Jiraya was definitely Itachi's superior

[adeshina365]

What is it with Minato fans also being Naruto, Kakashi and Jiraiya fans...?

OT: More garbage from Bogard.

 

[Transcendence]

What is it with the Minato fans also being Naruto, Kakashi and Jiraiya fans...?

OT: More garbage from Bogard.

It's more of a minority case. There's a complex that Minato fans like Naruto/Kakashi/Jiraiya and Itachi fans like Sasuke/Orochimaru/Madara, just because of their relations in the manga; this also applies to Naruto and Sasuke fans with the mentioned characters above. It actually doesn't happen too much. Only in select cases.

 

[ReverseZero12]

I'll keep it short U_U

Jiraya is simply a perfect counter for him in almost everything

Ninjutsu

- Self explanatory. Rare are the people capable to compete with Jiraya in the category(high level katons, doton, sealing scrolls, hair offensive and defensive techniques, powerful summons with sennin techniques, and so on)

Genjutsu

While it's true Itachi is greater in the category, Jiraya already managed to counter Itachi's genjutsu in part1. He already knows the pre-requist to counter genjutsu(he is the one who taught it to Naruto, only that Naruto lacked skills back then. Genjutsu is also useless on clone and with his high chakra reserves, using clones are a piece of cake for him. He is also a adept summoning user and thus with the partner method, he is virtually immune to Itachi's genjutsus

In sennin mode, it's even easier since he receives sennin chakra continuously from an external source(Pa and Ma) and thus making the use of genjutsu useless

Also in SM, he has the strongest genjutsu in the manga(databook), so GG
Taijutsu

Itachi is superior in taijutsu, but it won't do much because of Jiraya's close, mid-long range ninjutsu versatility, his attack-defensive hair and so on. And in SM, he is clearly superior to Itachi with the increased power and speed boast to the point he is capable to reach the floor 20meters a way from him before his sandal touches him while taking his time preparing Chou Odama rasengan before, and with frog katas it's the game ender

Susanoo

It's useless against Yomi Numa since it can't protect from underground, not only that but even the yata mirror is useless against him because he uses senjutsu attacks, which is different from ninjutsu(yata's hype covers ninjutsu only)

Stamina

I think it's pretty clear Jiraya shits on Itachi in the category U_U

Side effects

Itachi can only use his most powerful moves(MS techniques) 3 or 4 times a day while alive when Jiraya can spam his moves without even breaking a sweat U_U

No wonder Itachi was scared of Jiraya in part1. He is Itachi's superior. Jiraya is so underrated on the base it's not even funny. He is the only sannin who managed to achieve SM, which has been described to be the counter-part of MS in this manga(Jiraya-Itachi, Kabuto-Sasuke/Itachi, Naruto-Sasuke, Hashirama-Madara).

Kabuto > Sasuke/Itachi
Naruto > Sasuke
Hashirama > Madara

So? Lol

Nice thread, although I skimmed through most of it lol. It's great to see that there are some people on this site who are actually logical. I come from youtube and mostly debate there and the noobs there are horrible. But here, it's worse.

It's funny when the manga states that itachi stated that he is inferior to jiraiya, yet people make such excuses such as "itachi lied". It's baffling. I'm not saying that if you say Itachi>Jiraiya, your a noob but at least back that up with logical facts.

I mean, I can understand, before jiraiya showed SM, it's almost obvious that itachi can't beat him. But with SM? It's simple who takes it. Of course, if itachi was healthy, he could potentially take it. But his stamina only puts him borderline top 10.

 

[adeshina365]

It's more of a minority case. There's a complex that Minato fans like Naruto/Kakashi/Jiraiya and Itachi fans like Sasuke/Orochimaru/Madara, just because of their relations in the manga; this also applies to Naruto and Sasuke fans with the mentioned characters above. It actually doesn't happen too much. Only in select cases.

Bogard is definitely one of the select cases.

 

[NewKageism]

I think Itachi could beat jman 6/10

Jman could beat Itachi 4/10

I say this because Itachi sickness would take him out. If Itachi was not sick or edo Itachi or a
Izanami Itachi he wins. Sasnaoo is standing up and conquering.

But Jman is no simple fight. Jman got intel on Itachi now. It is not the first time they met and if they meet again Jman is going to get ready.

Plus jman is going to go with the number game.

3 big toads just in case of susanoo, ma and pa for Itachi eyes , and they are battling. Which jman might score a victory

 

[KingHashirama]

Tsunade literally has no counter for Tsukuyomi at all. And this isn't a case of fan boyism or anything... She's slow and has no knowledge of Itachi's proficiency with it.

Jiraiya is debatable, but Itachi is clear cut given the responses on this thread.

Chakra disruption is a counter for Tsukuyomi. Though of course fans take Itachi's words over Jiraiya's a sanin has twice the experience of Itachi.

Her Blitzes have been faster then any of Itachi's. Yes a Sanin who has traveled the world has no information on a famous brat traitor, who is considered a strong ninja.


Itachi = overrated.

Again all dependent on Scenario. Tsunade's knowledge far exceeds Itachi's.

 

[Ababeel]

Her healing ANOTHER PERSON, has no effect on a battle seeing as the theoretical scenario is between her and Itachi. She can do it for others, but when Itachi uses it on her? She won't know. And by then she will be bisected quite easily before she can trigger Byakugou.

her seal can still heal her automatically. Also, you just being bias, so why did you make itachi automatically use his MS
and put her under his Genjutsu, and she will do nothing against that? Just for your information Tsunade fought 5 Susanoos and those clones have the EMS, and she did not fall for a Genjutsu or other things, why am I suppose to think
that Itachi is better than 5 of madara again?

making scenarios is not hard, Tsunade can beat him if she summoned her slug first as well. Itachi can't beat that slug!
See?

anyway, Tsunade CAN heal the effect from the Tsukuyomi, taking that from her is just being bias for Itachi to make
him look good with that jutsu. Zzz

or at least that's my opinion.

 

[Transcendence]

her seal can still heal her automatically. Also, you just being bias, so why did you make itachi automatically use his MS
and put her under his Genjutsu, and she will do nothing against that? Just for your information Tsunade fought 5 Susanoos and those clones have the EMS, and she did not fall for a Genjutsu or other things, why am I suppose to think
that Itachi is better than 5 of madara again?

making scenarios is not hard, Tsunade can beat him if she summoned her slug first as well. Itachi can't beat that slug!
See?

anyway, Tsunade CAN heal the effect from the Tsukuyomi, taking that from her is just being bias for Itachi to make
him look good with that jutsu. Zzz

or at least that's my opinion.

I'm not even biased. And you're comparing arguably the best Genjutsu user in the manga to a bunch of wood clones of someone who is not at Itachi's level? Yea...no.

 

[NewKageism]

her seal can still heal her automatically. Also, you just being bias, so why did you make itachi automatically use his MS
and put her under his Genjutsu, and she will do nothing against that? Just for your information Tsunade fought 5 Susanoos and those clones have the EMS, and she did not fall for a Genjutsu or other things, why am I suppose to think
that Itachi is better than 5 of madara again?

making scenarios is not hard, Tsunade can beat him if she summoned her slug first as well. Itachi can't beat that slug!
See?

anyway, Tsunade CAN heal the effect from the Tsukuyomi, taking that from her is just being bias for Itachi to make
him look good with that jutsu. Zzz

or at least that's my opinion.

See this right here. Jman got an arena of attacks he can fight with toe to toe with Itachi. Tsunade one slug. What is a slug a slow insect that spits acid... Going to really do

Sorry but he would play mind games with her. She might , just might disrupt an eye contact with her charka, but then again Itachi is fast with fighting. He uses clones when has the last time we seen Tsunade use clones?

He lay back and has distance skills. What is Tsunade going to do throw rocks? GG

 

[Tera Path]

I just remembered, Tsukuyomi actually 1 shots him.
But that is only Itachi's Tsukyomi.

(Text directly from the Wiki)
''Itachi's prowess with the technique has allowed him to alter the perception of time with ease within the genjutsu to make a few seconds seem like many days as a means to torture the target. This results in the victim suffering psychological trauma that incapacitates them for a considerable period of time''.

So his will would be completely demolished within seconds.
And don't say they will constantly be transmitting chakra so it won't happen.
Bee was constantly using chakra of Gyuuki, but he got hit in the genjutsu and was paralized for a few seconds.

So nevermind my last post, unless you want to have a nice fight that is genjutsu free.
Genjutsu included Itachi will mostlikely win instantaneously.

 

[NewKageism]

I just remembered, Tsukuyomi actually 1 shots him.
But that is only Itachi's Tsukyomi.

(Text directly from the Wiki)
''Itachi's prowess with the technique has allowed him to alter the perception of time with ease within the genjutsu to make a few seconds seem like many days as a means to torture the target. This results in the victim suffering psychological trauma that incapacitates them for a considerable period of time''.

So his will would be completely demolished within seconds.
And don't say they will constantly be transmitting chakra so it won't happen.
Bee was constantly using chakra of Gyuuki, but he got hit in the genjutsu and was paralized for a few seconds.

So nevermind my last post, unless you want to have a nice fight that is genjutsu free.
Genjutsu included Itachi will mostlikely win instantaneously.

Well they already met before in battle and you saw how fast Jman went for a summoning. What would stop him from starting with ma and pa first? This is not out of his character

 

[AGoodBoy]

her seal can still heal her automatically. Also, you just being bias, so why did you make itachi automatically use his MS
and put her under his Genjutsu, and she will do nothing against that? Just for your information Tsunade fought 5 Susanoos and those clones have the EMS, and she did not fall for a Genjutsu or other things, why am I suppose to think
that Itachi is better than 5 of madara again?

making scenarios is not hard, Tsunade can beat him if she summoned her slug first as well. Itachi can't beat that slug!
See?

anyway, Tsunade CAN heal the effect from the Tsukuyomi, taking that from her is just being bias for Itachi to make
him look good with that jutsu. Zzz

or at least that's my opinion.

I don't know why people always try to use these completely terrible arguments... Everytime someone talks about itachi they jump to sasuke or Madara. FYI, unlike Itachi, Sasuke and madara do not rely on genjutsu in their battles! Itachi is a genjutsu fighter first, ninjutsu second, taijutsu last resort! Madara is ninjutsu first, Taijutsu second, genjutsu last resort! Sasuke is Taijutsu first, Ninjutsu second, Genjutsu last resort! They're all completely and utterly different. It's essentially like comparing Naruto And karin's Sensing just because they're uchiha. It doesn't work like that. Just because it's in their arsenal, doesn't mean that they both specialise in it. Why is that so hard for some people to understand.

 

[naruttebayo]

well done bogard

you pissed off some itachi fans
again XD

 

[Tera Path]

Well they already met before in battle and you saw how fast Jman went for a summoning. What would stop him from starting with ma and pa first? This is not out of his character

Yeah he always goes for his summonings.
But going for Ma and Pa first would be exactly what he shouldn't do....
Considering he wouldn't be able to make other handsigns and would have to fight with his feet only.
But what's stopping Itachi from casting genjutsu on his summonings

 

[NewKageism]

Yeah he always goes for his summonings.
But going for Ma and Pa first would be exactly what he shouldn't do....
Considering he wouldn't be able to make other handsigns and would have to fight with his feet only.
But what's stopping Itachi from casting genjutsu on his summonings

Jiraya would just summon them back where they came from if they got stuck in a eye contact and the rest cont the battle. The remaining jman would tell them not to catch eye contact and focus on Suasano.
Jman until his sm is ready is pretty good fighting and running with his feet. He can also use his hair, fire and some other simple jutsu without hands.

 

[Bogard]

Ok as promised i replied 6 Paths

The fire will have spread all over the hair in mere seconds, at which point Jiraiya will have to deal with the fire by removing his hair somehow, which would in turn make him vulnerable.

You're assuming he'll get in Sage Mode, which I must say is a far-fetched assumption. In any case, evading the needles or counter attacking with a Fire Ball would not be hard at all, at which point Itachi could attack with the Amaterasu once again. A couple of needles are not going to protect him from the flames.

Yeah, no. A man on fire won't be able to casually pull out a scroll, make seals and remove the fire. Not to mention that Itachi will be standing just feats away, and I assure you, he's not going to let Jiraiya just quell the flames like that.

You also, for some reason, seem to assume that Jiraiya knows everything about the execution of the Amaterasu. He's seen the flames before, but when it comes to it's speed and execution, he's not knowledgeable at all as far as we know.

The hair is covering his entire body. The black flames would be attacking externally, so whether they spread or not would change nothing since Amaterasu black flames have no piercing power to pass through the hair. It's even more like when the flames are left on their own, they just stay on surfaces burning slowly(The flames left inside Jiraya's summon was burning fairly slowly after Itachi left, the flames left on the samurai were burning slowly, the flames left on Raikage's hand was burning slowly, the flames left on Juubi were burning slowly, and so on) to the point it doesn't even hurt at all.

It's only when the user focuses on a certain area puting it more and more power and chakra that it accelerates the burning process, so Amaterasu left outside Jiraya's hair barrier would change nothing since it won't touch Jiraya's body from an external point. Jiraya's needle senbon on the other hand requires no handseals, so it's easy for him to throw them away at any point in time. He may even use Amaterasu as a weapon for his own self and fire it back at Itachi. So in the end, it would only be Itachi the one at a disadvantage especially after risking all in such a jutsu having a heavy cost in his chakra reserve and stamina

Actually there is a great misconception concerning Jiraya's SM. It doesn't take long at all. There are some instances where we've seen Jiraya entering SM without Pa and Ma(during Naruto's training we see that in a FB). The reason it took so long to Jiraya was because he wanted to combine summoning Pa and Ma with the amphihian technique(summoning Pa and Ma directly on his body with unlimited Sage Mode):

You must be registered for see links

And eventhen it didn't took that long when you read the manga. It's in the anime that it looks as if it took forever. In the manga, it took 10page at most and i believe Jiraya has the fire power and aptitude to contain Itachi meanwhile

Concerning the sealing scroll i never said Jiraya would be drawing it during the fight. It's a weapon he carries with him already as a preparation like kunais and so on. All he would need to do is release it if he feels the need and it will seal the fire(in case he is covered by it)

And concerning Jiraya's knowledge, as stated i base it on the fact he studied the jutsu and Naruto knew the process and dangerosity of the technique, all that leading to the fact it's Jiraya the one who told him about it since he was training Naruto against Itachi's techniques

 

[Tera Path]

Jiraya would just summon them back where they came from if they got stuck in a eye contact and the rest cont the battle. The remaining jman would tell them not to catch eye contact and focus on Suasano.
Jman until his sm is ready is pretty good fighting and running with his feet. He can also use his hair, fire and some other simple jutsu without hands.

That's kind of hax if he just reverse summons them and then re-summons them fully regenerated.

 

[NewKageism]

That's kind of hax if he just reverse summons them and then re-summons them fully regenerated.

I do not know if he would re summon them. They might be knocked out like Kakashi was, but the others would know not to do what that one did. But then again it might not have the same effect on a summon or summon of that size.