Did Lionel Messi deserve the golden ball award?

[OnPoint]

M8, do you know what you're on about? Firstly, you were the one to compare a forward striker to a defensive midfield player. Secondly, Messi was present in all games except in Nigeria, where he scored not just once, but twice. 80 minutes, wut? You now say because of the game with Germany that Mascherano deserved a Golden Ball. What? That's the logic of a child who decides to watch a grand football game, and dump the sport the next day. What about Gary Medel, who managed to play extremely efficiently in all plays for Chile despite playing only 3 games?

YOU started talking about STATISTICS when comparing a FORWARD player to a DEFENSIVE MIDFIELDER.

'...Mascherano were lower on statistics when compared to Messi - that is only, if we look at the assists and goals'

To try and use greater 'GOAL SCORER' or 'ASSIST MAKER' as a means of determining who was the better player for their team is NONSENSICAL if you are comparing a player like MESSI and a player like MASCHERANO.

Did you WATCH the games or did you only watch HIGHLIGHTS? These are comments of a Youtube watcher. Messi scored a great goal against Bosnia but was largely INEFFECTIVE for the rest of the game. He was POOR against Iran for 90 minutes before scoring the winning goal. The game against Nigeria was pretty much the only game in which Messi wasn't largely ANONYMOUS.

Who's only talking about the game against Germany? Mascherano was the STANDOUT player for Argentina in the knockout phase. Took each game by the scruff of the neck and roared the South Americans on. He was superb against Switzerland, Belgium, Holland and yes, Germany. Put in an excellent shift for 90 minutes in each game.

If Chile had progressed beyond the last 16 then perhaps Medel would've been up there too. But they didn't. Might as well throw in Tim f@cking Cahill since he put in a shift for only 3 games then.

'watch a grand football game, and dump the sport the next day.'

I live in Islington. My Dad and I have been on the Emirates season ticket waiting list for 5 years now. Don't disrespect me with such a comment.

So what if Robben played more? Being the best player isn't about the amount of effort you make, it's the things you do in the pitch and change the play to your advantage. What if Robben was running around the pitch like it was a race? Effort, but completely irrelevant to the play. Messi played, and he affected the play, and significantly more than Robben did. Not to mention Robben was the link to Robin van Persie and still had only one assist, while Messi was a striker and had one as well. Better player? Not only by subjective opinion, but also statistically Messi was better than Robben.

Robben put in consistently brilliant displays throughout the tournament. He certainly didn't go missing for the majority of the games. And he CERTAINLY wasn't reduced to running around aimlessly for 90 minutes as you seem to suggest. You're talking bollocks mate. Any Tom, D!ck or Harry could see that his performances surpassed Messi's. LVG often deployed Robben as a forward along side Van Persie with Sneijder just behind.

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'He only got 1 assist and Messi only got 1 assist so Messi was better'. Just nonsense mate.

Anonymous in game against Iran? Where was Mascherano? Even Marco Rojo defended much better than Mascherano who let some of the attackers slip past him. Messi also wasn't assisted at all when he scored the goal. If you really believe football is about 5 goal difference, you're completely wrong.

Mascherano's job was to protect the back four, and that's what he did for the 90 minutes. Iran were reduced to only 3 or four counter attacks because Argentina had so much of the ball. And Messi did f@ck all until he hit the winner.

It's not obvious at all, Robben didn't deserve the trophy at all nor did Mascherano. I can agree with you on Rodríguez and Müller, but the rest weren't better than Messi at all. Stop the h8, and learn to respect the game.

It's obvious to me, but you're allowed to believe what you want. I don't feel like i'm talking to an out and out football fan so i'm not going to take this any further. There's no hate involved, it's just my opinion - an opinion shared by many others.

 

[Luther]

YOU started talking about STATISTICS when comparing a FORWARD player to a DEFENSIVE MIDFIELDER.

'...Mascherano were lower on statistics when compared to Messi - that is only, if we look at the assists and goals'

To try and use greater 'GOAL SCORER' or 'ASSIST MAKER' as a means of determining who was the better player for their team is NONSENSICAL if you are comparing a player like MESSI and a player like MASCHERANO.

Did you WATCH the games or did you only watch HIGHLIGHTS? These are comments of a Youtube watcher. Messi scored a great goal against Bosnia but was largely INEFFECTIVE for the rest of the game. He was POOR against Iran for 90 minutes before scoring the winning goal. The game against Nigeria was pretty much the only game in which Messi wasn't largely ANONYMOUS.

Who's only talking about the game against Germany? Mascherano was the STANDOUT player for Argentina in the knockout phase. Took each game by the scruff of the neck and roared the South Americans on. He was superb against Switzerland, Belgium, Holland and yes, Germany. Put in an excellent shift for 90 minutes in each game.

If Chile had progressed beyond the last 16 then perhaps Medel would've been up there too. But they didn't. Might as well throw in Tim f@cking Cahill since he put in a shift for only 3 games then.



I live in Islington. My Dad and I have been on the Emirates season ticket waiting list for 5 years now. Don't disrespect me with such a comment.



Robben put in consistently brilliant displays throughout the tournament. He certainly didn't go missing for the majority of the games. And he CERTAINLY wasn't reduced to running around aimlessly for 90 minutes as you seem to suggest. You're talking bollocks mate. Any Tom, D!ck or Harry could see that his performances surpassed Messi's. LVG often deployed Robben as a forward along side Van Persie with Sneijder just behind.

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'He only got 1 assist and Messi only got 1 assist so Messi was better'. Just nonsense mate.



Mascherano's job was to protect the back four, and that's what he did for the 90 minutes. Iran were reduced to only 3 or four counter attacks because Argentina had so much of the ball. And Messi did f@ck all until he hit the winner.



It's obvious to me, but you're allowed to believe what you want. I don't feel like i'm talking to an out and out football fan so i'm not going to take this any further. There's no hate involved, it's just my opinion - an opinion shared by many others.

Shared by many others? The same principle applies both ways. Mascherano was argentina stand out player in the knock out? Amusing. Was he the one that created the goal for dimaria after having drawn many players to himself to create space for his comrade? No. I am a barca fan and i like mascherano as a player but he was man of the match against Holland nothing more nothing less he had a good tournament but lets be honest he wasn't as influential as messi for this team. Messi created the most goal scoring opportunities out of any player in this world-cup and he wasn't even playing as the main striker he was playing deep sort of like an attacking midfielder sometimes, his work ethic is tremendous and even when he loses the ball you see him tracking back to recover it thats what makes this guy great he isn't all concerned about goals and records but about helping the team. Muller didn't single handedley drive germany to worldcup glory you know? Germany scored above 16 goals this tournament and muller only had 5 of those and 3 coming against portugal in one match, james rodriguez was the closest to messi as far as competitor goes because you could see that his goals spearheaded his country to the quarters finals that along side with his country team work. So all in all messi deserved this award robben is a fantastic player, brilliant guy i love how he plays his football though i wish i could use that right foot more>_> but i dont feel he undoubtedly deserved this award.

The only thing you have been doing the past few weeks is being ridiculous and in complete denial. Argentina would win the world cup. After barely reaching the final, they got beaten after playing like an Italian team. Heck if you wouldn't know Argentina is located in South-America, you seriously would think it's a European team. They have the names for, the looks for it and the play like it. You also kept going on and on about how a European had never won on continental American soil, Germany still did it.

Also reality check the FIFA uses the Castrol Index to determine who are the best players. Do you know which place Messi is? 11th.

He wasn't the best player even according those same guys who chose him as the best player, stop living in these fake dreams of yours.

First and foremost the Golden Ball is supposed to be for the player who played the best during this tournament. Everything else is irrelevant, so how many prizes you won before and such are not supposed to matter. And did Messi preform individually that good? He played a decent tournament, but the best player? No and that's not just a subjective opinion. He scored 4 goals? Several players scored as much and several more. An assist? Many players gave more assists and there are even players who did both more than Messi. Neuer, a goalkeeper, gave more successful passes than Messi. Messi wasn't that actively present, while people like Robben and Müller kept on running for 120 minutest straight.

There isn't a shred of doubt, Messi was not the best player on this tournament as there are several others who simply preformed better than him. The only thing Messi has going for him is that there isn't any doubt either Argentina would have never come so far without him, but I find that a deplorable reasoning. If he now actually ran his ass off like Müller and Robben, if he was clearly present and a threat on the field, I could still accept it, but that was not even remotely the case. Germany - Argentina, barely present. They loose. The Netherlands - Argentina, Messi barely present, the won on penalties after 0 - 0. Belgium - Argentina, messi barely present, Argentina wins with 0 - 1 after a lucky goal. Switzerland - Argentina, Messi barely present, Argentina wins after nearly 120 minutes with 0 - 1 after Messi finally did something and they have the goddess of luck on their side with that last ball on the post. I said before Argentina looked like Italy, but after the final I would say the even looked like Greece. You could see during German attacks that the Argentinian defense and midfield was almost completely joined together in a line of 8 people.

So that Messi supposedly made Argentina reach the final isn't even correct, that was their hyper defensive play and luck. At best you could say Messi made them reach the quarter finals. So people like Müller and Robben, who scored goal after goal, gave assist after assist, created chance after chance, who kept on running no matter what are bypassed by a player who was for the largest part invisible, barely running, but does that one good thing that wins them a match.

That's disgusting. That prize is supposed to be for the best player, but I've already known for years that this prize is simply a convenient tool for the FIFA. In 2006 it was given to Zidane. I don't remember exactly how he played during the tournament and he was definitely an awesome player, however they had already decided even before the final they were going to give him the prize as he was going to stop after the tournament with fooball or being an international and what happens then? Zidane gets red after head butting another player, making him one of the few players who received two red cards on a WC. FIFA gives this price out for whatever reason. Do you know why Messi got it? Not just out of respect, more out of pity. Because he is one of the best players in the world, he won nearly everything except the WC, which is some kind of an unofficial requirement to really be counted among the great. But he failed again, so they just gave him that because they found it necessary. Mess should get something, so we have just given him that as we can't give him the golden boot nor the WC trophy.

Messi did overall great, but he didn't preform any better as many other players and even the guys who gave him that prize use statistics that clearly state that.

Actually robben only has 1 assist for this tournament and muller has 3. While rodgriugez has 6 goals and 2 assists. Toni kroos ranked top on the index thanks to his 2 goals and 2 assists this tournament and yet their are players with better stats than that so im quite surprised he came out top. Messi aside from scoring 4 goals none of which came from the penalty spot unlikes rvp, james and muller also created the most goal scoring opportunities in this tournament. They got beaten yes but it was a known fact that germany were the favorites and the scoreline is a far fetch from what people actually thought it would be after seeing the germans beat the brazil. Germany have broken the deadlock and won it on south american soil and they are deserved winners i must admit congratulations to them and their fans.

Also argentina has never been behind in this world cup tournament except against germany in the final so i wouldn't exactly say they "barely"got there.

Why i say messi deserves the award is this imagine the dutch without robben and Germany without muller and you still see their respective teams reaching the worldcup quarter finals at-least, which sadly as you mentioned is not the case for argentina. Messi basically took his team to the quarter finals due to his goals and assists and from the onwards even to this final you could see he was playing a role of a play maker of some sort creating room for the main strikers and giving that extra bit of magic when needed. Robben only scored 3 goals in this tournament and none of those goals came after the RO of 16 so they weren't the deciding factor in Netherlands progressing to the semifinal. Argentina lucky to get up to the final? Even the pundits and critics of this Argentine team admitted that against belgium and Holland their victories were fully deserved thanks to their solid defense and back line argentina has only conceded 4 goals in this tournament which is remarkable for a team many deemed to be overrated and who many taught would be pummeled and embarrassed by the germans. Im surprised you mentioned muller and robben but didn't mention james at all who i myself admit equally deserved this award aside from messi as his 6 goals and 2 assists if i can recall properly is basically what got his country into the quarters final he was their main go too guy in absence of falcao. In 2010 forlan scored 5 goals and 1 assist and took his team to quarterfinals muller and david villa both scored the same goals and where instrumental in their sides progression in the competition but despite villa winning the world-cup forlan one and no one complain it was deserved but because its lionel messi people begin to criticize.

Speaking from a staticstisc points, james a fellow south american who won the golden boot despite only getting to the quarterfinals deserves the award more than muller and robben and arguable against messi.

 

[OnPoint]

Caliburn already said everything that needed to be said to you. Jollof rice smoking fool.

 

[Cam]

Re: messi did not deserve the golden ball its BS

The only thing you have been doing the past few weeks is being ridiculous and in complete denial. Argentina would win the world cup. After barely reaching the final, they got beaten after playing like an Italian team. Heck if you wouldn't know Argentina is located in South-America, you seriously would think it's a European team. They have the names for, the looks for it and the play like it. You also kept going on and on about how a European had never won on continental American soil, Germany still did it.

Also reality check the FIFA uses the Castrol Index to determine who are the best players. Do you know which place Messi is? 11th.

He wasn't the best player even according those same guys who chose him as the best player, stop living in these fake dreams of yours.

First and foremost the Golden Ball is supposed to be for the player who played the best during this tournament. Everything else is irrelevant, so how many prizes you won before and such are not supposed to matter. And did Messi preform individually that good? He played a decent tournament, but the best player? No and that's not just a subjective opinion. He scored 4 goals? Several players scored as much and several more. An assist? Many players gave more assists and there are even players who did both more than Messi. Neuer, a goalkeeper, gave more successful passes than Messi. Messi wasn't that actively present, while people like Robben and Müller kept on running for 120 minutest straight.

There isn't a shred of doubt, Messi was not the best player on this tournament as there are several others who simply preformed better than him. The only thing Messi has going for him is that there isn't any doubt either Argentina would have never come so far without him, but I find that a deplorable reasoning. If he now actually ran his ass off like Müller and Robben, if he was clearly present and a threat on the field, I could still accept it, but that was not even remotely the case. Germany - Argentina, barely present. They loose. The Netherlands - Argentina, Messi barely present, the won on penalties after 0 - 0. Belgium - Argentina, messi barely present, Argentina wins with 0 - 1 after a lucky goal. Switzerland - Argentina, Messi barely present, Argentina wins after nearly 120 minutes with 0 - 1 after Messi finally did something and they have the goddess of luck on their side with that last ball on the post. I said before Argentina looked like Italy, but after the final I would say the even looked like Greece. You could see during German attacks that the Argentinian defense and midfield was almost completely joined together in a line of 8 people.

So that Messi supposedly made Argentina reach the final isn't even correct, that was their hyper defensive play and luck. At best you could say Messi made them reach the quarter finals. So people like Müller and Robben, who scored goal after goal, gave assist after assist, created chance after chance, who kept on running no matter what are bypassed by a player who was for the largest part invisible, barely running, but does that one good thing that wins them a match.

That's disgusting. That prize is supposed to be for the best player, but I've already known for years that this prize is simply a convenient tool for the FIFA. In 2006 it was given to Zidane. I don't remember exactly how he played during the tournament and he was definitely an awesome player, however they had already decided even before the final they were going to give him the prize as he was going to stop after the tournament with fooball or being an international and what happens then? Zidane gets red after head butting another player, making him one of the few players who received two red cards on a WC. FIFA gives this price out for whatever reason. Do you know why Messi got it? Not just out of respect, more out of pity. Because he is one of the best players in the world, he won nearly everything except the WC, which is some kind of an unofficial requirement to really be counted among the great. But he failed again, so they just gave him that because they found it necessary. Mess should get something, so we have just given him that as we can't give him the golden boot nor the WC trophy.

Messi did overall great, but he didn't preform any better as many other players and even the guys who gave him that prize use statistics that clearly state that.

I was gonna give a whole explanation on exactly how Messi didn't deserve it, but this is way better.

 

[Olorin]

I always find it disgusting how these awards always forget great players in the back like Lahm, true, he didn't do any flashy stuff but he was someone who always came through, he was probably the most reliable player in the tournament but you can't see that unless you specifically pay attention to kore than the forward players. I was cheering for Germany and every time Lahm got the ball I knew Germans were in control and I had nothing to be nervous about, not to mention how he was switching positions during games

And he isn't the only one

But ofc there's Messi, who is Messi, so let's give it to Messi

@Thinderbird, nor being behind isn't much when you struggle all the way through and barely make it before the penalties, most of the Argentine games looked like Ger v Alg, while Germany had one game like that and that because Hummels was missing and their lineup was bad

Even in the finals when Kheidira couldn't play and than Kramer got injured the Germans resorted to a lineup out of their comfort zone (Ozil to the middle, Klose left in for far too long, ...)

A European team deservingly won and beat the 2 greatest south American teams in the semi final and the final triumphing on south american soil, and now the last 3 wc champions were from Europe, next up Russia! It's quite likely we will get a fourth one Germany is still young, they have been steadily getting better for 10 years , let's see what happens in another 4 years, tho if Germany gets a 5th star Brazil will probably just boycott football forever

 

[Valhorus]

Simple . Messi doesn't deserved it , not even close .

 

[Rιver]

YOU started talking about STATISTICS when comparing a FORWARD player to a DEFENSIVE MIDFIELDER.

'...Mascherano were lower on statistics when compared to Messi - that is only, if we look at the assists and goals'

To try and use greater 'GOAL SCORER' or 'ASSIST MAKER' as a means of determining who was the better player for their team is NONSENSICAL if you are comparing a player like MESSI and a player like MASCHERANO.

Did you WATCH the games or did you only watch HIGHLIGHTS? These are comments of a Youtube watcher. Messi scored a great goal against Bosnia but was largely INEFFECTIVE for the rest of the game. He was POOR against Iran for 90 minutes before scoring the winning goal. The game against Nigeria was pretty much the only game in which Messi wasn't largely ANONYMOUS.

Who's only talking about the game against Germany? Mascherano was the STANDOUT player for Argentina in the knockout phase. Took each game by the scruff of the neck and roared the South Americans on. He was superb against Switzerland, Belgium, Holland and yes, Germany. Put in an excellent shift for 90 minutes in each game.

If Chile had progressed beyond the last 16 then perhaps Medel would've been up there too. But they didn't. Might as well throw in Tim f@cking Cahill since he put in a shift for only 3 games then.

I live in Islington. My Dad and I have been on the Emirates season ticket waiting list for 5 years now. Don't disrespect me with such a comment.

Robben put in consistently brilliant displays throughout the tournament. He certainly didn't go missing for the majority of the games. And he CERTAINLY wasn't reduced to running around aimlessly for 90 minutes as you seem to suggest. You're talking bollocks mate. Any Tom, D!ck or Harry could see that his performances surpassed Messi's. LVG often deployed Robben as a forward along side Van Persie with Sneijder just behind.

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'He only got 1 assist and Messi only got 1 assist so Messi was better'. Just nonsense mate.

Mascherano's job was to protect the back four, and that's what he did for the 90 minutes. Iran were reduced to only 3 or four counter attacks because Argentina had so much of the ball. And Messi did f@ck all until he hit the winner.

It's obvious to me, but you're allowed to believe what you want. I don't feel like i'm talking to an out and out football fan so i'm not going to take this any further. There's no hate involved, it's just my opinion - an opinion shared by many others.

You're talking about a man who was a standout player in only his team during the whole World Cup - which is nonsense. The only time Mascherano really started playing standout was against Netherlands - from that point on, understand that this is not standout during the whole world cup, and not even standout in his own team. Tell me, did he perform better than Toni Kroos? Better than Medel, when compared fairly f.e. 2 - 2 games? Sure he was an amazing player, but saying stuff (based on 2 games) he deserved more than Messi - what? Standout is the man who stands out of the whole World Cup, not the team. He could have been the second best player and best defender of Argentina, but damn hell not the best player of World Cup.

Poor against Iran... good God. Did you see the defense of Iran? Exactly the Catenaccio method without possession. What Argentina tried to use, was Tiki-Taka possession. They shut down Messi whenever he approached the goal. It was amazing how he scored that goal from that distance. Switzerland pressed him even harder and had even harder defense, same with Netherlands - the teamwork isn't about one man scoring, it's abut the team scoring. That's why Messi didn't score and let the others score except in Iran's case.

Messi was shut down the whole game. Why? Because he was a striker. This is totally different from a midfielder and a winger. He's supposed to create goaling opportunities and score whenever he has one. That should be obvious.

Not always. The only times he actually mattered was when he was a striker along with Robin van Persie. What about in his game against Costa Rica? Didn't create many opportunities - in fact, wasted some. Constantly he was blocked by the Costa Rican players f.e. Gonzalez while attempting to assist van Persie, and nearly none of them reached.

Spoiler

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I don't know why, but you hve this notion that Messi should have scored 5 goals even when he was suppressed hard. If someone actually passed to him (Lavezzi did, but it worked), it would have been a bad move.

...

Fine by me.​