Gai vs Third Raikage

[Manda II]

My new post is up for moderation. It's going to be a little until it gets approved.

 

[Forbidden Technique]

Except that's a big misunderstanding from you guys. Rasenshuriken blades all hit the opponent simultaneously..

Rasengan is already a

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attack that releases its energy by exploding. RS is a super sized version + shape manipulation + Futon chakra. Futon chakra boosts its destructive power that was already raised by shape manipulation. The wind shuriken changes into micro blades that attack the enemy all at once so the energy is being added up to what is already a focused attack which explodes and releases energy.

Except it clearly doesn't.

Exhibit A) If they all hit at once, then Kakuzu wouldn't of been shown getting progressively obliterated.

Spoiler

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Exhibit B) Kishi literally draws out that it strikes consecutively. You can't possibly be attempting at claiming that Kishi drew FRS's function incorrectly on purpose and be serious all at the same time. While introducing a new jutsu, when has he ever purposely explained a jutu's function incorrectly to us?

Spoiler

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Exhibit C) It literally shows the target getting hit consecutively from all different directions and distances within the wind sphere... The wind blades are not coming from the same exact distance.

Spoiler

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Lastly, your databook interpretation is inaccurate with what the manga has blantantly showed us multiple times. The one below is way more accurate with the manga, as it states that the wind blades attack the enemy all at once. Attacking all at once doesn't equate to making contact all at once, as the wind blades are coming from all different directions and distances within that giant wind sphere.

Spoiler

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[Forbidden Technique]

Well Manda II and KidGamer65 already explained why this scan doesn't work. That is a scan of Tsunade visualizing the jutsu based on Kakuzu's autopsy, not an actual picture of the jutsu taking effect; Databook says the needles hit all at once; the time difference between them all hitting would be so miniscule anyway that it doesn't matter. You said that "If one wind blade can't penetrate, then they all can't penetrate" but I have a hard time believing that a microscopic wind blade would be able to pierce straight through something really durable like Susanoo.

As for the two jutsu having similar attack power overall, here is why I think so. Hirudora's best feat is destroying V3 Susanoo so we shouldn't assume it can destroy stuff more durable than that. By feats FRS can also destroy V3 Susanoo.

-Danzo's Baku enhanced fuuton blew a hole through V3 Susanoo.

-KCM FRS>>>Baku's fuuton in destructive power. FRS made a giant explosion [

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] indicating its power is enough to destroy small mountains, similar to Kirin (Chou Oodama Rasengan is stated by DB to be capable of hollowing out a mountain, and FRS is canonically stronger than 25 COR.) The size of the explosion in that panel looks about half as big as the Chibaku Tensei crater.

-That same Chibaku Tensei could only restrain 8 Tailed Kurama for a little bit until it broke out [

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]. Half Kurama which is stronger than KN8 was held down and weakened by SM FRS [

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] and completely lost control of its chakra when it was hit [

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].

Based on these feats I think FRS can obliterate V3 Susanoo like how Hirudora did.



The part about wind needles not hitting all at the same time has already been addressed. @Bold doesn't Hirudora's explosion do exactly the same thing? Even if it's not all completely instant, they all hit within a couple seconds. I don't believe Hirudora does absolutely all the damage it does in a split second, or at least not significantly faster than FRS. That would put its attack speed on par with something like Jinton, which disintegrates almost instantly.

I got work early in the morning, so I have no time to reply to this right now. I'll address this later when I get out.

 

[KidGamer65]

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You are wrong. The red and black blades may be close to each other and will hit the target with a very tiny interval of time between them but the blue one is far off compared to them and will be hitting the target after some time so again no the attacks are not all at the same time.

I just expanded the image as millions of blades will be spread out. So just think and compare the red blade to a blade farther than the blue one you will see an even bigger time interval between the 1st blade and the nth blade.

Irrelevant. The blue being that far away literally means nothing when the blue and the black blades have wind blades in between them that are piling on the damage. There is no pause in the attack when Red blade and Black Blade hit. So you have no point. If there were a pause in the attack, you'd clearly see a pause in the attack during the explosion. No pause means:

-There is no pause.
-The pause is so minuscule that it's irrelevant.

Obviously the former.

Like I said. The notion that FRS can only pierce what one microscopic wind blade is nonsensical at best when it causes giant craters in the ground, Mountain sized explosions, and vaporizes solid rock with ease. The notion that it can only pierce what one microscopic blade can pierce and that this is the reason Raikage tanked it makes zero sense when we've already seen that a barrage of attacks piles the damage on top of each other as long as the attacks are close together in intervals. Shinsuusenju says hi. 1 fist can do nothing to Perfect Susanoo as one fist is not anywhere near as powerful as a Bijuu Dama, yet when Hashirama hit him with a barrage of hits, despite all fists not making contact at the same exact time, Perfect Susanoo was broken. Thus saying or implying that Raikage tanked Rasen Shuriken because one of those blades can't pierce him makes zero sense.

Stop implying that FRS=One microscopic wind blade. That's beyond ludicrous. Them not hitting at the same exact time doesn't mean anything when the blows are that close together.

 

[Manda II]

Spoiler

Dear lord man, did I really have to edit that panel.....

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Reds have hit target, blues have yet to hit target.....They dont all hit at the same time....

Spoiler

Except it clearly doesn't.

Exhibit A) If they all hit at once, then Kakuzu wouldn't of been shown getting progressively obliterated.

Spoiler

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Exhibit B) Kishi literally draws out that it strikes consecutively. You can't possibly be attempting at claiming that Kishi drew FRS's function incorrectly on purpose and be serious all at the same time. While introducing a new jutsu, when has he ever purposely explained a jutu's function incorrectly to us?

Spoiler

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Exhibit C) It literally shows the target getting hit consecutively from all different directions and distances within the wind sphere... The wind blades are not coming from the same exact distance.

Spoiler

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Lastly, your databook interpretation is inaccurate with what the manga has blantantly showed us multiple times. The one below is way more accurate with the manga, as it states that the wind blades attack the enemy all at once. Attacking all at once doesn't equate to making contact all at once, as the wind blades are coming from all different directions and distances within that giant wind sphere.

Spoiler

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I swore not to give second replies on this account but.. My other post got lost into moderation so I'm going to repost it again.

Spoiler

First of all, that's a visual representation based on Tsunade's hypothesis how FRS works.

-Tsunade never saw the technique. She is merely describing the effects from a medic's standpoint.
-Visual representations can be outweighted by feats and canon statements
-Even if Tsunade's standpoint is 100% correct, and the microscopic swords are not hitting at the exact split second it's important not to overlook the fact, that the blades aren't far off from each other to say the energy isn't being added up.

For several reasons.

-FRS isn't just a needle attack technique. It's explosion + Futon chakra(wind blades). Futon chakra boosts Rasengan's destructive power, it doesn't simply convert into needles altogether. Only the shuriken spiral is converted into needles, which all add up to the total energy in a compact explosion.

Adding "Wind" "nature manipulation" to the Rasengan, already boasting tremendous destructive power

-KidGamer65 gave a good example referring to Shin Senju punches vs PS. It's the same reason why 12 biju dama blades can destroy a portion of Shin Senju, despite 1 biju dama failing to destroy an inferior base construct such as Hobi.
-1 needle alone has no where near the energy of COR. Kurama could repel the energy

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, yet the

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of 20+ COR (added up onto each other) sent him flying. While something even stronger, the FRS pinned him down. [

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]


Given several feats, how net force works in Naruto and real life applications, it's completely absurd to state that 1 needle is the total energy FRS is spending to breach a defence.


And most importantly, Kakashi description in the same page refers to FRS as Attack Density rather than REPETITION. [

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] [

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]

If the blades are dense/concentrated on the target it means the energy is being added up together. I’m not a genius at Physics but by common sense and science: If you push a box in one direction with 20 N, and your friend pushes the same box in the same direction with 35 N the force applied to the box is the sum of both forces yours, and your friend's. Even if you push in different directions the force both of you are exerting is being received to one spot, the box itself.[

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]

All in all, it's very inaccurate and it really makes 0 sense to say that the attack is not concentrated or the energy of the countless blades isn't being added. For 2 major reasons:

-If all the blades energy wasn't being added up that would completely make the technique useless, when you could accomplish the same with less blades.
-Jiraiya describes the original Rasengan as highly concentrated, while Kakashi describes FRS blades as a concentrated attack rather than Attack repetition, which is a direct statement that the total energy from all the blades is being added up/concentrated in one target or point.