alright, here we go.
the elder son never had rinnegan, so how is it possible that uchiha can unlock something that has always been missing from their genes?
no. the need the other half of so6p's dna ---> younger son ----> senju/uzumaki
the reason in which senju have never gotten rinnegan is simply because they have never implanted ems into themselves, as ems is rare and the wielders too powerful as well as the fact that the only senju powerful enough to get it (hashirama), wasn't greedy enough to take madara's eyes.
to support this, nagato was given madara's eyes and thus unlocked rinnegan because uzumaki are distantly related to senju/younger son so now he had the requirements for rinnegan.
I believe it was said thatthe elder son had the Sage's eyes. What were his eyes; The rinnegan. We don't know if he had them or not. Madara had the rinnegan and was brought back with base sharingan.
Senju have the Sage's body which is why they don't have it.
Madara a.k.a Tobi implanted the Rinnegan into nagato as a child, it was never shown that he had sharingan. There's no way he could go through the sharingan process as a kid, meaning he needed EMS so how could he have had it as a child? Meaning his senju/uzumaki blood had nothing to do with it.
The only way Nagato had Rinnegan was being Implanted with it already same way Tobi did to himself.
madara himself said he fought hashi to gain a portion of his power and didn't unlock rinnegan until late in life, furthermore, every user of rinnegan shown has had some form of senju in them whether by relation as with nagato being uzumaki, or current users having hashi dna
Is this the way it has to be? Must you chose to oppose me? Lol D:
The same way Sharingan progresses into MS, EMS etc the Rinnegan is the next step of EMS.
I said it was plausable that he conveniently had Senju DNA while unlocking Rinnegan but that doesn't prove it.
As for Nagato he was Implanted with it so he does not count.
You guys forget Tobi has the rinnegan, and it is not stated he is a senju but had sharingan in both eyes so it can be assumed he is an Uchiha.
In other words we have seen an Uchiha with Rinnegan
But not a Senju with the Rinnegan
Nowhere was it stated you need senju DNA, but it wa sstated that EMS turns into the Rinnegan. With that logic we can assume no senju is required for what we know.
I'm only going to comment on the bold part, since I just had an idea about it. I think the Rinnegan he has is one of Nagato's, and then the other Rinnegan went to the Edo Jinchuuriki. That's what I think about Tobi's Rinnegan. I'm not sure if it's possibly, but it is if he took Madara's Rinnegan if he died before the eyes were taken. Tobi is just mysterious, so we never know when it comes to him.
But so far both sides make sense. The No side makes sense because Kabuto never went into detail about EMS evolving into Rinnegan. The Yes side makes sense because Madara unlocked the Rinnegan before he died, when he had Hashirama DNA. It could be possible because of the Sage's two sons, but I guess we'll have to wait for the next person to get Rinnegan to see which side is right. xd
I'm not disagreeing with you, just putting my opinion on both sides, since both are possible. And my theory on his Rinnegan there. xd
We don't explicitly know if Senju DNA is required but here are some key facts:
-Madara wanted Hashi's dna for some reason, whether it be for senju power or Rinnegan we don't know.
-Madara had not obtained Rinnegan until after getting Hashi's dna
-However Madara didn't seem to be able to use wood style until he was brought back with Edo Tensei, since he wanted to "try it out". Which would imply it's his first time using it.
-Tobi the other Rinnegan user who is most likely an Uchiha also has senju dna from his zetsu parts.
It's likely that Rinnegan requires senju dna since both users have it we're never told explicitly.
I believe it was said thatthe elder son had the Sage's eyes. What were his eyes; The rinnegan. We don't know if he had them or not. Madara had the rinnegan and was brought back with base sharingan.
Senju have the Sage's body which is why they don't have it.
Madara a.k.a Tobi implanted the Rinnegan into nagato as a child, it was never shown that he had sharingan. There's no way he could go through the sharingan process as a kid, meaning he needed EMS so how could he have had it as a child? Meaning his senju/uzumaki blood had nothing to do with it.
The only way Nagato had Rinnegan was being Implanted with it already same way Tobi did to himself.
it already showed that the elder son had these spiral looking eyes.
he probably implanted it with a "dormant" rinnegan, so when nagato got upset, he would activate it and believe it was his own power.
Good point, but this is basically saying that you do need senju dna to acquire rinnegan. Of course you have to be related to the uchiha or senju this is obvious.
it already showed that the elder son had these spiral looking eyes.
he probably implanted it with a "dormant" rinnegan, so when nagato got upset, he would activate it and believe it was his own power.
Also to me, it seems as if Kishi is showing what they both were like, Madara at his prime (This includes rinnegan). And Hashi and his abilities, along with some statements of Madara praising Hashi.
honestly, i dont even know anymore, ive been watching several arguments for a while and over the last couple of days some uncertainties have arose in my thinking that rinnegan was just ems evolution
i was just thinking about how the only other sage technique we have seen, izanagi, basically the creation of all things, required both senju and uchiha elements to use, and how appropriate it would be if the rinnegan, another of the sages techniques, would require both uchiha and senju elements to activate
that said the fact that madara actively went out of his way and nearly died to get senju dna might be a cue from kishi for things to come[or it might just be madara's hashi fanboyism ], and the fact that the first rinnegan user we saw besides the so6p was an uzumaki i think was another cue from kishi about the unified connection between the clans and their sage ancestry , not saying nagato necessarily had effect on getting a rinnegan, i still think it was just madaras implanted eyes, but the fact that an uzumaki can use it so well cannot be ignored
idk if senju dna is required but it wouldnt surprise me at all at this point, well just have to wait and see
I've seen lots of "elder son didn't have rinnegan" so i just want to ask these guys how they came up with such conclusions even when the manga clearly stated he inherited his father's "eyes"?? I mean, the first time we saw itachi he had just a sharingan, does that mean he doesn't have ms then?? I'll pick what the manga states that he inherited his father's "eyes" so it makes sense for an uchiha to awaken rinnegan.
I agree there's no solid proof either way, but I believe it doesn't. Will edit this post.
Here, Kabuto "Hypothesizes" that rinnegan is the next step after sharingan. This hypothesis is confirmed is what Kabuto is saying. The rinnegan is without a doubt a tech of the Uchiha clan.
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In this scan, Kabuto states that he did something to Madara's body. Note that Madara isn't surprised about having the rinnegan as he stated he unlocked shortly after his death.
But...He goes on to use God-like techniques, which Kabuto claims he gave him.
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Here, Kabuto tells Madara that he knows about his surviving the battle, and "gaining" a portion of Hashirama's strength.
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Now, immediately after Kabuto tells him that he "gained" his strength, Madara check under his clothes. Remember the part where Kabuto states he did something to his body.
Gained his actual dna, but never used it on himself? I think that's likely. Also, let's not forget Tobi, who has senju DNA. And is a partner of Madara. He could have used it solely for him.
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Now here, after Madara discovers Hashirama's DNA, he says he wants to try Mokuton. This implies that he didn't know about Hashirama's DNA being inside his body.
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Here Kishi confirms that he has Hashi's DNA. Several chapters later. Which Kabuto implanted in him It seems to me as he's separating the two. Senju DNA, and the rinnegan.
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Also, if senju+uchiha= rinnegan. Then Madara should have suspected right away that Kabuto hypothesis was senju+uchiha=rinnegan. And not be surprised that Hashi's DNA was implanted into him. But he wasn't, he continued on to use the rinnegan. And then the mokuton after Kabuto revealed it to him. It seems he wan't aware that he even had Hashi's DNA in his body, lol.
In short, they were both separated. There's Madara (Uchiha) and rinnegan, and then there's Hashirama (Senju) and Mokuton, and his other abilites.
no you dont need senju dna to achieve rinnegan. the reason why? its never stated or implied in the manga at all. madara obtained hashiramas dna after their fight at the valley of the end. madara then awakened it right before he doed. so tell me how is senju dna and the rinnegan connected at all. they are not. madara wanted hashiramas dna for his powers. nothing more, nothing less. the fact that the uchihas have the sages eyes and the senju the sages body tell you that the rinnegan have nothing to do with senju dna since its a dojutsu and the uchihas have what? the sages eyes.
I agree there's no solid proof either way, but I believe it doesn't. Will edit this post.
Here, Kabuto "Hypothesizes" that rinnegan is the next step after sharingan. This hypothesis is confirmed is what Kabuto is saying. The rinnegan is without a doubt a tech of the Uchiha clan.
You must be registered for see images
In this scan, Kabuto states that he did something to Madara's body. Note that Madara isn't surprised about having the rinnegan as he stated he unlocked shortly after his death.
But...He goes on to use God-like techniques, which Kabuto claims he gave him.
You must be registered for see images
Here, Kabuto tells Madara that he knows about his surviving the battle, and "gaining" a portion of Hashirama's strength.
You must be registered for see images
Now, immediately after Kabuto tells him that he "gained" his strength, Madara check under his clothes. Remember the part where Kabuto states he did something to his body.
Gained his actual dna, but never used it on himself? I think that's likely. Also, let's not forget Tobi, who has senju DNA. And is a partner of Madara. He could have used it solely for him.
You must be registered for see images
Now here, after Madara discovers Hashirama's DNA, he says he wants to try Mokuton. This implies that he didn't know about Hashirama's DNA being inside his body.
You must be registered for see images
Here Kishi confirms that he has Hashi's DNA. Several chapters later. Which Kabuto implanted in him It seems to me as he's separating the two. Senju DNA, and the rinnegan.
You must be registered for see images
Also, if senju+uchiha= rinnegan. Then Madara should have suspected right away that Kabuto hypothesis was senju+uchiha=rinnegan. And not be surprised that Hashi's DNA was implanted into him. But he wasn't, he continued on to use the rinnegan. And then the mokuton after Kabuto revealed it to him. It seems he wan't aware that he even had Hashi's DNA in his body, lol.
In short, they were both separated. There's Madara (Uchiha) and rinnegan, and then there's Hashirama (Senju) and Mokuton, and his other abilites.
please feel free to read and comment and also dont forget to post ur theories too.
Also yama's explanation is the best i have seen so far. Rep+ for that.
I've seen lots of "elder son didn't have rinnegan" so i just want to ask these guys how they came up with such conclusions even when the manga clearly stated he inherited his father's "eyes"?? I mean, the first time we saw itachi he had just a sharingan, does that mean he doesn't have ms then?? I'll pick what the manga states that he inherited his father's "eyes" so it makes sense for an uchiha to awaken rinnegan.
And my theory on his Rinnegan there. xd
