[Spoilers] Chapter 585 Tsukiyomi

[Senary]

Sasuke is using Genjutsu with MS activated which makes it extremely powerful.

Tsukiyomi is a MS Genjutsu that is proven to be able to manipulate time and has been referenced as Itachi's jutsu (and only Itachi has used that term when activating it).

Sasuke has never shown the ability to manipulate time with his MS. If he has Tsukiyomi because he took Itachi's eyes, he has not shown us that he has the ability to use it to it's full extent (meaning to manipulate time itself), so it is not yet "Tsukiyomi".

When someone takes a jutsu and improves it, it is often given a -new- name. Itachi was famous for Tsukiyomi because he improved the regular MS Genjutsu and as such, it was given that name. Yes, the semantics are important here.

The only requirement identified in the manga is that you possess a double MS to activate Susanoo.

I don't understand the confusion here. Perhaps it's because of what is in the Databook? I'm pretty sure that changes over time as the manga develops anyway since that is really only a snapshot in time.

In regards to thought bubbles and other things like that.. a mistake could have been made in the push to publication.

 

[9Bijuu]

Re: Sasuke doesn't have Tsukiyomi

Then whats his second power?
1. Amaterasu
2. ?
3. Susanoo

There's no order to it, nothing in the manga stated MS powers are unlocked in a linear manner. If this were true, it's either everyone would have Kamui or KA because they'd come first/second in a list (Shisui / Kakashi have never used Tsukuyomi, Amaterasu, or Susanoo) or you'd have to unlock every power to access them if that were the case. Don't say it's an exception because that also means every sharingan could be an exception and wouldn't have to follow that line.

 

[Midday]

All chapter 585 proves is Sasuke's ems genjutsu was sufficient to break Itachi out of genjutsu, nothing else.

 

[the one over there]

Re: Sasuke doesn't have Tsukiyomi

All of you epically fail.!

Sasuke has used tsukyomi on killer bee, danzo and just now in the last chapter.

Sasuke and itachi both used tsukyomi to cancel out the genjutsu used by kabutos tayuya flute.

This thread fails. Go reread the manga instead of giving false info noobs

I agree with this guy

 

[bl4ckJack]

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Read this and become educated people. Sasuke has Tsukuyomi.

Educate Urself first ... here people only believe manga ... evry one gives examples on manga only ... so show me the Manga Page where its stated sasuke used or have tsukuyomi ...
dont give wiki links ... dere r lots of diff things dere what u ppl woldnt believe.
u will fail .. so peace U_U

 

[Darth Wignus]

all of you, good people, are full of crap
let's start things off



I went through the manga and your little theory that everything goes black and white during Tsukoyomi.
In the battle with Danzo there was no such page.
When Sasuke casted genjutsu on Itachi he didn't go black-white.

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The only "proof" you have it that could have been cast on Bee.

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However, Tsukoyomi is a genjutsu that sends you to the hospital in literally one second. The hachibi couldn't possibly dispell the genjutsu in less than one second because we actually see Bee thinking he is paralyzed and falling on the floor. Also, if Sasuke could use Tsukoyomi, I'm sure he wouldn't let himself get stabbed by Danzo using a regular genjutsu.

Next, how can Sasuke use genjutsu when he has MS activated? Simple.
How can Madara use Susano'o when he has Rinnegan activated?

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Having advanced dojutsu doesn't mean you can't use the previous powers.

It's not about breaking from genjutsu, it's about nullifying the first genjutsu with a more powerful one. For example, Shisui's Komoamatsukami breaking Edo Tensei. I'm sure we can all agree that an Uchiha genjutsu is more powerful than Tayuya's sound genjutsu. So what's the problem? Once the weaker genjutsu is gone, the second one takes effect and it can be dispelled at will from the caster. That's what the Uchiha brothers did anyway.

And what gives you the right to call people idiots? Seriously? Everyone has the right to their opinion and you haven't done much to disprove anyone thinking Sasuke doesn't have Tsukoyomi.




How do you know Shisui had Komoamatsukami in both eyes? We never saw Danzo using Shisui's MS. For all we know Danzo could have casted a normal genjutsu on Mifune. Please, show me where is it said that he had Komoamatsukami in both eyes.

How exactly did I discredit myself? You are the one who has no proof whatsoever that could even suggest your theory. By the way, where did anyone say that everyone must have a physical and a genjutsu MS power? As far as I know, Kakashi has space-time ninjutsu which sends people and things in another dimension. Tobi can travel through dimensions himself with his sharingan.

Don't patronize me. I backed up my theory, now you back up yours.



Again, how do you know Sasuke gained a new genjutsu with MS? Does anyone ever say anything about it in the manga? Sasuke himself never said the word Tsukoyomi. Danzo said Sasuke's illusion was inferior to Itachi's Tsukoyomi. You are the one who should re-read the manga. It's on chapter 478, so go ahead.

If they were actually saying it together, that's something we won't know for sure until the anime gets to that point. Either that or we see something in the manga that could prove beyond any doubt that Sasuke has Tsukoyomi. Prove me wrong then. Give me some conclusive proof and I'll admit I'm wrong.

+1 Rep... I personally don't believe Sasuke has Tsukoyomi and unless he uses it in the managa and says its name. The no reason anyone should conclude he has "just cause." It appears that MS can come with any number of different techniques.

 

[Jayaraman MinatoItachi]

Re: Sasuke doesn't have Tsukiyomi

All of you epically fail.!

Sasuke has used tsukyomi on killer bee, danzo and just now in the last chapter.

Sasuke and itachi both used tsukyomi to cancel out the genjutsu used by kabutos tayuya flute.

This thread fails. Go reread the manga instead of giving false info noobs

this

 

[senjuONem]

sasukes does not have tsukoyomi !

 

[Killahkels]

How does sasuke not have it when he has itachi's eyes who did have it lol

 

[Eddyt7]

nice one

 

[Demonic Heart]

Sasuke does have Tsukuyomi. you could see that at naruto.wikia.com

You guys need to pay attention

 

[Gouryuuka]

I think that the MS Sharingan awakens Susano'o for sure. That explains why Madara has'nt used Amaterasu or Tsukuyomi yet in his battles.

 

[Ultimatevirus]

so whats sasukes 2nd power?

 

[Sasori of the six paths]

i think sasukedoes have tsukiomi, just no experience with it...i recall when the bandages were on his eyes he said he felt itachi's power but he has yet to practice it....its in the manga im just to lazy to go find specifics xD

 

[jegriff78]

why would danzo compare a normal sharingan genjutsu to tsukiyomi since it will obvisouly be inferior?! And why would sasuke activate his MS/EMS everytime he uses that "genjutsu". For all I know the only genjutsu that u need MS or EMS to perform is tsukiyomi. It has not been directly stated in the manga but implied. And regarding to the last chapter what do you think happened then?! Why would itachi use tsukiyomi to disactivate something you can do with a normal genjutsu (assuming sasuke didnt use tsuki)?! Why waste his chakra?!

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tobi implies sasuke used tuskiy. He could just have said "it is no match for itachi genjutsu" but he specifically says to itachi tsykiyomi. If that is not enough evidence for you. There is no other way to change your mind and let´s call it different opinion/way to read the manga.

He compares it to Itachi's Tsukiyomi because (to the best of my knowledge) that is what he considers Itachi's greatest genjutsu. When you compare people, typically you don't compare their level of proficiency based on their weakest skill, you base it upon their best/most powerfull skill. Since Tobi is comparing genjutsu he would compare it to Itachi's Tsukiyomi, Itachi's greatest genjutsu.

Also, Tobi never implies that Sasuke uses Tsukiyomi against Danzo; in fact two pages later he states that the genjutsu Sasuke uses is a weak one (ie., not Tsukuyomi).

just my thoughts

 

[Sasuke2]

Sasuke has Tsukuyomi, he has used it on Killer B ... also Databook confirms it by saying that to unlock Susanoo both Tsukuyomi and Amaterasu are required.
The only reason he has not used Tsukuyomi on Itachi is cause he sucks at it.

 

[SasukeUchiha5]

Why do people like to go against what the anime says. In order to awaken Susanoo you need to have both amaterasu and tsukuyomi.It is stated by Tobi and Itachi says Susanoo is the third power. And the first two are amaterasu and tsukuyomi. And at the kage summit Sasuke said to Gaara this is the third power. And mongekyou sharingan has the abilities of amaterasu and tsukuyomi that automatically comes to you when you get MS. It just doesn't make any sense to awaken it and not have all three MS abilities. And Sasuke does have tsukuyomi he's just not as good as it like Itachi that's why he doesn't use it as often. But he did use it in the Danzo fight. Even Danzo stated your tsukuyomi is not even comparable to Itachi's. Kishi wouldn't those MS techniques with some characters and not others. He would just be makeing himseld look dumb.

 

[Noobastank]

In my opinion, The second power is just heightened genjutsu via the eyes. just an illusion the user is able to craft and mode with the spiritual chakra granted by the doujutsu. some can control other things in their genjutsu such as time like Itachi's Tsukiyomi. Others can manipulate your free will through genjutsu without being able to tell like Shisui's Kotoamatsukami. I think everyone uses the same ability but creates a different genjutsu. What sasuke did to killer bee was his "attempt" to use itachi's Tsukiyomi. In theory he could possibly perform Tsukiyomi if he learns to paint the illusion of a lapse in time i suppose.

 

[jordan1]

If tobi has been studing the sharingan for years and has a laboratory of them and he says you have to gave tsukuyomi and amatersu to get susanoo I rather belive tobi

 

[Sasuke2]

What Kishi establishes is what matters ... people on NB are not making Naruto, if they like it or not, Sasuke HAS Tsukuyomi.