[Question] How many of Luffys opponents could Zoro and Sanji defeat

[ultraChalk]

Why do people think Zoro can beat Smoker? Just because he has an intimidation similar to KH?

That doesn't equate to an automatic win, like the guy said above me, Smoker is much stronger than Monet, in both will power and strength. Unbelievably stronger actually. No type of intimidation is getting through to him, unless it's a Roger or Garp tier character.

 

[Bogard]

Chinjao had haki as strong as Luffy and do we know if Sanji or Zoro do? I doubt they do seeing as they didn't train with Rayleigh. He also had speed enough to leave after images so he's no slouch. I doubt it'd be a cakewalk.

Armament haki is Zoro's speciality according to Oda. While Luffy trained with Rayleigh, Zoro trained with the WSS. Also, personal strength isn't depending on the teacher. Rifle is a weaker attack than Hell Memory or Shi shi sonson by far. They would rip Chinjao to shreds. Zoro and Sanji can move faster than fishmen under water

Why do people think Zoro can beat Smoker? Just because he has an intimidation similar to KH?

That doesn't equate to an automatic win, like the guy said above me, Smoker is much stronger than Monet, in both will power and strength. Unbelievably stronger actually. No type of intimidation is getting through to him, unless it's a Roger or Garp tier character.

Sanji was portrayed similar to Smoker and Zoro is stronger. Zoro can move faster than a fishman underwater, possess armament haki as a speciality, and possess attacks strong enough to make admiral levels like Fujitora struggle to deflect and we've yet to see his most strongest moves post-time skip(we didn't even see preskip Asura yet)

 

[SSS12]

Can Kuma destroy and entire continent with one attack? No, so get outta here with that. Chinjao has haki as strong as Luffy which again Kuma does not(or has not shown)

I wouldn't call this old age Garp either he was 30 years younger.

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The strongest person Akainu's beaten is Ace and Aokiji. Sengoku was in charge during Roger's era which Chinjao was around for to assume they never crossed when Chinjao had over 500 mil bounty is absurdity. He only holds a grudge on Garp and not Sengoku because of his head. What makes you think Kizaru or Akainu could beat him they've never actually beat someone in legendary status.

Chinjao had haki as strong as Luffy and do we know if Sanji or Zoro do? I doubt they do seeing as they didn't train with Rayleigh. He also had speed enough to leave after images so he's no slouch. I doubt it'd be a cakewalk.

If Chinjao had Haki as strong as Luffy, he wouldn't have lost so quickly. Every character has their skills. How much did destroying continents help Chinjao against Luffy? I thought so. I could say Kuma can teleport and repel all attacks.

And I meant Chinjao in his old age man, Chinjao in his old age was defeated easily by Luffy. Nobody gets that weak in their old age if I do believe you that Chinjao can defeat Admirals. How many people have Akainu and Kizaru fought on screen to the end? Akainu took out Aokiji. That's a serious feat. And both Akainu and Kizaru fought on par with WB himself, said to be Roger's equal.

Now you tell me what makes you think Chinjao could defeat an admiral. His bounty? Bounty is made up of more than strength. Splitting a continent? How does that help? Feats? Like getting one shotted by Garp while Chinjao was in his prime? Getting defeated easily by Luffy? Some feats. That makes Garp>>>>>>>>>Admirals and Sengoku, right? And Luffy>>>Admirals?

Why do people think Zoro can beat Smoker? Just because he has an intimidation similar to KH?

That doesn't equate to an automatic win, like the guy said above me, Smoker is much stronger than Monet, in both will power and strength. Unbelievably stronger actually. No type of intimidation is getting through to him, unless it's a Roger or Garp tier character.

Yeah, can't even begin to compare Smoker and Monet. People say that because Smoker has been beaten a couple of times Post-timeskip while Zoro hasn't ever been pushed or had a serious fight yet. I'd say it could go either way. But at the moment I'll also give it to Zoro. But I'm sure Smoker will be back stronger than ever.

 

[chopstickchakra]

If Chinjao had Haki as strong as Luffy, he wouldn't have lost so quickly. Every character has their skills. How much did destroying continents help Chinjao against Luffy? I thought so. I could say Kuma can teleport and repel all attacks.

And I meant Chinjao in his old age man, Chinjao in his old age was defeated easily by Luffy. Nobody gets that weak in their old age if I do believe you that Chinjao can defeat Admirals. How many people have Akainu and Kizaru fought on screen to the end? Akainu took out Aokiji. That's a serious feat. And both Akainu and Kizaru fought on par with WB himself, said to be Roger's equal.

Now you tell me what makes you think Chinjao could defeat an admiral. His bounty? Bounty is made up of more than strength. Splitting a continent? How does that help? Feats? Like getting one shotted by Garp while Chinjao was in his prime? Getting defeated easily by Luffy? Some feats. That makes Garp>>>>>>>>>Admirals and Sengoku, right? And Luffy>>>Admirals?



Yeah, can't even begin to compare Smoker and Monet. People say that because Smoker has been beaten a couple of times Post-timeskip while Zoro hasn't ever been pushed or had a serious fight yet. I'd say it could go either way. But at the moment I'll also give it to Zoro. But I'm sure Smoker will be back stronger than ever.

You're kidding yourself if you really think either of them fought on the same level as WB even when he was dying of disease and battle wounds he was still above them. People give the admirals too much credit based off of hype, Akainu beat Ace so everyone acts like he's this God. Ace sacrificed himself on that kill punch and they held their own in the war they didn't really take out any of the big guns though.

As for his Haki it is as strong as Luffy's hence when they fought each other and both hit with Haki they made the air around them
crackle from the force. Now this isn't my only source of info but it's the easiest to showcase my point

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Here in the Abilities and Powers section it says "He can also use Busoshoku Haki to harden his fist to augment the force of his punch, which turns shiny black, and clash evenly with Luffy's respective usage; the strikes resulted in the air itself crackling" as well as "Upon Luffy's strike restoring Chinjao's head to its old, pointed shape, his legendary strength from thirty years ago was restored, enabling him to split the Corrida Colosseum's arena simply by falling onto it head first"

Chinjao is back to his 30 year prior self which had to be beaten by Garp. You think the Marines just happened to send Garp after him back then? They could have sent admirals to handle him but they obviously weren't strong enough then and Garp is still stronger than admirals today so why do you expect Chnjao wouldn't be?

 

[SSS12]

You're kidding yourself if you really think either of them fought on the same level as WB even when he was dying of disease and battle wounds he was still above them. People give the admirals too much credit based off of hype, Akainu beat Ace so everyone acts like he's this God. Ace sacrificed himself on that kill punch and they held their own in the war they didn't really take out any of the big guns though.

As for his Haki it is as strong as Luffy's hence when they fought each other and both hit with Haki they made the air around them
crackle from the force. Now this isn't my only source of info but it's the easiest to showcase my point

You must be registered for see links

Here in the Abilities and Powers section it says "He can also use Busoshoku Haki to harden his fist to augment the force of his punch, which turns shiny black, and clash evenly with Luffy's respective usage; the strikes resulted in the air itself crackling" as well as "Upon Luffy's strike restoring Chinjao's head to its old, pointed shape, his legendary strength from thirty years ago was restored, enabling him to split the Corrida Colosseum's arena simply by falling onto it head first"

Chinjao is back to his 30 year prior self which had to be beaten by Garp. You think the Marines just happened to send Garp after him back then? They could have sent admirals to handle him but they obviously weren't strong enough then and Garp is still stronger than admirals today so why do you expect Chnjao wouldn't be?

Because Chinjao was one-shotted!!!! This should make it clear for you.
Shiki is one of the Pirate King rivals, on the same tier as Sengoku, WB, Garp, Roger. It takes Sengoku AND Garp to defeat and capture him. And half of MF was destroyed in the process.

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And how about Chinjao? Garp solos him with a single punch. Admiral level? Don't make me laugh. Prime Garp will defeat an admiral Mid Diff. Probably High Diff. And Chinjao? Super Low Diff. Now as per your understanding the pwer level of Shiki and Chinjao should be similar? So how come Chinjao got one-shotted and Shiki held his own and the two marines?

And Garp isn't the sort to follow orders. He chases after whoever he pleases. He chased after Shakky all the time too. I don't think Marines 'sent' him after Chinjao.

 

[TheHokage]

Sanji was portrayed similar to Smoker and Zoro is stronger. Zoro can move faster than a fishman underwater, possess armament haki as a speciality, and possess attacks strong enough to make admiral levels like Fujitora struggle to deflect and we've yet to see his most strongest moves post-time skip(we didn't even see preskip Asura yet)

Not really Sanji was clearly dominated in the fight against Vergo, his legs were breaking just fighting Vergo who wasn't even using the advanced form of CoA.

Why do people think Zoro can beat Smoker? Just because he has an intimidation similar to KH?

That doesn't equate to an automatic win, like the guy said above me, Smoker is much stronger than Monet, in both will power and strength. Unbelievably stronger actually. No type of intimidation is getting through to him, unless it's a Roger or Garp tier character.

I agree I think people assume Zoro is stronger because Zoro has been doing nothing but defeating fodders with ease since the time skip, Vergo was Doflamingo's right hand man so we'll be able to judge Zoro's strength if he battles Pica. but feat wise Smoker > Zoro.

Their actual strength however is more than likely Zoro = Smoker.

 

[chopstickchakra]

Because Chinjao was one-shotted!!!! This should make it clear for you.
Shiki is one of the Pirate King rivals, on the same tier as Sengoku, WB, Garp, Roger. It takes Sengoku AND Garp to defeat and capture him. And half of MF was destroyed in the process.

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And how about Chinjao? Garp solos him with a single punch. Admiral level? Don't make me laugh. Prime Garp will defeat an admiral Mid Diff. Probably High Diff. And Chinjao? Super Low Diff. Now as per your understanding the pwer level of Shiki and Chinjao should be similar? So how come Chinjao got one-shotted and Shiki held his own and the two marines?

And Garp isn't the sort to follow orders. He chases after whoever he pleases. He chased after Shakky all the time too. I don't think Marines 'sent' him after Chinjao.

Chinjao is familiar with Rayleigh and by his tone has had encounters with him and the crew before which would make him by definition a rival of Roger.

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You make it seem like Luffy handled him with ease well, buddy that's not really the case now is it?
Here they clash

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And here, plus Zoro says "don't let him beat you" which he wouldn't say if Luffy wasn't on the defensive

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Still fighting

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Luffy hits Hawk Rifle

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Chinjao gets up within a panel

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Announcer calls it the greatest fight it the Colosseum ever

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Luffy uses gear 3rd with Haki

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Chinajo breaks the ring simply by falling, Zoro would need an attack to do that

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As for Garp he had tried previously to beat Chinjao's head by his statement. Also he compared Chinjao's head to a mountain so you would need to be able to destroy a mountain to beat his head(according to Garp)

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[SSS12]

Chinjao is familiar with Rayleigh and by his tone has had encounters with him and the crew before which would make him by definition a rival of Roger.

Spoiler

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You make it seem like Luffy handled him with ease well, buddy that's not really the case now is it?
Here they clash

Spoiler

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And here, plus Zoro says "don't let him beat you" which he wouldn't say if Luffy wasn't on the defensive

Spoiler

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Still fighting

Spoiler

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Luffy hits Hawk Rifle

Spoiler

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Chinjao gets up within a panel

Spoiler

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Announcer calls it the greatest fight it the Colosseum ever

Spoiler

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Luffy uses gear 3rd with Haki

Spoiler

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Chinajo breaks the ring simply by falling, Zoro would need an attack to do that

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As for Garp he had tried previously to beat Chinjao's head by his statement. Also he compared Chinjao's head to a mountain so you would need to be able to destroy a mountain to beat his head(according to Garp)

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So the fight lasts for 3-4 manga pages. Alright. And Luffy still escapes unscathed from the fight.
Yes I'm sure Current Luffy would defeat Sengoku in 3-4 pages without being scratched too. Maybe MF WB too. And Prime Garp could probably one shot Rayleigh. Great.

I'm done explaining. Believe what you want. I'm quite sure you have realised that Chinjao is nowhere near as powerful as you make him out to be, you just don't want to admit it. If you still don't realise this, you probably never will. :bye:

 

[Anarkist]

Just because someone has Haki it doesn't mean they can beat a logia, Marco has Haki but he couldn't beat Akainu, Rayleigh has Haki but he didn't beat Kizaru. Your logic would only work if Smoker was as weak as Monet but since he's not your logic is flawed on that bases alone.

Not really, look at SH's training. Luffy is really strong right now until he meets someone stronger, Zoro is said to be of equal strength and his training with Mihawk means more. Zoro isn't affected by Seastone and he has really high endurance. He would be able to beat Smoker with his speed and whatever he learnt with Mihawk. (Haven't seen One Piece since the dragon fight on PH)

 

[chopstickchakra]

So the fight lasts for 3-4 manga pages. Alright. And Luffy still escapes unscathed from the fight.
Yes I'm sure Current Luffy would defeat Sengoku in 3-4 pages without being scratched too. Maybe MF WB too. And Prime Garp could probably one shot Rayleigh. Great.

I'm done explaining. Believe what you want. I'm quite sure you have realised that Chinjao is nowhere near as powerful as you make him out to be, you just don't want to admit it. If you still don't realise this, you probably never will. :bye:

It's funny you want to argue with the manga just because you disagree with me. The manga stated in multiple ways(Zoro, announcer, clash of Haki, duration) that Luffy vs Chinjao was no quick breeze through the park. 3-4 pages(which it wasn't it was over the span of chapters, so you clearly didn't read or are being an argumentative *******) is about 5-10 minutes(at the least) given all the other events that happened during Luffy's tournament match.

This thread was about Zoro and Sanji beating Chinjao not Sengoku or the admirals or WB the fact that you still desperately cling to an arguement that holds no relevancy to the topic is kind of astonishing, but I guess when you're wrong you'll hold on to anything, huh? Maybe you don't need to be a Monkey to defeat him but Zoro nor Sanji is as strong as anyone you mentioned so....good job typing some irrelevant stuff.

 

[same name]

Captain Kuro
Morgan (the marine with the metal jaw,you would count Sanji as we first saw him for this fight)
Don Krieg
Arlong
Wapol
Crocodile
Enel
Blueno
Lucci
Moria
Magelan
Hody
Caesar
Smoker (the post skip one,none of them could beat him pre TS since they had no haki)
Don Chinjao

 

[SSS12]

I looked at Chinjao as only Garp and his family could beat them. Zoro and Sanji would put up a serious fight but I assume you have to be a Monkey to win.

Because the only man to ever beat him was Garp. Not Sengoku not Kizaru not Akainu. Plus he said if he had known about Dragon earlier he'd have killed him, why not kill him now? Because Dragons too strong now.

Can Kuma destroy and entire continent with one attack? No, so get outta here with that. Chinjao has haki as strong as Luffy which again Kuma does not(or has not shown)

I wouldn't call this old age Garp either he was 30 years younger.

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The strongest person Akainu's beaten is Ace and Aokiji. Sengoku was in charge during Roger's era which Chinjao was around for to assume they never crossed when Chinjao had over 500 mil bounty is absurdity. He only holds a grudge on Garp and not Sengoku because of his head. What makes you think Kizaru or Akainu could beat him they've never actually beat someone in legendary status.

You are the one who started the whole thing by saying that only a Monkey can beat Chinjao. And then you went on to say that people like Sengoku and admirals can't beat him. I figured if I can't prove that Sengoku and the admirals can beat him, prime or not, I have no chance with Sanji and Zoro. You've spouted a lot of other nonsense which I chose to ignore to stay on topic.

It's funny you want to argue with the manga just because you disagree with me. The manga stated in multiple ways(Zoro, announcer, clash of Haki, duration) that Luffy vs Chinjao was no quick breeze through the park. 3-4 pages(which it wasn't it was over the span of chapters, so you clearly didn't read or are being an argumentative *******) is about 5-10 minutes(at the least) given all the other events that happened during Luffy's tournament match.

This thread was about Zoro and Sanji beating Chinjao not Sengoku or the admirals or WB the fact that you still desperately cling to an arguement that holds no relevancy to the topic is kind of astonishing, but I guess when you're wrong you'll hold on to anything, huh? Maybe you don't need to be a Monkey to defeat him but Zoro nor Sanji is as strong as anyone you mentioned so....good job typing some irrelevant stuff.

And here you change your mind. I did get through after all. Glad. And then you make it seem like I started all the Sengoku arguments.
I don't know how you think how someone who couldn't hurt Luffy can defeat Sanji and Zoro. And Zoro specialises in CoA Haki, so don't say he doesn't have strong haki.

The fact that you resorted to insults and swearing proves that you just lost the argument big time. It was real mature to swear man, way to go.

 

[chopstickchakra]

You are the one who started the whole thing by saying that only a Monkey can beat Chinjao. And then you went on to say that people like Sengoku and admirals can't beat him. I figured if I can't prove that Sengoku and the admirals can beat him, prime or not, I have no chance with Sanji and Zoro. You've spouted a lot of other nonsense which I chose to ignore to stay on topic.


And here you change your mind. I did get through after all. Glad. And then you make it seem like I started all the Sengoku arguments.
I don't know how you think how someone who couldn't hurt Luffy can defeat Sanji and Zoro. And Zoro specialises in CoA Haki, so don't say he doesn't have strong haki.

The fact that you resorted to insults and swearing proves that you just lost the argument big time. It was real mature to swear man, way to go.

I changed my point about being a Monkey to beat him because I wasn't originally counting older characters like WB or Roger and Sengoku hasn't been heard from in awhile so I didn't consider him. I still think that of the living characters your best chance at victory is if you are a Monkey.

Zoro may have strong CoA, I never said he didn't. I said I doubt he has stronger CoA than his captain who trained with one of the best Haki users we've seen so far(albeit Kings/Conqueror's Haki) Zoro trained with Mihawk who has shown no CoA so to assume he trained him in it is just illogical. And to assume Mihawk has stronger Haki than Rayleigh is also unjustified.


If you re-read my posts without putting your own bias into it you would see I never actually said Sengoku wouldn't beat him, I said Akainu or Kizaru wouldn't. I said, Sengoku was never mentioned beating him and that is what led me to believe that only Garp and his family could beat Chinjao.

As for the swearing, I can't control what they consider too offensive for children. As for the question of it's maturity, I reference you to a book titled grow up. We were having an argument, that's exactly what those words were invented for. Invented by mature adults I may add. You act as if I just inexplicably started hurling expletives and derogatory comments at you, I said one thing; either you didn't read well enough to realize the fight took more than 1 chapter(not the 3-4 pages you claimed) or you were being argumentative for arguments sake and to not feel wrong(which there's a word for that type of person in the English language.....as.shole)

 

[SSS12]

I changed my point about being a Monkey to beat him because I wasn't originally counting older characters like WB or Roger and Sengoku hasn't been heard from in awhile so I didn't consider him. I still think that of the living characters your best chance at victory is if you are a Monkey.

Zoro may have strong CoA, I never said he didn't. I said I doubt he has stronger CoA than his captain who trained with one of the best Haki users we've seen so far(albeit Kings/Conqueror's Haki) Zoro trained with Mihawk who has shown no CoA so to assume he trained him in it is just illogical. And to assume Mihawk has stronger Haki than Rayleigh is also unjustified.


If you re-read my posts without putting your own bias into it you would see I never actually said Sengoku wouldn't beat him, I said Akainu or Kizaru wouldn't. I said, Sengoku was never mentioned beating him and that is what led me to believe that only Garp and his family could beat Chinjao.

As for the swearing, I can't control what they consider too offensive for children. As for the question of it's maturity, I reference you to a book titled grow up. We were having an argument, that's exactly what those words were invented for. Invented by mature adults I may add. You act as if I just inexplicably started hurling expletives and derogatory comments at you, I said one thing; either you didn't read well enough to realize the fight took more than 1 chapter(not the 3-4 pages you claimed) or you were being argumentative for arguments sake and to not feel wrong(which there's a word for that type of person in the English language.....as.shole)

Hahaha. You sweared for no reason. Merely because I was getting the better of you? So you thought, "Hey since I can't win the argument maybe I should just swear at him." That's childish, NOT maturity. And I'm willing to bet my life you couldn't have written the book 'Growing Up.'
Lol, the guy who claims that Sengoku or admirals couldn't have defeated Chinjao telling me off, that's rich. And you're starting to deny and go back on your words. Like I said, I'm sure you've realized I was right now.

That's me signing off from this thread. Yeah, go ahead and swear some more, kid.

 

[chopstickchakra]

Hahaha. You sweared for no reason. Merely because I was getting the better of you? So you thought, "Hey since I can't win the argument maybe I should just swear at him." That's childish, NOT maturity. And I'm willing to bet my life you couldn't have written the book 'Growing Up.'
Lol, the guy who claims that Sengoku or admirals couldn't have defeated Chinjao telling me off, that's rich. And you're starting to deny and go back on your words. Like I said, I'm sure you've realized I was right now.

That's me signing off from this thread. Yeah, go ahead and swear some more, kid.

I don't know what's more sad, you refusing to accept the evidence the manga shows you or your believing you were right or somehow won for doing so.

 

[TheHokage]

Not really, look at SH's training. Luffy is really strong right now until he meets someone stronger, Zoro is said to be of equal strength and his training with Mihawk means more. Zoro isn't affected by Seastone and he has really high endurance. He would be able to beat Smoker with his speed and whatever he learnt with Mihawk. (Haven't seen One Piece since the dragon fight on PH)

Bold: That's an opinion in my own personal opinion Zoro is just a little bit stronger than Sanji and a little bit weaker than Luffy.

You don't need training off people like Mihawk or Rayleigh to become strong the majority of the Supernova's gained strength by fighting in the New World. Also there's no proof that you can provide that suggests in speed wise Zoro>Smoker as again that's just your opinion and also we don't know what Mihawk taught Zoro for all we know he might not have taught him anything...in relation to his swordsman ship.