Gai and Kisame vs Minato and Itachi

[Forbidden Technique]

how is kisame's chakra not apart of kisame? he's in contact with it, and it's HIS chakra.

Obito doesn't have naruto's chakra, therefore minato can't use him to teleport -_-

How is a jutsu a part of the user once it's used? That doesn't make sense.

You're forgetting that the KCM cloak isn't Naruto's chakra, it's Kurama's. JJ Obito does in fact have some of Kurama's chakra, that's number one. Number two, it's the very fact that Kurama's chakra is a part of Naruto that Minato was able to teleport him, otherwise we'd be claiming that Kurama's chakra was used as the medium here, which contradicts Minato's statement of how his teleportation works.

Re read my post.

its possible to teleport someone/something via a medium as long as said medium has the targets chakra and the target is also in contact.

Medium:naruto's chakra arms Target:naruto and sasuke. Contact: Naruto's chakra arms.

Medium:Kisame's chakra in his suiton Target: kisame.Contact:water containing kisame's chakra.

I understood what you're attempting to prove. The fact of the matter is that it is isn't supported by how Minato described his teleportation to work. "I can't teleport anything (Kisame) that I myself or my chakra isn't in direct contact with". Key word is directly. Unless Minato or his chakra is touching Kisame directly, he can't teleport him. What you're saying doesn't meet Minato's criteria.

 

[Zexion~]

Not to mention doesn't Minato have Kurama's chakra himself?

 

[BenjerminGaye]

How is a jutsu a part of the user once it's used? That doesn't make sense.

it is when the user is still in contact with it. The user's chakra and the jutsu's chakra is 1 and the same. Therefore minato can use said chakra as medium for ftg.

You're forgetting that the KCM cloak isn't Naruto's chakra, it's Kurama's. JJ Obito does in fact have some of Kurama's chakra, that's number one. Number two, it's the very fact that Kurama's chakra is a part of Naruto that Minato was able to teleport him, otherwise we'd be claiming that Kurama's chakra was used as the medium here, which contradicts Minato's statement of how his teleportation works.

Not to mention doesn't Minato have Kurama's chakra himself?

@bold Their chakra's are mixed, and kcm is in fact naruto's chakra:

Spoiler

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So again Naruto's Chakra was used as the medium. Giving minato the ability to teleport the things in contact with said chakra(sasuke/obito) at minato's discretion (sasuke only)

Minato didn't sync his chakra with naruto until here:

Spoiler

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So please stop trying to use kurama as the scapegoat. And even in that case he openly says "indirectly" contradicting his so called rule.

I understood what you're attempting to prove. The fact of the matter is that it is isn't supported by how Minato described his teleportation to work. "I can't teleport anything (Kisame) that I myself or my chakra isn't in direct contact with". Key word is directly. Unless Minato or his chakra is touching Kisame directly, he can't teleport him. What you're saying doesn't meet Minato's criteria.

Minato is in contact with kisame's chakra, that's how he gains contact to kisame.

 

[Oblivionx]

it is when the user is still in contact with it. The user's chakra and the jutsu's chakra is 1 and the same. Therefore minato can use said chakra as medium for ftg.



@bold Their chakra's are mixed, and kcm is in fact naruto's chakra:

Spoiler

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You must be registered for see images

So again Naruto's Chakra was used as the medium. Giving minato the ability to teleport the things in contact with said chakra(sasuke/obito) at minato's discretion (sasuke only)

Minato didn't sync his chakra with naruto until here:

Spoiler

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So please stop trying to use kurama as the scapegoat. And even in that case he openly says "indirectly" contradicting his so called rule.

Minato is in contact with kisame's chakra, that's how he gains contact to kisame.

You are making minato very dangerous. Though a new thread should be dedicated to this topic. What you are saying seems legit to me.

 

[BenjerminGaye]

You are making minato very dangerous. Though a new thread should be dedicated to this topic. What you are saying seems legit to me.

No, its very situational.

 

[Zexion~]

it is when the user is still in contact with it. The user's chakra and the jutsu's chakra is 1 and the same. Therefore minato can use said chakra as medium for ftg.



@bold Their chakra's are mixed, and kcm is in fact naruto's chakra:

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images

So again Naruto's Chakra was used as the medium. Giving minato the ability to teleport the things in contact with said chakra(sasuke/obito) at minato's discretion (sasuke only)

Minato didn't sync his chakra with naruto until here:

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

So please stop trying to use kurama as the scapegoat. And even in that case he openly says "indirectly" contradicting his so called rule.

Minato is in contact with kisame's chakra, that's how he gains contact to kisame.

Even if this is all true pretty sure this means he FTGs everyone in the dome correct? He can't choose if his chakra is only touching the dome itself, not to mention he would also warp the entire dome so its still not a very useful tool here.

 

[BenjerminGaye]

So every ninjutsu is now apart of the user? :lol There is an obvious difference between a shroud and a dome of water.

They're still ninjutsu, and youre missing the point. The only reason it works is because kisame is still in contact with it.

The same happens Here:

Spoiler

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Not touching naruto or sasuke, but touching their technique teleports all 3, leaves himself behind.

Even if this is all true pretty sure this means he FTGs everyone in the dome correct? He can't choose if his chakra is only touching the dome itself, not to mention he would also warp the entire dome so its still not a very useful tool here.

No. It's still at his discretion:

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Minato teleports kurama and his bijuu bomb but not gamabunta.

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tobirama teleports the TSB's but not obito.

 

[Zexion~]

They're still ninjutsu, and youre missing the point. The only reason it works is because kisame is still in contact with it.

The same happens Here:

Spoiler

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Not touching naruto or sasuke, but touching their technique teleports all 3, leaves himself behind.



No. It's still at his discretion:

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Minato teleports kurama and his bijuu bomb but not gamabunta.

Spoiler

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tobirama teleports the TSB's but not obito.

The TSB wasn't touching Obito, so it makes sense he wouldn't be teleported, and Bunta was not WITHIN Kurama. If you're going to use this example if anything is within the medium Minato is using should logically be teleported as well. Hence why he can't just FTG shrouds or Susano's off users.

 

[BenjerminGaye]

The TSB wasn't touching Obito, so it makes sense he wouldn't be teleported, and Bunta was not WITHIN Kurama. If you're going to use this example if anything is within the medium Minato is using should logically be teleported as well. Hence why he can't just FTG shrouds or Susano's off users.

Tobirama wasn't touching the tsb, he was touching obito. Meaning he chose to leave obito behind and teleport only the orbs.
Bunta not being within kurama is irrelevant, it's just a means of proof that the ftg user decides what goes and what stays.

I.e. as a have been stressing, its up to the FTG user what goes and what stays even if they're all in contact (regardless of means).

There's only 1 occasion where something was teleported inadvertently, and that's because minato was unaware of its presence. In all other situations the FTG user makes a conscious decision on what goes where.

 

[Zexion~]

Again all these examples are irrelevant as they were not in a medium, if Minato is using Kisame's chakra in the WD to FTG he's warping the dome AND Kisame as he's inside it. He can only consciously choose to warp things TOUCHING the medium if the object or person is completely within the medium than its either all or nothing here.....

 

[Forbidden Technique]

it is when the user is still in contact with it. The user's chakra and the jutsu's chakra is 1 and the same. Therefore minato can use said chakra as medium for ftg.



@bold Their chakra's are mixed, and kcm is in fact naruto's chakra:

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images

So again Naruto's Chakra was used as the medium. Giving minato the ability to teleport the things in contact with said chakra(sasuke/obito) at minato's discretion (sasuke only)

Minato didn't sync his chakra with naruto until here:

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

So please stop trying to use kurama as the scapegoat. And even in that case he openly says "indirectly" contradicting his so called rule.

Minato is in contact with kisame's chakra, that's how he gains contact to kisame.

Fair enough, you should of just posted that last scan. I did my research and the following one made it much more clear as well.

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[Oblivionx]

Tobirama wasn't touching the tsb, he was touching obito. Meaning he chose to leave obito behind and teleport only the orbs.
Bunta not being within kurama is irrelevant, it's just a means of proof that the ftg user decides what goes and what stays.

I.e. as a have been stressing, its up to the FTG user what goes and what stays even if they're all in contact (regardless of means).

There's only 1 occasion where something was teleported inadvertently, and that's because minato was unaware of its presence. In all other situations the FTG user makes a conscious decision on what goes where.

There's one mistake you are making here. Tobirama teleported obito and left the orbs behind not the vice versa.
@Zexion~ is right too. If what you are saying is possible then minato should be able to teleport the user out of susano too. Either minato becomes too broken like i said or he has to teleport both WD and kisame. This is totally different scenario then what has been shown in manga that's why it can only be speculated what minato's limits are as he never came across a susano user.

 

[BenjerminGaye]

There's one mistake you are making here. Tobirama teleported obito and left the orbs behind not the vice versa.
@Zexion~ is right too. If what you are saying is possible then minato should be able to teleport the user out of susano too. Either minato becomes too broken like i said or he has to teleport both WD and kisame. This is totally different scenario then what has been shown in manga that's why it can only be speculated what minato's limits are as he never came across a susano user.

imma get back on this after thanks giving.