Well for starters im going to prove why cqc isn't a bad option for Itachi up until 7gates come out. In terms of base vs base Itachi wins easily based from feats he's shown being able to fight on par with KM Naruto.(
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). Plus his manage to dodge Bee's assault very easy.(
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). Now it will be extremely hard for Gai to try and win due to him having to look at Itachi feet to avoid being caught by genjutsu. Itachi also has finger Genjutsu.(
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)-(
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) Which means Gai will not only have to evade eye contact but he won't even be able to see where Itachi is going to strike with his fist and he isn't a sensor so this method of fighting will not work well for Gai. Base Gai will be completely overwhelmed due to him trying to evade getting caught in genjutsu. 6th Gate Gai isn't really all that fast considering a less than 50% Kisame clone could easily track his movements.(
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). With Itachi MS he should easily be able to track 6th gate Gai. Morning peacock is easily tanked by this.(
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). Gates 1-5 shouldn't even be mentioned here since they'll be slower than 6th Gate which speed isn't impressive enough to suggest that he'll blitz Itachi.
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Why Amaterasu will work on Gai.
Amaterasu is one of Itachi signature jutsu and it will be of very good use in this battle. For starters Gai isn't a sensor so the bleed eye.(
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). won't even be seen by Gai because he'll be trying to avoid eye contact. Even if he decides to use the gates he'll have to use the 7th gate because 6th gate hasn't shown speed that suggest he could dodge it. V2 Ei needed his shunsui just to dodge it.(
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)-(
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). With that being said he'll need to be constantly in 7th gate just to dodge Amaterasu. Gai doesn't have enough stamina to do something like this simply because of his stamina. If he resorts to Hirudora it will be suicide due to it's drain on Gai.(
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)-(
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). So to sum it up Gai will constantly need 7th gate just to evade Amaterasu which isn't good for Gai at all considering his stamina problems with 7th Gate.
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Why Susanoo is tanking Hirudora...
Hirudora greatest feat is breaking a v3 Susanoo im here to debunk that claim but before i do that im going to explain why Itachi's v4 Susanoo would tank multiple Hirudora's if that's even possible for Gai to do. For starters i want to point out how much more Susanoo armor a v4 adds to a Susanoo. Which is literally like a bigger Susanoo swallowing a smaller Susanoo when shown here.(
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). Itachi v4 Susanoo also has Yata mirror.(
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). which by logical reason should be durable than a v4 Susanoo anyways due to it being it's shield and it would make no point to have a shield(Your main line of Defense) weaker than what it's protecting. Not only that Yata Mirror can indeed stretch/expand depending on what offense is being used against it.(
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)-(
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). Also it does have some repelling force in it as well seeing as how Sasuke and his blade went flying.(
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). So in no shape or form is a Hirudora busting through Itachi v4 Susanoo. Also Itachi has shown that he can pull out his Susanoo extremely fast.(
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). As we see here Itachi didn't even have his Susanoo up once Sasuke signaled Kirin to come down which means that he managed to pull his Susanoo out within 1/1000 of a sec which is basically how fast Kirin travels.(
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). So blitzing before Susanoo comes up isn't happening.
Also Gai was inside the Kurama Avatar before he used Hirudora to bust a v3 Susanoo.(
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). It's been proven multiple times that Kurama chakra can increase the size and the power of an attack.(
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). It was also proven that the chakra really never dies down inside someone.(
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). With that being said His Hirudora could have been powered-up by Kurama's chakra.
I’m still on the pinacle of youth
Might Gai, the leaf’s noble beast is about to kick some uchiha ass.
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First of all, a small summary on Gai’s advantages on this matchup.
Might Gai, known as Konoha’s noble beast is a master of Taijutsu and CQC, having showed amazing feats trough all the manga.
Thinking Taijutsu only means CQC (close quarters combat) is a terrible mistake, since Gai has showed the abilitie to perform long range techniques, that are in fact derivates of Taijutsu, but do not resemble the classic “physicall attacks” at all. Hirudora and Akasukaju are the perfect exaplmes of it, since they’re “physycall” attacks, but they seem more like long range attacks, resembling some ninjutsu techniques we’ve seen. Since Itachi has techniques that would allow him to keep his distance from Gai, this doesn’t mean Gai can’t attack, since as already mentioned, he can fight med-long ranged battles too.
On this matchup, Gai would be taking advantage on his superior speed, striking speed and strength. Itachi having sharingan won’t be such a big factor on this fight, as I will explain later.
Gai’s superior stamina and the fact that full knowledge is displayed here are the main factors that would give Gai the victory. Since he would dodge any attack Itachi has and keep him under constant pressure with his superior CQC skills, and when Itachi pulls out his MS is when the real battle begins. Gai’s superior stamina would allow him to keep fighting until Itachi’s chakra starts to fall due to his low chakra reserves and the huge chakra loss it means to use MS techniques. As soon as Itachi’s v4 susano downgrades to any weaker version, Hirudora destroys it, thus ending the match.
Before jumping to counter your post, I just want to clear a misconception about Gai’s chakra loss when using the 7th gate. As we saw against Kisame, after using Hirudora one time, his body suffered a punishment for it, showing us that the 7th gate was just a last resource for him, since his body could barely handle it. But when we reached the war arc, this thing changed, since when he faced JJ Madara, he opened the 7th gate and used Hirudora, and after that he didn’t seem to be exhausted at all (he just showed signs of being injured by madara), and after that he even opened the 8th gate. Meaning that his stamina grew to the point that he can use the gates more than before. Here are the manga scans.
Well for starters im going to prove why cqc isn't a bad option for Itachi up until 7gates come out. In terms of base vs base Itachi wins easily based from feats he's shown being able to fight on par with KM Naruto.(
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). Plus his manage to dodge Bee's assault very easy.(
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). Now it will be extremely hard for Gai to try and win due to him having to look at Itachi feet to avoid being caught by genjutsu. Itachi also has finger Genjutsu.(
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)-(
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) Which means Gai will not only have to evade eye contact but he won't even be able to see where Itachi is going to strike with his fist and he isn't a sensor so this method of fighting will not work well for Gai. Base Gai will be completely overwhelmed due to him trying to evade getting caught in genjutsu. 6th Gate Gai isn't really all that fast considering a less than 50% Kisame clone could easily track his movements.(
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). With Itachi MS he should easily be able to track 6th gate Gai. Morning peacock is easily tanked by this.(
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). Gates 1-5 shouldn't even be mentioned here since they'll be slower than 6th Gate which speed isn't impressive enough to suggest that he'll blitz Itachi.
In CQC, Itachi gets totally smacked.
1- You said he kept up with KM Naruto, okay, first of all, Naruto there was keeping a conversation with him, there’s was no indication of him fighting serious, not saying he was just joking around, but it doesn’t seem naruto was really “fighting” Itachi there. Any ways, probably, he was indeed fighting all out (cqc), but still, not such an impressive feat, since Naruto’s sunshin is really fast but his striking speed and hand speed are not that impressive (just taijutsu, without FRS and rasengan variants of course). And right here, is where I proof Gai’s superiority. Lets say Itachi kept up with KM Naruto in CQC…well I must say that by manga facts, KM naruto, not even with the help of clones could keep up with Obito, here I’ll show you how Obito was handling Naruto hands down, and would have warped him away to the pocket dimension if naruto didn’t get help everytime. From this we can assume Obito >> KM Naruto in CQC (since naruto’s striking speed and Taijutsu prowess are not impressive at all in pure taijutsu).
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And this is how Base Gai managed against the same opponent
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So that’s the difference between Base Gai and KM Naruto in CQC, this subject is does not deserve to be kept under discussion. Itachi gets wrecked in CQC against Gai.
2- About Gai having to worry about not looking at Itachi’s eyes and fingers, this is not a main problem, on part 1 he stated he has a method to fight the sharingan, which is to not make eye contact. Fighting Kakashi, he probably mastered completely this technique and probably was using it against Obito too. Obito is a sharingan and rinnengan user, its obvious that Gai avoided eye contact if he had already learned to fight that way, and still, his Taijutsu prowess did not decrease at all, meaning Gai can fight doujutsu users avoiding genjutsu perfectly without losing effectiveness. In this case, with full knowledge, Gai knows that he musn’t look at Itachi’s eyes nor his finger, while the latter is almost irrelevant, since Itachi using finger genjutsu in the heat of a CQC battle is almost imposible.
So, Gai can fight Itachi avoiding his eyes just like he did with Obito (who is superior to itachi in CQC). Even in base and fighting a dojutsu user (using his method) Gai still showed better feats than Itachi’s.
Here the scans of Gai’s method of fighting doujutsu
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3- About kisame “easely” tracking his movements… That’s what you call “easely tracking”?, Kisame got his face wrecked in that scan. Also, Gai’s speed and CQC grew a lot during the war arc, so showing old scans is irrelevant, since after that Gai’s powers grew to the point that he kept up with Obito in base. New scans > Old scans, we should take the last feat from each character. Also if he opens gates this shouldn’t even be argued.
Amaterasu is one of Itachi signature jutsu and it will be of very good use in this battle. For starters Gai isn't a sensor so the bleed eye.(
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). won't even be seen by Gai because he'll be trying to avoid eye contact. Even if he decides to use the gates he'll have to use the 7th gate because 6th gate hasn't shown speed that suggest he could dodge it. V2 Ei needed his shunsui just to dodge it.(
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)-(
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). With that being said he'll need to be constantly in 7th gate just to dodge Amaterasu. Gai doesn't have enough stamina to do something like this simply because of his stamina. If he resorts to Hirudora it will be suicide due to it's drain on Gai.(
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)-(
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). So to sum it up Gai will constantly need 7th gate just to evade Amaterasu which isn't good for Gai at all considering his stamina problems with 7th Gate.
First, to make this point clear, I must say that I think Gai can dodge amaterasu if the required circumstances are given. In the case he doesn’t dodge it, he has another resource, which I’ll add later. Another thing that must be mentioned is Itachi’s chakra loss when using Amaterasu, which will take a lot of his energy meaning no hope in facing Gai on a prolongued battle.
1- First of all, we must say that, Ay did not only dodge Amaterasu from a really short distance, he even counter-atacked after having dodged it, which means Ay’s speed is not > Amaterasu’s, it is >>>> Amaterasu’s.
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That being said, I’ll procede to say that, Gai is not looking for a counter attack like the raikage did here, his main goal would be just to merely dodge it to be able to survive, so he doesn’t need to be as fast and reflexive as Ay, he just needs to be the necessary to dodge it. As soon as he sees amaterasu coming (will address how later), he would just need to use 5th or 6th gate to dodge it, now, he won’t need to open them because it would be probably the gates he would be already using when Itachi resources to amaterasu.
Why isn’t the seventh gate needed? Because all gai needs here is to at least barely dodge amaterasu, and he doesn’t need godly speed to accomplish that. When using 6th gate (or 5th, is really impossible to know which one he was using here) he was even fast enough to intercept JJ Madara’s dujo damas (which at the same time, ar too fast for freaging haxxed Kakashi’s super fast kamui, as double kamui was needed)
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.
So Gai doesn’t need to open the 7th gate to dodge amaterasu, he just needs to use the gate he was using on that scan (probably 5 or 6), since it allowed him to incercept something a lot faster than amaterasu, and this gate would probably be already opened, since I don’t think Gai would fight Itachi in Base if he has full knowledge.
2- How is Gai seeing amaterasu coming if he isn’t a sensor? Very simple, he fights avoiding visual contact right? Then, with full knowledge, he would be fighting very cautious to any sign of amaterasu, and guess what? Bleeding would appear on the floor!
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So gai sees the blood on the floor and proceedes to do what I already addressed.
3- Gai’s second resource against amaterasu: If Gai doesn’t make the dodging on time (which is highly unlikely, Gai is more than capable of dodging it) because the blood didn’t reach the floor or Itachi was too close to dodge or anything, he uses his second resource to survive amaterasu, which is not dodging it or tanking it, it is to expel it out of his body. How? Well, here we see Nagato doing it with deva path’s shinra tensei, which makes a power wave that pushes everything back using the user as an epicenter
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How is this related to Gai expelling amaterasu from his body? Simple, he can do something like a shinra tensei to get the flames out.
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There we see the result of Gai opening the 7th gate, it creates a pushing wave that even made madara cover himself from such a big distance between him and Gai. If Amaterasu catches Gai, he can expel the flames using the force that gets out of his body when he uses the 7th gate. It is a pretty huge wave, so it should be capable of blowing Amaterasu away.
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Why Susanoo is tanking Hirudora...
Hirudora greatest feat is breaking a v3 Susanoo im here to debunk that claim but before i do that im going to explain why Itachi's v4 Susanoo would tank multiple Hirudora's if that's even possible for Gai to do. For starters i want to point out how much more Susanoo armor a v4 adds to a Susanoo. Which is literally like a bigger Susanoo swallowing a smaller Susanoo when shown here.(
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). Itachi v4 Susanoo also has Yata mirror.(
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). which by logical reason should be durable than a v4 Susanoo anyways due to it being it's shield and it would make no point to have a shield(Your main line of Defense) weaker than what it's protecting. Not only that Yata Mirror can indeed stretch/expand depending on what offense is being used against it.(
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)-(
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). Also it does have some repelling force in it as well seeing as how Sasuke and his blade went flying.(
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). So in no shape or form is a Hirudora busting through Itachi v4 Susanoo. Also Itachi has shown that he can pull out his Susanoo extremely fast.(
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). As we see here Itachi didn't even have his Susanoo up once Sasuke signaled Kirin to come down which means that he managed to pull his Susanoo out within 1/1000 of a sec which is basically how fast Kirin travels.(
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). So blitzing before Susanoo comes up isn't happening.
Also Gai was inside the Kurama Avatar before he used Hirudora to bust a v3 Susanoo.(
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). It's been proven multiple times that Kurama chakra can increase the size and the power of an attack.(
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). It was also proven that the chakra really never dies down inside someone.(
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). With that being said His Hirudora could have been powered-up by Kurama's chakra.
To address the final point of your post, I must say that I agree that Gai’s hirudora does not break Itachi’s v4 susano, but on this matchup, as I already mentioned, full knowledge is crucial. Gai knows Itachi’s stamina is not very high, even in the databook he has a 2,5 (source:
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) and this is not because of his sickness, its because MS takes a lot of chakra. Sasuke, who was also an MS user, had a 3.5 in stamina (source:
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), that’s because they both had something in common, the mangekyo sharingan, which takes a lot of chakra. This being said, Gai would have knowledge on Itachi’s susano, and he would know he can’t keep v4 for too much , and that’s because Sasuke with an MS could barely keep it activated, while he really started using it when he gained EMS. This is because v4 susano is more suited for EMS users, since MS users get drained to fast and can’t keep it activated too long.
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There we see MS Sasuke (who has more stamina than itachi) trying to activate v4 susano and failing to do so. I know Sasuke was worn out because of his fight with danzo, but don’t forget he got a chakra refill from Karin by that time
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So he wasn’t out of chakra at all at the moment his v4 susano faded
So, itachi can’t keep v4 for too long and Gai knows it. Moving on
1- Itachi showed he can pull out susano extremely fast, yes, but it was not his v4 susano, it was his v2 susano that came out after Kirin, since it’s the version its showed on the scan. If he managed to bring out v4 against kirin, his susano wouldn’t have been obliverated by it due to Yata Mirror, but since his susano was completely busted by kirin, we have evidence that he managed to bring out a much weaker version on time
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So bringing out v2 susano really fast is not helping against Gai, since his Hirudora blows it away. So if Gai tries to blitz and Itachi brings out a v2 susano it’s useless.
2- Gai being inside kurama’s chakra did not increase his powers, and this has already been proved (same for kakashi). Kurama gave kakashi a chakra boost when he touched his hand, being inside the avatar does not increase the chakra power, why? Here’s proof, Kurama says “get me that Gai guy here, I’ll restore him later”... that’s the key word, later, he asked bee to throw Gai inside the avatar so he’d be save, but the chakra resoring thing would be done after.
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Look, after that, Gai still looked like shit, so being inside the avatar did not increase his chakra pool or power (same for kakashi, for future discussions)
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So, let’s make a summary:
1- In CQC Gai *****-slaps Itachi, since Itachi was keeping up with KM Naruto who is not impressive in CQC skills (He is just very fast with his sunshin) while Gai in base was pretty much even with Obito (who is far superior to KM naruto). Also, if Itachi engages CQC he gets a short ranged Hirudora in the face
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2- Genjutsu is countered by his not-eye contact method, which is already proved very effective since he did not lose any taijutsu effectiveness using it against Obito. Finger genjutsu is also avoided by the fact that Gai has full knowledge, and also, its highly unlikely that Itacih can perform something like that on the heat of a CQC battle against someone of Gai’s caliber.
3- Amaterasu is either dodged or expelled from his body as I already explained. Gai would already have 5th or 6th gate opened to engage itachi and he would be very cautious to see the blood on the floor. Even without the 7th gate he could intercept Madara’s TSB so he can dodge Amaterasu, remember he needs to at least merely dodge it, no need to make a counter attack like Ay did.
4- V4 Susano is the only Susano that can tank Hirudora, and Itachi can’t hold it for too long, and Gai has full knowledge on it, so as soon as it goes down, Gai blows it away with Hirudora.
Alternative ending: Gai goes for an initial speed blitz using the 7th gate from the beginning and engaginf Itachi on on CQC, then when he is close enough he uses Hirudora, itachi won’t be on time to activate v4 susano since against Sasuke’s kirin he was only on time to activate v2 susano, there’s no reason to believe he can summon v4 susano that fast, because v4 susano wouldn’t have gotten destroyed by Kirin.
Was'it you just on my penis in that tourny? in shit? you didnt start talking shit untill i did'nt address you in my thread of people i whopped must have been mad you could not make the cut Maybe next time.
You say this to everybody you debate seriously nb4 i only say it to fools.
Anyways im better than both debaters and have no relationship with either so i guess i can judge but if these post get to long i might bounce.
i upgraded from owning dudes to now judges underlinks its a nice fit maybe i need to hang up my debating talents and focus on judging they're comes a time when winning gets to easy
Hop off my team damn did'nt i just whop you in a debate in currently whacking yo shit
Was'it you just on my penis in that tourny? in shit? you didnt start talking shit untill i did'nt address you in my thread of people i whopped must have been mad you could not make the cut Maybe next time.
You say this to everybody you debate seriously nb4 i only say it to fools.
Anyways im better than both debaters and have no relationship with either so i guess i can judge but if these post get to long i might bounce.
i upgraded from owning dudes to now judges underlinks its a nice fit maybe i need to hang up my debating talents and focus on judging they're comes a time when winning gets to easy
I've always talked shit to you vice versa. Shut that shit up son. And on your tip when? Because I gave you a compliment on one of your good post or w/e? Boy if you don't get your ass outta here.
And what I stated was the truth so stfu rn. You do fap Uchihas. PS. You'll never whoop my fam. If you want this work you know where to go.
Please go away. Ezelosses already said he didn't care if he judges or not and i find this funny coming from you seeing as that your Girlfriend Icelerate has been the judge in how many of your last debate matches? Also it's funny that you guys got mad when Draegod said he didn't want any of the people who surrounds them selfs with Beans the judges in their debate match. L0l you only don't like Kratos because he didn't agree with Lmao quit being a cry baby *****.
Just to make it clear i agreed with the judges. Their duty is to judge the arguments the debaters give without thinking who is the real winner of the fight. They don't judge the fight, they judge the debate, so i don't care if they're uchiha fanboys or anything, i know they wont be biased.
Just to make it clear i agreed with the judges. Their duty is to judge the arguments the debaters give without thinking who is the real winner of the fight. They don't judge the fight, they judge the debate, so i don't care if they're uchiha fanboys or anything, i know they wont be biased.
