Current Kakashi and Darui vs Kakuzu and Hidan

LuckyMan

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I ignored it because you completely took out the context of the scan that the sharingan did not give the insight to act accordindly. As the manga states your wrong to saying he can still perform it with the insight needed for him to counter the combo

That was Kakuzu's own assumption, that the Sharingan aided in him surviving that combo all because no else had did before. That holds zero weight in a debate and it gets crushed under Rock Lee's explanation of how the Sharingan works. The Sharingan does not increase ones body abilities, shinobi have to train that their-selves. Every way Kakashi moved in that fight he can still move like that without his Sharingan and his reactions and reflexes are still top tier because they've always have been, as was shown in the Kaguya Arc

I'm not about to go back and forth on a subject like this. I can post a whole page about it but you still haven't posted how the zombie duo even wins yet either so I would suggest you do that first then get to subjects like this.
 

DemonicAvenger

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The jump from the Kakuzu and Hidan Arc Kakashi to the War Kakashi is actually pretty big. His Stamina literally multiplied, and his speed definitely went up.

Team 1 takes this Mid-High Diff.​
 

Brother Numpsay

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Darui with his sword can handle hidan, while kakashi is keeping kakuzu busy with clones, without the sharingan he has still fast reflexes

Thats never going to happen with full intel. Zombies know this strategy before[ ]. And know about his clones tech, so he isn't getting fooled . Kakuzu gets his hearts out 1 supports Hidan and the rest barrages Kakashi if they ever encounter separation. The scan doesn't even prove reflexes. Although Kakashi never lacked in it anyway.

hiding like a mole can counter almost every attack of kakuzu combined with ration trap clones which will give kakuzu a hard time until darui finished hidan.

That move will only works once, which Kakuzu can hide an arm with Doton too, for any sneak attacks in coming. Kakashi will not have time do this all the time when Kakuzu canonically was cratering the ground forcing/pressuring him[ ] and eventually gets caught like in canon[ ]

1/5 (raiton) Hearts help Hidan in CQC, which Hidan doesn't even need. Hidan was strong enough to put Sharingan Kakashi on his toes when his fighting style was nerfed by Shikimaru from the beginning of the match. One of team 1 is going to end up getting scratch

Together they can take down kakuzu med diff.

Thats never going to happen

I think with intel darui won't take long against hidan due to his fast ranton element and superior food speed.

He definitely will and ranton gets outmaneuver by Hidans acrobatic ability and speed he has shown to be excellent with, with his unorthodox fighting style.

He can paralyze hidan very easily and will cut him into pieces to immobilize him for a long time.

Thats not happening Hidan has experience fighting someone with enhance chakra blade, exchanging blows[ ]. Not to mention Raiton Mask ends up being use when Darui is distracted by Hidan CQC. He either gets penetrated by Raiton, or at least gets scratch. One of them is guaranteed.

Once of them gets scratch, Kakuzu uses Katon or Futon to keep them away from Hidan, so he can perform the ritual, unless they want to get caught in the blast. Either way one of them dies since Kakuzu can also use Hidan as an option to hit them

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That was Kakuzu's own assumption, that the Sharingan aided in him surviving that combo all because no else had did before. That holds zero weight in a debate and it gets crushed under Rock Lee's explanation of how the Sharingan works. The Sharingan does not increase ones body abilities, shinobi have to train that their-selves. Every way Kakashi moved in that fight he can still move like that without his Sharingan and his reactions and reflexes are still top tier because they've always have been, as was shown in the Kaguya Arc

I'm not about to go back and forth on a subject like this. I can post a whole page about it but you still haven't posted how the zombie duo even wins yet either so I would suggest you do that first then get to subjects like this.

Except that "assumption" was correct when Kakashi Sharingan literally had its own panel focused on it. So everything you are stating doesn't stand on nothing. So repeating yourself to what I already know doesn't change the fact the without the Sharingan, he isn't going to predict the attack, therefore he isn't going to have time to counter. And Kakashi was keeping everything in check with the whole fight with Sharingan. He even attempt to follow the chakra flow of Rasenshiurken so another thing that craps on your argument[ ].

If you want an argument theres one of top that I made against ATD.
 
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ATD

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oooh, a match up where hidan makes an actual difference~

akatsuki win mid diff. hidan stalls darui w/ his underrated & slick cqc prowess until kakuzu finishes kakashi w/ jiongo tendril blitz

knowledge always favors the stronger side, & its blatant ITT. its the case of the mythical, plot armor'd, clone feint.
...good luck w/ that, team jounin

This time knowledge favors team jonins, they are aware of the immortal advantage of seam 2.
Dpnt underrate darui here, with his sword he can defend himself pretty good against hidans weapons, with raiton infused in his blade he could probably cut hidans blade into half and after that catch him with ranton missiles.
Hidan is immortal, but when he is cut into peaces without kakuzu he will be immobilized for longer time.

Kakashi in the other battle won't be finished that fast, he is a threat to kakuzus domu, now that kakashi needn't protect 3 kids he can dodge ration gain, katon zukoku and fuuton atsugai with his current food speed or with hiding like a mole.
Kakashi has jutsus he hadn't back there in the immortal arc : Beats runner, lightning clone, raiden, Raiton kunai....
Now with larger chakra resources he will be able to use also his ninjutsus more often like water dragon, water vortex,earth tracking fang no jutsu, taju kage bun shin no jutsu, rasengan.....
 

Dannie

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Current Kakashi as in no Sharingan Kakashi?

Kakuzu shits.
 

ATD

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Thats never going to happen with full intel. Zombies know this strategy before[ ]. And know about his clones tech, so he isn't getting fooled . Kakuzu gets his hearts out 1 supports Hidan and the rest barrages Kakashi if they ever encounter separation. The scan doesn't even prove reflexes. Although Kakashi never lacked in it anyway.
okay the ration heart is going with hidan !? it will be more difficult for darui but on the other side easier for kakashi.
Kakuzu knows about kakashis clone feints but he can't differ between them and he has to attack them either with nin jutsu or with taijutsu.

Kakashis foodspeed improved a lot, he would have no problem dodging all ninjutsus of kakuzu without thinking about others, he won't play the babysitter this time.
The scan proves that he really fast has thought about a way to save obito sakura and himself with only 2 kunais and a scroll.
Those reflexes are useful even in close combat.


That move will only works once, which Kakuzu can hide an arm with Doton too, for any sneak attacks in coming. Kakashi will not have time do this all the time when Kakuzu canonically was cratering the ground forcing/pressuring him[ ] and eventually gets caught like in canon[ ]
kakashi is aware of this move of kakuzu too, he won't go underground when kakuzus doton heart isn't outside of his body.
Last time they fought kakashi hasn't used a lot of jutsus he is capable of doing now.
Kakuzu to use his large scale ninjutsus has to do hand signs, kakashi can use 3 kage bun shins to fight the fire and wind heart and the other clone and himself fighting kakuzu keeping him busy, who will keep his doton heart inside his body to use domu and arm hiding.

1/5 (raiton) Hearts help Hidan in CQC, which Hidan doesn't even need. Hidan was strong enough to put Sharingan Kakashi on his toes when his fighting style was nerfed by Shikimaru from the beginning of the match. One of team 1 is going to end up getting scratch
Against kakashi he had the larger weapon and was more aggressive, while darui can defend himself pretty good against the blade of hidan with his own.
Daruis sword can be infused with raiton which also is a good defense against the small lightning streams of the ration heart ( it won't use gian because kakuzu has to do hand signs which isn't allowed by kakashi who keeps him busy)
tenten was able to destroy the heart of lightning with a fuuton stream , so daruis fast and agile ranton missiles will catch it too. To keep hidan busy for the moment he can use the black lightning panter.






Thats not happening Hidan has experience fighting someone with enhance chakra blade, exchanging blows[ ]. Not to mention Raiton Mask ends up being use when Darui is distracted by Hidan CQC. He either gets penetrated by Raiton, or at least gets scratch. One of them is guaranteed.
Darui would use black lightning panter to distract hidan, while using ranton against the slow heart.
After that he will forcing hidan in a close combat fight where both of them using theire weapons, darui can either cut the scythe or the rope with his ration infused sword.
Without kakuzu forming the hand seals the lightning of the heart is weak and easy dodged (shikamaru had no problems)
Darui won't get scratched, he is better than asuma in close combat and his speed will help him in every urgent situation.


Once of them gets scratch, Kakuzu uses Katon or Futon to keep them away from Hidan, so he can perform the ritual, unless they want to get caught in the blast. Either way one of them dies since Kakuzu can also use Hidan as an option to hit them

Even if they gets scratched hidan must do the circle and the ritual, which won't be allowed by ranton.
Kakuzu is busy with kakashi and his clones, mud wall or water wall will defend him from katons or fuutons.
what will kakuzu do against beast runner ?
 
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super yang

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This time knowledge favors team jonins, they are aware of the immortal advantage of seam 2.
Dpnt underrate darui here, with his sword he can defend himself pretty good against hidans weapons, with raiton infused in his blade he could probably cut hidans blade into half and after that catch him with ranton missiles.
Hidan is immortal, but when he is cut into peaces without kakuzu he will be immobilized for longer time.
but hidan has knowledge of daruis sword & jutsu prowess...
laser missiles cant even hurt hidan
black panther cant hit him directly
Kakashi in the other battle won't be finished that fast, he is a threat to kakuzus domu, now that kakashi needn't protect 3 kids he can dodge ration gain, katon zukoku and fuuton atsugai with his current food speed or with hiding like a mole.
Kakashi has jutsus he hadn't back there in the immortal arc : Beats runner, lightning clone, raiden, Raiton kunai....
Now with larger chakra resources he will be able to use also his ninjutsus more often like water dragon, water vortex,earth tracking fang no jutsu, taju kage bun shin no jutsu, rasengan.....
No, kakashi is not ''a threat to domu''. its a jutsu not an object tool or vulnerability.
kakuzu has full intel; domu has no purpose in this fight but as a spare life & underground slithering
you can keep your kakashi stamina & whatever bias fanfiction you're subconsciously entertaining.
if ur gonna tell me kakashi can compete w/ kakuzu elemental ninjutsu, im gonna get shorter & more curt w/ my replies.
if ur gonna tell me team pakkun is a threat to jiongo.. well I lol'd just now


and I make it a point to tell anyone who mentions raiden chain, as a serious jutsu to consider, that the jutsu is worthless fanservice - the equivalent of sakura throwing sleepbombs or naruto using fake do'ton against neji in the CE finals.
 

Migster257

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Current Kakashi is too OP. Pls nerf.

Honestly, Teuchi negs all of them.

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LuckyMan

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@EJBlack

Before this goes further, prove why Darui can't immediately blitz off Kakuzus or Hidans head with his Lightning Cleaver.
 

BenjerminGaye

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@EJBlack

Before this goes further, prove why Darui can't immediately blitz off Kakuzus or Hidans head with his Lightning Cleaver.

I see that happening to hidan by kakashi or darui. Hidan already admitted to having the worst taijutsu in the akatsuki.
 

RicardoA

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I see that happening to hidan by kakashi or darui. Hidan already admitted to having the worst taijutsu in the akatsuki.

@bold: He said he had the slowest attack speed, not the worst taijutsu ( )
His taijutsu is actually quite good even by Akatsuki standards.
 

LuckyMan

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I see that happening to hidan by kakashi or darui. Hidan already admitted to having the worst taijutsu in the akatsuki.

Then we have Darui who's movement and fight speed is on par with V1 Ay. Kakuzu or Hidan have no speed or reaction feats that even put them remotely on that level. There is no dodging or reacting to his blitz, they simply get their heads taken off, like Sasuke nearly did.
 

AizenSosuke

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Kakashi and Darui mid diff. Cmon guys Kakashi has 1k jutsus and w/o Sharingan his chakra won't be drained that much. Kakashi also has good chakra control. Darui is quite strong and black lighting is better than normal lightning so Kakuzu's Doton and Raiton gets countered. Kakashi does the rest. Hidan wont get blood from these 2.
 

ATD

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but hidan has knowledge of daruis sword & jutsu prowess...
laser missiles cant even hurt hidan
black panther cant hit him directly
No, kakashi is not ''a threat to domu''. its a jutsu not an object tool or vulnerability.
kakuzu has full intel; domu has no purpose in this fight but as a spare life & underground slithering
you can keep your kakashi stamina & whatever bias fanfiction you're subconsciously entertaining.
if ur gonna tell me kakashi can compete w/ kakuzu elemental ninjutsu, im gonna get shorter & more curt w/ my replies.
if ur gonna tell me team pakkun is a threat to jiongo.. well I lol'd just now


and I make it a point to tell anyone who mentions raiden chain, as a serious jutsu to consider, that the jutsu is worthless fanservice - the equivalent of sakura throwing sleepbombs or naruto using fake do'ton against neji in the CE finals.

why so aggressive ?
tbh you can't deny that now kakashi has a straight source of chakra and won't be drained by sharingan, its not fan fiction its logic.
why can't black panter or ranton hurt hidan ?? he is immortal, but still hurt able.

have you never noticed that kakahsis food speed has improved since his fight against kakuzu and hidan 300 chapters ago ?
Back there he was weakened due to his training with naruto+ he must protect team 10, with his current speed he would dodge kakuzus ninjutsus.
tell me why he won't be able to dodge them or counter them ?
team pakkun could be useful against hidan to trap him and hold him.
 

BenjerminGaye

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@bold: He said he had the slowest attack speed, not the worst taijutsu ( )
His taijutsu is actually quite good even by Akatsuki standards.

It says right there in the scan"slowest and least skilled" that means the worst taijutsu, and considering that white/black zetsu is in akatsuki. ...
You get the point.
He relies on his gimp for kills and tbh once you know the secret he's no longer a threat.
 

RicardoA

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It says right there in the scan"slowest and least skilled" that means the worst taijutsu, and considering that white/black zetsu is in akatsuki. ...
You get the point.
He relies on his gimp for kills and tbh once you know the secret he's no longer a threat.

But that doesn't mean his taijutsu is overall the worst. Otherwise he would've stated it bluntly: "My taijutsu is the worst in the Akatsuki".

That wouldn't even make practical sense. I mean, he's the only Akatsuki member who's strictly limited to CQC, while the great majority relies mostly in their range. It wouldn't make sense for the only CQC oriented member to be less competent in his primary area than the rest who rarely engaged in close combat.

Furthermore, the databook made it very clear where his taijutsu stands compared to other Akatsuki members. While he's got a 4.5, Kakuzu has a 4, Deidara a 3.5, Sasori a 4 and if you want to count him, Oro has a 3.5.
 

super yang

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speaking of hidans statement....

the ''slowest'' was a direct foreshadow of his laborious & strict blood curse/jutsu. he cant earnestly ''attack'' as he says cuz he has to prepare, & then the slow torturing is also part of it.

the ''skill'' part is self explanatory.

his actual foot speed & cqc prowess is brilliant & crisp, on the other hand.
 
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Brother Numpsay

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okay the ration heart is going with hidan !? it will be more difficult for darui but on the other side easier for kakashi.
Kakuzu knows about kakashis clone feints but he can't differ between them and he has to attack them either with nin jutsu or with taijutsu.

No it isn't easier as Kakashi canonically was being pressure by these 2 mask anyway, with Sharingan.

@Bold: Good thing Kakuzu is mid range fighter

Kakashis foodspeed improved a lot, he would have no problem dodging all ninjutsus of kakuzu without thinking about others, he won't play the babysitter this time.

@Bold is there any evidence to state this?

The scan proves that he really fast has thought about a way to save obito sakura and himself with only 2 kunais and a scroll.
Those reflexes are useful even in close combat.

Still doesn't say anything when part 1 Sakura was able to do something similar[ ]. This movement is very ninja basic.

kakashi is aware of this move of kakuzu too, he won't go underground when kakuzus doton heart isn't outside of his body.

Have you forgotten he has 5 hearts? He can use the featless heart to perform that.

Last time they fought kakashi hasn't used a lot of jutsus he is capable of doing now.

They would all be useless against Kakuzu's ninjutsu barrages.

Kakuzu to use his large scale ninjutsus has to do hand signs, kakashi can use 3 kage bun shins to fight the fire and wind heart and the other clone and himself fighting kakuzu keeping him busy, who will keep his doton heart inside his body to use domu and arm hiding.

Kakashi using Bushin isn't going to stop Kakuzu from weaving hand signs. They all can blown away from Kakuzu ninjutsu.

tenten was able to destroy the heart of lightning with a fuuton stream , so daruis fast and agile ranton missiles will catch it too. To keep hidan busy for the moment he can use the black lightning panter.

Kakuzu's mask were fighting the whole SA so of course the focus wasn't consistent. He is fighting only two characters here so Kakuzu will have them react much better.
Your premise isn't even effective to state he can use ranton and black lightening at the same time.


Darui would use black lightning panter to distract hidan, while using ranton against the slow heart.
After that he will forcing hidan in a close combat fight where both of them using theire weapons, darui can either cut the scythe or the rope with his ration infused sword.

Again no evidence he can simultaneously do that and you cant distract a Close quarters characters so no distractions. All they do is try to get closer. Hidan, to which I post a scan clashing with futon weapon, can easily sacrifice a basic ninja tool to clash with infuse chakra weapons and then uses his scythe for the opening, just like he did to Asuma in canon.

Without kakuzu forming the hand seals the lightning of the heart is weak and easy dodged (shikamaru had no problems)
Darui won't get scratched, he is better than asuma in close combat and his speed will help him in every urgent situation.

Except Kakuzu WIll form hand seals as Kakashi isn't stopping him when he has to worry about Katon and Futton barrages. Too bad Shikamaru never dodged it so therefore your argument holds no water. Are you suggesting that Suigetsu is superior to Asuma in CQC too? Since he was keeping up with Darui in close quarters only to get distracted.

Even if they gets scratched hidan must do the circle and the ritual, which won't be allowed by ranton.
Kakuzu is busy with kakashi and his clones, mud wall or water wall will defend him from katons or fuutons.
what will kakuzu do against beast runner ?

Except you ignored my premise that Kakuzu prepares Katon barrage to which these two are force to retreat or they get caught, while its covering hidan, to give him time. Kakuzu will never be busy with them when they go out by one shot. Beast runner isn't a factor. It is very similar to Black panther to which he easily dodges or neglects wit with Futon.

@EJBlack

Before this goes further, prove why Darui can't immediately blitz off Kakuzus or Hidans head with his Lightning Cleaver.

Because you are using ABC logic to state he is V1 Ay fast. To which I will also use ABC logic. Cee stated team Taka can keep up with V1 Ay, which they literally were. Kakuzu and Hidan are on that speed of Kakashi since they were able to keep up with him with a Sharingan, to which Kakashi speed and reaction is comparable to Sasuke, then.

Darui gets kicked in the chest and goes flying.
 
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