[Question] How much of a challenge is Smoker to Luffy, from 1-10?

[24 12 11 to troll]

Hijey, I'll let you handle this unless you want me to step in. This Smoker fanboy knows his shit.

God!
Ever seen how a missile or a rocket works?
Its the exact same principle he is using.

Well one thing is for certain. Rockets are not Smoke powered! Smoke is a bi-product of burning fuels or ignition. Are you sure you should be questioning me? Besides : your gif is anime only.

"Weight of smoke is low" aww my head its about to burst lol

Chemistry student here. I know my shit, not too bad at physics either. You probably can't distinguish the difference between Mass and Weight without looking it up. You also probably calculate weight with Kilograms, which is technically the unit for Mass. As Weight is in Newtons.

Smoke has low density, all gases have low density, in fact if you weigh all the air on the earth after condensing it into a container, so that it's just right (not condensing into a liquid). it's not much heavier than an average sized Skyscraper.

Keep in mind this is 1,212,100 kg in mass
12,121,000 N in weight
1212.1 Tonnes in mass

It's hardly anything when comparing it to the weight of the Earth at 5,972,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 kg in mass
59,720,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 N in weight

The Atmosphere of Earth is approximately 50,900,000,000 (m)3 in volume (Just imagine the 3 is little... :|)
The Earth itself is approximately 1,097,509,500,000,000,000,000 (m)3 in volume (Just imagine the 3 is little... :|)

When the Atmosphere is about one third of the mass of Earth, if it was exactly the same mass as Earth it would be approximately 150,270,000,000 (m)3 in volume. That's still less than a hundred-trillionths the volume. So in general Gas is far less dense than Solids and therefore weigh much less. If that wasn't enough:

Mass = D x (m)3 (Density x Volume if you didn't know)
- The degree of compactness of a substance = Density
- The amount of space that a substance or object occupies, or that is enclosed within a container = Volume

Mass = p / m/s (Momentum over velocity)
- The quantity of motion of a moving body, measured as a product of its mass and velocity = Mass
- The speed of something in a given direction = Velocity

So: Smoke with it's Low density will mean a low Mass as any gas has a density is so low we might aswell not even consider Volume, especially if it's a little bit of Smoke from Smokers legs. Momentum is calculated using mass and velocity, since Smoke has both a low velocity (as a gas has no general direction for its particles to spread unless assisted or forced in a particular direction by other objects) it has a low mass!

Why is Mass relevant? Well:
Weight = Mass x Acceleration

Low mass, low acceleration therefore low weight. I win.

Spoiler

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[Hijey]

Spoiler

If Law were to have, at the last moment when he was sent flying next to the Colosseum, managed to take out Doflamingo via a surprise attack, it would have been a 10. If you get blitzed, you get blitzed, simple as. Anything can be a one hit kill, if you punch someone in the throat hard enough, they'll be incapacitated, or possibly even die. So your argument 'that the difficulty of the fight isn't apparent because Law has a one hit kill ability' is silly. But I do understand where you're come from. It's like a man with a knife vs a Lion, the lion can slash, prowl and attempt to charge, but as long as the man thrusts the knife into its chest when it leaps he's won, and he might just come out of it unscathed. But that doesn't change the fact that had the Lion be smarter, faster, more resilient or resourceful it would've won.
But regardless, how is your accused to be underestimated Smoker going to give Luffy a run for his money? How?

Spoiler

Was the difficulty of Zoro vs Ryuuma not hard? Neither of them recieved a damage from what I can remember. It's the same case here with Law and Smoker. They both have an ability that can make the fight end just like that during a fight, unlike brawlers like Luffy and Garp. Keep in mind that their fight was offpaneled for a dozen pages or so while we saw the whole fight between Z/R. The example you gave with the lion and the man is not a good one in this case either because that wasn't how things played out between Law and Smoker, they were evenely matched. Smoker was pushing Law really hard in their fight, was a split second from defeating him and would have come out unscatched if that were to happen, that much was clear. Smoker also fought against Vergo and seemingly looked like he had the advantange. Sanji, someone who can give Luffy a run for his money being part of the M3 and all, was portrayed to be below Vergo unlike Smoker. So given the fact that Smoker accomplished all of this against opponents that can give Luffy a run for his money, it's not a smart thing to say he can't do that against Luffy.

 

[Sherlock.]

I can't tell whether your actually being serious if you are then you are really bad at power scaling. Again the people Smoker lost to are way stronger than your making them out to be.

Well considering Luffy mid-diffed Ceaser who is a Gas Logia who can do stuff like removing oxygen from the atmosphere, poisioning the atmosphere and all, Smoker is simply smoke and Luffy who knows about his ability will surely exploit it like Vergo did. I'm not underestimating him solely because he lost 3 fights but I'm also considering Luffy's recent fights here upto Don Chinjao. It's not that Smoker is weak but it's more like Luffy's growth has been tremendous. He fought well underwater even when there is so much water current pressure underwater, he mid diffed Ceasr who is a strong Logia, he beat a legend like Don Chinjao with relative ease. Thats why I feel currently Smoker is way out of Luffy's league.

 

[24 12 11 to troll]

Well considering Luffy mid-diffed Ceaser who is a Gas Logia who can do stuff like removing oxygen from the atmosphere, poisioning the atmosphere and all, Smoker is simply smoke and Luffy who knows about his ability will surely exploit it like Vergo did. I'm not underestimating him solely because he lost 3 fights but I'm also considering Luffy's recent fights here upto Don Chinjao. It's not that Smoker is weak but it's more like Luffy's growth has been tremendous. He fought well underwater even when there is so much water current pressure underwater, he mid diffed Ceasr who is a strong Logia, he beat a legend like Don Chinjao with relative ease. Thats why I feel currently Smoker is way out of Luffy's league.

Chinjao = old and at the time weakened tremendously
Caesar = WEAK Logia (far weaker than Smoker)
Hody = WEAK.

 

[Anduril]

Hijey, I'll let you handle this unless you want me to step in. This Smoker fanboy knows his shit.


Well one thing is for certain. Rockets are not Smoke powered! Smoke is a bi-product of burning fuels or ignition. Are you sure you should be questioning me? Besides : your gif is anime only.


Chemistry student here. I know my shit, not too bad at physics either. You probably can't distinguish the difference between Mass and Weight without looking it up. You also probably calculate weight with Kilograms, which is technically the unit for Mass. As Weight is in Newtons.

Smoke has low density, all gases have low density, in fact if you weigh all the air on the earth after condensing it into a container, so that it's just right (not condensing into a liquid). it's not much heavier than an average sized Skyscraper.

Keep in mind this is 1,212,100 kg in mass
12,121,000 N in weight
1212.1 Tonnes in mass

It's hardly anything when comparing it to the weight of the Earth at 5,972,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 kg in mass
59,720,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 N in weight

The Atmosphere of Earth is approximately 50,900,000,000 (m)3 in volume (Just imagine the 3 is little... :|)
The Earth itself is approximately 1,097,509,500,000,000,000,000 (m)3 in volume (Just imagine the 3 is little... :|)

When the Atmosphere is about one third of the mass of Earth, if it was exactly the same mass as Earth it would be approximately 150,270,000,000 (m)3 in volume. That's still less than a hundred-trillionths the volume. So in general Gas is far less dense than Solids and therefore weigh much less. If that wasn't enough:

Mass = D x (m)3 (Density x Volume if you didn't know)
- The degree of compactness of a substance = Density
- The amount of space that a substance or object occupies, or that is enclosed within a container = Volume

Mass = p / m/s (Momentum over velocity)
- The quantity of motion of a moving body, measured as a product of its mass and velocity = Mass
- The speed of something in a given direction = Velocity

So: Smoke with it's Low density will mean a low Mass as any gas has a density is so low we might aswell not even consider Volume, especially if it's a little bit of Smoke from Smokers legs. Momentum is calculated using mass and velocity, since Smoke has both a low velocity (as a gas has no general direction for its particles to spread unless assisted or forced in a particular direction by other objects) it has a low mass!

Why is Mass relevant? Well:
Weight = Mass x Acceleration

Low mass, low acceleration therefore low weight. I win.

Spoiler

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You really are stupid, aren't you?

 

[24 12 11 to troll]

You really are stupid, aren't you?

So that's all you can say?

 

[Sherlock.]

Chinjao = old and at the time weakened tremendously
Caesar = WEAK Logia (far weaker than Smoker)
Hody = WEAK.

So that's all you can say?

Sry but that actually made you look really stupid rinnemaki. All that calculation and stuff, the real world physics and all. First of all this is One Piece we are taking about so using Real World logic is a nay. On top of that you should know they have six or seven satellites unlike our earth so all that mass and acceleration calculation is a big fail. Lastly I'll stick to my view about Smoker being way out of Luffy's league simply because we haven't seen Luffy going all out Post TS and Smoker did go all out against Vergo but realized he couldn't stop Vergo alone and so helped Law to defeat Vergo. I think Luffy could have mid diffed Vergo since Sanji was able to temporarily hold his own against Vergo.

 

[jiraiya lives]

Luffy would take him with zero difficulty . Now that Luffy has haki smoker stands zero chances of winning 0

I come back to this thread after a few days just to see that the underestimation has gotten worse..smh

 

[Red Swag]

This proves nothing. Try again.


People like you are the reason why Shampoo bottles need instructions.

I simply answered the question. imo it's around that level. you mad bro?

 

[24 12 11 to troll]

Sry but that actually made you look really stupid rinnemaki. All that calculation and stuff, the real world physics and all. First of all this is One Piece we are taking about so using Real World logic is a nay. On top of that you should know they have six or seven satellites unlike our earth so all that mass and acceleration calculation is a big fail. Lastly I'll stick to my view about Smoker being way out of Luffy's league simply because we haven't seen Luffy going all out Post TS and Smoker did go all out against Vergo but realized he couldn't stop Vergo alone and so helped Law to defeat Vergo. I think Luffy could have mid diffed Vergo since Sanji was able to temporarily hold his own against Vergo.

I was simply proving Anduril wrong when we were talking about Smoke and its properties. I went overboard and it turns out he's too ashamed to respond properly, knowing he is wrong.

I'm sorry to say this but real world logic is incorporated in One Piece. Especially when we go about the properties of the elements regarding any Logia class Devil Fruit or its user. Otherwise powers would be totally unrelated and therefore be pretty much retarded. You can't ignore Smokes properties or change them if Smoke is a Logia Devil Fruit. The need for accuracy is actually further increased due to the fact Smoker is a main antagonist.

My calculations were a big fail because of Satellites? This makes absolutely no sense, nor is it relevant to the debate at hand. Stay on topic.

Smoker never realized he couldn't defeat Vergo, in fact he was winning the fight before he decided to get Laws heart back from Vergo's posession. He deliberately increased his surface area so that he would intentionally get hurt or injured. Pretty sure this is proof that he brought defeat upon himself deliberately. That fight should never be used when powerscaling Smoker. It's like when Vivi was slapping the sh*t out of Luffy, does that mean Vivi > Alabasta Luffy? No it doesn't. Both fights (or "fight" in Vivi's case) are of the same concept when the stronger party lets themselves get hurt.

I simply answered the question. imo it's around that level. you mad bro?

Yes. Because you're simply retarded.

 

[TheCCV]

It's okay, you can go ahead and make this into an open debate if you'd like
I don't know what this 'haki' thing is, but I know Luffy is going to get it, so that's already been spoiled and it seems like a really, really big deal.

I've also read some other stuff I didn't want to so yeah
I'm outta here

 

[crono0929]

why is real life Physics/science being used in a One Piece Discussion?

LMAO at Gas gas being Weaker than Smoke smoke...

 

[System001]

Spoiler

Was the difficulty of Zoro vs Ryuuma not hard? Neither of them recieved a damage from what I can remember. It's the same case here with Law and Smoker. They both have an ability that can make the fight end just like that during a fight, unlike brawlers like Luffy and Garp. Keep in mind that their fight was offpaneled for a dozen pages or so while we saw the whole fight between Z/R. The example you gave with the lion and the man is not a good one in this case either because that wasn't how things played out between Law and Smoker, they were evenely matched. Smoker was pushing Law really hard in their fight, was a split second from defeating him and would have come out unscatched if that were to happen, that much was clear. Smoker also fought against Vergo and seemingly looked like he had the advantange. Sanji, someone who can give Luffy a run for his money being part of the M3 and all, was portrayed to be below Vergo unlike Smoker. So given the fact that Smoker accomplished all of this against opponents that can give Luffy a run for his money, it's not a smart thing to say he can't do that against Luffy.

Spoiler

But he didn't defeat him, and Law walked away unscathed. End of. It's funny, you're practically saying that Law Vs Smoker is a bad fight to go by, as they both have one-hit end game abilities, yet you insistently reference to it as if the fight can only support the argument that Smoker is close to Law/Luffy/Kid's level. If Law was light-years ahead of smoker, the fight would've ended in pretty much the same way, in a clean win by taking out Smokers heart. And, according to you, even if Law was on the same level, only slightly stronger, or weaker than Smoker, the fight still would've ended the same way. With the latter frankly making less sense than the former. But nonetheless, on both sides, according to you, referencing to the Law Vs Smoker fight is pointless.
So, instead of doing that, how about you tell me how Smoker will actually give Luffy a run for his money. Because, the way I see it, Luffy's abilities will be able to pin down Smoker and counteract his tactics due to him now having Haki. Thus resulting in a relatively easy fight, especially seeing as his body seems to be pretty well conditioned, probably significantly better than that of Law's or Kid's, as they have DF abilities that don't necessarily rely on physicality.

 

[24 12 11 to troll]

It's okay, you can go ahead and make this into an open debate if you'd like
I don't know what this 'haki' thing is, but I know Luffy is going to get it, so that's already been spoiled and it seems like a really, really big deal.

I've also read some other stuff I didn't want to so yeah
I'm outta here

Sorry about that... I tried to avoid it whenever possible.

 

[crono0929]

well, look at that, some people Could not contain themselves and filled the thread with spoilers and the OP has lost interest....

 

[24 12 11 to troll]

well, look at that, some people Could not contain themselves and filled the thread with spoilers and the OP has lost interest....

I wasn't the only one...^^

 

[Hijey]

Spoiler

But he didn't defeat him, and Law walked away unscathed. End of. It's funny, you're practically saying that Law Vs Smoker is a bad fight to go by, as they both have one-hit end game abilities, yet you insistently reference to it as if the fight can only support the argument that Smoker is close to Law/Luffy/Kid's level. If Law was light-years ahead of smoker, the fight would've ended in pretty much the same way, in a clean win by taking out Smokers heart. And, according to you, even if Law was on the same level, only slightly stronger, or weaker than Smoker, the fight still would've ended the same way. With the latter frankly making less sense than the former. But nonetheless, on both sides, according to you, referencing to the Law Vs Smoker fight is pointless.
So, instead of doing that, how about you tell me how Smoker will actually give Luffy a run for his money. Because, the way I see it, Luffy's abilities will be able to pin down Smoker and counteract his tactics due to him now having Haki. Thus resulting in a relatively easy fight, especially seeing as his body seems to be pretty well conditioned, probably significantly better than that of Law's or Kid's, as they have DF abilities that don't necessarily rely on physicality.

Spoiler

Was the fight between Zoro and Ryuma hard or not? What about Daz, who was strong enough to push Zoro to the bring of death, and was on shotted by him. That's the sort of fight we had between Law and Smoker. Law would for instance be in better state and finish a fight between him and say Sanji faster than Luffy would, even if Luffy was stronger than Law. You slip up once and you're done for if you fight those sort of fighters. You got it wrong, it wouldn't have ended the same way it did. We clearly saw how Law dealt with someone he was ligh years ahead - Tashigi. He got rid of her the second their fight began just like that. Whereas Smoker was actually pushing Law and was a split second away from defeating him. Had Smoker now defeated Law at that point, he would have been the one to come out unscatched. Now, would you be saying that Smoker would be light years ahead of Luffy too, since Law is one of Luffy's main pirate rivals? Sanji got his leg damaged as soon as Vergo took him seriously without his bamboo and Sanji himself admitted inferiority after that fight. On the other hand, Smoker was going head to head against a physical fighter like Vergo and was seemingly the one that had the advantage until Smoker deliberately lost on purpose against an excellent haki user. Smoker was portrayed above/below three different fighters that can give Luffy a run for his money and now that he knows more about Law's abilities he's able to perform much better. Like I told you earlier, unless you think Sanji and Co are unable to give Luffy a run for his, you have no reason at all to doubt Smoker can't. If you do, you'll also have to argue the same for Sanji and Co.

 

[nasuke242]

9 definitely

 

[Netferarri]

I would give it a 7. ​

 

[Reaper]

I would just like to ask,has anyone actually ever changed their opinion about anything related to anime through this fighting ._.

Cause it happens ALOT here on NB,but people still stay the same,so by that is it rly worth it to write wallies just for the other person to post some bs so you respond with bs etc etc