Good or Evil? Who are the real villains of the Narutoverse?

[Mitarashi]

What gives you the right to say that if someone doesn't believe in the Bible 100%, they're not Christian? Who gave you that right? Or did you just think of that yourself because you're arrogant?

Hmm... That riled me up a bit... That usually doesn't happen lol. I don't mean to be hostile.

The bible is the sole source of Christianity, if you don't believe in that you're practically taking someone's word that 'god' exists and all of that other gibberish.

And if you believe in Christianity without having read the bible you're a complete fool that is gullible beyond belief.

wow that is probably the most narcissistic thing I've ever heard; you don't share that folly?

not everyone fears death even without religion

religion isn't created solely for the purpose of having an afterlife; there are some religions that have a pretty unhappy afterlife like in Ancient Egyptian mythology.

religion(not just christianity) is meant for guiding, discipline, enlightenment, redemption, order

religion was many times created to give people an understanding of the world around them

and having faith can inspire




good and evil are subjective terms. To some good is evil and vice versa.

hence there can be a messiah to some and not to others.

The only thing that makes such things considered to be true and fact is if the majority believes it.

If humans were immortal there'd be no Christianity.
That alone goes to show that it's mainly just something people use as an excuse to not fear death so much.

 

[saw2097]

The bible is the sole source of Christianity, if you don't believe in that you're practically taking someone's word that 'god' exists and all of that other gibberish.

And if you believe in Christianity without having read the bible you're a complete fool that is gullible beyond belief.




If humans were immortal there'd be no Christianity.
That alone goes to show that it's mainly just something people use as an excuse to not fear death so much.

That's not true, I am Christian and believe in God but I have only read bits and pieces of the bible. I don't need anyone to tell me what to believe in.

The Bible was written by humans and has been re translated over and over again many times, so who knows how much of what was originally written has been changed over the years.

 

[Lightbringer]

The bible is the sole source of Christianity, if you don't believe in that you're practically taking someone's word that 'god' exists and all of that other gibberish.

And if you believe in Christianity without having read the bible you're a complete fool that is gullible beyond belief.

have you even read the bible?

Having faith and believing that Jesus is the savior of mankind is what makes a person Christian

The bible is the sole source of Christianity, if you don't believe in that you're practically taking someone's word that 'god' exists and all of that other gibberish.

And if you believe in Christianity without having read the bible you're a complete fool that is gullible beyond belief.


have you read the bible?

having faith and believing that jesus is the savior of mankind is the source of christianity



If humans were immortal there'd be no Christianity.
That alone goes to show that it's mainly just something people use as an excuse to not fear death so much.

that is a baseless assumption

what makes you think that it is mortality that drives religion?


being immortal wouldn't stop people from searching for a purpose or the cause of their origin and the origin of all life

 

[BlueMeteor]

Oro obiti and madara are the villains, sasuke and nagato are confused, and itachi naruto and minato are the heros

agreed ^^^^^

 

[HiddenSound]

The bible is the sole source of Christianity, if you don't believe in that you're practically taking someone's word that 'god' exists and all of that other gibberish.

And if you believe in Christianity without having read the bible you're a complete fool that is gullible beyond belief.




If humans were immortal there'd be no Christianity.
That alone goes to show that it's mainly just something people use as an excuse to not fear death so much.

You can believe in parts of the Bible and not others. It's not too hard to comprehend. But I'm not about to argue something like this with someone like you.

 

[Mitarashi]

I Have read the bible, my family is all religious.

I believe in what I can prove.
I don't believe in religion for the same reason that I don't believe Naruto is real, it's a book.

 

[Lightbringer]

I Have read the bible, my family is all religious.

I believe in what I can prove.
I don't believe in religion for the same reason that I don't believe Naruto is real, it's a book.

well that explains it then, you hate religion because you were forced into it

unlike you, I chose to believe in it. My family is atheist and I have my own reasons for believing in what I believe


believing what you can prove?

Can you prove the big bang? Evolution? Relativity?

No you cannot, because they're theories. A theory is something that doesn't have conclusive evidence either because we don't have the technology to prove it further or that it doesn't exist.


Science is in its core a theory. We only know less than 1% of the universe and you expect that we should know everything already.

Can you disprove god, an afterlife, or a higher power? No you can't


that's why people choose to believe in something.



So because religion is in a book you choose not to believe it? What about science books then?

 

[ILikeBigYolos]

Mizuki DAT TIGER FORM SWAG.

 

[Mitarashi]

well that explains it then, you hate religion because you were forced into it

unlike you, I chose to believe in it. My family is atheist and I have my own reasons for believing in what I believe


believing what you can prove?

Can you prove the big bang? Evolution? Relativity?

No you cannot, because they're theories. A theory is something that doesn't have conclusive evidence either because we don't have the technology to prove it further or that it doesn't exist.


Science is in its core a theory. We only know less than 1% of the universe and you expect that we should know everything already.

Can you disprove god, an afterlife, or a higher power? No you can't


that's why people choose to believe in something.



So because religion is in a book you choose not to believe it? What about science books then?

I wasn't 'forced' into religion, my family knows I don't accept it and they don't pressure me at all, very good tbh.
Evolution can be proved, and has been multiple times.
Can I disprove god?
Look at the state of the world dude, millions of people starve and die every day for no reason, a god wouldn't do this, and if he is, he doesn't deserve my faith.

 

[-immortal-]

i could make such a Good AMV with this song...sadly..my shit doesnt work

 

[Mitarashi]

i could make such a Good AMV with this song...sadly..my shit doesnt work

Dude that is a good AMV, did you not watch.

 

[Lightbringer]

I wasn't 'forced' into religion, my family knows I don't accept it and they don't pressure me at all, very good tbh.
Evolution can be proved, and has been multiple times.
Can I disprove god?
Look at the state of the world dude, millions of people starve and die every day for no reason, a god wouldn't do this, and if he is, he doesn't deserve my faith.

evolution has varying degrees. We've only proved small evolutionary feats, not large ones such as humans evolving from prehistoric apes

how does our state of the world disprove god?

I could tell this right now, if I were god and had unlimited power I'd create a perfect world for myself(heaven) and a world where randomness and chaos is still a possibility for my amusement(earth), alongside an infinite number of other universes

Why would god limit himself when he's unlimited?

also, there's the reason for an afterlife.

Suffering and hardship are trials for us in order to ascend. Without evil, how would we know the value of good? Where is the choice in that?

God gave us free will, and it was us that made the world the way it is.

Could you really say you could develop your own unique identity without having faced the obstacles you did in your life?

You say you know the bible, yet you don't understand it and you say things without thinking it.



Sure much of the bible doesn't sound realistic, but do you really believe that in this infinite universe there isn't such a being that amount of power? Again, the universe is infinite

Have you ever thought that god could have been the cause of evolution or the big bang?

Let's take the big bang theory for instance. A giant star that exploded and created the universe. Before this star there was absolutely nothing, so how could this star have come to existence without nothing? And not just any star, but a star so huge we can't even fathom it because it is the star that birthed all life in existence.

Don't you think it's more unrealistic to say that it just happened to come from nowhere without some force to create it?


Have you ever thought how amazing it is that every little thing in our existence works in synchronized harmony from gravity, to light, to plants growing and releasing CO2 and animals breathing it in and releasing Oxygen, from cells multiplying and dying and replicating DNA for reproduction?

This is too complicated for life to be just random; it's too well organized.

 

[Mitarashi]

evolution has varying degrees. We've only proved small evolutionary feats, not large ones such as humans evolving from prehistoric apes

how does our state of the world disprove god?

I could tell this right now, if I were god and had unlimited power I'd create a perfect world for myself(heaven) and a world where randomness and chaos is still a possibility for my amusement(earth), alongside an infinite number of other universes

Why would god limit himself when he's unlimited?

also, there's the reason for an afterlife.

Suffering and hardship are trials for us in order to ascend. Without evil, how would we know the value of good? Where is the choice in that?

God gave us free will, and it was us that made the world the way it is.

Could you really say you could develop your own unique identity without having faced the obstacles you did in your life?

You say you know the bible, yet you don't understand it and you say things without thinking it.



Sure much of the bible doesn't sound realistic, but do you really believe that in this infinite universe there isn't such a being that amount of power? Again, the universe is infinite

Have you ever thought that god could have been the cause of evolution or the big bang?

Let's take the big bang theory for instance. A giant star that exploded and created the universe. Before this star there was absolutely nothing, so how could this star have come to existence without nothing? And not just any star, but a star so huge we can't even fathom it because it is the star that birthed all life in existence.

Don't you think it's more unrealistic to say that it just happened to come from nowhere without some force to create it?


Have you ever thought how amazing it is that every little thing in our existence works in synchronized harmony from gravity, to light, to plants growing and releasing CO2 and animals breathing it in and releasing Oxygen, from cells multiplying and dying and replicating DNA for reproduction?

This is too complicated for life to be just random; it's too well organized.

Free will?
The bible says ' I gave you free will so that you could do exactly what I say or you will be eternally punished'
I never said there was no 'Higher power', I just said I don't believe in this one.

Also, if you've ever looked into it Christianity is an evident rip off of Greek mythology, There are more than 10 cases of the only difference in the 2 being the name of the person involved.

You obviously don't know how the Big bang worked, so we'll skip that.

The reason everything works is because if it didn't, it wouldn't exist, this points to evolution, over billions of years.

 

[Seventh Sama]

I really don't know ..... Madara and obito are trying to "save" the world but in a bad way....

 

[Lightbringer]

Free will?
The bible says ' I gave you free will so that you could do exactly what I say or you will be eternally punished'
I never said there was no 'Higher power', I just said I don't believe in this one.

Also, if you've ever looked into it Christianity is an evident rip off of Greek mythology, There are more than 10 cases of the only difference in the 2 being the name of the person involved.

You obviously don't know how the Big bang worked, so we'll skip that.

The reason everything works is because if it didn't, it wouldn't exist, this points to evolution, over billions of years.

it never said that. It just said there is a punishment for sinning.

There are people who believe in hell and still murder; it just goes to show that people will still choose evil even though they themselves believe in eternal punishment.

You're nitpicking at something that's meant to guide people and not meant to be literal most of the times.

The most important words are those of Jesus. His words are meant to inspire good in people and teach them to be virtuous.

Yet people would misinterpret it and start wars and argue over it.

Regardless if the rest of the bible is not true, the goal is meant to make a better world. Whether Jesus was the son of god or not, he died for what he believed in and he believed that humanity was worth dying for because he had faith that we would follow his example.

Christianity is not believing in an afterlife or an origin story, it's believing in what Jesus did.

 

[Mitarashi]

it never said that. It just said there is a punishment for sinning.

There are people who believe in hell and still murder; it just goes to show that people will still choose evil even though they themselves believe in eternal punishment.

You're nitpicking at something that's meant to guide people and not meant to be literal most of the times.

The most important words are those of Jesus. His words are meant to inspire good in people and teach them to be virtuous.

Yet people would misinterpret it and start wars and argue over it.

Regardless if the rest of the bible is not true, the goal is meant to make a better world. Whether Jesus was the son of god or not, he died for what he believed in and he believed that humanity was worth dying for because he had faith that we would follow his example.

Christianity is not believing in an afterlife or an origin story, it's believing in what Jesus did.

I respect your opinion, and I'm going to have to say you're one of the most intelligent Christians that I've have this discussion with.

We could do this all day ( and we have been xD ) so I'll just stop now and save us both some effort.
In the end we all have free will, whether or not it was given to us by a god or not doesn't matter.
We are all humans and I think we are equal.

 

[Lightbringer]

I respect your opinion, and I'm going to have to say you're one of the most intelligent Christians that I've have this discussion with.

We could do this all day ( and we have been xD ) so I'll just stop now and save us both some effort.
In the end we all have free will, whether or not it was given to us by a god or not doesn't matter.
We are all humans and I think we are equal.

thanks, and I think it's for the best we end it.

I spent a lot of time pondering this subject and not just on Christianity but other religions as well. Sometimes we just need to question existence and find the best answers that we see fit for ourselves.

Religion doesn't hold all the answers, but it can definitely enlighten and make life a more optimistic place, at least from personal experience.

 

[Mitarashi]

thanks, and I think it's for the best we end it.

I spent a lot of time pondering this subject and not just on Christianity but other religions as well. Sometimes we just need to question existence and find the best answers that we see fit for ourselves.

Religion doesn't hold all the answers, but it can definitely enlighten and make life a more optimistic place, at least from personal experience.

.

O.T
Could Hiruzen/tobirama be seen as a villian because of what they did to the Uchiha?
Or could you see the Uchiha as the villians here, I'm pretty sure there were options other than destroy the clan.

 

[Lightbringer]

.

O.T
Could Hiruzen/tobirama be seen as a villian because of what they did to the Uchiha?
Or could you see the Uchiha as the villians here, I'm pretty sure there were options other than destroy the clan.

Well Tobirama was already thought to be prejudice but then we heard his side of the story of how he tried to give an Uchiha something to focus on other than their anger which would lead them to darkness.

I don't think Hiruzen had much to do with the slaughter since Danzo initiated the event while Hiruzen was still trying to make peace with the Uchiha.

The Uchiha felt mistreated because of the actions of Madara and wanted justice, and Tobirama did what he did because of Madara.

I don't think there was any right or wrong decision made. Danzo did what he did because he believed the Uchiha couldn't be reasoned with and was afraid of civil war.


So I suppose it's safe to say that Madara is the villain since he was the cause of this strife. He says that what he's trying to do is for the sake of peace, but I highly doubt it. It was probably a story he fabricated to deceive Obito into doing what he wanted.

 

[Mitarashi]

Well Tobirama was already thought to be prejudice but then we heard his side of the story of how he tried to give an Uchiha something to focus on other than their anger which would lead them to darkness.

I don't think Hiruzen had much to do with the slaughter since Danzo initiated the event while Hiruzen was still trying to make peace with the Uchiha.

The Uchiha felt mistreated because of the actions of Madara and wanted justice, and Tobirama did what he did because of Madara.

I don't think there was any right or wrong decision made. Danzo did what he did because he believed the Uchiha couldn't be reasoned with and was afraid of civil war.


So I suppose it's safe to say that Madara is the villain since he was the cause of this strife. He says that what he's trying to do is for the sake of peace, but I highly doubt it. It was probably a story he fabricated to deceive Obito into doing what he wanted.

I agree with everything except the last bit.
If he wanted too, he could have killed Obito the minute he was reanimated and then been completely free of any competition.
I genuinely think he's trying to help the world, but he's mainly doing it for his brothers I think.
The Uchiha love more than any, and he loved more than most, it's like Sasukes' will to destroy his only friends and his home for retribution for what his brother had to go though.

He's just trying to get revenge on a world that's hurt him and his people so much, but he still does want to 'help'.