and that on itself is far from impressive in a crew that has hundreds of zoan types.
Yes the top fighters of the WB crew should be similar to the Three Calamities. Ace, Jozu and Marco were able to hold themselves against the admirals. Similar to Jack. He attacked a convoy with an admiral, former fleet admiral and several VA, sunk several battleships and was able to get away with it. If he could do that in such a disadvantageous situation, he definitely can hold his ground in a one on one battle. With other words this is far beyond the abilities of Drake. Power wise it doesn't make sense.
What you are doing is blotting everything out that's inconvenient for your statements and only focus on the small, ambiguous stuff and try to make it look important.
Skull Knight
Active member
What proof u are talking about? Because I understand nothing u wrote above^
I have given enough proofs & evidences in this thread that these two are calamities. Now u can think whatever u want. But I m not changing my opinion unless Oda shows different calamities in manga.
He knew Kizaru's strength that's why he didnot fought against him. I never said he was Admiral lvl /high Shichibukai lvl pre TS. He was like other supernovas(vice admiral lvl).
Capone is the one of the weakest supernova. Comparing him wit a calamity is a bad example.
And Luffy's family history has nothing to do wit his bounty.
Kid kills fodders & civilians & has bounty more than 400m.
Now u r in denial. Urogue & Bonney has nothing to do wit Kaido. BB's bounty is also not shown but we can assume it will be more than 1billion.
And Drake is a member of Kaido pirates. If he is not a big shot in Kaido's army then why didn't oda showed his bounty???
Come on bro Zoro is not the only guy who got training from top tier guys in OPverse.
Luffy got training from Rayleigh.
Sanji got training from Ivankov.
Law got training from Doffy family.
What's wrong wit my idea that Drake got training from Jack.
100's of possibilities? Like what he is siting in a cave waiting for a guy named Edward Weeble who will come at him & ask him "where is my dad's treasure?"
They don't know where Marco is that's why they are now trying to find Luffy because Marco & Co. helped Luffy at MF. If Marco is 3rd Calamity then few people only know this.
Wrong. They read newspapers. Did u forgot that's how they knew they have to met after 2years. That means newspapers were available to them.
I repeat they didnot went there to die. They must hav prepared plans like WB will handle all 3admirals, Jozu-Vista-Marco will handle Sengoku & Garp & other commanders/captains will handle Shichibukai & marines. And someone from them will free Ace & everyone will go back to NW.
Shanks stopped Kaido. Do u think he Tnj him?
It's just a theory. There can be 100s of reasons like after the war Kaido killed 1or2 commanders & he joined him because he wants to take revenge. Anything is possible.
Yes it definately means something. Pekoms was angry when Jack destroyed his country. Obviously Izo would be also mad because Kaido has taken over Wano & killed Momo's dad.
Because my theory is better then
Rat & Locust being next calamity
Bro Jimbei served WB & now he went to BM. How is it different?
And what if my theory comes true?
I see no SH Jolly Roger on Zoro, Ussop, Luffy, Chopper, Nami etc.
Luffy is not a Yonko & some of the commanders are stronger than Luffy. Why will they join him?
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@Caliburn
If Drake didn't cause the majority of that destruction like you and Avi have said then that takes that point away atleast.
The whole point of showing that was someone calm like Drake caused such destruction...it would mean something if he was the one that actually caused it. It doesn't matter if others can cause that type of destruction lol wtf is that even supposed to mean? The calamities aren't the only people in the OP verse who cause destruction on that level, destruction isn't copyrighted by them or something. That was simply to show Drake can cause destruction if ordered too (but if he didn't like I said, then sure the point is moot).
Regarding power levels, you are either severely overestimating Ace or underestimating X Drake. There is no way in hell Drake will be introduced as significantly weaker than Ace was. He was given portrayal to be among the top supernova, and don't tell me Ace was able to fight Admirals because he got absolutely manhandled by Akainu. Blocking one attack from Aokiji which favoured his DF doesn't put him on that level.
If Drake didn't cause the majority of that destruction like you and Avi have said then that takes that point away atleast.
The whole point of showing that was someone calm like Drake caused such destruction...it would mean something if he was the one that actually caused it. It doesn't matter if others can cause that type of destruction lol wtf is that even supposed to mean? The calamities aren't the only people in the OP verse who cause destruction on that level, destruction isn't copyrighted by them or something. That was simply to show Drake can cause destruction if ordered too (but if he didn't like I said, then sure the point is moot).
Regarding power levels, you are either severely overestimating Ace or underestimating X Drake. There is no way in hell Drake will be introduced as significantly weaker than Ace was. He was given portrayal to be among the top supernova, and don't tell me Ace was able to fight Admirals because he got absolutely manhandled by Akainu. Blocking one attack from Aokiji which favoured his DF doesn't put him on that level.
Skull Knight
Active member
Bro everything regarding Drake matches up with Calamities.
He is a Ancient Zoan DF user, he is a Kaido's men, oda is hiding his bounty & he recently stopped a rebellion Caribou did.
With proper training anyone can become Shichibukai lvl in 2years.
Caliburn's reply makes no sense. He wrote "Drake don't wear Kaido's Jolly Roger that's why he is not a calamity" as if Zoro wears SH Jolly Roger.
But Kaido most probably had the 3 Disasters for a really long time. Nothing suggest he acquired them recently so Drake cannot be a Disaster because only allied himself 2 years ago.
It has been stated that Yonko fought WB for territory so no way Kaido fought WB with just Jack+fodder artificial Zoan users. Kaido mostly challenged WB with his own Crew and his 3 Disasters.
Skull Knight
Active member
Bro nothing suggest he had calamities for a long time.
Kaido fought Moriah & destroyed his crew. Nothing regarding calamity was stated in Thriller Bark Arc.
Kaido never fought against WB. He tried to attack WB before MF but shanks stopped him.
Kaido did fight WB in the past.
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Law states that "Yonko" fought WB so i am assuming Kaido was part of it. So yeah no way Kaido fought WB's crew with just 2 Calamaties. He probably had a 3rd one as well.
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Skull Knight
Active member
Honestly I don't remember this panel. Which chapter this happened?
still I don't think he had 3calamities when he fought WB.