I think Kishi needs to take some time off from the manga and regather his thoughts.

[Ariow]

To be honest I don't see the problem. It's a war like battle on a huge scale and characters are likely to die quickly and without meaning just like in real life you won't always be satisfied with the answers. If you want emotion go back and read the chapter with sad music or something. For me the chapters are actually good, of course I have a connection with each of the characters as I see the mangas story as a whole and don't usually judge it seriously chapter by chapter. Give it time.

 

[jonatu]

I like you avatar:luv: but hate your ideaWTH

 

[ady adham]

your Ava have some nice tits

LOL....

 

[Uchiha Josephus]

Er, that just proves you missed the point in the first place :/

It's about how the characters died that is the problem here. Not the lingering after-effects. None of that is any excuse of the poor way he handled things.

... sigh...

The point of the thread, as you said, is that the OP believes that the characters died too quickly/suddenly without the amount of build up that the OP has come to expect.

I posted my opinion that I thought the way in which it was done was just fine, and I'm sticking to that.

Since you're so pushy about it I shall elaborate:

Both the deaths of HQ and Neji are a reminder that war is chaotic and unpredictable. On top of that, the destruction of HQ was reminiscent of the atomic bombings of Nagasaki and Hiroshima, so that would strike an even deeper chord with fans over in Japan. That said, HQ's final plan can still be completed though, which may have some redeeming effects in that regard for those who feel Kishi didn't handle it well.

As far as Neji's death is concerned, I felt it was done in a very heroic, touching way. Neji sacrificed himself for not only Hinata and Naruto, but for the entire world by protecting the completion of HQ's final plan. This shows that even in the chaos of war there are heroes. Some known (like Neji), others forgotten (nameless fodders).

:scorps:

 

[noted]

To all those who are saying the war is being rushed -> what are you talking about?

It felt like this war was taking forever. The battle with the still-masked Tobi took forever. People made threads to the effect of "what's taking the other divisions so long to get here?" And now that a few (main character) deaths take place everyone is like "whoa whoa WHOA Kishi! Slow down!!!" It's not like there is time in war to have funerals and memorial services for everyone 0_o

How bizarre. :|

Not about rushed or taking too long per se, my point was events in the manga feels scattered and contrived with things happening on a whim, without any properly developed cohesive thought and function and flow of things happening through the chapters. Though I do understand the point you're making.

Edit: To clarify, so an example in the manga where it is about rushed/taking too long:

For example Kishi spent over two months on a single battle (Uchiha brothers vs Kabuto). I'm sure he had many ideas in the beginning he wanted to explore and share with his readers, but by the end of it he was like "Let's just get this over and done with." And you can tell with his let down anticlimactic release of Iznami (in contrast to the build-up leading to it). Therein lies a picture of a man who was burnt-out by his own manga. If Kishi had a little more time to think things through and gain perspective, instead of just mindlessly plowing through on a weekly basis, perhaps there would've been a more cohesive and properly structured and thought out battle.

 

[KGB Kakuzu]

While I wish deaths could be more entitled like how Neji had several screens just last week.....the way Shikaku died added to the sense of war....it was fast, it was unexpected, and there isn't time to mourne over it....it shows the sad aspect of war...as war is hell...Neji's death just showed Naruto just how bad it is going to get.

The fact Shikamaru and Ino were in tears leads me to believe he said his goodbyes, and once this plans does whatever we will see their final words!

Part of it though is deffinatly the rush, but it isn't only a rush!

 

[Uchiha Josephus]

Not about rushed or taking too long per se, my point was events in the manga feels scattered and contrived with things happening on a whim, without any developed cohesive thought and function and flow of things happening through the chapters. Though I do understand the point you're making.

For example Kishi spent over two months on a single battle (Uchiha brothers vs Kabuto). I'm sure he had many ideas in the beginning he wanted to explore and share with his readers, but by the end of it he was like "Let's just get this over and done with." And you can tell with his let down anticlimactic release of Iznami. Therein lies a picture of a man who was burnt-out by his own manga. If Kishi had a little more time to think things through and gain perspective, instead of just plowing through on a weekly basis, perhaps there would've been a more cohesive and properly structured and thought out battle.

... huh ... and here I've felt like it was all very cohesive and well thought out, especially the Itachi/Sasuke/Kabuto battle 0_o

(Granted, some of the lengthiness of that battle was extensive flashbacks xd)

Oh well, I guess I'll have to agree to disagree.

While I wish deaths could be more entitled like how Neji had several screens just last week.....the way Shikaku died added to the sense of war....it was fast, it was unexpected, and there isn't time to mourne over it....it shows the sad aspect of war...as war is hell...Neji's death just showed Naruto just how bad it is going to get.

The fact Shikamaru and Ino were in tears leads me to believe he said his goodbyes, and once this plans does whatever we will see their final words!

Part of it though is deffinatly the rush, but it isn't only a rush!

And this is sort of my point ^^^

It's not that the manga is being rushed, it's that some things happen quickly and unexpectedly in war. I think the OP just takes it as Kishi rushing things. I disagree. But everyone is entitled to their opinion.

Evidently, it was not.

And that - as you imply, Kishimoto going for the shock value - excuses him killing off characters who haven't been shown in ages, which was my point? No, it doesn't. In case you didn't know, build up is crucial. No shit there can't be an entire monologue like with Jiraiya's death, it's still war, but the fact that he killed off a character in the same chapter in which he got the spotlight for the first time in so long was a bad execution. Shikaku's death was decent and kind of, yeah, whatever, he's a fodder with a name, who cares.

It's Neji's death I have a problem with.

I edited my post to include more on Neji. I'll repost it here:

As far as Neji's death is concerned, I felt it was done in a very heroic, touching way. Neji sacrificed himself for not only Hinata and Naruto, but for the entire world by protecting the completion of HQ's final plan. This shows that even in the chaos of war there are heroes. Some known (like Neji), others forgotten (nameless fodders).

Anyway, it's your opinion that his death was bad execution on Kishi's part. And that's okay. I personally felt it was handled just fine.

 

[ady adham]

Recent chapters feel overly contrived and he's making it up as he's going along. I'm sure he has the whole bigger picture intact, but he has only so many hours in a week to fill what happens to each of the characters and events in the meantime. And it comes off with things such as Kishi suddenly deciding to kill off characters on a whim in one chapter and barely mentioning them the next, moving on to the next thing.

Like for example with every death you can explore it e.g. Asuma's death. That was poignant and beautiful. But with Shikaku's death, shit he died and he left his story.. and that's it. A semblance of a story is there but the feelings and emotions that go with it is rushed. Or e.g. Neji's death. Uncannily intelligent throwback, or overly corny, cheesy, and contrived resolution?

I respect Kishi as a brilliant storyteller but lately it feels he's off his game. It feels like he's been working overtime and is being whipped by the ever-present eager fans to provide the goods week after week. I think he's at a lull where he's at with the story and is just chugging along as he feels. Like it's not a form of play and wonder and excitement for him anymore full of possibilities, it's just work to move from one point of the story to another point in the story at a glacier's pace.

Don't get me wrong I love the manga. It's just that I think Kishi would do well if he took some time off and took a breather, maybe go swimming, catch up with friends, and take his wife on an overdue romantic holiday or something. And come back to the manga feeling refreshed and invigorated for the next phase of the story full of burning excitement and wonder as it once was. Just a fantastical thought I'm having

probaly...
haha kishi will love to see this..

 

[noted]

... huh ... and here I've felt like it was all very cohesive and well thought out, especially the Itachi/Sasuke/Kabuto battle 0_o

(Granted, some of the lengthiness of that battle was extensive flashbacks xd)

Oh well, I guess I'll have to agree to disagree.

Lol perhaps that was a bad example, but that was an example specifically about the rate/length of the manga, as a tangent follow-on reference to the point the other poster was making.

How a half-playful fantastical opinion turns into a serious debate of mechanics haha

 

[Pakura]

What we are reading now was probably planned out months before. Kishi isn't writing this chapter to chapter. And most mangaka turn in three to four chapters of their work ahead. SJ probably already has up to 618. So taking a break wouldn't change to story.

Evidently, it was not.

And that - as you imply, Kishimoto going for the shock value - excuses him killing off characters who haven't been shown in ages, which was my point? No, it doesn't. In case you didn't know, build up is crucial. No shit there can't be an entire monologue like with Jiraiya's death, it's still war, but the fact that he killed off a character in the same chapter in which he got the spotlight for the first time in so long was a bad execution. Shikaku's death was decent and kind of, yeah, whatever, he's a fodder with a name, who cares.

It's Neji's death I have a problem with.

In the grand scheme of the manga, Neji was as much a fodder with a name as Shikaku. Hell, Shikaku was probably the more important character at the time of his death. Both existed to elevate more important characters. I thought both deaths were fine if they are used for their desired effect. Neji's death to push Hinata and Naruto. Shikaku for Shikamaru.

 

[shri3kbat]

Lol, it's still war you know. They don't have time to reflect on that stuff when juubi is ****ing shit up.. You can't compare it to Asuma

 

[Gyakusetsu]

I think you have to consider just how many are going to die. If you think it's only going to be a handful. I would agree but I think the tally will be much greater than that. Doing a week after week heartbreaker would have a negative effect as well. This will be very difficult for Kishimoto to try and get the right balance.

 

[Kurama999]

Recent chapters feel overly contrived and he's making it up as he's going along. I'm sure he has the whole bigger picture intact, but he has only so many hours in a week to fill what happens to each of the characters and events in the meantime. And it comes off with things such as Kishi suddenly deciding to kill off characters on a whim in one chapter and barely mentioning them the next, moving on to the next thing.

Like for example with every death you can explore it e.g. Asuma's death. That was poignant and beautiful. But with Shikaku's death, shit he died and he left his story.. and that's it. A semblance of a story is there but the feelings and emotions that go with it is rushed. Or e.g. Neji's death. Uncannily intelligent throwback, or overly corny, cheesy, and contrived resolution?

I respect Kishi as a brilliant storyteller but lately it feels he's off his game. It feels like he's been working overtime and is being whipped by the ever-present eager fans to provide the goods week after week. I think he's at a lull where he's at with the story and is just chugging along as he feels. Like it's not a form of play and wonder and excitement for him anymore full of possibilities, it's just work to move from one point of the story to another point in the story at a glacier's pace.

Don't get me wrong I love the manga. It's just that I think Kishi would do well if he took some time off and took a breather, maybe go swimming, catch up with friends, and take his wife on an overdue romantic holiday or something. And come back to the manga feeling refreshed and invigorated for the next phase of the story full of burning excitement and wonder as it once was. Just a fantastical thought I'm having

Actually, i intent to have a thread regarding Kishi.
Please bear with me about how and why Naruto became my favourite manga.
Actually, this was my 2nd manga story.

Kishi did not failed and may not be his idea at all.
We have to understand how and why Kishi started this Naruto manga.
In the beginning, Kishi was undecided that his manga story was worth it or not.

Just give you some idea, and what i had read in the past, which also regarding Kishi.

When someone (about mid of last year 2011) who was using my computer, he saved some of this Naruto video.
Then i started watching this Naruto video. And i got very interested and became addicted.
I went to the Library, internet, etc, to read and watch Naruto manga and anime.
In the meanwhile, i did some research into how, when, why.., regarding Naruto.
For me, i always did some research like, who was the author and read about Kishi himself.


In SJ, like any publisher, they want people to submit some sort of story to them.
The editor of SJ were to decide whether or not to publish the story on their weekly mag.

Currently, many are not happy the way Kishi present this series.
I don't blame him, so you /we cannot totally blame on him.
Kishi had to follow the SJ editor policy and rules.
When Kishi submitted Naruto as his story, so SJ included Kishi manga in the weekly mag.
The response and readership of his manga became top favourite.
Go and read the Chapter 1, and why was it had so many pages - actually thought to be one time only.
When the readership continue to be high, then the SJ editor gave him a nod to proceed as weekly.
But there is one issue!. This Naruto manga become the property of SJ and/or Publisher (not Kishi).

When SJ editor see the readership had gone down, Kishi will have to create 'whatever' so that the readership remain high.
(Just give some support by buying Naruto items. I had some Naruto manga book, include the "3rd Character Data Book".)

Actually, i had another theory on why Kishi is "killing" of the some of the good/famous character.

**Shikaku had to be killed, so that the story is moving to next level, the K-11 growth.
**Also, Madara/Obito's plan had failed.....



This does not only apply in manga, but others fiction novel; etc..
Author only have some royalties, etc.................................

 

[Chatte]

Tell that to the raging fans who cannot even wait for 2 weeks when Shonen Jump is taking a pause...

 

[rollin]

I dont agree with anything you said

 

[Kurama999]

Neji was killed - just a theory.

Konoha K-12 (original, with Uchiha Sasuke).
Of the K-12, there were 11 Clans each, except Hyuga clan - Neji & Hinata.
Kishi wanted to balance of one nin to each clan, so that he can focus on.
As for Hyuga clan, the "screen time" had being done.
On the Genin fight one-to-one, Kishi selected both Hyuga clan fight with each other; Hinata vs Neji.
On the second fight, Neji vs Naruto. The Hyuga clan rule was made very clear.
In this way, Naruto teaches Neji to open his mind & eyes and fate is up to the individual.
When "rescue of Sasuke" as well as other scenario, Neji always think "what will Naruto do in this situation".
In one scene, Neji escort Hinata home, showing that Neji mind had already open.

Since Neji had quite some "screen time", Kishi decided on how to "kill" Neji and what sort of message to give.
So, Neji die in front of both Hinata and Naruto.
One very clear message to Naruto.
"I, Neji, is giving Hinata to you and protect her and loved her"
(Obito asking Kakashi to protect Rin)
Message is clear...................................

 

[~Cherry~]

TrueU_U he's trying to get over with it quick

 

[Nigete]

Neji's purpose was finished in Part 1. I think his death was beautiful and well placed.

 

[BeastMode]

I'm sure he is doing this to try to make us feel like there is no time. Authors strive to make the reader feel as if they are in the story.

In war you don't really have time to grieve, I mean even the characters said that. It is a psychological thing that makes you feel as if we don't have time to dwell on the dead because the threats are growing bigger and many other people are at risk of dying.

As for the break, I am sure that Kishi is many many weeks ahead of what we receive. Granted I may be wrong, but it just seems that Shonen Jump would be massively flawed if Kishi only had a week to finish a story and artwork for a chapter that would come out that week. I bet he's a good 5-10 chapters ahead of what we are currently on. Gives him plenty of cushion room to not have to overly push himself to meet a very difficult deadline.

As for Shikaku, sadly I believe we have not seen the last of him. I bet they are not dead. I think it would be better for the story if they were dead and I would love it if they were dead because it adds realism to the story. But since we did not physically see them die I would bet against them being dead. One of the major rules of storytelling: If you didn't see them die, then they probably aren't dead. Now Shikaku and the gang, being secondary characters, don't have a very high probability as Naruto or Sasuke would have, because there being Main Characters.

But, good thoughts and smile! We're reaching the climax.

 

[Kakaisan]

Really? Do you guys really think the every episode's story is thought of that week? Are you that naive?
The entire story has been made up, and probably written down, for quite some time now. It's not like he went: "Oh, for next week I want some deaths. Who should I kill?"