Hell doesn't exist - Unbiased, non-religous

[The Work]

Are you sure its not a misinterpretation?

In this story, you're pretty much taught that after death the unrighteous are eternally separated from God, that they remember their rejection of the Gospel, that they are in torment.

Torment can stand for a bunch of things. In the bible it says that Satan is always in Torment (since he was cast from the heavens). I doubt he is in constant physical pain, however, he can be in mental pain as a POW is when they are being shackled and left in a room with little to no water (That too is torment). It's just a word to explain how much hatred he bleeds.

As Brother Numpsay discussed, "Fire" is just a terminology for someone back in the day, and even now, used because we understand what fire can do to people and materials.

Satan is not in hell yet. He's roaming the Earth finding people to tempt, recieve worship from, and make people fall astray. He even tried tempting Jesus but he failed.

Satan was casted down from Heaven along with his helpers to Earth.

Whenever Christ returns that is when he will throw Satan in hell or Lake of Fire along with the unrighteous to burn eternally.

In the bible it says "Do not fear man who can destroy the body, but fear God who can destroy the soul."

Just google all the bible verses that talk about hell and you will see.

 

[Ansatsuken]

Im asking again why using bible only as references as Quran, Torah were bible's siblings?

 

[Tartarus]

There's a lot of evidence that the early Israelites actually didn't even have an afterlife belief until the Second Temple Period. Everyone good or bad eventually went to Sheol(The Grave) for an eternal slumber with their family. The term Gi-Hinnom/Gehenna (Valley of Hinnom) was a valley where worshipers of Moloch burned their children alive as sacrifices. It was cursed to be a dumping ground for the corpses of the wicked in the Prophetic books. It eventually evolved to a vague hell or purgatory-like realm where the wicked would go after death, however the "Hell" most people think of is actually based more on the Tartarus of Greek mythology.

 

[Brother Numpsay]

Read the story about Lazarus and the Rich Man in the bible.

Hell is real (Lake of Fire, Fiery Furnace, Eternal Punishment, Fiery Lake of Burning Sulfur

Jesus got the keys of death and hell. He controls where you go.

Of course you wouldn't believe in it since your not a Christian.

Read my post. Post 32 corrects what he says, which he agrees, made some mistakes in his OP.

If you understood his post, he conceded (post #37). What our post is trying to say that Hell exsist. BUT NOT THE COMMON INTERPRETATION everyone thinks whats its going to be like. People thinks it "eternal suffering", which is main point this thread was made in the first place to discuss.

Dont jump to conclusions.



Check out this video it breaks down why "Lazarus and the Rich Man", a parable, shouldnt be used a evidence for eternal suffering in hell.

Satan is not in hell yet. He's roaming the Earth finding people to tempt, recieve worship from, and make people fall astray. He even tried tempting Jesus but he failed.

Satan was casted down from Heaven along with his helpers to Earth.

Whenever Christ returns that is when he will throw Satan in hell or Lake of Fire along with the unrighteous to burn eternally.

In the bible it says "Do not fear man who can destroy the body, but fear God who can destroy the soul."

Just google all the bible verses that talk about hell and you will see.

Agree with everything but bold. It also says that Hades, the very place for the dead, is also being thrown into the lake of fire. Does that mean the location is going to burn in hell forever (like the video says)? This is why we need to be careful of interpreting things.

 

[The Work]

Read my post. Post 32 corrects what he says, which he agrees, made some mistakes in his OP.

If you understood his post, he conceded (post #37). What our post is trying to say that Hell exsist. BUT NOT THE COMMON INTERPRETATION everyone thinks whats its going to be like. People thinks it "eternal suffering", which is main point this thread was made in the first place to discuss.

Dont jump to conclusions.

Spoiler

Check out this video it breaks down why "Lazarus and the Rich Man", a parable, shouldnt be used a evidence for eternal suffering in hell.


Agree with everything but bold. It also says that Hades, the very place for the dead, is also being thrown into the lake of fire. Does that mean the location is going to burn in hell forever (like the video says)? This is why we need to be careful of interpreting things.

Ok

To simplify things, God judges for a person to either go to Everlasting Life or Everlasting Punishment.

Everlasting Punishment as in being tormented in fire that doesn't end and being destroyed.

Besides the Lazarus story, there are still many other bible versus that talks about one's destruction in Hell.

 

[Tartarus]

Ok

To simplify things, God judges for a person to either go to Everlasting Life or Everlasting Punishment.

Everlasting Punishment as in being tormented in fire that doesn't end and being destroyed.

Besides the Lazarus story, there are still many other bible versus that talks about one's destruction in Hell.

Torment may not imply instant destruction, but it does not imply the opposite either, all it implies is suffering. Compare these two:
-(Isa 34:5-10):“For my sword has drunk its fill in heaven;now it descends on Edom to judge them,the people I have doomed to destruction.”...Its streams will be changed to tar, its dust to sulfur, its land burning tar that will not be quenched night or day;its smoke will rise forever.In all generations it will lie waste;no one will pass through it ever again.

-(Rev 14):And the smoke of their torment will rise for ever and ever. There will be no rest day or night for those who worship the beast and its image, or for anyone who receives the mark of its name.

Edom (Modern day Jordan) isn't still on fire is it? The other issue is that words commonly used for "eternal" don't plainly mean that. Rotherhan and Aion are closer translated as "age-enduring". They are usually meant as hyperbolic statements to mean a long time or something that endures until the end of our age until the World to Come.

 

[Desanto]

Ok

To simplify things, God judges for a person to either go to Everlasting Life or Everlasting Punishment.

Everlasting Punishment as in being tormented in fire that doesn't end and being destroyed.

Besides the Lazarus story, there are still many other bible versus that talks about one's destruction in Hell.

I don't think you get the point we are trying to make, man.

 

[Desanto]

Im asking again why using bible only as references as Quran, Torah were bible's siblings?

Why would I ? The Quran contradicts itself many times...in certain places it claims that those who enter the fire will endure it forever, whereas other texts say that the punishment of hell is not eternal... There's no need to go any further.

 

[Ansatsuken]

Why would I ? The Quran contradicts itself many times...in certain places it claims that those who enter the fire will endure it forever, whereas other texts say that the punishment of hell is not eternal... There's no need to go any further.

Thats the part you doesnt understand.

For non-believer of Allah and Islam(non-moslim or athiest) they will stayed in hell forever/eternal.

For the believer of Allah and Islam(moslim) but having more sins than good deed, they get send to hell and get the punishment until all the sins is gone/no more. Then they can enter heaven and live there forever/eternal.

Dont call me troll if you unable to understand. Go read the book, actual book and not from internet.

 

[Desanto]

Thats the part you doesnt understand.

For non-believer of Allah and Islam(non-moslim or athiest) they will stayed in hell forever/eternal.

For the believer of Allah and Islam(moslim) but having more sins than good deed, they get send to hell and get the punishment until all the sins is gone/no more. Then they can enter heaven and live there forever/eternal.

Dont call me troll if you unable to understand. Go read the book, actual book and not from internet.

I understand completely, you don't understand me. The Quran contains more problems than it does answers, mate. I'd rather not go into details. If you can't see how it contradicts itself, you are already going into this debate with a biased state of mind. The Quran isn't even sure if people who go to hell (If there is one) go forever or not and if not, how long and if there's limitations. It contradicts itself over and over. I wont go any further than that.

 

[Ansatsuken]

I understand completely, you don't understand me. The Quran contains more problems than it does answers, mate. I'd rather not go into details. If you can't see how it contradicts itself, you are already going into this debate with a biased state of mind. The Quran isn't even sure if people who go to hell (If there is one) go forever or not and if not, how long and if there's limitations. It contradicts itself over and over. I wont go any further than that.

Quran just telling human most important things.

At bold, there the proof that you not understanding Quran.

Quran was not created to be a book of results. Its book of messages. It only tells the most important thing human need to know example: the existance of God, Hell, Heaven, Angels, After life, Death, Judgement day, Satan-Djin-Iblis, What is sin etc. and not telling the result like you want here.

Only God(Allah) knew and holds all the results example the staying period of a person inside hell, the punishment. The times duration you stayed in hell depends on the amount/sum of sins you made when you alive. Only God knew that. Quran wont tell that.

What I know from Quran:-

Quran 22.47 compares time of Earth with time at Paradise/Hell (1 day vs 1000 years). While Quran 70.4 compares time on Earth with time in wormholes (1 day vs 50,000 years).

[Quran 22.47] They challenge you to bring forth that torture [in Hell] and Allah will not break His promise; a day of your Lord [Paradise/Hell promise] is like a thousand years of what you count

::::1day in Hell/Heaven=1000 years of our world::::

And in current time according to Islam(Moslim believe), there are no human inside Hell or Heaven as of now. Hell and Heaven still empty.

All decease humans as of right now were inside after life. After Judgement day is the time human get told by God(Allah) which place they will go, Hell or Heaven.

 

[Desanto]

Quran just telling human most important things.

At bold, there the proof that you not understanding Quran.

Quran was not created to be a book of results. Its book of messages. It only tells the most important thing human need to know example: the existance of God, Hell, Heaven, Angels, After life, Death, Judgement day, Satan-Djin-Iblis, What is sin etc. and not telling the result like you want here.

Only God(Allah) knew and holds all the results example the staying period of a person inside hell, the punishment. The times duration you stayed in hell depends on the amount/sum of sins you made when you alive. Only God knew that. Quran wont tell that.

What I know from Quran:-

Quran 22.47 compares time of Earth with time at Paradise/Hell (1 day vs 1000 years). While Quran 70.4 compares time on Earth with time in wormholes (1 day vs 50,000 years).

[Quran 22.47] They challenge you to bring forth that torture [in Hell] and Allah will not break His promise; a day of your Lord [Paradise/Hell promise] is like a thousand years of what you count

::::1day in Hell/Heaven=1000 years of our world::::

And in current time according to Islam(Moslim believe), there are no human inside Hell or Heaven as of now. Hell and Heaven still empty.

All decease humans as of right now were inside after life. After Judgement day is the time human get told by God(Allah) which place they will go, Hell or Heaven.

Nothing in the Quran or bible is solid proof. Like I said, I wont debate with you. Quran contradicts itself more than the bible. All you did was prove to me that you don't know how to stay on topic to my thread about the BIBLE and 2nd, that you're debating over the Quran with an extremely biased view.

All I did was make a statement about Hell or the rapture being misinterpreted in the bible, no more.

If you want the truth about how the Quran contradicts itself, google it.

 

[Tartarus]

How come no one likes my posts :<

 

[Ansatsuken]

Nothing in the Quran or bible is solid proof. Like I said, I wont debate with you. Quran contradicts itself more than the bible. All you did was prove to me that you don't know how to stay on topic to my thread about the BIBLE and 2nd, that you're debating over the Quran with an extremely biased view.

All I did was make a statement about Hell or the rapture being misinterpreted in the bible, no more.

If you want the truth about how the Quran contradicts itself, google it.

Ok , kind to tell me some of the contradictions. Post 3 contradictions that you knew and I will enlighten you.

About Jihad/about Prophet Muhammad(P.B.U.H) wives/about universe creation etc etc etc.

You already got some of the info from me here

like I said only God knew and true moslim never saw any contradictions in Quran. Only moslim extremist will try to benefits from that so-called contradictions in which never exist.

Im asking you, if you really read Quran and not internet, do you know about this 1 day in Hell = 1000 years of our world?

And the so-called contradictions exist because non-moslim that tried to read Quran never trully understand it.

 

[TrollingSage]

Read the story about Lazarus and the Rich Man in the bible.

Hell is real (Lake of Fire, Fiery Furnace, Eternal Punishment, Fiery Lake of Burning Sulfur

Jesus got the keys of death and hell. He controls where you go.

Of course you wouldn't believe in it since your not a Christian.

Romans 6:23 "The wages sin pays is death". If humans pay for their sins with death, what are the people in hell paying for then?
The story about Lazarus is just an illustration. In that parable the rich man was able to look up from hell and see Lazarus in heaven. How does that even make sense.

 

[The Work]

I don't think you get the point we are trying to make, man.

I see what you're trying to say now bro. But I still believe in the eternal suffering.
Tbh, I don't want to know what's in store for the people that go that direction.

Romans 6:23 "The wages sin pays is death". If humans pay for their sins with death, what are the people in hell paying for then?
The story about Lazarus is just an illustration. In that parable the rich man was able to look up from hell and see Lazarus in heaven. How does that even make sense.

Death isn't eternal life. It's the exact opposite. You go to eternal suffering.

 

[Brother Numpsay]

Everlasting Punishment as in being tormented in fire that doesn't end and being destroyed.

You can't be forever suffering if your destroyed...

Besides the Lazarus story, there are still many other bible versus that talks about one's destruction in Hell.

Then I guess you aren't listening as Lazarus story was been explained in that video. So I expect every other verses you are think supports this, is also taken out of context.

 

[The Work]

You can't be forever suffering if your destroyed...



Then I guess you aren't listening as Lazarus story was been explained in that video. So I expect every other verses you are think supports this, is also taken out of context.

Well bro, I see you guys point.
You might be right, you might not be. No one knows for sure until they die.
It's something I don't want to know about really, cause I don't want to go there.

As a Christian, my goal is not to end up being there.

 

[Venomous Cobra]

I don't follow the bible and thus I can't correct you but even so, I can clearly see some mistakes in you argument....

 

[nefraiko]

Ok , kind to tell me some of the contradictions. Post 3 contradictions that you knew and I will enlighten you.

About Jihad/about Prophet Muhammad(P.B.U.H) wives/about universe creation etc etc etc.

You already got some of the info from me here

like I said only God knew and true moslim never saw any contradictions in Quran. Only moslim extremist will try to benefits from that so-called contradictions in which never exist.

Im asking you, if you really read Quran and not internet, do you know about this 1 day in Hell = 1000 years of our world?

And the so-called contradictions exist because non-moslim that tried to read Quran never trully understand it.

hey, just don't bother with him, he say's the quran is full of contradictions that's his belief, he won't change it, just stop. (I'm a muslim)