[VS] Itachi Vs Six Paths of Pein

[Forbidden Technique]

More of me asking how does 6POP defeat a hypothetical 'healthy' MS Itachi. I admittedly don't know everything about them, so I can't confidently say that Itachi wins, but I don't see how he doesn't.

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but; 6POP is significantly hindered in comparison to Nagato, right? All of his abilities are split into 6 different entities, and Deva Path can't even go all out. With the other Paths still functioning and on the battlefield, he can't use CST and CT without destroying the other Paths... Right?

Some other quick points/questions;

1. Does visual genjutsu affect all the Paths at once, given shared vision?
2. V4 Susano'o + Yata should definitely tank CST right?
3. The CT core can be destroyed before developing, given Itachi's knowledge (Amaterasu/Totsuka/Magatamas)?
4. Both have full knowledge, who wins? Itachi is alive and healthy

 

[EZQ]

1. Does visual genjutsu affect all the Paths at once, given shared vision? This is on the DoU questions thread. It was explained, i don't remember the veredict but i think that Apex or Haizaki explained it well. If you ask me right now, it does affect them.

2. V4 Susano'o + Yata should definitely tank CST right? Its gravitational control. Susano gets pushed back regardless of Yata mirror. Susano gets pushed back, but Itachi still survives. Then he takes advantage of the long time gap after using CST.


3. The CT core can be destroyed before developing, given Itachi's knowledge (Amaterasu/Totsuka/Magatamas)? Well Nagato's (which is a lot stronger than Deva path) was destroyed by TBB + FRS + Magatamas. If Itachi starts without knowledge, it's canon that he'd take a minute to understand how to destroy the core, which by that time would be pretty big, so i don't think he can destroy it by himself. If he starts with knowledge then he destroys it when it's small. Anyways Itachi would break free from it with v4 susano.

4. Both have full knowledge, who wins? Itachi is alive and healthy

Oh here's the knowledge. I'm leaning towards Itachi, tho i don't know a lot about Pain. But Itachi's V3 can tank CT and CST.

 

[Forbidden Technique]

3. The CT core can be destroyed before developing, given Itachi's knowledge (Amaterasu/Totsuka/Magatamas)? Well Nagato's (which is a lot stronger than Deva path) was destroyed by TBB + FRS + Magatamas. If Itachi starts without knowledge, it's canon that he'd take a minute to understand how to destroy the core, which by that time would be pretty big, so i don't think he can destroy it by himself. If he starts with knowledge then he destroys it when it's small. Anyways Itachi would break free from it with v4 susano.

4. Both have full knowledge, who wins? Itachi is alive and healthy

Oh here's the knowledge. I'm leaning towards Itachi, tho i don't know a lot about Pain. But Itachi's V3 can tank CT and CST.

And even so, that was given a decent amount of time to develop before getting busted by TBB, FRS, and a Magatama. Without knowledge, Itachi should swiftly destroy it. So we pretty much agree on all terms here. You really think a V3 susano'o can tank and bust out of CT? How?

 

[EZQ]

And even so, that was given a decent amount of time to develop before getting busted by TBB, FRS, and a Magatama. Without knowledge, Itachi should swiftly destroy it. So we pretty much agree on all terms here. You really think a V3 susano'o can tank and bust out of CT? How?

Naruto's 6tk broke free from it as i remember. Maybe not v3 but v4 definitely does break from it.

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When naruto reached the 8th stage, the force of CT didn't even affect him anymore

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In that state naruto is stronger than Itachi's v4. But, considering that Naruto broke out with just swipping his tails, Itachi would break from it with several susano sword slashes.

In other words, Itachi with some effort, can overpower the CT force as Naruto did like nothing.

 

[KidGamer65]

1. Genjutsu won't affect all of them. They perceive through the other pain's eyes like one would look through a security screen. Jiraiya used this exact example I believe.

2. Yes. CST is too widespread to do major damage to him and I don't think that focusing into a single direction (not a single spot like some believe) is going to push it from not killing Katsuyu protected people to busting V4 Susanoo AND Yata Mirror at the same time. If it were just V4 then it'd probably break. I don't see it breaking Susanoo, Yata AND mortally wounding Itachi in the process so even if Susanoo is done or almost done, Itachi reforms it and opens the rapeshed on powerless Deva. I could be wrong though.

3. The moment the core appears is when it's at it's weakest, so while it's traveling upwards Itachi could fire a Magatama (Sharingan tracks it's trajectory allowing him to catch up to it before it reaches it's peak height) or he could just save himself the trouble and use Amaterasu.

4. Honestly, the only things that will finish Itachi off are CT and CST, and I don't think CST is busting Susanoo, Yata and killing Itachi all at once nor do I think he gets CT off. Preta Path ain't gonna help either since Itachi would just murk it without using chakra. If Pain wants to win he'll need to get Chibaku Tensei off, because Itachi isn't breaking out when it takes an almost full power Kyuubi to bust out of it, and unless Itachi's V4 is near Sasuke's PS in power (which it's not) Pain traps him. Not to mention Pain was about to up the power of CT. He'll survive it though....but is rendered incapacitated and will eventually suffocate and die.

So basically, if Deva gets CT off, it's GG no re. If he doesn't, Itachi murks them. The other paths aren't doing jack to Itachi for obvious reasons and using CST is pretty much an auto loss unless someone can show me why CST would bust through Yata, Susanoo AND kill Itachi in a single shot.

 

[Forbidden Technique]

1. Genjutsu won't affect all of them. They perceive through the other pain's eyes like one would look through a security screen. Jiraiya used this exact example I believe.

2. Yes. CST is too widespread to do major damage to him and I don't think that focusing into a single direction (not a single spot like some believe) is going to push it from not killing Katsuyu protected people to busting V4 Susanoo AND Yata Mirror at the same time. If it were just V4 then it'd probably break. I don't see it breaking Susanoo, Yata AND mortally wounding Itachi in the process so even if Susanoo is done or almost done, Itachi reforms it and opens the rapeshed on powerless Deva. I could be wrong though.

3. The moment the core appears is when it's at it's weakest, so while it's traveling upwards Itachi could fire a Magatama (Sharingan tracks it's trajectory allowing him to catch up to it before it reaches it's peak height) or he could just save himself the trouble and use Amaterasu.

4. Honestly, the only things that will finish Itachi off are CT and CST, and I don't think CST is busting Susanoo, Yata and killing Itachi all at once nor do I think he gets CT off. Preta Path ain't gonna help either since Itachi would just murk it without using chakra. If Pain wants to win he'll need to get Chibaku Tensei off, because Itachi isn't breaking out when it takes an almost full power Kyuubi to bust out of it, and unless Itachi's V4 is near Sasuke's PS in power (which it's not) Pain traps him. Not to mention Pain was about to up the power of CT. He'll survive it though....but is rendered incapacitated and will eventually suffocate and die.

So basically, if Deva gets CT off, it's GG no re. If he doesn't, Itachi murks them. The other paths aren't doing jack to Itachi for obvious reasons and using CST is pretty much an auto loss unless someone can show me why CST would bust through Yata, Susanoo AND kill Itachi in a single shot.

And by using CT and CST, he'd be also sacrificing the other Paths as well right? Don't recall for CT, but they had to be removed from the battlefield for CST. Overall, Itachi seems to have a much better success rate. Does this also apply with Nagato? Or is his power so much stronger then the 6POP

 

[Apêx1]

To use CT in the first place Deva would need to be close to Nagato, which is unlikely. But assuming he is, I don't see why Amaterasu wouldn't instantly stop it if Itachi has intel on it.

Genjutsu is also effective to stop the Paths on by one. They only see what Itachi allows them to see whilst controlling their brain, so they won't get the vision the other Paths have. So if by chance Itachi makes eye contact with Deva Path, a simple Tsukiyomi would instantly end him and then the rest of the Paths are as good as dead. He can replace himself with a Crow Bunshin that's made of the crow which has the Sharingan and once Deva uses BT on the clone, the clone could disperse into those crows and put Deva into Genjutsu. Naruto in Base already stalemated Deva in CQC so I'd say Itachi utterly destroys him in a CQC confrontation.

To your other point, Nagato by himself destroys Itachi.

 

[EZQ]

1. Genjutsu won't affect all of them. They perceive through the other pain's eyes like one would look through a security screen. Jiraiya used this exact example I believe.

2. Yes. CST is too widespread to do major damage to him and I don't think that focusing into a single direction (not a single spot like some believe) is going to push it from not killing Katsuyu protected people to busting V4 Susanoo AND Yata Mirror at the same time. If it were just V4 then it'd probably break. I don't see it breaking Susanoo, Yata AND mortally wounding Itachi in the process so even if Susanoo is done or almost done, Itachi reforms it and opens the rapeshed on powerless Deva. I could be wrong though.

3. The moment the core appears is when it's at it's weakest, so while it's traveling upwards Itachi could fire a Magatama (Sharingan tracks it's trajectory allowing him to catch up to it before it reaches it's peak height) or he could just save himself the trouble and use Amaterasu.

4. Honestly, the only things that will finish Itachi off are CT and CST, and I don't think CST is busting Susanoo, Yata and killing Itachi all at once nor do I think he gets CT off. Preta Path ain't gonna help either since Itachi would just murk it without using chakra. If Pain wants to win he'll need to get Chibaku Tensei off, because Itachi isn't breaking out when it takes an almost full power Kyuubi to bust out of it, and unless Itachi's V4 is near Sasuke's PS in power (which it's not) Pain traps him. Not to mention Pain was about to up the power of CT. He'll survive it though....but is rendered incapacitated and will eventually suffocate and die.

So basically, if Deva gets CT off, it's GG no re. If he doesn't, Itachi murks them. The other paths aren't doing jack to Itachi for obvious reasons and using CST is pretty much an auto loss unless someone can show me why CST would bust through Yata, Susanoo AND kill Itachi in a single shot.

Didn't you argue that Susano breaks off CT? I recall you convinced me of this at some thread.

 

[ARGUS]

1. Does visual genjutsu affect all the Paths at once, given shared vision?

No it doesnt. They are dead bodies, and nagato himself is controlling them from far away.
He breaks them out, just how partner method does.

2. V4 Susano'o + Yata should definitely tank CST right?

Unsure about how much of a defense yata gives. but V4 probably gets busted
a widespread CST eradicated the entire konoha, which puts it comfortably at mountain level, perhaps even higher
focusing onto just the direction of itachi himself, busts V4 open. as the force isnt distributed to such a large area.
unless V4 susanoo can tank something on the level of a TBB, then CST eradicates it.

yata might protect him, or itachi himself might be protected from it

3. The CT core can be destroyed before developing, given Itachi's knowledge (Amaterasu/Totsuka/Magatamas)?

not seeing how amatearsu can cut it. the core would be covered in rocks rather quickly.
and if all itachi really needed was amaterasu to stop it then he would have done that, not asked naruto and bee to fire off their strongest long range techniques
then theres the amatearsu nerf of it failing to burn thrrough zetsu and samurai armor

magatamas are too weak to have an affect. esp when a KN6 TBB was tanked with no significant damage

4. Both have full knowledge, who wins? Itachi is alive and healthy

Pein would win by CT
itachi cant break free and he isnt busting it open. he eventually runs out of air and dies

restrict CT and Itachi probably wins,
--amatearsu mows down summons
--susanoo mows down every path bar preta and possibly deva in close quarters
--he survives CST and weakened deva gets one shotted by totsuka
--preta eventually gets a kunai stabbed through his neck

 

[Apêx1]

No it doesnt. They are dead bodies, and nagato himself is controlling them from far away.
He breaks them out, just how partner method does.

Unsure about how much of a defense yata gives. but V4 probably gets busted
a widespread CST eradicated the entire konoha, which puts it comfortably at mountain level, perhaps even higher
focusing onto just the direction of itachi himself, busts V4 open. as the force isnt distributed to such a large area.
unless V4 susanoo can tank something on the level of a TBB, then CST eradicates it.

yata might protect him, or itachi himself might be protected from it



not seeing how amatearsu can cut it. the core would be covered in rocks rather quickly.
and if all itachi really needed was amaterasu to stop it then he would have done that, not asked naruto and bee to fire off their strongest long range techniques
then theres the amatearsu nerf of it failing to burn thrrough zetsu and samurai armor

magatamas are too weak to have an affect. not when a KN6 TBB was tanked with no significant damage



Pein would win, CT GG
itachi cant break free and he isnt busting it open. he runs out of air and dies

Pls read manga, by your logic Nagato is mentally retarded because he forgot to break them out from Jiraiya's Sound Genjutsu.
Didn't use Ama on it because he was seeing it for the first time, and by then it was too late. With intel he could use it before any rock reaches from the ground to the sky. Any rock that comes to it, assuming the core is still in tact, would instantly melt.

 

[KidGamer65]

And by using CT and CST, he'd be also sacrificing the other Paths as well right? Don't recall for CT, but they had to be removed from the battlefield for CST. Overall, Itachi seems to have a much better success rate. Does this also apply with Nagato? Or is his power so much stronger then the 6POP

If he didn't bother to get them out of the area before using those moves then yes. Otherwise they'd just be turned off for a little while. And his power is much greater when he's using his original body, and the weakness of getting rid of one body equating getting rid of an entire ability doesn't apply. So he'd probably be able to get CT off and/or ward off most of his attempts at destroying it. Or maybe CST would be strong enough to actually kill him, or at least weaken him enough so that Nagato can use the other abilities he has to end Itachi.

Didn't you argue that Susano breaks off CT? I recall you convinced me of this at some thread.

Pretty sure it wasn't V4 Susanoo.

 

[ARGUS]

Pls read manga, by your logic Nagato is mentally retarded because he forgot to break them out from Jiraiya's Sound Genjutsu.

Frog Song seals the nerves and body of the paths into a completely different dimension.

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nagatos connection with the paths was broken once the paths were caught

itachis genjutsu wont sever nagatos link with the paths. and it wont affect them mentally since they have no brain and are mere corpses

Didn't use Ama on it because he was seeing it for the first time, and by then it was too late. With intel he could use it before any rock reaches from the ground to the sky. Any rock that comes to it, assuming the core is still in tact, would instantly melt.

the heat of amatearsu:
--failed to burn through zetsu
--failed to burn through KN0 shroud
--failed to burn through the fodder samurai armor

the heat of a KN6 TBB explosion had 0 affect on CT. and by feats is far stronger than that of amaterasu.
given the powerful gravitational pull of CT. its going to require a seriously powerful heat to cancel it out. and amatearsu lacks the feats to suggest that it can do such thing

 

[EZQ]

If he didn't bother to get them out of the area before using those moves then yes. Otherwise they'd just be turned off for a little while. And his power is much greater when he's using his original body, and the weakness of getting rid of one body equating getting rid of an entire ability doesn't apply. So he'd probably be able to get CT off and/or ward off most of his attempts at destroying it. Or maybe CST would be strong enough to actually kill him, or at least weaken him enough so that Nagato can use the other abilities he has to end Itachi.



Pretty sure it wasn't V4 Susanoo.

It was on the Itachi + Minato vs Nagato thread so i doubt it was something above it.

:Remember i was the judge?

 

[KidGamer65]

It was on the Itachi + Minato vs Nagato thread so i doubt it was something above it.

:Remember i was the judge?

Oh, that. I didn't say that Susanoo breaks out of CT, I said Susanoo protects them so that Minato can warp out.

 

[Haizaki]

- Not sure about Genjutsu though

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and I believe the chakra being passed through the rods can snap him out of it as it's disruption from a third party.

- CT is a big problem for Itachi but Pain seems to have control of this as it doesn't attract him or the surrounding ground he stands on compared to the others so he may actually be able to control what it attracts and what it doesn't.

 

[EZQ]

Oh, that. I didn't say that Susanoo breaks out of CT, I said Susanoo protects them so that Minato can warp out.

Oooh yeah i remember

 

[Apêx1]

Frog Song seals the nerves and body of the paths into a completely different dimension.

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nagatos connection with the paths was broken once the paths were caught

itachis genjutsu wont sever nagatos link with the paths. and it wont affect them mentally since they have no brain and are mere corpses

What the actual fuk? WHERE did you even get all this bullshit? Nowhere in that scan is sealing even written. It says their mind is drawn in to a GENJUTSU world. That's like EVERY OTHER Genjutsu. Where did you get this bullshit about nerves? That's Frog Call, not Frog Song boy, please read the shit you give others as 'evidence' of your statements. This is ridiculous reading comprehension on your part if you actually read that and still gave me it. Nothing in that DB distinguishes it from any other Genjutsu.

the heat of amatearsu:
--failed to burn through zetsu
--failed to burn through KN0 shroud
--failed to burn through the fodder samurai armor

the heat of a KN6 TBB explosion had 0 affect on CT. and by feats is far stronger than that of amaterasu.
given the powerful gravitational pull of CT. its going to require a seriously powerful heat to cancel it out. and amatearsu lacks the feats to suggest that it can do such thing

God damn. What the hell? Amaterasu instantly one shotted a summon which could take FRS without being cut up

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. It had enough eat to dispose of several of the Hachibi's limbs overall a long period of time despite him being capable of surviving TBB. It had enough heat to destroy Kidomaru's webs instantly even though Sasuke's Chidori Sword can't cut through it. It reverted Kabuto's cave with heat alone and has a tremendous amount of hype. But since you'd like to take the "FEATS or GTFO route" then how about I get some durability feats performed by the CT orb. No feats, that's right. The orb feels none of the pressure exerted by the rock in the same way the Gedo and all 9 Bijuu felt no pressure from being the cores of CT.

 

[TheJinx]

Kotoamatsukami GG