can ems madara's ps tank the bijuu's combined tbb

[Uverdore9]

PS implicitly didn't tank the Shinsūsenju's 1,000 Hands Spree Barrage, the Manga nor Databooks supplements that presumption, infact, the Databooks explicitly invalidates it, and states that the Shinsūsenjû obliterates all of it's arms due to the magnificent force at which it strikes the opposing force; in this case, the Perfect Susano'o.

Therein, I'd like to say that cannot be quantified as PS lacks any substantial durability features but I'd like to presume that it's pretty durable from the fact that it's the most magnificent, highest, perfect form of the Eién no Mangekyô Sharingan's ocular powers implying that it should effortlessly tank the infused Bijuudama chakra mixture of 5 Bijuu, whom couldn't trounce BM Naruto magically who's a significantly weaker shinobi compared to the likes of SM Hashirama or EMS Madara, like, the latter explicitly trounced the BM Naruto cannonically with a relatively simplistic weapon like Gunbai - not even manifesting his significantly greater Susano'o stages (skeleton chakra ribcage/V1/V2/V3/V4/PS) let alone PS.

@Infant Thoughts?

 

[Infant]

Thanks for the tag, @Uverdore9

A heat/energy based attack is naturally weak against crystal/glass like defences, so the energy armour is a good choice.

Of course, this only applies to an extent. The combination of the sheer quantity of energy from all nine tailed beasts as well as the fact that they are not simply firing a beam but a ball that will go on to explode makes me think that their attack would win.

Madara using an illusion/mind control to force a contract with Kurama makes it likely that he could not at least risk straight combat with the beast.

On top of that, a laser hits with energy alone, but a projected ball also strikes with concussive force. So even a TBB from a single beast could break the energy armour.

 

[Uverdore9]

Thanks for the tag, @Uverdore9

Welcome.

A heat/energy based attack is naturally weak against crystal/glass like defences, so the energy armour is a good choice.

Isn't it quite the opposite though? I mean, if we pour an ounce of lime water in a glass after we irradiate it with heat it begins to weaken and eventually breaks.

Of course, this only applies to an extent. The combination of the sheer quantity of energy from all nine tailed beasts as well as the fact that they are not simply firing a beam but a ball that will go on to explode makes me think that their attack would win.

A concentrate energy beam of light is significantly more irradiative than an expansive explosive ball of energy - the reason why we see people surviving explosions (both in real life and in this Manga), however there's virtually 0 example of anyone tanking or surviving an irradiative light beam (both in real life and in this Manga) sans Tonêri's GWRE, though that's likely an extra can of worms that doesn't pertains to this debate, as it's an anomalistic example of that transpiring in fictional works.

Madara using an illusion/mind control to force a contract with Kurama makes it likely that he could not at least risk straight combat with the beast.

Except that was Full Kurama - an entity that soars sky-high through this verse as a god level that not even the likes of a Juubi Jinchuuriki can explicitly beat. I'll concede on the crux of your point though.

On top of that, a laser hits with energy alone, but a projected ball also strikes with concussive force. So even a TBB from a single beast could break the energy armour.

A concentrate energy beam of light is significantly more irradiative than an expansive explosive ball of energy - this is implicit by the likes of portrayal as well, as Quad Juubidama is the strongest form of Juubi TBB which obliterated countries in it's explosive wake - which implicitly indicates that the presumption that an expansive explosive ball of light <<< concentrate energy beam of light is axiomatically likely to intrinsically link with reality.

 

[Infant]

Isn't it quite the opposite though? I mean, if we pour an ounce of lime water in a glass after we irradiate it with heat it begins to weaken and eventually breaks.

Everything weakens

The reflective and solid structure of a glass greatly reduces how much of the energy it takes on structurally. The solidify also creates no openings for the beam to pass through, unlike concrete or sponge materials.

So structurally, it fares much better than other materials. Put a piece of sticky paper on a mirror and set it on fire using a fire lighter (you can direct and boost the flames with deoderent if you don't have the expensive lighters. You will see the paper not burn at all because the mirror somehow negates the flames. After five minutes, the mirror will crack but the paper will still be fine. Based on personal experience as a pyromaniac.

concentrate energy beam of light is significantly more irradiative than an expansive explosive ball of energy - the reason why we see people surviving explosions (both in real life and in this Manga), however there's virtually 0 example of anyone tanking or surviving an irradiative light beam (both in real life and in this Manga) sans Tonêri's GWRE, though that's likely an extra can of worms that doesn't pertains to this debate, as it's an anomalistic example of that transpiring in fictional works

A concentrate energy beam of light is significantly more irradiative than an expansive explosive ball of energy - this is implicit by the likes of portrayal as well, as Quad Juubidama is the strongest form of Juubi TBB which obliterated countries in it's explosive wake - which implicitly indicates that the presumption that an expansive explosive ball of light <<< concentrate energy beam of light is axiomatically likely to intrinsically link with reality.

Agreed.

But against a material that counters radiative energy, the added boost of concussive force makes an explosion better.

 

[Uverdore9]

So structurally, it fares much better than other materials. Put a piece of sticky paper on a mirror and set it on fire using a fire lighter (you can direct and boost the flames with deoderent if you don't have the expensive lighters. You will see the paper not burn at all because the mirror somehow negates the flames. After five minutes, the mirror will crack but the paper will still be fine. Based on personal experience as a pyromaniac.

From a scientific standpoint, you're probably right. However, the Manga is filled to the brim with magical spiritual connotations. Therein, how would say that effects this simulation? I mean, does the Bijuu have the feats to suggest that they could bypass the magnificent PS Avatar?

 

[Infant]

From a scientific standpoint, you're probably right. However, the Manga is filled to the brim with magical spiritual connotations. Therein, how would say that effects this simulation? I mean, does the Bijuu have the feats to suggest that they could bypass the magnificent PS Avatar?

These additional elements do not usually negate natural laws of our own world.

When they do, this is shown or explained. And as a rule, it should be shown since the natural assumption is of consistency with nature as we understand it.


With the short number of appearances they got, one must apply some logic to them. Shukaku, via Gaara, can either bury the armour or sink it deep underground. Matatabi can simply use bigger Fire Rats, since she has the energy for it. Isobu flashes directly in an armour battle. I am not sure he would win. Son Goku can melt it. Kokuo can use pinpoint attacks to break it. Saiken can also melt it. Chomei will also contest an armour battle. Gyuki will copy Kokuo with horn attacks. Kurama would have to rely on explosions. They may not easily win, but it would be a contest.

Besides their unique powers, exploding their TBBs on or near the armour should prove sufficient to crack it. Sasuke and Jugo not considering an NE boosted version enough to contest the TBB of the ten tails tells us its limit. Now while the TT is superior to normal tailed beasts, the basic element of the TBB is the same and as such will work so far as there is enough of it to match the size of the complete armour.

 

[Angel90]

His cloaked version tanked bijuudama

 

[Uverdore9]

These additional elements do not usually negate natural laws of our own world.

When they do, this is shown or explained. And as a rule, it should be shown since the natural assumption is of consistency with nature as we understand it.


With the short number of appearances they got, one must apply some logic to them. Shukaku, via Gaara, can either bury the armour or sink it deep underground. Matatabi can simply use bigger Fire Rats, since she has the energy for it. Isobu flashes directly in an armour battle. I am not sure he would win. Son Goku can melt it. Kokuo can use pinpoint attacks to break it. Saiken can also melt it. Chomei will also contest an armour battle. Gyuki will copy Kokuo with horn attacks. Kurama would have to rely on explosions. They may not easily win, but it would be a contest.

Besides their unique powers, exploding their TBBs on or near the armour should prove sufficient to crack it. Sasuke and Jugo not considering an NE boosted version enough to contest the TBB of the ten tails tells us its limit. Now while the TT is superior to normal tailed beasts, the basic element of the TBB is the same and as such will work so far as there is enough of it to match the size of the complete armour.

Actually, I'm not quite sure about this, though. It's implicit that when debating any fictional work, that we've to compulsorily cater to the guidelines stated and alluded to by the author.

Therein, I think that the natural laws of our world don't necessarily supplement the scientific laws of a fictional work, unless explicitly stated to be so.

In this case, however, we don't exactly know whether the author intended for the former to be conflated with the latter in his fictional work, which alludes to the fact that we take real life science with a grain of salt at all times.

Actually, we don't know if these attack strategies would work, though. BM Naruto could casually wrist flick these bijuudama to the adjacent area code, I don't see the magnificent PS being <<< to that feature to the point that it'd get moderately or completely shattered.

 

[Infant]

Actually, I'm not quite sure about this, though. It's implicit that when debating any fictional work, that we've to compulsorily cater to the guidelines stated and alluded to by the author.

Therein, I think that the natural laws of our world don't necessarily supplement the scientific laws of a fictional work, unless explicitly stated to be so.

In this case, however, we don't exactly know whether the author intended for the former to be conflated with the latter in his fictional work, which alludes to the fact that we take real life science with a grain of salt at all times.

Actually, we don't know if these attack strategies would work, though. BM Naruto could casually wrist flick these bijuudama to the adjacent area code, I don't see the magnificent PS being <<< to that feature to the point that it'd get moderately or completely destroyed.

The laws of the fictional world are built upon the natural one, by necessity for readers to follow and understand, among other factors. So we actually should assume such unless a difference is pointed out, even implicitly.

Otherwise, everything comes with a grain of salt. In this context, also because there is a possibility of new factors being introduced that are different from the natural world, as in any developing story/universe.

We never truly know, we can only estimate by accounting for various factors given.

Kurama doing so was with a body that naturally handles the energy of a TBB so it wouldn't be hurt by the raw energy and also before said TBB exploded. The strategy of the tailed beasts here would be to explode the TBB on or near the energy armour so as to strike it with the concussive energy of the explosion. In terms of using the pure weight of the ball for impact, it is certainly possible to the energy armour to use its sword akin to a baseball bat and punt the ball away, although I suspect the sharp impact could explode the ball on contact.

Also consider that Kurama fought the other beasts while they were being controlled and not fighting freely. Therefore, even their usage of techniques will have been sub-standard in terms of strategy and application.

@Shady Nurse, what say you?

 

[Shady Nurse]

The laws of the fictional world are built upon the natural one, by necessity for readers to follow and understand, among other factors. So we actually should assume such unless a difference is pointed out, even implicitly.

Otherwise, everything comes with a grain of salt. In this context, also because there is a possibility of new factors being introduced that are different from the natural world, as in any developing story/universe.

We never truly know, we can only estimate by accounting for various factors given.

Kurama doing so was with a body that naturally handles the energy of a TBB so it wouldn't be hurt by the raw energy and also before said TBB exploded. The strategy of the tailed beasts here would be to explode the TBB on or near the energy armour so as to strike it with the concussive energy of the explosion. In terms of using the pure weight of the ball for impact, it is certainly possible to the energy armour to use its sword akin to a baseball bat and punt the ball away, although I suspect the sharp impact could explode the ball on contact.

Also consider that Kurama fought the other beasts while they were being controlled and not fighting freely. Therefore, even their usage of techniques will have been sub-standard in terms of strategy and application.

@Shady Nurse, what say you?

Not sure. Was just giving it a quick glance.

 

[Hafiz Dembos]

It will definitely be destroyed. Most people on here are trying to compare the Bijiuudama to Hashirama's A Few Thousand Hands. If you understand how a bomb works, you'll know that a bomb that looks small can create an disproportionate level of damage. An example will be the atomic bomb, it was small enough to be carried by a small plane but it had a yield that could destroy a city. So, when those huge Bijuudamas explode you can as well expect that Perfect Susano will be obliterated a thousand time over.

Note: Hashirama's attack did not solely do the damage to the Valley of the End (VOTE), Madara's bladed Bijuudamas also contributed to the damage.

 

[Angel90]

Its clearly stated in the manga that susano tanked bijudama