[Spoilers] Jigen's Identity

Lukecetion

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SUMMARY
A lot of people are adamant that the person we see a hologram of when Sasuke is exploring the Otsutsuki Shrine and the leader of Kara, Jigen are two different people. Because of the somewhat mystery revolving around this people have drawn different conclusions and made their own theories. I am here to offer my own views and knowledge regarding this and I aim to explain why Jigen and this "mysterious" Otsutsuki member are one and the same.


THE HORNS
The first evidence that these two are the same person lies in their designs, specifically the horns the both of them spout on their head. The horns on Otsutsuki Hologram is shaped in a "V" shape starting from around the bottom of the neck, around the Cervical Vertebrae with something alike scales covering the bottom based of where the horns originate from. The angle we see the hologram from makes it hard to see if there are two horns, one half and one whole or just one horn. I can with (some certainty) say that this individual possess only one horn and not one of each side of the head. This is backup with how the angle of the left side of the "horn" is drawn along with the symbol on the shrine that represents this individual.

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This symbol depicts the horn shape of each individual. Kaguya for example is portrayed with two symmetrical horns that looks like "ears" which speaks to her inspiration as the "Rabbit Goddess". While the one for this Otsutsuki Member and Kaguya's alleged partner shows a hammer like shape from the front with only a single horn coming out of the right side. This fits with what we see of the Otsutsuki hologram. When we see Jigen starting to transform, his Karma grows to cover his entire body and a horn starts to shape on his right side with what appears to be the a broken horn. This also fits with the hologram and symbol that we've seen already.

THE SYMBOL
We know a few things for certain, for example, each Otsutsuki Shrine has a symbol dedicated to each member in the shrine as noted above. The one for the "unknown" member takes shape as a "Hammer" with a single horn on the right side. We see this symbol one other place in the manga so far and its in Chapter 36 when Jigen is about to arrive.

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When Jigen uses Kawaki's Karma to teleport to his location a symbol manifests on Kawaki. This symbol being the same as the one we saw on the Otsutsuki Shrine further connecting the two characters by more than just looks and assumed power level. As other people have noted however, this could just mean that the two people possess the same power from the same source and that the Karma has been passed down for decades and now it has passed down to Kawaki. This notion is built upon a single panel from the manga which we will talk about next.

TRANSFORMATION
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Because of the panel above people drew the conclusion that when fully released, the Karma that Kawaki has would transform him into the same person we see a Hologram of, at least in terms of looks. They draw this conclusion from the fact that Kawaki grows a horn like we've seen Jigen do and the hologram possess. This is a wildly inaccurate conclusion to draw from this however, which have already been outlined a bit earlier in this thread. Though to sum that up.
  • The Otsutuki Shrine depicts the "Unknown" Shrine symbol as a "hammer" with a single horn on the right side.
  • When Jigen transforms he gains a single horn on the right side, lacking one of the left.
  • In both Jigen and the "Unknown" transformation the horn grows from the back of their head, in a "V" shape from the Cervical Vertebrae.
These are all different with Kawaki however so let us sum those up quickly too.
  • Kawaki grows a single horn on the left side, lacking one on the right side.
  • Kawaki's horn originates from his forehead and grows backwards as opposed to outward from the neck area as seen in Jigen and the "Unknown".
What this means is that their transformation are different. Jigen and Kawaki transform differently, where as Jigen and the "unknown" transforms in the same manner to look the same.

KARMA
As a extra note in regards to the two Karma in question, that being Jigen and Kawaki. They are different in design upon activation. While Kawaki possess lines with sharp and pointing ends like spears, Jigen possesses lines with a flat end like a rectangle.

CONCLUSION
Jigen and the Otsutsuki Hologram we see at the shrine are the same person, not different people with the same power. As seen with Kawaki, when the power is passed down the power manifests differently, not identically.
 
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Yahcob13

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Its difficult to say which is which. We know Kawaki isn't Otsutsuki and he can transform just like Jigen does. Although Jigen's dojutsu makes me wonder if he is human or not im guessing he's at least part alien.
 

Lukecetion

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Its difficult to say which is which. We know Kawaki isn't Otsutsuki and he can transform just like Jigen does. Although Jigen's dojutsu makes me wonder if he is human or not im guessing he's at least part alien.
Physical transformation doesn't mean that someone is an Otsutsuki or an Alien. It means they are capable of such feats through the application of chakra as seen in the following (but not limited to them only):

  • Juugo
  • Sasuke
  • Orochimaru
  • Kimimaro
  • Sakon
  • Ukon
  • Jirobo
  • Kidomaru
  • Tayuya
  • Naruto (Tailed Beast Cloak prior to control)
  • Kisame
  • Obito
  • Madara
  • Momoshiki
All of which have some form of transformation that causes a physical change in the body through the application of chakra. They are all not Otsutsuki, and they are certainly not Jigen's clones. Kawaki and Jigen's transformation are both different in design and (from what we know) application.
 

Yahcob13

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The difference in their transformation probably has to do with how advanced their skill is with karma seals. Since Jigen is like a master he is far more advanced than Kawaki therefore his transformation is far more developed.
 

Lukecetion

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The difference in their transformation probably has to do with how advanced their skill is with karma seals. Since Jigen is like a master he is far more advanced than Kawaki therefore his transformation is far more developed.
We're not talking about their abilities, but how it manifests. For example, a Perfect Susano'o requires immense chakra control and ability to be used. Now if you aren't good at that you will only manifest a partial Susano'o without a complete shape. When you fully master it you manifest the entire body. However, depending on the user, the Perfect Susano'o is different and has different traits. Even if the Sharingan that cast the Susano'o along with the chakra of the original Sharingan over is used, the ability is different because its a different user.

We see this with Kakashi who is using Obito's Sharingan with Obito's chakra. Yet the Susano'o takes on the shape of Kakashi's traits rather than Obito's. Its not Kakashi's power, but Obito's power cast through Kakashi as a proxy. In the same regard if Jigen is using someone else's power as a proxy then his powers would appear differently at max level like the Susano'o. Yet it doesn't. Hence it falls to reason that Jigen isn't a proxy but the original user.

In Kawaki's case he uses a Karma that is located on a different part of his body, it manifests with different lines and alters his body in a different way (a different type of horn). Another example of this is how the Curse Mark worked by manifesting differently in different people despite it being the same power.
 

wanderingcactus

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I will still be skeptical about this as there are many contradicting facts about KP (Kaguya's Partner).

KP SHOULD be a celestial like the rest of the Otsutsukis that has come. It can be arguable that he is human as Hagoromo and Hamura are a hybrid. Although Kishimoto has not and never will discuss their origins. Ikemoto can retcon that or give a reason in the future, until then, Hagoromo and Hamura are half-human from a human father, presumably.


If Jigen is the father, it makes sense that Hagoromo and Hamura are hybrid. You also stated previously that Jigen may be pretending or is forced to be a human. This could be plausible as well.

If Jigen is a celestial turned human, we obviously know that he can morph back into a celestial. Which begs to question, why is he so keen into making vessel candidates? If he truly is a celestial, he surely can make them without going the Orochimaru route.

Speaking of Orochimaru, the karma (Kawaki's) storyline is so far similar to Part 1 Orochimaru's curse seal. We all know that he gave everyone that could carry them the seal so that he could revive himself. I see this as a possible route that Ikemoto is taking with Karma. So far, there are a lot of similarities so it is still a good theory, for me at the very least.

We know that curse seal carriers can be different types of demons. Most notably Sasuke's final transformation with the wings and whatnot.

Each one of them are different but still remains that Orochimaru can come out of the seal. I believe that KP and Jigen are 2 different people and Jigen is just like Kabuto. He is extremely similar to Orochimaru and yet are completely 2 different people.

I do like the theory though but it is simply offsetted through Part 1 parallels and the fact that Kawaki's transformation may only be a beginning phase. We won't know if it would still take shape of the Hammer or it would grow into what it looks like now.

Jigen seemed shocked of Kawaki's progress meaning that there are stages that Karma inheritors go through.
 

LightSo6p

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Madara transformed into kaguya( even though it wasn’t willingly) but this could be something like that and the reason he need a vessel maybe because his body can’t handle the full power, I think the juubi is the otsutsuki jigen turned into. Do people think that jigen have a dojutsu I just always thought they were his regular eyes lol
 

wanderingcactus

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Madara transformed into kaguya( even though it wasn’t willingly) but this could be something like that and the reason he need a vessel maybe because his body can’t handle the full power, I think the juubi is the otsutsuki jigen turned into. Do people think that jigen have a dojutsu I just always thought they were his regular eyes lol
Maybe Jigen isn't willing to be the vessel for KP's resurrection?
Also his eyes are weird. Much like a reverse Byakugan. Its huge iris and the only difference about it is that it is black instead of being white.
 
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