By the War Arc the only thing Hinata can't do that Neji can is Kaiten (rotation). Aside from that Neji and Hinata were keeping pace against the Zetsu's together. Although it was Neji who collapsed before Hinata due to overuse of the Byakugan.
Hinata by the skin of her teeth pulled off 64 palms. Neji did it comfortably in part one. :| Neji also has rotation. :| At best she can match him but I still don't see it.
Doesn't matter how hard it was for her. Once character get how to do it, it is very short way to master it and auto access to use such technique with no problems - manga rules, especially Kishimoto's universe.
Neji has rotation true, but part 1 Neji lacks air palm so he is only dangerous in close combat and also part 1 Neji's vision is limited to 50 meters. Hinata's vision is 2 km range, and databook IV gives her One body blow and states her Byakugan is no way infferior to Neji.
By the War Arc the only thing Hinata can't do that Neji can is Kaiten (rotation). Aside from that Neji and Hinata were keeping pace against the Zetsu's together. Although it was Neji who collapsed before Hinata due to overuse of the Byakugan.
^^ Let me see it then, I expect you to adress all arguments.
Nope, Naruto saving her is nothing but for pairing reasons and hype. Sakura was also saved and bothhad exclamation marks which means they saw it comming and could react to it, that how Kishi shows it. Unless you show me where that logic fails I will keep believing as correct.
There is no proof that part 1 Neji could rotate in time, in the worst case he would just put up chakra shroud around did against KNO Naruto, so called incomplete Kaiten and I am not certain it would stop them. Besides ABC logic doesn't work here, as something which Neji part 1 was barberly supperior on defence in compare to her, but her offence is supperior to him and for quite a wide margin
Actually no , the exclamation only showes shock to the imediate scenerio , it does not mean that any and all who show surprise would have the bodily reactions to counter or the abilities , eg:
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Kidomaru had the exclamation which showes instant surprise but yet failed to even close his mouth too detach his spear much less react in a defencive way , wat would hinata hav done to those 3 zetsu's? , her air palm could only slap one or two at best , its speculation that she could survive in that scenerio which is why i said we work with wat we are given an wat we were given is hinata needin saving.
Neji would not need to rotate which is why i said kaiten 'stage1" , that would be more than enough to stop all 3 , followed by the spin to blast them neg diff. He can also easily rotate in time lol if he could rotate in time to block kido's barrages point blank then 3 swings aint beating that unless ur willing to underate the velocity of small daggers
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he easily evades those swings same as he did kido's much faster attacks , look carefully at the distance between neji an the daggers in this scan
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Neji was able to evade all those daggers while at the same time cuttin a large amount of kido's movement restrictin webs only gettin hit by 2 due to his blindspot , that should show the the difference between their prowes , compair that to hinata needin savin againt thosr 3 zetsu , even if she could react with air palm i fail to see how she would of tagged all 3 but maybe thata just me.
Hinata was able to react to something which Base Naruto and Hiashi reacted but Hiashi deflected it also.
Wtf ?, Naruto has never upgraded hsi cloak to V2 against Neji in part 1, stop dreaming. I am disappointed now by that line of yours.
I was under the impression u wouldve understood my meaning bro , i never meant he literaly entered V2 , i simply meant that his determination was able to upgrade his cloaks chakra output which enhanced his speed in a instant an caught neji offguard:-( , i never imagined i would hav to clarify this:'( , look carefuly at the bottom left.
already proved Hinata's reaction time is on par with Part 1 Neji at least, or barerly supperior to his. You are just blantly ignorant to scans or forgot to adress them for some reason.
Neji can cover distance and strike Hinata, but it would be very hard as their speed is close to each other, Hinata's Taijutsu matches Neji with Twin Lion fists while using 64 palms which make up for Neji's battle experience and skill advantage.
Im tryin to agree with u but hav yet to see why hinata has equal or better reaction than SRA neji jus because she fighting alongside his stronger counterpart , kiba was also able to cover neji but does that mean he has equal reaction to neji an could evade kido's raining daggers with ease pointblank?.
its the same for hinata , neji is a genius an trains alot to refine his prowes given the fact that he's a part of konoha's taijutsu squad only adds to this , also hinata havin 64 palms in no way proves she matches him but u already admitted he has the skill advantage so he can easily gain the upperhand usin chakra.
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This tactic can also be used in CQC to give an even bigger advantage to neji:-( , hinata cant nd wont survive a jyuken vs jyuken clash without twin lions which i will handle below:-\.
true, but only If Neji is attacked while fully unleashing Kaiten, if it was intercepted in the begining or by the end of it then, same case as with KN0 Naruto would happen.
Hinata has wider range of vision, her Byakugan is on par with part 2 Neji as stated by IV databook. So Neji can only has better trained body as Hinata profile also mention finally matching Neji's taijutsu and it talks about part 2.
If hinata attacks before kaiten is completed then she dies in the explosion or gets ko'ed since she lacks the protective chakra an auto healing given by the fox's cloak so neji wins no matter wat in a kaiten vs twin lion scenerio;-)
Hinata's byakugan range is useless in this battle since this is a CQC based battle , the profile never s mentioned her matching neji's taijutsu , the only comparison it made was between their byakugan , the profile only mentioned that as a ninja neji walked far ahead of hinata due to his talent which can also apply to his p1 self , the profile seems to support hinata still not bein close to neji an only took one single step of advancment which is 64 palms, said by hinata herself.
Nope, databook IV states Hinata can use One body blow, it seems she just can not yet keep that chakra emitted around her body which is required for Kaiten. One body blow is just shot time expelled chakra in instant so it must be keeping it which is problem.
part 1 Neji is no way supperior to Hinata in Taijutsu also, databook IV and manga proves that as my thread does.
Where does it state hinata can use full body blow? , iv never seen this , also it makes no sense for her be able to maintain perfect control for twin lion fist but yet is capable of full body blow an cant maintain the raw chakra needed for a simply spin , based on portrayal it seems hinata has yet to master jyuken to the point she could expell chakra from her whole body sinse we hav never seen this
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Also the databook only noted that in no way is neji's byakugan better than hinata's , but it made it clear that neji walked far ahead of hinata which makes him better than her in almost everything due to his unatural talent an his feats heavily support this.
I am not disputing that neji improved but that does not mean hinata beats him , my reasonin is shown above , havin kaiten gives him full advantage since he can use its chakra in different ways to unbalance hinata an give him the win without needin to rotate , reaction time an speed goes directly to neji , i think ur overestomating the leap in power hinata recieved from pain arc to juubi arc , by hinata's own words she was only able to take a single step in her advancment from the pain arc an that was when she performed 64 palms so even tho its likely she inproved , u cant just estimate how much she improved an use it to giv stats to gauge how she surpassed neji, tho i like the effort nd would like to agreeT_T.
It is not small advantage is is huge advantage along with wider range of byakugan, it were these two abilities which if part 1 Neji had he would much better handle Kidomaru U_U
I agree , havin a wider range with byakugan along with air palm would hav given neji a much quicker victory against kido , but how does that hav anything to do with this match? , i already listed how he can anticipate nd courter her air palms , if she had air wall palm then this would be a much different story but witout it her standard air palms are easily evaded eith the help of chakra.
Only If Hinata closes distance to Neji without Twin Lion fists put up ready to strike.
Neji's taijutsu skills I already adressed. Check damn Hinata's profile in databook IV along with Hyuuga techniques then please come back and debate more.
If hinata charges up twin lions an closes distance then kaiten will be used for the win , if hinata somhow catches neji before he can spin then as u said the same explosion which happend against naruto would take place , givin neji the win since she lacks defence or instant auto healing an durabilily.
But ur right i do need to catch up on the databook since i dont want to disagree with anything u said if there is proof to support it..
I see that u stand firm with ur reason nd i tried to agree but the feats an logical jus points to p1 neji still bein the stronger hyuga , im sorry i jus disagree 囧 , maybe things will change when read the databook fully O.
Actually no , the exclamation only showes shock to the imediate scenerio , it does not mean that any and all who show surprise would have the bodily reactions to counter or the abilities , eg:
Kidomaru had the exclamation which showes instant surprise but yet failed to even close his mouth too detach his spear much less react in a defencive way , wat would hinata hav done to those 3 zetsu's? , her air palm could only slap one or two at best , its speculation that she could survive in that scenerio which is why i said we work with wat we are given an wat we were given is hinata needin saving.
scan please. Also there in Hinata scan if you tak closer look there is shown mark of her body motion/wave of hand which make difference in compare to Kidomaru, who just stood in place while he was approached/hit.
If you can not see it, then I will zoom it in for you.
Neji would not need to rotate which is why i said kaiten 'stage1" , that would be more than enough to stop all 3 , followed by the spin to blast them neg diff. He can also easily rotate in time lol if he could rotate in time to block kido's barrages point blank then 3 swings aint beating that unless ur willing to underate the velocity of small daggers
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he easily evades those swings same as he did kido's much faster attacks , look carefully at the distance between neji an the daggers in this scan
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Neji was able to evade all those daggers while at the same time cuttin a large amount of kido's movement restrictin webs only gettin hit by 2 due to his blindspot ,
Of course It could in Neji's case, but It depens if tip's of swords wouldn't cut through initial Kaiten before he can do full Kaiten.
It is indeed impressive, but keep in min the 50 meters of vision allowed him to anticipated/expect incomming attacks.
that should show the the difference between their prowes , compair that to hinata needin savin againt thosr 3 zetsu , even if she could react with air palm i fail to see how she would of tagged all 3 but maybe thata just me.
Depends if you think Kidomaru is supperior to Juubi's clone/minion which I doubt. Databook IV also adress Juubi's minion with it seems more importance.
I wouldn't understimate vacuum palm , which also have quite big range to blast there who get too close. Do you know that main difference between Neji part 1 and Neji part 2 is vacuum palm at which Kishi put big meaning which means it wasn't only detail.
I was under the impression u wouldve understood my meaning bro , i never meant he literaly entered V2 , i simply meant that his determination was able to upgrade his cloaks chakra output which enhanced his speed in a instant an caught neji offguard:-( , i never imagined i would hav to clarify this:'( , look carefuly at the bottom left.
Of course, I could but nevertheless using such words can be confusing and lead to misunderstading each other.
I doubt it was power's boost, it looked more like chakra burst and increased determination.
Im tryin to agree with u but hav yet to see why hinata has equal or better reaction than SRA neji jus because she fighting alongside his stronger counterpart , kiba was also able to cover neji but does that mean he has equal reaction to neji an could evade kido's raining daggers with ease pointblank?.
good, and I posted the reasons already + more to come:
- Hinata and Neji protecting each other + Hinata saving once Neji and Neji apologizing which means he indeed was in weak situation, it wasn't just play.
- Hinata deflecting wooden spike before it hit Base Naruto
- Hinata reacting to incomming Juubi's arm, but it was Hiashi in front who deflected it.
Debatable. Kibra has no protection from all sides as move, so he would have to avoid case when he is cornered by daggers flying from all points at him.
its the same for hinata , neji is a genius an trains alot to refine his prowes given the fact that he's a part of konoha's taijutsu squad only adds to this , also hinata havin 64 palms in no way proves she matches him but u already admitted he has the skill advantage so he can easily gain the upperhand usin chakra.
True, but Hinata put herself through very hard/strict training also which shown beginig of results...
Of course, however Gentle steps Twin Lion Fists make up for that.
This tactic can also be used in CQC to give an even bigger advantage to neji:-( , hinata cant nd wont survive a jyuken vs jyuken clash without twin lions which i will handle below:-\.
^^ True, however Hinata with wider range of vision and having medium range of attack would keep distance from him, so he would run out of chakra first. Also her speed is on par with part 1 Neji at least and Neji being close range fighter, gives her chance and advantage to make up for inferior skills.
Sure but once Hinata put up Lion fists, I am sure she would overpower Neji in direct clash.
If hinata attacks before kaiten is completed then she dies in the explosion or gets ko'ed since she lacks the protective chakra an auto healing given by the fox's cloak so neji wins no matter wat in a kaiten vs twin lion scenerio;-)
Disagree... you understimate greatly Twin lion fists which Hinata can use.
it was these lion fists which forced Pein to back away and avoid direct contact/taijutsu:
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^^ Keep in mind it was same Path of Pein who matched Kakashi's taijutsu. Which shows Hinata's striking speed isn't something to laugh off, but her physcial speed is lesser but still not that bad.
Databook IV Gentle Steps Twin Lions Fists:
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柔歩双獅拳 Juuho Soushiken (Gentle Step: Twin Lion Fists)
Taijutsu, Kekkei Genkai, Offensive, Defensive, Supplementary, Short Range
拳に宿す強き意思！！
Strong will held in the fists!!
その姿双頭の獅子の如し！！
Its form is double lion heads!!
日向一族の中でも宗家にしか伝わっていない、柔拳秘伝高等体術。両手から放出するチャクラを形態変化させる ことで、リーチと破壊力を格段に向上させる。その腕はまるで獅子のような様相を呈し、触れた相手の経絡系を 喰らい尽くすのだ。
A secret high-level juuken technique, taught only to the main family of the Hyuuga clan. By changing the shape of chakra released from both hands, [the user] greatly increases reach and destructive power. The arms become entirely like lions which drain the chakra network of those they touch.
チャクラコントロールを少しでも誤ると失敗するため、習得は極めて困難緻密な技量と“白眼”があればこその 芸当である。
Because it will fail at even the slightest mistake in chakra control, it is extremely difficult to learn this ability, which is a feat that requires the Byakugan.
Caption:
“八卦六十四掌”の威力を底上げすることができる。
It can be used to increase the power of Eight Trigrams Sixty-Four Palms.
^^ I wouldn't take it as lightly as you if as I was you lol.
Hinata's byakugan range is useless in this battle since this is a CQC based battle , the profile never s mentioned her matching neji's taijutsu , the only comparison it made was between their byakugan , the profile only mentioned that as a ninja neji walked far ahead of hinata due to his talent which can also apply to his p1 self , the profile seems to support hinata still not bein close to neji an only took one single step of advancment which is 64 palms, said by hinata herself.
Well it may not but the way she was potrayed through War arc and finally Juubi arc + databook statement that she was directly training with Neji being able to finally blossom her hidden talent after Neji's death
Where does it state hinata can use full body blow? , iv never seen this , also it makes no sense for her be able to maintain perfect control for twin lion fist but yet is capable of full body blow an cant maintain the raw chakra needed for a simply spin , based on portrayal it seems hinata has yet to master jyuken to the point she could expell chakra from her whole body sinse we hav never seen this
Well I saw it somewhere, but I can not recall that memory or find it myself.
Check databook IV for Hyuuga techniques, there should be something like that.
Also she at least completed First step to use Gentle fist full body blow, aka releasing instantly chakra from hands. Now it only depends if she can emit from all her Tenketsu, but She supposedly used in the movie or so they say. Still no rotation.
Also the databook only noted that in no way is neji's byakugan better than hinata's , but it made it clear that neji walked far ahead of hinata which makes him better than her in almost everything due to his unatural talent an his feats heavily support this.
I am not disputing that neji improved but that does not mean hinata beats him , my reasonin is shown above , havin kaiten gives him full advantage since he can use its chakra in different ways to unbalance hinata an give him the win without needin to rotate , reaction time an speed goes directly to neji , i think ur overestomating the leap in power hinata recieved from pain arc to juubi arc , by hinata's own words she was only able to take a single step in her advancment from the pain arc an that was when she performed 64 palms so even tho its likely she inproved , u cant just estimate how much she improved an use it to giv stats to gauge how she surpassed neji, tho i like the effort nd would like to agreeT_T.
Well it once again shows that you understimate Lion fists technique which in cqc along with 8 trigrams: palms(even just 32), is really deadly. Disagree completly wtih speed and from what I remember on OBD there is calculation and Hinata is little supperior in speed to part 1 Neji speed. She is close in speed to early Part 2 Neji.
Well, just try to be more open mided, that my suggestion.
The only way I see Hinata loosing is either Neji executing full Kaiten while she strikes him from close range or Neji caughting her off-guard which I assure you would be very hard to do.
I agree , havin a wider range with byakugan along with air palm would hav given neji a much quicker victory against kido , but how does that hav anything to do with this match? , i already listed how he can anticipate nd courter her air palms , if she had air wall palm then this would be a much different story but witout it her standard air palms are easily evaded eith the help of chakra.
If hinata charges up twin lions an closes distance then kaiten will be used for the win , if hinata somhow catches neji before he can spin then as u said the same explosion which happend against naruto would take place , givin neji the win since she lacks defence or instant auto healing an durabilily.
True, and here I see two options:
- Hinata hits Neji's initial kaiten while he begin or ends spining ->Hinata wins, if lion fists were used
- Hinata hits Neji while Full Kaiten is used-> Neji wins
But ur right i do need to catch up on the databook since i dont want to disagree with anything u said if there is proof to support it..
I see that u stand firm with ur reason nd i tried to agree but the feats an logical jus points to p1 neji still bein the stronger hyuga , im sorry i jus disagree 囧 , maybe things will change when read the databook fully O.
I am glad you see that fallacy in your way of using feats and arguments. I am really not bias or something and I respect your opinion, but I can not agree with you if above half of points show me that I am more close to being right then wrong.
No need to be sorry, if you can back up your claims and yet preserve from insulting, character bashing or ignoring my arguments which you in most's part adressed as well.
I hope you just try to see my side as well and you really should visit OBD also
scan please. Also there in Hinata scan if you tak closer look there is shown mark of her body motion/wave of hand which make difference in compare to Kidomaru, who just stood in place while he was approached/hit.
If you can not see it, then I will zoom it in for you.
Of course It could in Neji's case, but It depens if tip's of swords wouldn't cut through initial Kaiten before he can do full Kaiten.
It is indeed impressive, but keep in min the 50 meters of vision allowed him to anticipated/expect incomming attacks.
Depends if you think Kidomaru is supperior to Juubi's clone/minion which I doubt. Databook IV also adress Juubi's minion with it seems more importance.
I wouldn't understimate vacuum palm , which also have quite big range to blast there who get too close. Do you know that main difference between Neji part 1 and Neji part 2 is vacuum palm at which Kishi put big meaning which means it wasn't only detail.
Nope , hinata was caught "offguard" by the zetsu's while her attension were elswhere , the same thing happend to neji in the chunin exams an with kaguya , the byakugan has a 360 degree scope of vision but it does not actively stay within that scppe of vision , the hyuga can be caught offguard if their eyes are locked elsewhere , think of it as two different modes of vision , penetrating sight/ long range/normal vision which can up to 900m nd higher plus 360 degree vision which has a certain
range also, presumably 70m
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As u can see neji was caught offguard due to no havin his 360 degree vision active , its the same with kaguya.
Hinata covering neji in the war could very well hav been a similar instance where he had to switch vision which left him open since we already kno that anything which enters within 50m or higher would of easily been detected an reacted to
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Hinata watching out for her cuz simply came to help same as narutp helping her when she was caught offguard , tho it can be due to zetsu transformation bein undetectible which added to this , but thats not the point as feats/hype an logic puts SRA Neji's reaction an speed way above hers an it can no longer be argued at all.
Of course, I could but nevertheless using such words can be confusing and lead to misunderstading each other.
I doubt it was power's boost, it looked more like chakra burst and increased determination.
good, and I posted the reasons already + more to come:
- Hinata and Neji protecting each other + Hinata saving once Neji and Neji apologizing which means he indeed was in weak situation, it wasn't just play.
- Hinata deflecting wooden spike before it hit Base Naruto
- Hinata reacting to incomming Juubi's arm, but it was Hiashi in front who deflected it.
Debatable. Kibra has no protection from all sides as move, so he would have to avoid case when he is cornered by daggers flying from all points at him.
First things first there is no way in hell fodder swords are doing anything to neji's chakra cloak but get deflected neg diff, i can believe u said that:-(
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Or blocked neg diff , neji does not even need to rotate his body to kick start his kaiten
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It cannot be argued if neji would neg diff those 3 zetsu without needin to be saved as he has already mastered his gentle fist by this point:-(
Also in the case of neji bein aware of the daggers , look closely , the exclamation showes surprise , an its understandable since a giant spider had just landed on top of him , blocking his vision which as i explained above has different modes of sight it can use
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Neji same as hinata was caught unaware , only he reacted evasively to faster an more pinpointed assaults to which hinata needed savin from 3 fodder swords:-(
Also kidomaru is wayyyyyyyy stronger than a juubi minion an could neg diff one easier than neji or war arc hinata , heck he neg diff a small army of them in a forest , the guy was no dummy or slowpoke , displayin about equal speed to KN0 Naruto while in base , he was able to instantly vanish from sight , cover a great distance an set up dozens of daggers at different locations along with a decoy dagger all in a single panel while neji was still on his knees
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Heck thats even faster than KN0 Naruto only only managed this in a almost similar scenerio
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CM and CM2 would only increase his already haxed speed the guy eould trash multpily juublings withput effort , no diff at all , same with SRA Neji who bested him even tho he had haxed speed , chakra stoppin armor , CM1 nd 2 for even more haxness , yet he was still scared to death of confronting neji in in CQC , even while the guy was half dead already lol
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Just goes to show how dangerous neji was in CQC for him to have such advantages plus chakra stoppin armor nd CM2 to amp it yet still feared jyuken B-) , we hav never really seen neji receive a clean hit while he had his byakugan(360 degree vision active) .
About vacuum palm , when did i underestimate it? i already detailed how neji can counter this with byakugan insight , chakra an evasion its not so hard to understand also in the scenerio where u claim hinata could hav air palmed those 3 zetsu , its obvious she had no time to do so since they were already in her face nd caught her unaware while she was busy , nor would the air palm stretch so wide to hit all 3 , at most could 2 while one kills her, and thats pushing it , we hav seen that the standard air palm can only hit one person.
True, but Hinata put herself through very hard/strict training also which shown beginig of results...
Of course, however Gentle steps Twin Lion Fists make up for that.
^^ True, however Hinata with wider range of vision and having medium range of attack would keep distance from him, so he would run out of chakra first. Also her speed is on par with part 1 Neji at least and Neji being close range fighter, gives her chance and advantage to make up for inferior skills.
Sure but once Hinata put up Lion fists, I am sure she would overpower Neji in direct clash.
Disagree... you understimate greatly Twin lion fists which Hinata can use.
it was these lion fists which forced Pein to back away and avoid direct contact/taijutsu:
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^^ Keep in mind it was same Path of Pein who matched Kakashi's taijutsu. Which shows Hinata's striking speed isn't something to laugh off, but her physcial speed is lesser but still not that bad.
Databook IV Gentle Steps Twin Lions Fists:
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柔歩双獅拳 Juuho Soushiken (Gentle Step: Twin Lion Fists)
Taijutsu, Kekkei Genkai, Offensive, Defensive, Supplementary, Short Range
拳に宿す強き意思！！
Strong will held in the fists!!
その姿双頭の獅子の如し！！
Its form is double lion heads!!
日向一族の中でも宗家にしか伝わっていない、柔拳秘伝高等体術。両手から放出するチャクラを形態変化させる ことで、リーチと破壊力を格段に向上させる。その腕はまるで獅子のような様相を呈し、触れた相手の経絡系を 喰らい尽くすのだ。
A secret high-level juuken technique, taught only to the main family of the Hyuuga clan. By changing the shape of chakra released from both hands, [the user] greatly increases reach and destructive power. The arms become entirely like lions which drain the chakra network of those they touch.
チャクラコントロールを少しでも誤ると失敗するため、習得は極めて困難緻密な技量と“白眼”があればこその 芸当である。
Because it will fail at even the slightest mistake in chakra control, it is extremely difficult to learn this ability, which is a feat that requires the Byakugan.
Caption:
“八卦六十四掌”の威力を底上げすることができる。
It can be used to increase the power of Eight Trigrams Sixty-Four Palms.
^^ I wouldn't take it as lightly as you if as I was you lol.
Well it may not but the way she was potrayed through War arc and finally Juubi arc + databook statement that she was directly training with Neji being able to finally blossom her hidden talent after Neji's death
^^ Which means she just be better and better.
Well I saw it somewhere, but I can not recall that memory or find it myself.
Check databook IV for Hyuuga techniques, there should be something like that.
Also she at least completed First step to use Gentle fist full body blow, aka releasing instantly chakra from hands. Now it only depends if she can emit from all her Tenketsu, but She supposedly used in the movie or so they say. Still no rotation.
Truth. In the past that it. Part 2 Neji of course but part 1 Neji is overrated as I would put him at the most Juubi arc Hinata's level.
Well it once again shows that you understimate Lion fists technique which in cqc along with 8 trigrams: palms(even just 32), is really deadly. Disagree completly wtih speed and from what I remember on OBD there is calculation and Hinata is little supperior in speed to part 1 Neji speed. She is close in speed to early Part 2 Neji.
Well, just try to be more open mided, that my suggestion.
The only way I see Hinata loosing is either Neji executing full Kaiten while she strikes him from close range or Neji caughting her off-guard which I assure you would be very hard to do.
I am glad you see my point. Well Just to show you how much important and tides changing are air palm and wider range of byakugan
True, and here I see two options:
- Hinata hits Neji's initial kaiten while he begin or ends spining ->Hinata wins, if lion fists were used
- Hinata hits Neji while Full Kaiten is used-> Neji wins
First things first theres no way u can tell me that KN0 Naruto did not receive a power speed boost here , (bottom left panel), its evident by the fact tjat neji was able to comfortable react to his speed beforehand an was ready to do so again , (upper right panel) until naruto's thoughts caused his cloak to grow obviously increasin his speed which caught neji offguard which is why he said "kaiten oh no" an explains the exclamation before the clash
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Naruto's will to prove everyone wrong caused him to get a drastic increase in speed , its pretty obvious:-D
I already explained how hinata watching neji's back in a offscreen scenerio does not prove she is on par reaction wise to SRA Neji , dont even kno wat the heck happend or wat was about to happen to neji.
Hinata reacting to wooden spike means ntn since her job was to "protect" naruto , her love interest , her vision was fully set on covering naruto , thats it.
The only decent reaction feat was when she tried to save naruto from the pinpointed attack which indicates that she could probably react by evading it herself if it was aimed at her but not enough time to react with a air palm as she did before.
The point about the juubi arm is baseles since the hand was not comin fast an was simply sweeping away fodders , any fool that were in close proximity to naruto/hinata should of saw a giant hand wreckin shit an comin towards , the funny thing is they dont need the byakugan for that:-D.
Also about kiba , its not debatable kiba would get wrecked by kido's web/spider/dagger barrages , the guy got taged by chunin prelims naruto ab got the ultimate shame of p1, there is no argument there bro.
About twin lion fist , it can only be used from the arms an takes a little time for the to chakra change shape an take the form of lions , if hinata rushes with lions in hand neji can easily use his better mastery over jyuken chakra from his body to focus it in a way to manipulate her feet while he prepares to evade her strikes , similarly to this
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And this
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He can possible use this chakra to cause her to fallO , unbalance her or cause her to go air born then quicky finish her bein a master at jyuken is realy helpful in a battle like this , it can easily giv him the win , twin lion is at end of the day a linear move similar to standard jyuken , only with greater reach which neji can accurately read with his byakugan.
Also in terms of feats an databook his speed is way above hinata bein able tp react to things/people far quicker than anything she has an was even able to blitz kido before he could even shut his mouth , i hav never seen hinata blitz or react to somone as fast/strong as KN0 Naruto , nor has she recieved hype from top blitz kings lee/gai , neji's body speed is obviouly able to easily keep up with unweighted lee as is the requirments for keep up with somone at that speed (eyes plus body speed) as noted by neji's former punching bag , lee , he displayed this fact when he danced around naruto's clones without them even gettin a good look at him an was able to keep up with KN0 Naruto while sasuke with lee speed plus precog got taged in less than 5 minutes by naruto's base clones , SRA Neji is much faster , im sorry i cant simply jus hand his speed feats over to hinata an say she's about equal at least:-(
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Again air palm will be anticiped an avoided or nulled an avoided usin chakra , so she has no such advantage from it.
And twin lion fist , i already detailed how neji can easily deal with it , im sure by now u at least see my points an hope this scan can help open ur eyes widerO , read the words of the great black zetsu
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Neji the expert with the stone
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Will overcome hinata the novice with the kunai
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So no , hinata will not simply overpower him with twin lions.
She us portrayed in the war arc to be way below neji who learned 64 palms by himself while hinata had him teaching her nd showing her the steps nd wat to do coulnt manage it till after his death ,the only thing she had on SRA Neji was air palm an twin lions an the only reason she had those over hom was because he had no one to teach him these things unlike hinata , its a fact that he's the most blessed/talented hyuga , hiruzen an hiashi made it clear , so those moves would of been cake walk for him to learn if he had the right teacher , this bloomed talent u speak of cant be gauged until we see her progress in the last before she awakens hamura's chakra.
I am as open minded about this as possible an without decent speed feats from her i cant jus place hinata at a higher speed than him , i jus cant:-( they walked different paths an builded different aspects of their overall prowes , like speed an defence in neji's case , cant jus pass on his speed feats to her in the same way i cant pass over his kaiten feats to her.
Neji can easily catch her offguard in CQC usin his chakra an speed as i explained above an it cant be argued.
She cant hit him with twin lions before he uses kaiten since her speed an reaction is below his an if she does get the chance to hit the initial kaiten , this would happen since neji can instantly expand a chakra dome if in any imediate danger to twin lions
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Givin hinata the bluntt of the damage bein the advancin force plus lacking defence or auto healing making neji the winner high diff , but i dont see this happening since she lacks the speed feats of enhanced KNO Naruto and SRA Neji is much stronger than that neji.
She also wont catch neji after he rotats since she lacks any means to force neji to rotate nd he wont just randomly rotate for no reason , i already explained he deals with her air palms so that also not happening , unless u think she will launch air palm to which neji will rotate to block while she charges twin lions an blitz him? , na, aint happenin, giv the guy some credit he aint that dumb , in the end neji wins mid diff or they both lose at worse.B-)
I am glad you see that fallacy in your way of using feats and arguments. I am really not bias or something and I respect your opinion, but I can not agree with you if above half of points show me that I am more close to being right then wrong.
No need to be sorry, if you can back up your claims and yet preserve from insulting, character bashing or ignoring my arguments which you in most's part adressed as well.
I hope you just try to see my side as well and you really should visit OBD also
I respect ur opinion too but feats an logic shows that im more right than uO , i expect u would see this by now:-D , i see nd understand ur side but the manga just seems to disagree , only after seein "the last" an if hinata has yet to leatn kaiten would be the only time we can truly compair her bloomed talent to neji's talent which was hyped an praised by a number of top gun ninja like gai/kakashi/hiruzen an hiashi to name some , for now hinata is still below SRA Neji:-(.
Nope , hinata was caught "offguard" by the zetsu's while her attension were elswhere , the same thing happend to neji in the chunin exams an with kaguya , the byakugan has a 360 degree scope of vision but it does not actively stay within that scppe of vision , the hyuga can be caught offguard if their eyes are locked elsewhere , think of it as two different modes of vision , penetrating sight/ long range/normal vision which can up to 900m nd higher plus 360 degree vision which has a certain
range also, presumably 70m
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As u can see neji was caught offguard due to no havin his 360 degree vision active , its the same with kaguya.
Well it was to show that opposite could happen to this what happened when Fake Hinata was hit and everyone was worried about her.
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Legend:
Red arrows - shows direction of Hinata's look
Red circles - shows Hinata's left hand swatting away someone and other shows that enemy
Green circle - shows Hinata's right hand ready to be thrusted forward at any moment.
First, Hinata doesn't have Byakugan active most likely here
Second, you are right about Byakugan working here, but it doesn't touch topic.
As you can see on the bottom left image Hinata could react and strike them using her right hand already bend ready to thrust forward with air palm in time. However the only question is Could vacuum palm contain all of them in range, they seem pretty close so I guess it could even if these on sides would be barerly hit changing trajectory of the swords's tips falling down towards her.
Hinata covering neji in the war could very well hav been a similar instance where he had to switch vision which left him open since we already kno that anything which enters within 50m or higher would of easily been detected an reacted to
That is correct deduction. However before comming up with such explanation one need to answer what the reason of possible such act of Neji could be.
I meant these were just White Zetsu, which power lays not in quality but quanity which means 360 degress scope is better in such case which proves my point that She has to be close to him in reaction time.
Hinata watching out for her cuz simply came to help same as narutp helping her when she was caught offguard , tho it can be due to zetsu transformation bein undetectible which added to this , but thats not the point as feats/hype an logic puts SRA Neji's reaction an speed way above hers an it can no longer be argued at all.
> She wasn't caught off-guard as I proved it.
> Yes, it could be. Either of that or being low on stamina created openning in Neji's defence.
> Neither see hype of feats putting him above her.
First things first there is no way in hell fodder swords are doing anything to neji's chakra cloak but get deflected neg diff, i can believe u said that:-(
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Or blocked neg diff , neji does not even need to rotate his body to kick start his kaiten
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It cannot be argued if neji would neg diff those 3 zetsu without needin to be saved as he has already mastered his gentle fist by this point:-(
Yes they could slash through it or at the worst they could break Neji's chakra layer/cloak putting him out of balance. of course Neji would kill them but so Could Hinata.
Well all your points are based oN Neji's chakra layer being unbreakable by swords and fallacy of understimating cutting force of swords.
Swinged down swords at you > shot from arrow dagger
Also in the case of neji bein aware of the daggers , look closely , the exclamation showes surprise , an its understandable since a giant spider had just landed on top of him , blocking his vision which as i explained above has different modes of sight it can use
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Neji same as hinata was caught unaware , only he reacted evasively to faster an more pinpointed assaults to which hinata needed savin from 3 fodder swords:-(
Blocking vision is correct deduction and fact, although stuff about switching modes of sight is just assumption hardly hinted/implied in manga.
I would just call it not enough fast Neji's reaction time from such close distance to dodge them. The switching modes of sight stuff is basically your excusse to cover lack of Neji's reaction time to dodge/react in time from such close range U_U
He didn't evade them, he was hit by all of them but somehow was able to ommit vital points. That or either Kidomaru didn't aim at vital points yet, keeping playing with Neji.
Also kidomaru is wayyyyyyyy stronger than a juubi minion an could neg diff one easier than neji or war arc hinata , heck he neg diff a small army of them in a forest , the guy was no dummy or slowpoke , displayin about equal speed to KN0 Naruto while in base , he was able to instantly vanish from sight , cover a great distance an set up dozens of daggers at different locations along with a decoy dagger all in a single panel while neji was still on his knees
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Heck thats even faster than KN0 Naruto only only managed this in a almost similar scenerio
> Based on ? I see Juubi's minion more intimidating and capable of, besides ABC logic doesn't work.
> that is fanfic with small army of them being negged by Kidomaru in forest
> Kidomaru has never fought KNO Naruto. So could a lot of other shinobi later.
> Neji was injured/wounded enough already to be unable to follow/find him, so Kidomaru took advantage of it by only getting out of 50 meters range which means Neji's vision.
> the problem is that KNO Naruto moved horizontally while Kidomaru jumped into trees which is hard to judge and estimate properly.Fail
CM and CM2 would only increase his already haxed speed the guy eould trash multpily juublings withput effort , no diff at all , same with SRA Neji who bested him even tho he had haxed speed , chakra stoppin armor , CM1 nd 2 for even more haxness , yet he was still scared to death of confronting neji in in CQC , even while the guy was half dead already lol
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Just goes to show how dangerous neji was in CQC for him to have such advantages plus chakra stoppin armor nd CM2 to amp it yet still feared jyuken B-) , we hav never really seen neji receive a clean hit while he had his byakugan(360 degree vision active) .
>Again just opinion. Kidomaru may have chance against one's Juubi minion and that it. Besides that you just put them in another landscape in reply above to make fight in his favour. Put Kidomaru in Hinata's place in same battlefield and let's see how he fares when he has nowhere to hide and shoot from distance while staying in hidden place.
>Kidomaru's abilities are hax, but as I said it is not ABC logic.
>only because Juuken was dangerous style of fighting.
>Of course he wasn;t seen hit, but then again he faced not as strong opponents as shown in part 2 later on.
About vacuum palm , when did i underestimate it? i already detailed how neji can counter this with byakugan insight , chakra an evasion its not so hard to understand also in the scenerio where u claim hinata could hav air palmed those 3 zetsu , its obvious she had no time to do so since they were already in her face nd caught her unaware while she was busy , nor would the air palm stretch so wide to hit all 3 , at most could 2 while one kills her, and thats pushing it , we hav seen that the standard air palm can only hit one person.
>Chakra evasion is not hard, but you can not keep it up forever. Just few more tries and Nejiw would be hit hard so it could create opening as he would be stunned for few seconds
>I already covered that stuff
>The vacuum palm having enough AOE to hit all 3 is debatable but I also covered this already.
First things first theres no way u can tell me that KN0 Naruto did not receive a power speed boost here , (bottom left panel), its evident by the fact tjat neji was able to comfortable react to his speed beforehand an was ready to do so again , (upper right panel) until naruto's thoughts caused his cloak to grow obviously increasin his speed which caught neji offguard which is why he said "kaiten oh no" an explains the exclamation before the clash
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Naruto's will to prove everyone wrong caused him to get a drastic increase in speed , its pretty obvious:-D
> Well, I don't see how he could, as when he does there was always shown panel of Kurama lending him more chakra and there was no such panel.
>part 1 Neji didn't react to KNO Naruto's speed comfortably, he barerly could follow him and only for short amount of time
> Neji just understimated boost of Naruto's speed that why this happened. The most logical assumption is that KNO Naruto didn't use full speed against Neji until last moment taking advantage of Neji's surprise.
I already explained how hinata watching neji's back in a offscreen scenerio does not prove she is on par reaction wise to SRA Neji , dont even kno wat the heck happend or wat was about to happen to neji.
> Of course you did, and I refuted although not fully disagreeing.
> Yes she is, I see nothing from SRA Neji's speed/reaction time which would be above her
Hinata reacting to wooden spike means ntn since her job was to "protect" naruto , her love interest , her vision was fully set on covering naruto , thats it.
The only decent reaction feat was when she tried to save naruto from the pinpointed attack which indicates that she could probably react by evading it herself if it was aimed at her but not enough time to react with a air palm as she did before.
> Still that shows she can react to such fast flying/approaching her wooden spikes.
> of course she could, The vacuum palm would also be used in time, but it wouldn't deflect all incomming wooden spikes. It shows her lack of Kaiten which in that case would be crucial.
>She could but air palm wouldn't deflect of them.
The point about the juubi arm is baseles since the hand was not comin fast an was simply sweeping away fodders , any fool that were in close proximity to naruto/hinata should of saw a giant hand wreckin shit an comin towards , the funny thing is they dont need the byakugan for that:-D.
Also about kiba , its not debatable kiba would get wrecked by kido's web/spider/dagger barrages , the guy got taged by chunin prelims naruto ab got the ultimate shame of p1, there is no argument there bro.
About twin lion fist , it can only be used from the arms an takes a little time for the to chakra change shape an take the form of lions , if hinata rushes with lions in hand neji can easily use his better mastery over jyuken chakra from his body to focus it in a way to manipulate her feet while he prepares to evade her strikes , similarly to this
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And this
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He can possible use this chakra to cause her to fallO , unbalance her or cause her to go air born then quicky finish her bein a master at jyuken is realy helpful in a battle like this , it can easily giv him the win , twin lion is at end of the day a linear move similar to standard jyuken , only with greater reach which neji can accurately read with his byakugan.
> Correct about Twin Lion Fists
> that it is overdoing it in shape of fanfic. I don't see how it could inject chakra in her without need to direct contact which is required and Lion fists would connect with his head before he can inject chakra in her.
> Possibly depending how thick that chakra filled area is. I meant it could only change and detect trajectory of incomming shoot daggers. Lion Fists seems to be above any of that.
> yes he can read it, but unless he put up Kaiten he is done for after strike from her with Lion fists. Also databook IV mentions ability to absorb chakra, which means if lion fists shaped fists clash with Kaiten then it may slowly absorb chakra from it while trying to pierce through it, unless it would blown her away along with it...
Also in terms of feats an databook his speed is way above hinata bein able tp react to things/people far quicker than anything she has an was even able to blitz kido before he could even shut his mouth , i hav never seen hinata blitz or react to somone as fast/strong as KN0 Naruto , nor has she recieved hype from top blitz kings lee/gai , neji's body speed is obviouly able to easily keep up with unweighted lee as is the requirments for keep up with somone at that speed (eyes plus body speed) as noted by neji's former punching bag , lee , he displayed this fact when he danced around naruto's clones without them even gettin a good look at him an was able to keep up with KN0 Naruto while sasuke with lee speed plus precog got taged in less than 5 minutes by naruto's base clones , SRA Neji is much faster , im sorry i cant simply jus hand his speed feats over to hinata an say she's about equal at least:-(
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Again air palm will be anticiped an avoided or nulled an avoided usin chakra , so she has no such advantage from it.
And twin lion fist , i already detailed how neji can easily deal with it , im sure by now u at least see my points an hope this scan can help open ur eyes widerO , read the words of the great black zetsu
> KNO Naruto's speed is far from being impressive in part 2 although. All I see is your opinion which I think I refuted.
> True, however all of these situations don't neglect feats of Hinata in part 2.
> She is on par with him in speed/reaction time which I proved.
> Vacuum palm argument I refuted it already.
> Twin Lion fists argument also was refuted by me, I won't repeat myself.
> I despise Black Zetsu, and think about him as useless garbage. He was just nothing but annoyance and no impressive feats from him prove my point.
> Of course he could be. However The gap of skills were dimnished by growth of Hinata's skills and chakra through part 2 U_U
> Yes she does if he doesn't put up Kaiten in time and she hit him directly, then yes he is KO-ed.
She us portrayed in the war arc to be way below neji who learned 64 palms by himself while hinata had him teaching her nd showing her the steps nd wat to do coulnt manage it till after his death ,the only thing she had on SRA Neji was air palm an twin lions an the only reason she had those over hom was because he had no one to teach him these things unlike hinata , its a fact that he's the most blessed/talented hyuga , hiruzen an hiashi made it clear , so those moves would of been cake walk for him to learn if he had the right teacher , this bloomed talent u speak of cant be gauged until we see her progress in the last before she awakens hamura's chakra.
I am as open minded about this as possible an without decent speed feats from her i cant jus place hinata at a higher speed than him , i jus cant:-( they walked different paths an builded different aspects of their overall prowes , like speed an defence in neji's case , cant jus pass on his speed feats to her in the same way i cant pass over his kaiten feats to her.
Neji can easily catch her offguard in CQC usin his chakra an speed as i explained above an it cant be argued.
She cant hit him with twin lions before he uses kaiten since her speed an reaction is below his an if she does get the chance to hit the initial kaiten , this would happen since neji can instantly expand a chakra dome if in any imediate danger to twin lions
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Givin hinata the bluntt of the damage bein the advancin force plus lacking defence or auto healing making neji the winner high diff , but i dont see this happening since she lacks the speed feats of enhanced KNO Naruto and SRA Neji is much stronger than that neji.
> The speed and reaction time got countered.
> However difference is that Naruto's clashed with neji's chakra layer with his barehands with small chakra layer around him on his own. The difference is that it was not focused, while in Twin lion fists the chakra is focused greatly in hands which add power and potency to attack. It is possible it breaks through or just blow up blasting hinata backwards depending if there are objects as trees she would be hurt but on open field she wouldn't be just being little stunned with chakra's leaving her hands or being dissolved.
She also wont catch neji after he rotats since she lacks any means to force neji to rotate nd he wont just randomly rotate for no reason , i already explained he deals with her air palms so that also not happening , unless u think she will launch air palm to which neji will rotate to block while she charges twin lions an blitz him? , na, aint happenin, giv the guy some credit he aint that dumb , in the end neji wins mid diff or they both lose at worse.B-)
> Correct. That is only issue so she would force to rotate with some attacks but It would be hard. The only bait I see working would vacuum palm spamming until he will be forced to rotate, but it would be risky and exhausting herself risking move.
> She can not blitz him probably but moving at the same speed she may barerly anticipate him with attack.
I agree with loosing both as the least what Hinata could achieve.
I respect ur opinion too but feats an logic shows that im more right than uO , i expect u would see this by now:-D , i see nd understand ur side but the manga just seems to disagree , only after seein "the last" an if hinata has yet to leatn kaiten would be the only time we can truly compair her bloomed talent to neji's talent which was hyped an praised by a number of top gun ninja like gai/kakashi/hiruzen an hiashi to name some , for now hinata is still below SRA Neji:-(.
That is great, I am not sure that you are more right then I am lol. Well if you can refute my arguments. So do I, also yeah I can not wait to see the last the movie and Hinata in it with progress she made. Correct with talent.
I am afraid she is either on par with him or barerly above at least once she is offence and has killing intent. At defence she most likely looses but this is not certain also.
OBD - Outskirts Battledome
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^^ proving my point about their;s speeds. Hinata's speed > part 1 Neji speed as Hinata's speed would almost reach part 2 Neji's speed.
