[VS] Base Naruto v Base Sasuke

[sayian]

sc1: healthy GKS sasuke/naruto arc

sc2: War arc sasuke/naruto (before rikudou buff)

Spoiler

some quick reference of what war arc versions can do.

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[KidGamer65]

Sasuke wins S1. He's still faster than Naruto, superior in CQC due to his speed and his sword, and he has the mid-long range advantage due to Fireball Jutsu and Great Dragon Flame Jutsu. (jutsu that set up Kirin) Naruto's strongest form of Rasengan is Oodama Rasengan at this point, however Sasuke can stop Naruto from getting close w/ Nagashi, evade his Oodama Rasengan, or use snake summons to survive.

He gets stomped in s2. Naruto can freely ask Kurama for chakra and he was capable of stopping Jukai Kotan and that's far beyond anything Base Sasuke can do. We also have him using Chou Oodama Rasengan as posted in the OP and by the time the war arc has come Naruto and Sasuke have equal physical statistics. Base Naruto and Base Sasuke brawled and came out as dead equal. Strength, reaction speed, Taijutsu ability and all that. Sasuke moves faster but Naruto can cover far more ground due to clones, and higher levels of Rasengan take care of Sasuke's Katon.

 

[Antdog]

The Kage summit arc fight could go either way as both have the tools to deal with most of what the other can dish out along with having an offense to take out the other but they'd need to play the perfect game and one slip up can give the advantage to the other so it'd be close. With War arc versions Naruto should beat Sasuke thanks to having BM/BSM in order to overwhelm Sasuke who needed power ups to match Naruto so yeah

 

[Booker]

Sasuke wins S1. He's still faster than Naruto, superior in CQC due to his speed and his sword, and he has the mid-long range advantage due to Fireball Jutsu and Great Dragon Flame Jutsu. (jutsu that set up Kirin) Naruto's strongest form of Rasengan is Oodama Rasengan at this point, however Sasuke can stop Naruto from getting close w/ Nagashi, evade his Oodama Rasengan, or use snake summons to survive.

He gets stomped in s2. Naruto can freely ask Kurama for chakra and he was capable of stopping Jukai Kotan and that's far beyond anything Base Sasuke can do. We also have him using Chou Oodama Rasengan as posted in the OP and by the time the war arc has come Naruto and Sasuke have equal physical statistics. Base Naruto and Base Sasuke brawled and came out as dead equal. Strength, reaction speed, Taijutsu ability and all that. Sasuke moves faster but Naruto can cover far more ground due to clones, and higher levels of Rasengan take care of Sasuke's Katon.

You classify borrowing Kurama chakra as remaining in base?

 

[sayian]

Sasuke wins S1. He's still faster than Naruto, superior in CQC due to his speed and his sword, and he has the mid-long range advantage due to Fireball Jutsu and Great Dragon Flame Jutsu. (jutsu that set up Kirin) Naruto's strongest form of Rasengan is Oodama Rasengan at this point, however Sasuke can stop Naruto from getting close w/ Nagashi, evade his Oodama Rasengan, or use snake summons to survive.

He gets stomped in s2. Naruto can freely ask Kurama for chakra and he was capable of stopping Jukai Kotan and that's far beyond anything Base Sasuke can do. We also have him using Chou Oodama Rasengan as posted in the OP and by the time the war arc has come Naruto and Sasuke have equal physical statistics. Base Naruto and Base Sasuke brawled and came out as dead equal. Strength, reaction speed, Taijutsu ability and all that. Sasuke moves faster but Naruto can cover far more ground due to clones, and higher levels of Rasengan take care of Sasuke's Katon.

so essentially since GKS naruto can't/won't throw his base FRS yet, he'd had to flank sasuke the same way he did to kakuzu but since sasuke has better base stats he'd react and counter that naruto with said ninjutsu like you said. is

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what you mean by kurama?

war arc stomps due to his sagemode-like techniques to overwhelm sasuke's ninjutsu and since it can be thrown w/ larger AoE it'd be easier to hit sasuke, rikudou buff not factor in base vote2?

 

[KidGamer65]

so essentially since GKS naruto can't/won't throw his base FRS yet, he'd had to flank sasuke the same way he did to kakuzu but since sasuke has better base stats he'd react and counter that naruto with said ninjutsu like you said. is

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what you mean by kurama?

war arc stomps due to his sagemode-like techniques to overwhelm sasuke's ninjutsu and since it can be thrown w/ larger AoE it'd be easier to hit sasuke, rikudou buff not factor in base vote2?

Yup. Pretty much, and yeah, that is what Kurama lets Base Naruto do. Base Naruto in the War Arc has no Sage Mode like techniques. over half of the stuff you posted for War Base Naruto is actually Sage Mode Naruto. Base Naruto can't throw FRS until The Last and his strongest tech is a Chou Oodama Rasengan and he still needs clones to form his Rasengan.

And they got an equal amount of power from Hagoromo so take it away from both of them and nothing changes.

You classify borrowing Kurama chakra as remaining in base?

Yeah, because it's just an increase in chakra. He doesn't change modes or form in any way like he did back in the day.

 

[Booker]

Yup. Pretty much, and yeah, that is what Kurama lets Base Naruto do. Base Naruto in the War Arc has no Sage Mode like techniques. over half of the stuff you posted for War Base Naruto is actually Sage Mode Naruto. Base Naruto can't throw FRS until The Last and his strongest tech is a Chou Oodama Rasengan and he still needs clones to form his Rasengan.

And they got an equal amount of power from Hagoromo so take it away from both of them and nothing changes.



Yeah, because it's just an increase in chakra. He doesn't change modes or form in any way like he did back in the day.

Technically KCM is just a massive increase in chakra from Kurama. Only difference is a change of appearance, which is arbitrary.

 

[KidGamer65]

Technically KCM is just a massive increase in chakra from Kurama. Only difference is a change of appearance, which is arbitrary.

-More durable.
-Faster.
-Ninjutsu get stronger.
-New abilities. (chakra arms)
-Physical strength increases.
-Can throw his FRS.

Definitely far more differences than just a change in appearance. None of these occur when Kurama kneads extra chakra for Naruto.

 

[Booker]

-More durable.
-Faster.
-Ninjutsu get stronger.
-New abilities. (chakra arms)
-Physical strength increases.
-Can throw his FRS.

Definitely far more differences than just a change in appearance. None of these occur when Kurama kneads extra chakra for Naruto.

Right, but it's still just a massive influx of Kurama's chakra. Presumably with less chakra, you get less benefit, but you still gain some sort of buff. Like Naruto using Kurama's chakra (without cloak) to perform a summon he's otherwise incapable of. If Sasuke were just to activate 1-Tomoe as an adult, it's inconsequential but it's still a buff to his base abilities.

 

[KidGamer65]

Right, but it's still just a massive influx of Kurama's chakra. Presumably with less chakra, you get less benefit, but you still gain some sort of buff. Like Naruto using Kurama's chakra (without cloak) to perform a summon he's otherwise incapable of. If Sasuke were just to activate 1-Tomoe as an adult, it's inconsequential but it's still a buff to his base abilities.

No, cause if they were fundamentally the same thing then Naruto would get at least some of those benefits in base, but he doesn't. It's not that he gets less of those buffs, he gets none. The only thing that changes is the amount of chakra he wields. Naruto using Kurama's chakra to summon Gamabunta doesn't mean that it's not Base Naruto, it's just Base Naruto with extra chakra. Sharingan isn't base because it has it's own set of special abilities, enhances reaction speed and Taijutsu capability.

 

[Booker]

No, cause if they were fundamentally the same thing then Naruto would get at least some of those benefits in base, but he doesn't. It's not that he gets less of those buffs, he gets none. The only thing that changes is the amount of chakra he wields. Naruto using Kurama's chakra to summon Gamabunta doesn't mean that it's not Base Naruto, it's just Base Naruto with extra chakra. Sharingan isn't base because it has it's own set of special abilities, enhances reaction speed and Taijutsu capability.

Yeah, I'd call Bold a buff to his base form since he doesn't have it in base. And it's not just extra chakra, we knew even back in Part 1 that Kurama's chakra was more potent.

 

[KidGamer65]

Yeah, I'd call Bold a buff to his base form since he doesn't have it in base. And it's not just extra chakra, we knew even back in Part 1 that Kurama's chakra was more potent.

Then that all depends on what Base really is. If we define base as "nothing but what you have initially" then I agree. In fact that definition probably makes more sense than just referring to Base as a lack of modes. Back in Part 1 when Naruto borrowed Kurama's chakra he either got a cloak or he entered KN0. That's when his speed and other physical abilities increased and only when he enters those modes does his physical abilities increase. When Kurama gave Naruto chakra against Madara none of the above happened.

In that case I'd change my initial response and say that War Base Naruto still wins with mid-high diff, but not a stomp.

 

[Booker]

Then that all depends on what Base really is. If we define base as "nothing but what you have initially" then I agree. In fact that definition probably makes more sense than just referring to Base as a lack of modes. Back in Part 1 when Naruto borrowed Kurama's chakra he either got a cloak or he entered KN0. That's when his speed and other physical abilities increased and only when he enters those modes does his physical abilities increase. When Kurama gave Naruto chakra against Madara none of the above happened.

In that case I'd change my initial response and say that War Base Naruto still wins with mid-high diff, but not a stomp.

Yeah it would help to define what's considered base. Basically anything that gives you a semi-permanent buff to your immediate abilities or stamina goes above base. I also thought your initial post was accurate regardless in terms of who would win.

 

[sayian]

Yup. Pretty much, and yeah, that is what Kurama lets Base Naruto do. Base Naruto in the War Arc has no Sage Mode like techniques. over half of the stuff you posted for War Base Naruto is actually Sage Mode Naruto. Base Naruto can't throw FRS until The Last and his strongest tech is a Chou Oodama Rasengan and he still needs clones to form his Rasengan.

And they got an equal amount of power from Hagoromo so take it away from both of them and nothing changes.



Yeah, because it's just an increase in chakra. He doesn't change modes or form in any way like he did back in the day.

my fault, I checked the mangalife version that has better quality and yeah it's sage mode.

Spoiler

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the second panel I posted was to show he can do regular rasengan w/o clones. not the sagemode part.

 

[UnknownJin]

HAHAHAHAHHAHAA

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-get blitzed fodderz