[Discussion] Gedo Mazo: An Analysis

[naruttebayo]

nice theory

 

[shadedcrow]

yeah, and your point is...?

This is Naruto's seal:

Spoiler

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Its the same symbol. Manga says Minato learned sealing from Kushina, who was an Uzumaki.

Not just that, here:

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Notice how in the panel in the middle right there's a guy performing a seal, with the very same symbol again.

Deduction, does'nt hurt, does it?

Yeah that mark is from the death reaper seal the third hokage has it and so does the forth after they used the death reaper seal. Natrutos mom was from the whirlpool village just because something looks similar doesn't mean its the same. It seems like your stretching artistic detail to fit your theory. But what ever it takes to float your boat lol have at it.


And my point is is that the seal mark you keep referencing isn't just Narutos. It's from the village of his ancestors that had close ties with the leaf village. There are all kinds of artistic details in the series that have meaning but don't mean much of anything in terms of adding to the plot of the story. And there has yet to be a demonic statue sealing jutsu other than the nine phantom dragons.sealing jutsu that seals tailed beast chakra into the statue. Look at chapter 255 like pages 4-8 and you see marks again but its just detail of the statue. Before the shikaku chakra is sealed.

 

[NarutoKage2]

Yeah that mark is from the death reaper seal the third hokage has it and so does the forth after they used the death reaper seal. Natrutos mom was from the whirlpool village just because something looks similar doesn't mean its the same. It seems like your stretching artistic detail to fit your theory. But what ever it takes to float your boat lol have at it.


And my point is is that the seal mark you keep referencing isn't just Narutos. It's from the village of his ancestors that had close ties with the leaf village. There are all kinds of artistic details in the series that have meaning but don't mean much of anything in terms of adding to the plot of the story. And there has yet to be a demonic statue sealing jutsu other than the nine phantom dragons.sealing jutsu that seals tailed beast chakra into the statue. Look at chapter 255 like pages 4-8 and you see marks again but its just detail of the statue. Before the shikaku chakra is sealed.

Why do you pretend to be stupid? I already told you in the OP that the basis of this theory is speculation based on imagery. Learn to read.

Your comments clearly show you did'nt bother to read that part of my post. And no shit it is'nt just Naruto's thats what i've been saying its related to the Uzumaki's, Naruto's seal was just an example.

Sigh. Are you really that dumb? Take it as a symbol on the flag of the whirlpool village or as a pattern found on several different seals the pattern is still similar. Ok, i'll tell you what. Show me an Uzumaki performing a seal that does'nt have that swirl and i'll take your point under serious consideration.

 

[naruto sennin]

I like it!s

 

[mintoandkushina]

Great! Always love you theories! Keep at this one, seems very viable.xd

 

[shadedcrow]

Why do you pretend to be stupid? I already told you in the OP that the basis of this theory is speculation based on imagery. Learn to read.

Your comments clearly show you did'nt bother to read that part of my post. And no shit it is'nt just Naruto's thats what i've been saying its related to the Uzumaki's, Naruto's seal was just an example.

Sigh. Are you really that dumb? Take it as a symbol on the flag of the whirlpool village or as a pattern found on several different seals the pattern is still similar. Ok, i'll tell you what. Show me an Uzumaki performing a seal that does'nt have that swirl and i'll take your point under serious consideration.

Watch eps 10 and Pein uses the sealing tech and nagato is uzumaki and it doesn't have the swirl on top of that you can see the demon statue in color and you see its just detail of the statue in color.

 

[NarutoKage2]

I like it!s

Thanks

Great! Always love you theories! Keep at this one, seems very viable.xd

Thanks everyone! I jumped some 50-60 points in rep after this

Watch eps 10 and Pein uses the sealing tech and nagato is uzumaki and it doesn't have the swirl on top of that you can see the demon statue in color and you see its just detail of the statue in color.

Anime= non canon.

This is the Manga section, in case you did'nt notice.

 

[Scorpio0Pharaoh0Titan]

amazing theory.
Makes sense.

Uzumaki excelled at sealing jutsu's, this is their best one yet.

 

[Bloody Temari]

This makes a lot of sense really. Gave some rep for excellent theory

 

[leafeater]

What is the Gedo Mazo, the Demonic Statue Of the Outer Path?

I wanted to analyze this in detail, so i started back reading the manga and i'll just sum up all that i found.This analysis looks at the imagery and is basically a theory of the Gedo Mazo representing the zenith in sealing abilities, and its possible links with the Uzumaki clan. I'll use manga pages to suggest the possibility of my theory, and it also takes into account the fact that Nagato was an Uzumaki and touches on the subject of why Tobi may have decided to have given him the Rinnegan in the first place. As with any theory, its not fact, and is based on speculation as such but it was an interesting topic to speculate on and unless Edo Madara can use said statue, this theory ought to hold weight.


The statue is first shown here:

Spoiler

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Pain does a seal before that :

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So initially it would appear to be a simple rinnegan summon. However, as we all know its later used to seal Gaara's Shikaku.Its also later shown to be used to seal other tailed beasts by providing enough chakra by the Akatsuki members to equal the chakra of the beast in question, something which normally takes 3 dyas.

One thing i just noticed about the picture, and i'll theorize:

Spoiler

The uzumaki clan symbol, we all know looks like this:

Spoiler

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The swirly image being shown on both the flag of the Eddy country, and on Naruto's Kyuubi seal. Basically, this symbol represented the Uzumaki clan who were renowned for sealing jutsus, and as told in the image were directly related to the Senju clan. Both the Senju and Uchiha were direct descendants of the Younger and Elder sons of the Sage of the 6 paths, respectively.

Now, take a look at this image, and tell me how many Uzumaki clan symbols do you see?:

Spoiler

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Is it a mere co incidence the Gedo Mazo is used for sealing the Bijuu.....?

Spoiler

If the Uzumaki clan were related to the Senju, and the Senju related to the Sage of the 6 Paths, this has to mean that the Uzumaki were related to the Sage as well. The Gedo Mazo is the ultimate sealing jutsu, passed down by the SO6P by blood to the Uzumaki. I'm sure you'll be like wtf!! at this point but bear with me. The Uzumaki were so deadly at sealing that their whole village was destroyed, only a few scattered survivors remained. Their seals were of sufficient caliber to seal Bijuu, as attested by both Mito's seal and later Naruto's seal (based off Uzumaki techs performed by the 4th Hokage). The fact that the same seal symbol appears on the Statue suggests a connection between the Gedo's sealing and the Uzumaki clan's seal.

Why Tobi gave Nagato the Rinnegan, and later wanted that rinnegan back::

Spoiler

Ok, now my theory with regard to the Gedo statue reaches its crux at this point. Why would Tobi give Nagato the rinnegan(he probably got it from Madara, but that's a different story). Why not just wear one eye himself, as he does now? My belief is that Tobi figured out a way to seal the tailed beasts and achieve his Moon's Eye Plan by giving an Uzumaki the rinnegan, and thus the opportunity to unlock the ultimate kekkai genkai of the Uzumaki clan: the God of Sealing, the Gedo Mazo. Why has'nt Edo Madara, an Uchiha been able to summon Gedo during his fight with the 5 kages? Basically, once an Uzumaki uses a rinnegan, it reacts by giving him the ability to reach the ultimate in his genetic potential, which is sealing. Thereafter, that specific rinnegan will always have the ability to summon said statue.

To do a rundown:

Spoiler

The Sage passed his complete strength/abilities into:
1. The Elder Son(Uchiha Clan)= eye powers
The ultimate potential: the Rinnegan
2. The Younger Son(Senju Clan)=body powers
The ultimate potential: unknown/mokuuton perhaps
3. The Uzumaki Clan(first member unknown, possibly an off shoot of the Senju)
The ultimate potential: The Gedo Mazo, awakened only when Uzumaki blood is used to tame the Rinnegan.

Conclusion:

Spoiler

The Gedo Mazo is the ultimate sealing jutsu, used originally by the SO6P to tame the Juubi. The sealing techniques later adopted by the Uzumaki clan were off shoots to this, the ultimate sealing technique, in a way similar to how the MS and sharingan can be thought of as lesser forms of the rinnegan, so the 8 trigrams Uzumaki seal on Naruto is a lesser form of the Statue, which can seal far more. However, it requires an Uzumaki with the Rinnegan to awaken it, as i earlier stated which is why Nagato was given this eye by Tobi.

Well, thanks for reading

Very interesting as always and well written, +rep . It's threads like these, along with others, that contain legitimate material in the OP and discussion that keep NB discussion relevant and actually get me to post. We need more of these... :izuna:


However, something is off (or not entirely consistent) with the swirls being entirely exactly Uzumaki-like that I'm not sure has been mentioned. If it has I apologize for repeating this, but I think I'll at least offer up some novel material anyway, hopefully...

First, take a look at the right hand of Gedo Mazo, which in the picture is actually on the left actually because it's facing us. The left-ward swirl is clockwise in its rotation (i.e. Uzumaki), while the other swirl is counter-clockwise in its rotation, which is inconsistent with the Uzumaki clan symbol. The question now is why is that the case and is it significant; further, are the swirls at all significant. First, we could see if it's an outlier, but there's one that goes counter-clockwise on the left-side of the left hand (i.e. right side of the picture) so that's two, and I'm only counting around 6-7 swirls with another counter-clockwise one on the left wrist below the one I just mentioned, again in the opposite rotation of the Uzumaki (clockwise rotation). Thus, I don't think we can simply dismiss the counter-clockwise swirls as outliers (i.e. non-Uzumaki-like) unfortunately. Finally, there's another Uzumaki swirl looking clockwise swirl on the main body just to the left of left hand as well. As well, I'm sure I missed some, it's like trying to find Waldo, lol.

Again, why is there a mixture of clockwise (i.e. Uzumaki) and counter-clockwise swirls (i.e. non-Uzumaki-like) on the Gedo Mazo. First, they could simply be artwork that has no significance whatsoever, but if that's the case, the story's over, and we all go home. Thus, let's assume there's some import to swirls so we can have a discussion, as in math we don't care as much about the trivial results either except for completeness, which I was just doing now.

One thing that is evident when illustrating the clockwise Uzumaki swirl symbol is the Senju clan symbol, which has the counter-clockwise swirl component. As well, I believe that you made reference to Mokutoun at some point (I apologize I forget where), so maybe there's a component of the Senju bloodline or those respective powers of the Rikudou Sennin being involved in the Gedo Mazo somehow before being passed down to the younger son. It's not clear, but as mentioned, an unconscious "vegetable" Hashirama Senju has been recomposed from the portion of the tissue Uchiha Madara took at the Valley of the End fight and is at the base of the Gedo Mazo (i.e. heretical demon statue) as shown by Tobi to Kabuto relatively recently.

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Thus, perhaps aside from using Senju Hashirama to build Tobi's Zetsu's:

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Senju Hashirama's tissue plays a critical functioning role in the Gedo Mazo as indicated by both Tobi's use and the counter-clockwise swirls. Just a theory and speculation of course.

Another possible explanation for the counter-clockwise swirls could be for the balance of Yin and Yang of the Bijou's chakra during sealing and containment. They could still both be Uzumaki in origin this way, but by going in opposite directions they are designed to make the statue achieve balance, again theory and speculation... I'm not sure, with each swirl respectively corresponding a Yin or Yang (e.g. Yang -> clockwise and Yin -> counter-clockwise or vice versa).

Further, we know that the 9 Bijou were created by manipulation of Yin and Yang from the deconstruction of the Jubi using the Rinnegan and "Creation of all Things" jutsu (hierarchal jutsu of Izanagi as stated by Tobi to Konan when retrieving Nagato's Rinnegan) by the Rikudou Sennin. Thus, it makes sense if the Gedo Mazo is being used to reassemble the Jubi that there is something inherent in it for maintaining the Yin and Yang balance during the process, who knows...:shrug:

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One might think then that Minato's use of the DRS to seal the Yin half of the Kyuubi would've produced a counter-clockwise seal on his stomach:

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However, the seal appears clockwise in rotation after sealing the Yin Kyuubi chakra and doesn't negate this possibility. This is simply because the DRS was a Fuuinjutsu based on Uzumaki Fuuinjutsu principles; thus, it's more likely (at least in my personal view, I'm speculating) that the imprint on Minato's stomach was a result of the seal type rather than the input of what was actually sealed. Given the same type of seal appeared on Hiruzen for using the DRS on Hashirama, Tobirama, and Orochimaru's arms (lol, ), that provides support for my position regarding the mark of the seal not depending on the input. However, the sample size of the DRS is of course very small, 4 objects.

very minor correction:

Spoiler

you mean "Gaara's Shukaku" -- Skikaku is Shikamaru's father, lol... You can just edit your OP to fix that.

Peace

 

[shadedcrow]

Thanks

Thanks everyone! I jumped some 50-60 points in rep after this


Anime= non canon.

This is the Manga section, in case you did'nt notice.

Yeah because that was a filler eps lol. Look at chapter 477ish where negato uses his sealing technique against hanzo and you see on the statue and in the phantom dragon swirl marks for detail. It's funny you want people to stretch thier thoughts but you only want to see things in black and white. Lol plus look at chapter 520 page 2.

 

[NarutoKage2]

Thanks for the response leafeater i'll just break your post down with some observations/opinions of my own:

First, take a look at the right hand of Gedo Mazo, which in the picture is actually on the left actually because it's facing us. The left-ward swirl is clockwise in its rotation (i.e. Uzumaki), while the other swirl is counter-clockwise in its rotation, which is inconsistent with the Uzumaki clan symbol.

Possibly, but the connection is based not on the direction of rotation but the rotation itself. Sounds far fetched? Then take a look at this:

Spoiler

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Look at Naruto's hand in the image above. His hand performs the seal in a counter clockwise direction, so even though the image is of a clockwise rotation in the Uzumaki seal itself, the direction of rotation while performing the seal is anti clockwise, i.e the exact opposite.

The question now is why is that the case and is it significant; further, are the swirls at all significant. First, we could see if it's an outlier, but there's one that goes counter-clockwise on the left-side of the left hand (i.e. right side of the picture) so that's two, and I'm only counting around 6-7 swirls with another counter-clockwise one on the left wrist below the one I just mentioned, again in the opposite rotation of the Uzumaki (clockwise rotation). Thus, I don't think we can simply dismiss the counter-clockwise swirls as outliers (i.e. non-Uzumaki-like) unfortunately. Finally, there's another Uzumaki swirl looking clockwise swirl on the main body just to the left of left hand as well. As well, I'm sure I missed some, it's like trying to find Waldo, lol.

Again,if the rotation is always clockwise as seen on the Uzumaki swirls then why is the seal itself performed in the opposite direction? It might be a combination that the seals have idk but i don't think the direction is that important because of this.

One thing that is evident when illustrating the clockwise Uzumaki swirl symbol is the Senju clan symbol, which has the counter-clockwise swirl component. As well, I believe that you made reference to Mokutoun at some point (I apologize I forget where), so maybe there's a component of the Senju bloodline or those respective powers of the Rikudou Sennin being involved in the Gedo Mazo somehow before being passed down to the younger son. It's not clear, but as mentioned, an unconscious "vegetable" Hashirama Senju has been recomposed from the portion of the tissue Uchiha Madara took at the Valley of the End fight and is at the base of the Gedo Mazo (i.e. heretical demon statue) as shown by Tobi to Kabuto relatively recently.

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Thus, perhaps aside from using Senju Hashirama to build Tobi's Zetsu's:

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Either that, or its just a convenient base(the mokuuton flower) to keep the statue perched upon. There are many more variables here as unlike with the Uzumaki, we have a fair degree of info on the Senju and therefore less room to speculate= i don't want to dwell on the possible Senju connection. I also sincerely doubt what some people suggest that the 1st Hokage would invent a jutsu such as this, in my opinion it came directly from the SO6P.

Senju Hashirama's tissue plays a critical functioning role in the Gedo Mazo as indicated by both Tobi's use and the counter-clockwise swirls. Just a theory and speculation of course.

Another possible explanation for the counter-clockwise swirls could be for the balance of Yin and Yang of the Bijou's chakra during sealing and containment. They could still both be Uzumaki in origin this way, but by going in opposite directions they are designed to make the statue achieve balance, again theory and speculation... I'm not sure, with each swirl respectively corresponding a Yin or Yang (e.g. Yang -> clockwise and Yin -> counter-clockwise or vice versa).

Or another explanation is what i mentioned as well, i.e the difference in actual shape and the shape that would form whilst the jutsu is being performed/reinforced.

Further, we know that the 9 Bijou were created by manipulation of Yin and Yang from the deconstruction of the Jubi using the Rinnegan and "Creation of all Things" jutsu (hierarchal jutsu of Izanagi as stated by Tobi to Konan when retrieving Nagato's Rinnegan) by the Rikudou Sennin. Thus, it makes sense if the Gedo Mazo is being used to reassemble the Jubi that there is something inherent in it for maintaining the Yin and Yang balance during the process, who knows...:shrug:

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One might think then that Minato's use of the DRS to seal the Yin half of the Kyuubi would've produced a counter-clockwise seal on his stomach:

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The problem here is that the manga clearly states that the SO6P sealed the Juubi's body and it became the moon. The Gedo has a very tiny mass compared to the moon, don't you think? And besides, Tobi does'nt want to revive the Juubi, he wants its chakra in him for the Eye of the moon plan.

However, the seal appears clockwise in rotation after sealing the Yin Kyuubi chakra and doesn't negate this possibility. This is simply because the DRS was a Fuuinjutsu based on Uzumaki Fuuinjutsu principles; thus, it's more likely (at least in my personal view, I'm speculating) that the imprint on Minato's stomach was a result of the seal type rather than the input of what was actually sealed. Given the same type of seal appeared on Hiruzen for using the DRS on Hashirama, Tobirama, and Orochimaru's arms (lol, ), that provides support for my position regarding the mark of the seal not depending on the input. However, the sample size of the DRS is of course very small, 4 objects.

Well, minato did learn sealing from Kushina so an Uzumaki connection to Naruto's seal is a reasonable presumption.
Sigh, ok look thing is as long as there's a connection between the Uzumaki and the Senju, there has to be at least some connection between the Uzumaki and the Rikuudo Sage. That clan never had any legendary items(or they would'nt have been wiped out lol) what fits the puzzle more than a dormant Kekkei Genkai, one that required a Doujutsu(rinnegan) that most did'nt have access to?It would account for the Uzumaki's annihilation in the 3rd ninja war as well.

Yeah because that was a filler eps lol. Look at chapter 477ish where negato uses his sealing technique against hanzo and you see on the statue and in the phantom dragon swirl marks for detail. It's funny you want people to stretch thier thoughts but you only want to see things in black and white. Lol plus look at chapter 520 page 2.

This is the page:

Spoiler

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Not only is that not part of the manga, its just a promo type page lol.
Dude are you really that dumb?


Terrible example. That sealing is from the Gedo Mazo, and according to this theory its linked to the Uzumaki wtf kind of a counter argument is giving me this link? I asked you to show me a link where an Uzumaki does a seal w/o the swirl, not the fcking Gedo Mazo itself, we all know it seals things that's the whole idea. I can't believe you're too stupid to figure this out on your own.:sy: