[VS] Edo Madara > Hashirama

[Waltz]

The part about only Hashirama being able to stop him may have been a hyperbole but the overall idea of Hashirama being able to beat Madara can't be deemed hyperbole just because of that. Why bring Obito into this? He has no relevance to this discussion as Madara was clearly talking about Hashirama is the only one who can beat him in a fight, as he was comparing how the Gokage can't beat him to how Hashirama can beat him. The Obito and Madara situation is not related to a battle so no, that statement is not invalid.

Nagato claiming he is God is very very different from Madara saying Hashirama can beat him. Nagato claiming he is God is an obvious unsupported hyperbole. Madara saying Hashirama can beat him is fact because Madara who knows his own limits and Hashirama's limits stated that Hashirama can beat him. Same thing with Jiraiya saying he will kill Kisame and Itachi. Completely unsupported.

When two people are rivals, fight frequently and know each other's limits. When one says the other can beat him, then its true.



Obviously he isn't a fusion of the two and its not like Goku beating Vegito.

Can Madara use every single one of Hashirama's abilities and techniques? No. So that invalidates your little comparison.

They are characters other than Hashirama who could defeat Madara in a fight, like kabuto or the Sage for example and your contradicting yourself on the bold. However, the statement over all isn't implying that Hashirama is going do defeat Madara single handedly, or even at all. When Madara made that statement Hashirama himself was dead and there was no implication of his resurrection via edo tensei or that he would even receive screen time. Your stretching the statement.

 

[KidGamer65]

They are characters other than Hashirama who could defeat Madara in a fight, like kabuto or the Sage for example and your contradicting yourself on the bold. However, the statement over all isn't implying that Hashirama is going do defeat Madara single handedly, or even at all. When Madara made that statement Hashirama himself was dead and there was no implication of his resurrection via edo tensei or that he would even receive screen time. Your stretching the statement.

I'm not contradicting myself. There are two parts to that sentence.

1. Hashirama can beat Madara.
2. Hashirama is the only one who can beat Madara.

Just because 2 is a hyperbole in the sense that Hashirama isn't the only one who can beat Madara, it doesn't make 1 a hyperbole either.

Madara's statement wasn't meant to imply that Hashirama is going to come and defeat him. It shows that Hashirama can and has the power to defeat Madara single-handedly.

 

[KingHashirama]

Lets just look at the facts , both of them Edos...:

- One of them is so strong that he can crack a room without even doing anything

- One on the other hand needs tremendous amounts of jutsus to match the other one. o-o

 

[Waltz]

I'm not contradicting myself. There are two parts to that sentence.

1. Hashirama can beat Madara.
2. Hashirama is the only one who can beat Madara.

Just because 2 is a hyperbole in the sense that Hashirama isn't the only one who can beat Madara, it doesn't make 1 a hyperbole either.

Madara's statement wasn't meant to imply that Hashirama is going to come and defeat him. It shows that Hashirama can and has the power to defeat Madara single-handedly.

What am saying is, the Statement is prone to contradiction making it an exaggeration. There is no solid facts that Madara will not be bested by other shinobi, hence the contradiction.

 

[KidGamer65]

What am saying is, the Statement is prone to contradiction making it an exaggeration. There is no solid facts that Madara will not be bested by other shinobi, hence the contradiction.

I agree with you on that part of the setence being exaggeration, but I don't see how that relates to our original discussion of Hashirama being stronger than Madara or not.

 

[Waltz]

I agree with you on that part of the setence being exaggeration, but I don't see how that relates to our original discussion of Hashirama being stronger than Madara or not.

Douryoku puts it quite nicely:

This thread is fallacious in its approach because we can never know if Hashirama has the appropriate prerequisites to counter the Rinnegan. You cannot assume that because Hashirama defeated Madara with the EMS that he can do it against a Madara with infinite Chakra, Mokuton and the Rinnegan.​

​

 

[mun]

rinnegan is nothing ;/ madara has no counters for hashi

 

[KidGamer65]

Douryoku puts it quite nicely:

That would apply, but we aren't saying Hashirama can beat Madara just because he beat EMS Madara. We are saying that Hashirama can beat him because of Madara's statement.

 

[Waltz]

That would apply, but we aren't saying Hashirama can beat Madara just because he beat EMS Madara. We are saying that Hashirama can beat him because of Madara's statement.

The most you can do is assume based on the exaggeration. Going by feats, Hashirama already loses this.

 

[KidGamer65]

The most you can do is assume based on the exaggeration. Going by feats, Hashirama already loses this.

The exaggeration has no weight on the point of the statement.

"The only one capable of stopping me is Hashirama"

The bold is the exaggeration. Hashirama being the only one who can beat Madara is the exaggeration. Madara saying Hashirama can beat him is not an exaggeration and like I said before. If Madara, who knows the limits of himself and Hashirama says that Hashirama can beat him then Hashirama can beat him.

 

[Waltz]

The exaggeration has no weight on the point of the statement.

"The only one capable of stopping me is Hashirama"

The bold is the exaggeration. Hashirama being the only one who can beat Madara is the exaggeration. Madara saying Hashirama can beat him is not an exaggeration and like I said before. If Madara, who knows the limits of himself and Hashirama says that Hashirama can beat him then Hashirama can beat him.

Even though that is so, a conclusion cannot be made from that single statement with no supporting evidence. This is the same issue taking place pertaining to itachi's statement that jiraiya was "too much to handle". Until Hashirama provides necessary feats to counter madara's current arsenal, it's all hype.

 

[pateuvasiliu]

"The only one capable of stopping me is Hashirama"

That doesn't mean Hashi beats him. It means Hashi -can- beat him. There's a difference. Hashirama is capable of beating him, but it doesn't mean that he -will- beat him.