Thats the thing that feat brings Mihawk down with Vista because Mihawk didn't shown anything top tier worthy, Vista showed us later on that he can't hurt an Admiral even when hes not looking, imagine Akainu aiming at Vista...if he fails to hurt him during a cheapshot he's not faring any better when Akainu is focusing on him, Marco shown he can we can't make up imaginary situations.
The only one making imaginary and illogical situations here is you. You are making zero sense whatsoever. Fact of the matter is, failing once does not mean you will always fail. All it means is that at that time his haki was not enough, as we've already seen with twice with Whitebeard. He was the strongest man in the world and because he failed that those two times he would always fail meaning he's not the strongest man because he can't beat the Admirals. Marco has already proven this as well. Stop being so dense.
Vista is in the general level of the M3, Ace stopped a named Aokiji attack. An Admiral took him seriously but then we saw what happens when you push your luck. If Ace had left the war after he clashed with Aokiji would I say oh Ace is a top tier?
Vista fought and Ace stopped one attack, so no Ace would not be a top tier if he left. Big, big, big difference right there. Hyouzou stopped a named Luffy attack, is he now at Luffy's general level? No, likewise neither is Ace a top tier like Vista.
No he wasn't helping Marco afterwards for a reason, him and the other commanders were non factors a top tier can only stop a top tier, people in the tiers below will only be a hindrance in that type of battle. If you honestly believe Vista was a top tier where was he in the war? Lol a top tier doesn't get one shotted against another top tier (Aokiji freezing Jozu) and Vista is below Jozu there is no arguing that.
You admitted yourself that Mihawk is a top tier and we've seen how Vista was able to protect Luffy from him like Marco told to and actually fight the man, that's what he was up to. So, how come you are saying Vista is non factor against Akainu? That is illogical, because Akainu is also a top tier and on top of that Vista had Marco there with him, greatly increasing his chance of beating killing Akainu. What we can logically deduce is that he became preoccupied with another guy - or that he left Marco for Akainu so that he can check on Ace or help another crewmate. Aokiji was able to one shot Jozu because he caught him off guard with 1 hit KO devil fruit. Law can do that to people in his general level, but some of them can't even if they would have been stronger.
No it is not. Jozu managed to injure Aokiji (make him bleed) showing that his BH can get past Aokiji's logia intagibility and haki armor, yet Vista's BH wasn't enough to get past Akainu's who is powerscaled to Aokiji. It does not get clearer than this.
Failing once = / = always failing. We have several examples of people failing at one point and succeeding at another. That's the great defence of the Admirals intagibility. People stronger than Vista failed more times than once - it's understandable that Vista would have more trouble getting past Admiral intagibility than his crewmates.
He is a top tier but he barely makes it because he lacks offence that rivals the other top tiers I mean the guy couldn't injure Akainu with a cheapshot, a top tier should be able to get the better of another top tier or at the least be able to damage another top tier with a freebie, thing is Marco's defense is so good that none of the Admirals managed to injure him either so he makes up for it, thus he is the lowest of top tiers. Jozu is not there he got OHKO'd by Aokiji (distraction or not a top tier should not get OHKOd) , Vista and Ace are definite no nos.
The Admirals failed to damage him. Going with that logic, neither are they top tiers. Listen, what Marco clearly lacks is AoE like Sanji, but that doesn't mean his attacks are not strong enough to damage an Admiral. Is Sanji weak that he can't damage Luffy/Zoro etc in a fight? His AoE does not rival theirs, but their defence does not rival his. It's beyond pathetic to say that the second best man after an Emperor Captain lacks an offence. This is not any Emperor crew either, it's Whitebeard's crew the man who was as strong as Roger. Marco, Jozu, Vista are definitely top tiers(according to your definition) and Ace is a big no.
No he cannot fight WB, nothing implies he can tank a quake punch. 1 Quake punch and Vista is a goner. WB stomps not low diff.
Yes there is. Vista can give the people of similar level such as the Admirals and Emperors run for their money, so ofcourse one quake is not taking him out. Unless this quake punch is done when Vista is caught off guard, in which case I could see Vista dying seeing as Akainu almost got K.O. You might as well say Whitebeard would stomp Jozu, Mihawk, Aokiji too.
Ok but we have no idea how serious Mihawk was, and im gonna keep bringing this up Croc came in and clashed with Mihawk stopped him from going after Luffy, we dont say Croc is a top tier for that do we? Like you said, Mihawk wasn't taking Croc seriously or w/e that is biased as it can be pointed to him no taking Vista seriously either. Mihawk having trouble with Vista is actually one of the issues with Mihawk and his portrayel in MF, he had trouble with a Yonkous 4th man.
What implies he wasn't serious? He said himself he would be fool if he didn't know somoene like Vista, praised him and also was the one that suggested to have a duel against him another time. That's what Oda was portraying there. That Mihawk would need to put in effort to beat Vista, in the same way he had Jozu defeated because of a distractions. That how strong WB's 2nd and 3rd best are.
No no they would not both the Admirals and Yonkou including WB stomp him, its not up for debate 1 quake Vista's game over, 1 ice time Vistas game over, seriousl even Jozu got KO'd off one attack....and he showed in his cheapshot that he can injure an Admiral while Vista showed in his cheapshot that he couldn't, what makes you think Vista isn't getting one shotted, if even Jozu did?
If Mihawk could not stomp him, the Admirals and Emperors can not. We know that if Zoro can fodderize someone, so can Luffy, Sanji and people in their general level. Like I said before, failing once does not mean always failing as we've seen it happen to stronger people than Vista. One hit K.O devil fruit is the reason why Aokiji managed to do that to Jozu - durability means jack shit against him like Law, who can 1OHKO people similar level as him like how he did to an off guard Sanji.
No it is not impossible, its impossible that its anything higher, even saying low diff is blasphemous, as it stands Jozu is in another league already but heres the game changer, Jozu is a swordsmans living breathing weakness, Mihawk's slash in which he didn't hold back with couldn't scratch Jozu....are you actually implying Vista can dish out a stronger slash than that? Vista is not putting a scratch on Jozu. Its a stomp.
Yes, it impossible. Mihawk, who according to you is top tier and Jozu who according to you is below that level, couldn't fodderize him. Blasphemous is saying otherwise and that Jozu is on another league when that is not true at all.
How did you come to the conclusion that Jozu is n another level? Firstly, long ranged attacks are weaker than direct hit attacks. Secondly, that slash travelled a long distance. Thirdly, while that was a strong attack from Mihawk because it's against WB and all, he's able to dish stronger than those becase 1) Oda was holding back the top tiers in the war, 2) a direct hit would be stronger 3) diamond man is what stopped it - it wasn't intended for him. Therefore, Vista could dish stronger attacks by using a direct hit instead. Let's also not forget that Jozu no longer has an arm.
Yes its not my bad. Jozu just has an overwhelming advantage and add in the fact that he is already stronger to begin with.
Yeah, and Blackbeard was not only stronger than Ace but he also had the overwhelming advantage yet that didn't help him to stomp him, same case here. A top tier simply can't be tossed by another one top tier.
Na Sengoku is not that strong actually I believe he couldn't push one of the logia trio to high, mid-high at most. And again I'm basing this off of what Mihawk has shown.
What's that baseless assumption based on? Rayleigh who comes from the same generation as Sengoku was inactive for over 2 decades and he managed to stalemate an Admiral and espace from him as well. It's uncertain wether that said Admiral can even defeat him, like some other top tiers. Sengoku is in a better shape than Rayleigh and he was the former partner of Garp.
Okay?
No I havent changed my mind, its just that my wishes and beliefs mean squat here. Here I need evidence, and the evidence works against me here if I made that claim.
No, it would not. Like I said above, it's uncertain wether some top tiers such as the Admirals can even beat Rayleigh and he's weaker than Mihawk.
See this is just a total 100% opinion Oda did not show it through Rayleigh whatsoever, Rayleigh right now has more going for him , first of all he trained Luffy while Mihawk trained Zoro, so thats some portrayel, second of all holding off Kizaru is >>>>>>>> Holding off Vista. Even by your definition this is true since you said an Admiral would mid diff Vista.
Not gonna lie, that made me laugh. Rayleigh has absolutely nothing more going for him than Mihawk. Like I told you for the thousand time, there is no portrayal regarding who got which teacher. Following your logic, since Zoro is stronger than Sanji - the guy that trained kid Zoro is portrayed above Ivankov. Get that logic out of here. It's useless against facts. Since Mihawk is stronger than Rayleigh, he would do a better job than Rayleigh at fighting Kizaru. Totally does not help your case.
the Admirals also failed to injure Marco thats why hes a top tier, WB already showed what he can do to an Admiral. Vista couldn't cheapshot an Admiral while Jozu could injure an Admiral with a cheapshot, yet even Jozu in the end can't put up more than a mid diff (being generous as he got OHKOd), so Vista putting up even a low diff is pushing it considering someone whos cheapshot made an Admiral bleed got put down in one attack.
Mihawk failed to injure Vista, that's why he's a top tier. Aokiji failed to damage Jozu until the latter was distracted, that's why he's top tier. Marco could not damage an Admiral at the same time as Vista could not, it only happened
ONCE. From the looks on Aokiji, he looked the same he looked as his fight with Jozu began - clearly you can see that Jozu didn't damage him after that. Same with Marco/Kizaru after the initial start.
Actually no Aokiji showed where he ranks because he put down Jozu distraction or not in one hit. For someone to put Jozu down in one attack that tells you a lot. Look Jozu got a freebie on Aokiji and the worst he did was cause a lip bleed, when Aokiji got a freebie he OHKOd him, theres a huge difference, another thing to notice is that Jozu is not Vista he is much stronger.
Yeah, it would tell you a lot if they didn't have a 1HKO ability, that much is clear. Jozu does not have hax of that sort, that's why he failed to put down Aokiji. Garp who is a lot stronger than Magellan would fail to do that to Whitebeard while Magellan would not thanks to his devil fruit.
That is highly arguable, he was in the middle of his swing. Regardless his sword should've cut right through Crocs hook.
Mihawk is about to attack Luffy (middle panel). Mihawk notices. Crocodile coming at him (bottom right panel). Mihawk turns his attention to Crocodile, and blocks his swing. It looks like Crocodile is on the offenstive to me because the motion lines all around his arm while Mihawk's sword looks relatively stationary.
Sanji can give him a fight? C'mon dude please, you said you weren't biased yet you are here saying Sanji can give him a fight....dude Sanji got stomped.........he did not manage to make Doflamingo even sweat much less give him any sort of injury. That just shows you being praised doesn't mean you are on the same level or even close (Mihawk praising Vista).
Except that Sanji had zero idea about DD's hax devil fruit. Doflamingo even said how Sanji got in his way. Luffy is not able to toss Sanji whenever and as the current story is progressing it looking more and more likely that Luffy will solo him. Law was already injured before his fight against DD while DD was perfectly fine and because he knew about DD's abilities he wasn't stomped and pushed DD. Are you now going to say a fully healed Law can stomp Sanji?
Ok but its not about quantity its about quality
The quality is there for the amount he did - you just choose to ignore it.
I already talked about this Rayleigh case earlier.
Which was wrong because you again ignored the fact that Rayleigh is weaker than Mihawk.
Ok, that is not too farfetched.
There's nothing far fetched about that. Blackbeard is the man that Luffy will have to fight for the title of PK and there's no denying this guy will barely lose against Luffy putting him at close second.
Yea and so were the Vice Admirals........
The big boys were the ones that started and performed attacks/stopped attacks. Clearly, no VA was put in parallel as those boys.
K
No Jozu was contained he couldn't move, and Squard is on WBs side total surprise there.
Regardless of the situation, it does not matter because at the end of the day it's the same. The Yeti brother caught Zoro and Co off guard, they surely aren't at their level now are they?
Aokiji froze DD because DD was taunting him to freeze him when he ignored his request.
Point still stands that is was brief. Let's not forget how DD was panting from a casual attack when he was incased in ice.
kool, Jozu got contained though he couldn't move.
For a brief sec
Na this was a bit different though. Other characters didnt use someone as a foot stool, although I will refrain from this one as we arent sure if DD could control him he only showed stopping him.
Because that's what his devil fruit allows him to do if he catches someone off guard. He couldn't even control Sanji who is far weaker than Jozu. Why the hell would he then be able to control Jozu?
Doflamingo has more portrayel, feats, hype all that put him infront of Vista please don't compare the two I dont want this to get that extreme.
What portrayal, feats and hype puts DD above Vista?
I want you to answer one question as im baffled by your power ranking. How in the world do you think the WB pirates had 4 top tiers??? Are you kidding me? If they had 4 top tiers how come none of the Admirals other than Akainu was injured.........if they had 4 top tiers I'm sure Kizaru and Aokiji wouldn't be having a cakewalk of an arc. No they had 2 top tiers, one that can potentially beat the Admirals and another that can clash with the Admirals without getting injured.
What kind of messed up logic is that? Neither were they injured by them unless they were caught off guard. You say they aren't have top tiers because of that and at the same time you say Marco is top tier even though Kizaru was not injured after their fight. The same thing happened with Rayleigh/Kizaru fight too. It simply takes longer time for them to get to that point. Let's also not forget the WB pirates are not any pirates but the crew closest to OP and was around during the time Roger was around.
I am not replying past this. This is gonna go on forever im just gonna let you know that Mihawk is a tough one to scale as his hype means he is a top tier, but his feats say otherwise. But as for Vista and the others, I think you're being too lenient with your tiers, also you are downplaying DD. That's all I'm gonna say, but regarding Mihawk I will wait for further feats to completely erase his MF performance out of the way.
Big fuvking bullshit. First of all, his feats don't say otherwise. Casually performing one of the greatest feat without a devil fruit which non top tier ever did is one of those. Secondly, following that logic of yours, Mihawk is NOT a top tier because apparently according to you the feats were not 'top tier' meaning that the man Zoro will defeat in order to achieve his dream is not top tier. Yeah, that doesn't work buddy. His hype and feats dictate he is top tier, absolutely nothing difficult to scale about Mihawk. You're being too strict with your tiers and saying baseless things such as DD having something he doesn't posses, Vista getting stomped/non factor against top tiers.
... Stomping and low-mid diffing is not the same. 