Current Jubi is probably stronger than the previous

[Waltz]

I'm not that convince concerning the chakra point, but nice point concerning Hachibi's statement. It indeed kind of prove the original Jubi was still stronger, but don't forget he was talking about his final form, so what if the current one is in his final form as well? Would the comparison still stand?

No problem. It's just the truth Lol

It's quite simple, as regards it's Yin and Yang portions:

Jūbi's full chakra = Bijū's compiled chakra

The Bijū's compiled chakra pools cannot be greater than the Jūbi's because they are it's chakra. The Comparison still stands due to the fact that the Jūbi has been displayed to have 2 portions of chakra being the Inton and Yōton portions [Bijū] as well as the Shizen Enerugi portions it absorb's from the environment which can be used to amplify techniques or promote anatomical growth. Even if the current Jūbi reached it's final form it would still be missing the Hachibi and Kyūbi and inferior to the version Rikudō faced. ​

 

[Nous]

Doubt it but possible.

 

[SIR HERDERP PRESIDERP SDO]

The point is the "cuddly appearance" of the baby Bijuus were merely artistic expression of their infancy aka the beginning of their lives as 9 different sentients, and as far evidence goes, the Bijuus chakra don't "evolve" greater than their original capacity, quite the contrary, it's been shown that Kurama wasn't able to regain its' lost Yin Chakra since it's been taken from him.

 

[Bogard]

Yeah I just read the comments

I still believe otherwise U_U

I don't believe the baby bijuus's chakra increased because Kurama's chakra hasn't increased in 16 years. In any case we'll be sure later on

No problem. I doubt it as well. Like i've said previously it was just a possibility Lol

It's quite simple, as regards it's Yin and Yang portions:

Jūbi's full chakra = Bijū's compiled chakra

The Bijū's compiled chakra pools cannot be greater than the Jūbi's because they are it's chakra. The Comparison still stands due to the fact that the Jūbi has been displayed to have 2 portions of chakra being the Inton and Yōton portions [Bijū] as well as the Shizen Enerugi portions it absorb's from the environment which can be used to amplify techniques or promote anatomical growth. Even if the current Jūbi reached it's final form it would still be missing the Hachibi and Kyūbi and inferior to the version Rikudō faced. ​

Hmm you do have a point here, but what makes you think Jubi's chakra would not have change with time as well? May i remind you that Sasuke's chakra has grown with time? We even observed a chakra change on his part according to Karin during the kage summit(she said it was colder, darker and so on). So while it's true that Jubi's chakra = combined Biju's chakra like you say, i'm not sure that Jubi's chakra would have remained the same. So accordingly, each Biju's chakra could have developed with time, but i do get your point though

 

[ImNoOne]

Re: Current Juubi is weaker than Original

You mean he didn't die instantly:

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He was still going to die anyways after extracting the Juubi from himself and dividing the Bijuus.

For all we know he was dying of old age. The way he speaks with the Bijuus sugested that they had lived with him for quite sometime, which would be the only explanation on how they knew him well and why they loved him.

If that scene had happen right after their creation they would not have known him well.

By the way here

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is the rest of the theory.

 

[SIR HERDERP PRESIDERP SDO]

Re: Current Juubi is weaker than Original

For all we know he was dying of old age. The way he speaks with the Bijuus sugested that they had lived with him for quite sometime, which would be the only explanation on how they knew him well and why they loved him.

If that scene had happen right after their creation they would not have known him well.

By the way here

You must be registered for see links

is the rest of the theory.

No, logic suggest that the direct cause of his death was the extraction of the Juubi and its division into the 9 Bijuus, the time frame wherein he remained alive afterwards is the result of his innate life force, much like Kushina's, but compared to Kushina, his life force was far greater hence the longer the time he remained alive afterwards.

 

[Unbiased King]

Proof that the maturity of 7 tailed beasts > 9 tailed beasts?

None? Well how surprising.

The point is the "cuddly appearance" of the baby Bijuus were merely artistic expression of their infancy aka the beginning of their lives as 9 different sentients, and as far evidence goes, the Bijuus chakra don't "evolve" greater than their original capacity, quite the contrary, it's been shown that Kurama wasn't able to regain its' lost Yin Chakra since it's been taken from him.

Here it is.

 

[ImNoOne]

Re: Current Juubi is weaker than Original

No, logic suggest that the direct cause of his death was the extraction of the Juubi and its division into the 9 Bijuus, the time frame wherein he remained alive afterwards is the result of his innate life force, much like Kushina's, but compared to Kushina, his life force was far greater hence the longer the time he remained alive afterwards.

No, Manga dictates that when he got old and weak, closer to die and having no one to entrust the Juubi he decided to divide it's power. So logic can not dictate what you are implying.

Having an opinion and calling it logic does not make it logic. I could as well say that everything with weals is a vehicle, because most vehicles have weals and then if it has 4 weals it's logically a car. But not all vehicles have weals and there are lots of things with 4 weals that are not vehicles.

Manga facts say that Rikudo was old and feared his death was close so he created the Bijuus. So we have a manga evidence of his death, old age. Then we have evidence that he lived after making the Bijuus and when he spoke to them he said that his time was almost up, and he was very old.

So logic dictates he died from old age. Not extraction/sudden chakra depletion.

 

[SIR HERDERP PRESIDERP SDO]

Re: Current Juubi is weaker than Original

No, Manga dictates that when he got old and weak, closer to die and having no one to entrust the Juubi he decided to divide it's power. So logic can not dictate what you are implying.

Having an opinion and calling it logic does not make it logic. I could as well say that everything with weals is a vehicle, because most vehicles have weals and then if it has 4 weals it's logically a car. But not all vehicles have weals and there are lots of things with 4 weals that are not vehicles.

Manga facts say that Rikudo was old and feared his death was close so he created the Bijuus. So we have a manga evidence of his death, old age. Then we have evidence that he lived after making the Bijuus and when he spoke to them he said that his time was almost up, and he was very old.

So logic dictates he died from old age. Not extraction/sudden chakra depletion.

No sir, logic dictates he died from Chakra exhaustion, afterall after creating the Bijuus he also created the Moon with the Juubi's Chakra removed and sealed the Gedo Mazo in it. Even he would die after performing such a feat, without the Juubi's Chakra

You must be registered for see images

 

[ImNoOne]

Re: Current Juubi is weaker than Original

No sir, logic dictates he died from Chakra exhaustion, afterall after creating the Bijuus he created the Moon with the Juubi's Chakra removed and sealed the Gedo Mazo in it. Even he would die after performing such a feat, without the Juubi's Chakra

Assuming you are right, it still makes it a fact that he did not divided all of the Juubi's chakra into the 9 Bijuu's otherwise he could have not lived for enough time to get to know the Bijuus and vice-verse, nor would there be time for them to create an affection relationship and respecting him. Relations like those take time to develop.

Well time is here the key word, you either die from chakra depletion after the extraction or you live on and the chakra extracted will be replenished naturally. He could not have lived like Kushina for years and then still make the Moon. The only logical explanation is that he did not take all of the Juubi out of himself but only a part, much like Bee did when he faked defeat against Sasuke, only on a larger portion.

Logic actually dictates that surviving a full extraction is impossible. If you say that So6P was so powerful that logic does not apply to him, hence enabling him to undergo a full extraction and still live for years. Then you can not say that "logic" dictates that.

You simply use logic or you don't. Despite common misconception logic is not when it sounds right, but when it can be subsequently proven down to the elemental and axiomatic level. This is why it's used to validate mathematical theorems.

To use logic you have to make it so that your statement is proven and contained on another statement that is accepted as axiomatic. The only axiom there is concerning this issue that is proven and stated by manga is that all Jins die after extraction due to chakra depletion.

If are having troubles with logic and how it works I suggest that you search these key words: inductive and deductive reasoning ( which is basically building up from basis or deconstructing to the basis) and retroductive inference (which is containing it within two points which you prove to be equal).

If you can not comply with simple logic, please refrain from stating that "logic suggests". Logic does not suggest it proves or disproves something with formal methods.

Logic is a tool not a crystal ball.

 

[BloodSeed]

Maybe yes maybe no, but 60% agree to your thread. Since the toril seal dont work on jubito but works on the incomplete jubii.

 

[Black Literati]

✽ ✽ ✽U_UI Think NotU_U✽ ✽ ✽

 

[Minator93]

Now that I think about it its actually plausible! Given the fact that Kurama accumulates chakra when he runs out and also the fact that a smaller body can't take more chakra I think its plausible!

Nice observation bro

 

[rakitha]

Re: Current Juubi is weaker than Original

because he doesn't have the nine tails and the hachibi {{{{he has only small amount of chakra of them<<:devil:

 

[cptenn94]

Re: Current Juubi is weaker than Original

you forget something....it is a manga FACT that while most jins die getting bijuus extracted, at least those of uzumaki origin, do not die. Kushina lived more than 30 minutes after kurama was extracted.(after a other extremely stressful, and tireding process.....childbirth)(She was actually killed by one of his claws.)

Now im not sure if it said all jins that have bijuus extracted die eventually, but it is a manga fact that people of certain bloodlines(bloodlines of people with strong life force/body)

Other than that solid theory. Actually before the juubi was revealed and before i began to read manga, I heard a theory, that each bijuu was the embodiement of a personality trait that came from the juubi.

Again, interesting thread. Just wanted to clear up the false fact you stated that all jins die instantly after haveing bijuus extracted. If the sage was indeed an uzumaki(the only clan confirmed to have the neccesary strong life force to survive extraction) then he would indeed have time to talk to the bijuus after FULLY extracting the juubi. Also releasing the bijuu, may not be as life threatening as haveing it ripped from you(this part is pure speculation though)

 

[Unorthodox]

Derp obito & Puppydog General ended this thread