[VS] Gaara Vs Sasuke

Forbidden Technique

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Location: Sannin 3 way deadlock
Distance: 60 meters
Intent: To Kill
Intel: Full
Restrictions: Gaara can't lose control to Shikaku

Scenario 1) SRA Gaara Vs VOTE1 Sasuke
Scenario 2) Early Shippuden Gaara Vs Hebi Sasuke
Scenario 3) War Arc Gaara Vs MS Sasuke
Scenario 4) Hypothetical Perfect Jin Gaara Vs EMS Sasuke (Pre PS)

Who wins? IMO Gaara doesn't lose
 
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KidGamer65

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Scenario 1) SRA Gaara Vs VOTE1 Sasuke
Chidori should pierce his sand, regular moves can be evaded but the only issue is dodging the widespread stuff. IIRC Gaara caught Kimimaro, who is easily above PTS Sasuke in speed even w/ the Curse Mark so Sasuke would get caught and crushed since he lacks Kimimaro's bone mask. And I don't think flight will help Sasuke here either, especially since it's more like gliding and not flight. :lol

Scenario 2) Early Shippuden Gaara Vs Hebi Sasuke
Gaara wins no explanation necessary.


Scenario 3) War Arc Gaara Vs MS Sasuke


Only one Sasuke might win. His War Arc shields have been pierced by Madara's Magatama so Sasuke's V4 Susanoo Arrows/Enton Sword would pierce right through. Kirin is a game ender if Sasuke sets it up, which is possible since the orb increases his accessibility to the flame. He isn't busting Susanoo so his only hope is to pull Sasuke outside, but he was only able to bind Susanoo to pull Madara out when the sand was lightened, allowing the speed to increase. It's highly likely that if he tries this without Onoki, Sasuke reacts to the sand coming at him from the ground and evades and it's 100% likely that Susanoo destroys/bats away any sand that tries to hold it in place.

So Sasuke wins.

Scenario 4) Hypothetical Perfect Jin Gaara Vs EMS Sasuke (Pre PS)

Bijuu Dama GG. Gaara is too versatile for Sasuke to interrupt like he would be able to do with B.
 

Forbidden Technique

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.Only one Sasuke might win. His War Arc shields have been pierced by Madara's Magatama so Sasuke's V4 Susanoo Arrows/Enton Sword would pierce right through. Kirin is a game ender if Sasuke sets it up, which is possible since the orb increases his accessibility to the flame. He isn't busting Susanoo so his only hope is to pull Sasuke outside, but he was only able to bind Susanoo to pull Madara out when the sand was lightened, allowing the speed to increase. It's highly likely that if he tries this without Onoki, Sasuke reacts to the sand coming at him from the ground and evades and it's 100% likely that Susanoo destroys/bats away any sand that tries to hold it in place.

So Sasuke wins.
Sasuke's susano'o arrows have pretty bad penetrative power, seeing it's inability to pierce deep into the bridge, Kabuto's cave, and getting it's trajectory altered by Danzou's Mokuton. Three objects that shouldn't be anywhere close to as durable as Gaara's higher quality defenses. At the very least, Gaara should be capable of altering it's trajectory, in the same fashion as Danzou did. That, or disrupting Sasuke's aim, by attacking the bow with sand. Gaara also doesn't need to pull Sasuke out of susano'o, when he can just attack him from below his feet. I don't see how any of these [ ]-[ ] or similar coming from directly underneath Sasuke's susano'o, and then followed by desert coffin isn't a game ender since susano'o doesn't add any form of defense from below the users feat. And then adding in Suna Bunshins to the mix to make things more difficult and drawn out for Sasuke, who can't hold a V3/V4 susano'o forever...
 

KidGamer65

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Sasuke's susano'o arrows have pretty bad penetrative power, seeing it's inability to pierce deep into the bridge, Kabuto's cave, and getting it's trajectory altered by Danzou's Mokuton. Three objects that shouldn't be anywhere close to as durable as Gaara's higher quality defenses. At the very least, Gaara should be capable of altering it's trajectory, in the same fashion as Danzou did. That, or disrupting Sasuke's aim, by attacking the bow with sand. Gaara also doesn't need to pull Sasuke out of susano'o, when he can just attack him from below his feet. I don't see how any of these [ ]-[ ] or similar coming from directly underneath Sasuke's susano'o, and then followed by desert coffin isn't a game ender since susano'o doesn't add any form of defense from below the users feat. And then adding in Suna Bunshins to the mix to make things more difficult and drawn out for Sasuke, who can't hold a V3/V4 susano'o forever...
-Mokuton altering it's trajectory has nothing to do with it's penetrative power. And it had to pierce through Mokuton before it hit the bridge and it's a bridge. A large stone bridge. Not sure why people bring this up to discredit the arrows when most penetrative techniques shown in the Manga wouldn't penetrate deep into this structure.

-The Susanoo Arrow he used on Kabuto was smaller than what he normally uses with V3 and it and stopped at the ground. So I'm not sure how you are claiming that it's penetrative force is inferior to Yasaka Magatama.

There's nothing that makes a V2 Susanoo's Magatama so much stronger than a V4 Susanoo's Arrow (or it's sword) that'd let Gaara tank the latter and fail to tank the former. And Danzo only deflected Susanoo Arrow with Mokuton because the Mokuton pushed him out of the way and left it in it's place. Gaara holding a sand shield in front of him isn't going to cause the arrow's trajectory to be shifted. If he tries to grab Susanoo to interrupt the firing process Susanoo swats his sand away and then fires anyway.

If Gaara attacks with that much sand then Susanoo is only going to be pushed up into the air, if he attacks with less sand then Sasuke can just evade it, or he can fight on his Hawk or on Aoda to prevent Gaara's Sand from getting him from below. And Suna Bunshin aren't anywhere near as strong as Shadow Clones from what I've seen so Sasuke shouldn't have any difficulty destroying them and then getting to Gaara. Then we have the fact that the more Sasuke attacks with Kagutsuchi the hotter the atmosphere gets. When he has enough heat Katon sets up Kirin and that's the end for Gaara.
 

Forbidden Technique

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-Mokuton altering it's trajectory has nothing to do with it's penetrative power. And it had to pierce through Mokuton before it hit the bridge and it's a bridge. A large stone bridge. Not sure why people bring this up to discredit the arrows when most penetrative techniques shown in the Manga wouldn't penetrate deep into this structure.

-The Susanoo Arrow he used on Kabuto was smaller than what he normally uses with V3 and it and stopped at the ground. So I'm not sure how you are claiming that it's penetrative force is inferior to Yasaka Magatama.

There's nothing that makes a V2 Susanoo's Magatama so much stronger than a V4 Susanoo's Arrow (or it's sword) that'd let Gaara tank the latter and fail to tank the former. And Danzo only deflected Susanoo Arrow with Mokuton because the Mokuton pushed him out of the way and left it in it's place. Gaara holding a sand shield in front of him isn't going to cause the arrow's trajectory to be shifted. If he tries to grab Susanoo to interrupt the firing process Susanoo swats his sand away and then fires anyway.

If Gaara attacks with that much sand then Susanoo is only going to be pushed up into the air, if he attacks with less sand then Sasuke can just evade it, or he can fight on his Hawk or on Aoda to prevent Gaara's Sand from getting him from below. And Suna Bunshin aren't anywhere near as strong as Shadow Clones from what I've seen so Sasuke shouldn't have any difficulty destroying them and then getting to Gaara. Then we have the fact that the more Sasuke attacks with Kagutsuchi the hotter the atmosphere gets. When he has enough heat Katon sets up Kirin and that's the end for Gaara.
Yes, it does. If the Susano'o arrows penetrative power was strong enough, the Mokuton wouldn't of altered it's trajectory. It would of just stayed on course. Gaara can form a thick and dense defense that would enable the arrows to pierce through, like the bridge. I mentioned a higher quality defense in my previous post, not what failed against Madaras magatamas. Gaara doesn't have a set constant form or level of defense like Susano'o, for example. He can strengthen his defenses by adding more quantities of sand, making it more thick, compact, dense, and solidifying it with more chakra. Susano'o arrow isn't making it's way through something as dense as like a sand pyramid or probably even half that, is what I'm saying. If he keeps the sand moving like the Mokutan, it will change the arrows trajectory. And I didn't say the sand would grab Susano'o as a whole, I said it would specifically aim for the bow to disrupt Sasuke's aim.

It would push the Susano'o up in the air, but it would also fill in the pocket inside of Susano'o where Sasuke is in. Sand Coffin GG. Hawk is knocked down with Suna Arare, and MS Sasuke doesn't have access to Aoda. They aren't Kage Bunshins, the purpose of Suna Bunshins are to prolong the fight, making it more difficult for Sasuke to hold up Susano'o. Kagutsuchi can be covered with sand, to suppress the heat. Can't the sand also disrupt Sasuke's control over Kirin? If not, Suna Bunshins makes the whole effort a gamble. Kūsa Bōheki which tanked C3, should withstand it.
 
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Beans2

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MS Sasuke beats Gaara.

If Gaara wraps himself up in layers of heavy defensive sand, he'd be heavily dependant on his Third Eye to navigate the battle. Sasuke can just snipe it with a Susanoo arrow. His hawk lets him go airborne, and he can cover it in Susanoo to protect it. If Gaara gets hit with Susanoo arrow, it's over, or Kirin which can be prepped by V4 Susanoo spamming its enton orb, or Sasuke using Katon then lighting it up with Amaterasu.

Defensively, Gaara can't restrain Sasuke's V4 Susanoo seeing as he couldn't restrain Madara's senjutsu enhanced V3 even with Shukaku's help, and his sand coffin isn't even scratching it. Gaara can't whip him out of Susanoo with sand at his feet because Sasuke can just hover in his Susanoo.
 

Lariatoo

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Location: Sannin 3 way deadlock
Distance: 60 meters
Intent: To Kill
Restrictions: Gaara can't lose control to Shikaku

Scenario 1) SRA Gaara Vs VOTE1 Sasuke
Gaara wins. His AoE was insane for part 1 standards.
Scenario 2) Early Shippuden Gaara Vs Hebi Sasuke
If Gaara can go Full Shukaku he wins. If not he loses.
Scenario 3) War Arc Gaara Vs MS Sasuke
Sasuke wins 7/10
Scenario 4) Hypothetical Perfect Jin Gaara Vs EMS Sasuke (Pre PS)
Gaara wins

Who wins? IMO Gaara doesn't lose
Of course :lol
 
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KidGamer65

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Yes, it does. If the Susano'o arrows penetrative power was strong enough, the Mokuton wouldn't of altered it's trajectory. It would of just stayed on course. Gaara can form a thick and dense defense that would enable the arrows to pierce through, like the bridge. I mentioned a higher quality defense in my previous post, not what failed against Madaras magatamas. Gaara doesn't have a set constant form or level of defense like Susano'o, for example. He can strengthen his defenses by adding more quantities of sand, making it more thick, compact, dense, and solidifying it with more chakra. Susano'o arrow isn't making it's way through something as dense as like a sand pyramid or probably even half that, is what I'm saying. If he keeps the sand moving like the Mokutan, it will change the arrows trajectory. And I didn't say the sand would grab Susano'o as a whole, I said it would specifically aim for the bow to disrupt Sasuke's aim.

It would push the Susano'o up in the air, but it would also fill in the pocket inside of Susano'o where Sasuke is in. Sand Coffin GG. Hawk is knocked down with Suna Arare, and MS Sasuke doesn't have access to Aoda. They aren't Kage Bunshins, the purpose of Suna Bunshins are to prolong the fight, making it more difficult for Sasuke to hold up Susano'o. Kagutsuchi can be covered with sand, to suppress the heat. Can't the sand also disrupt Sasuke's control over Kirin? If not, Suna Bunshins makes the whole effort a gamble. Kūsa Bōheki which tanked C3, should withstand it.
That doesn't even make sense. The thicker the Mokuton, the harder it is to pierce. If thickness was an issue it wouldn't have ripped through, it would just go farther in. A strong defense blocks attacks it doesn't cause the direction of attacks to shift for no reason. Either the growth of the Mokuton pushed Danzo away or it pushed the Susanoo Arrow away, and that relates to it's speed and not it's penetrative power.

You say Susanoo Arrow from V4 Susanoo won't rip through a defense w/ a sand pyramid level of density yet Madara's V3 Susanoo ripped through Shukaku+Gaara's Sand Pyramid which is stated to be one of his thickest defenses in Databook IV, and Shukaku's influence makes it stronger, also stated in the databook.

Sabaku Sōtaisō Fūin

In an ultra heavy massive sand prison one bids farwell to the physical world for all eternity

The body's movements are stolen by a massive amount of sand, it's a fuuin jutsu. It's characteristic is a large pyramid-like shape, it's extraordinarily difficult to escape. It's immensely effective against formidable kage-class enemies. A large quantity of sand mercilessly coils around the enemy. To add shukaku's sand body and curse seal, the seal becomes more secure. The air can not penetrated, a perfect grave stone of ultra high density sand.

A person is imprisoned in a sand pyramid, that day it was seen twice. A sand prison of extreme hardness.

------
Interesting that Kishi seem to have a Kage-class of shinobi in mind as well.
So good luck arguing that a V4 Susanoo doesn't pierce through something like this, but weaker since this isn't Gaara+Shukaku making the pyramid this time around. Then we have the fact that Joki Boy obliterated Gaara's Sand Pyramid yet he protected the alliance from it using his Mom Shield, which Madara pierced through with Magatama and still had enough power left over to crack Onoki's Rock Golem, and his sand would have to be moving at a fast enough rate to cause the arrow to miss him completely.

Never said you said he'd grab it. If he goes for the bow the same exact thing happens.

If he uses Suna Arare then Susanoo tanks it and the hawk stays afloat, and no, MS Sasuke has access to Aoda unless you want to claim he made the contract in between the time after he fought Naruto and the time before he got accustomed to EMS which would make no sense.

If his clones are too weak, then they'd be easily obliterated meaning this fight isn't prolonged enough to cause Sasuke to drop of stamina issues, and sure, sand can block out the heat of the flame but if Sasuke fires towards the atmosphere this doesn't really work. How would sand cause him to lose control or disrupt his control? And what feats put C3 on par with Kirin? Even if C3 was on par with Kirin, Kirin is far more focused than C3 is so Gaara still can't block it. Though that's assuming he can even mobilize enough sand to block it in the first place.
 

Forbidden Technique

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That doesn't even make sense. The thicker the Mokuton, the harder it is to pierce. If thickness was an issue it wouldn't have ripped through, it would just go farther in. A strong defense blocks attacks it doesn't cause the direction of attacks to shift for no reason. Either the growth of the Mokuton pushed Danzo away or it pushed the Susanoo Arrow away, and that relates to it's speed and not it's penetrative power.

You say Susanoo Arrow from V4 Susanoo won't rip through a defense w/ a sand pyramid level of density yet Madara's V3 Susanoo ripped through Shukaku+Gaara's Sand Pyramid which is stated to be one of his thickest defenses in Databook IV, and Shukaku's influence makes it stronger, also stated in the databook.

So good luck arguing that a V4 Susanoo doesn't pierce through something like this, but weaker since this isn't Gaara+Shukaku making the pyramid this time around. Then we have the fact that Joki Boy obliterated Gaara's Sand Pyramid yet he protected the alliance from it using his Mom Shield, which Madara pierced through with Magatama and still had enough power left over to crack Onoki's Rock Golem, and his sand would have to be moving at a fast enough rate to cause the arrow to miss him completely.
It was the thickness of the Mokutan in tandem of it moving, as the Susano'o arrow pierced through it. @ bold, correct, but in this particular instance, the defense was moving. It wasn't a standstill defense. The thickness of the tree carried the arrow off course in the direction the tree was moving.

Lol, you mean SM Madaras V3 legged Susano'o? You also realize that this isn't exactly comparable to a Susano'o arrow..? Madaras SM enhanced legged V3 Susano'o busting out of Sabaku Sōtaisō Fūin say's more about it's strength, not penetrative power. It's sword lunge was strong enough to penetrate through half of the Sabaku Sōtaisō Fūin (Not the whole thing, since it came from the center), and then used it's power to bust out. Yet, a thrown Susano'o sword couldn't even pierce through Shukaku's hand [ ]. And we have no reason to believe that Shukaku's hand is more durable then Sabaku Sōtaisō Fūin, when the latter is composed of larger quantities of the same exact sand, and is is more much thick. In any case, we're discussing projectiles here, and Shukaku's hand blocking just that holds much more weight then an entire Susano'o busting out of it's sand defenses from the inside.

The Joki Boi that obliterated the sand pyramid exploded from directly within it. The Mom Shield protected the SA from a distance away from the explosion, in addition to Gaara attempting to suppress Joki Boi with additional sand before it even exploded. That's not a fair comparison. And again, busting through Gaaras defenses from the inside is a whole lot easier then doing so from the outside; because the attack doesn't have to bust through the entire defense, just the lesser portion that lays in between. Also, I'll flip this very logic on you. Kūsa Bōheki tanked C3 without a single scratch. If C3 was dropped on the stone bridge or Danzous Mokutan, it would of been obliterated, yet Sasukes Susano'o arrow could barely pierce through the former, and got it's trajectory altered by the latter. A decent size sand shield, should easily do a serviceable job protecting Gaara from the arrows.

Never said you said he'd grab it. If he goes for the bow the same exact thing happens.

If he uses Suna Arare then Susanoo tanks it and the hawk stays afloat, and no, MS Sasuke has access to Aoda unless you want to claim he made the contract in between the time after he fought Naruto and the time before he got accustomed to EMS which would make no sense.

If his clones are too weak, then they'd be easily obliterated meaning this fight isn't prolonged enough to cause Sasuke to drop of stamina issues, and sure, sand can block out the heat of the flame but if Sasuke fires towards the atmosphere this doesn't really work. How would sand cause him to lose control or disrupt his control? And what feats put C3 on par with Kirin? Even if C3 was on par with Kirin, Kirin is far more focused than C3 is so Gaara still can't block it. Though that's assuming he can even mobilize enough sand to block it in the first place.
Susano'o swats the sand, and it get's immediately reapplied.

Not sure what exactly you're implying here. How is Sasuke going to activate the higher stages of Susano'o on top of it's hawk, while it maintains flight? Even if that's possible, Suna Arare works by clumping onto the target and accumulating. So it will eventually make it's way onto the Hawk. But I hope we're not claiming that MS Sasuke coats the hawk with Susan'o now, smh. There is no proof of when Sasuke made that contract, and there is no proof that Aoda was a fully matured boss level snake at that given time, especially given Gamakichi's progression.

How are clones capable of spreading out aerially going to be easily obliterated? And wait, his Susano'o drops if he uses it tandem with Amaterasu? Otherwise, how does he get Kagutsuchi into the atmosphere? Sasuke controls Kirin from sending his raiton into the sky, IIRC. Gaara should be capable of disrupting that. Kirin isn't an entire village buster, and neither is C3. They'd both destroy a decent portion though. Kūsa Bōheki tanked C3 with zero difficulty, the DB practically said it was left unscathed. So even if Kirin is much more focused then C3, there is nothing aiding the notion that it'll bust right through Kūsa Bōheki and kill Gaara (assuming it's aimed at Gaara, and not a Bunshin). Gaara formed this defense nigh instantly btw.

You didn't address Gaara simply utilizing this [ ]-[ ] into Sasuke's Susano'o and ending it with sand coffin.
 

blazekev90

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People are giving Sasuke Madara feats now?! Good lawd NB lol.

Just sink susano and call it day. Body flick+clones+sand storm shields Garra's whereabouts ultimately stomps MS Sasuke and his inability withstand a prolonged battle.

As far as the arrow penetration power, no one has taken into the consideration the drag effect in the arrows momentum. Garra being a long range fighter, the arrows momentum would drop considerately depending the distance two the two. Also, the higher the mass, the harder it is to accelerate. If Garra is indeed airborne, the travel speed of the decelerate. So, with that factoring in, it's hard to say for sure what Sasuke's arrows would do, as Garra himself could provide offense/defenses in the midst of the arrows travel.
 
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Forbidden Technique

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MS Sasuke beats Gaara.

If Gaara wraps himself up in layers of heavy defensive sand, he'd be heavily dependant on his Third Eye to navigate the battle. Sasuke can just snipe it with a Susanoo arrow. His hawk lets him go airborne, and he can cover it in Susanoo to protect it. If Gaara gets hit with Susanoo arrow, it's over, or Kirin which can be prepped by V4 Susanoo spamming its enton orb, or Sasuke using Katon then lighting it up with Amaterasu.

Defensively, Gaara can't restrain Sasuke's V4 Susanoo seeing as he couldn't restrain Madara's senjutsu enhanced V3 even with Shukaku's help, and his sand coffin isn't even scratching it. Gaara can't whip him out of Susanoo with sand at his feet because Sasuke can just hover in his Susanoo.
You want to debate this too or? Got some time on my hands.
 
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