Another Sage-Uzumaki Thread!

[Transcendence]

The famous quote which states that the Uzumaki are no more than distant relatives of the Senju.

Distant relativism and Direct Relativism are two different things. If it was Direct Relativism, then the Uzumaki would have been stated to have descended DIRECTLY from the Younger Son. But when it was all said and done, only the Senju were have stated to have descended from the Younger Son. Distant Relativism implies that there is a link along the road of line of descent, and if it isn't the Younger Son's Direct Relativism, it has to be Rikudou as there is no other plausible choice.

If Senju + Uchiha = Uzumaki, why were the Uzumaki only famous for their stamina and sealing abilites?

They have been famous for both their stamina (Senju) and their special Chakra (Uchiha) with cases such as Kushina who had special chakra in order to effectively conceal and subdue Kurama effortlessly inside her.

There has never even been a hint that the Uzumaki have any sort of relations to the Uchiha, which is fundamental to the theory.

The hint was given roughly 20+ chapters back. An Uchiha (Sasuke) was needed to unseal an Uzumaki sealing technique (Shiki Fujin) at the Naka Shrine, which was located on the tablet which was created by Rikudou.

 

[spckoroma]

look at there symbol a whole circle with everything mixing together....... lol I don't know if that plays a part but that's what I thought.

 

[KGB Kakuzu]

Honestly I don't like it because of what that means for Naruto's character as well as what Kishi did to the Hyuga.

When he first brings in the Hyuga he states they are Konoha's oldest clan. He then has Kakashi propose it could be that the Sharingan derived from the Byakugan.

Now all the sudden it is an Uzumaki sage, and only the Uchiha and Senju bloodlines. Also, Uchiha and Senju founded Konoha... he's gone practically 180 on his Oldest clan statement, and now the Hyuga are just their own thing.


As for Naruto... so much for being an underdog. We start off with him being this no one child who was nothing special. He talked about making his own destiny.

Then what happens: Dad is Hokage, Mom is from a powerful ancient clan, child of prophecy, and now the same clan as the Sage?! Shit so much for underdog... he's practically just an embarrassment of a child for all he's supposed to be related to. And even there with this destined child he shits on everything he tried to say to Neji.



I just find him going the opposite way of what he established doesn't do so well for an overall story, but it is still an interesting development.

 

[Gerkak]

Honestly I don't like it because of what that means for Naruto's character as well as what Kishi did to the Hyuga.

When he first brings in the Hyuga he states they are Konoha's oldest clan. He then has Kakashi propose it could be that the Sharingan derived from the Byakugan.

Now all the sudden it is an Uzumaki sage, and only the Uchiha and Senju bloodlines. Also, Uchiha and Senju founded Konoha... he's gone practically 180 on his Oldest clan statement, and now the Hyuga are just their own thing.


As for Naruto... so much for being an underdog. We start off with him being this no one child who was nothing special. He talked about making his own destiny.

Then what happens: Dad is Hokage, Mom is from a powerful ancient clan, child of prophecy, and now the same clan as the Sage?! Shit so much for underdog... he's practically just an embarrassment of a child for all he's supposed to be related to. And even there with this destined child he shits on everything he tried to say to Neji.



I just find him going the opposite way of what he established doesn't do so well for an overall story, but it is still an interesting development.

I agree absolutely.

 

[BlacLord™]

Look beneath the underneath:

Viz:

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The Bijuus are but one example

So what were the other creations with Banbutsu Sozo?

This:

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The Elder Son (Juubi's Yin) The Younger Son (Juubi's Yang)

All I'm seeing is theories built on theories?

1) Where was it stated that the Stone Tablet was Rikudou's?
2) The whole idea of Rikudou creating sons is ethically borderline barbaric, especially considering he was a monk.
3) The Shinigami's design was introduced in Part 1, the same time that Hiruzen repeatedly was stated to be Konoha's strongest Hokage and it was rumoured that the Uchiha shared blood with the Hyuuga, I doubt Kishimoto thought in detail about the plot ten years ahead.
4) Much of what was said was told by Obito, who was most likely told by Madara, who was most likely told by whoever etcetera etcetera, need I say more on that?
5) The whole Naka Shrine/Uzumaki Temple thing again is just theoretical, it doesn't suggest a blood relation, and could just as easily be interpreted as a way of safeguarding their use.

 

[Cursed Prince]

I dislike it because of how.. It makes Naruto less of what attracted me to the characterl. An underdog, someone who wasn't set for life. Knowing he is a descendant or possibly reincarnation of well, God, would make me lose even more interest in him.

He had a tailed beast that rofl stomps all others at only half power, underdog does not fit him >_>

 

[The Necromancer]

The hate stems from some retarded thread about a year or two ago where someone tried to prove the same point by saying the uzumaki as a whole could not perform ninjutsu. Back when there were Hot Threads it got almost 25 pages of reply against it.

 

[spckoroma]

All I'm seeing is theories built on theories?

1) Where was it stated that the Stone Tablet was Rikudou's?
2) The whole idea of Rikudou creating sons is ethically borderline barbaric, especially considering he was a monk.
3) The Shinigami's design was introduced in Part 1, the same time that Hiruzen repeatedly was stated to be Konoha's strongest Hokage, I doubt Kishimoto thought in detail about the plot ten years ahead.
4) Much of what was said was told by Obito, who was most likely told by Madara, who was most likely told by whoever etcetera etcetera, need I say more on that?
5) The whole Naka Shrine/Uzumaki Temple thing again is just theoretical, it doesn't suggest a blood relation, and could just as easily be interpreted as a way of safeguarding their use.

so explain why there clan was wiped out. it couldn't be because of there sealing

 

[ballerjordan]

There is nothing wrong with it. Kishi's been hinting if for a long time now.

 

[SIR HERDERP PRESIDERP SDO]

All I'm seeing is theories built on theories?

1) Where was it stated that the Stone Tablet was Rikudou's?
2) The whole idea of Rikudou creating sons is ethically borderline barbaric, especially considering he was a monk.
3) The Shinigami's design was introduced in Part 1, the same time that Hiruzen repeatedly was stated to be Konoha's strongest Hokage and it was rumoured that the Uchiha shared blood with the Hyuuga, I doubt Kishimoto thought in detail about the plot ten years ahead.
4) Much of what was said was told by Obito, who was most likely told by Madara, who was most likely told by whoever etcetera etcetera, need I say more on that?
5) The whole Naka Shrine/Uzumaki Temple thing again is just theoretical, it doesn't suggest a blood relation, and could just as easily be interpreted as a way of safeguarding their use.

Will you just stop being in denial, obviously you're a Senju fanboy that's why you deny the obvious, the Sage is Uzumaki, it is an absolute logical certainty, and painfully as obvious as Tobi=Obito.

 

[SIR HERDERP PRESIDERP SDO]

All I'm seeing is theories built on theories?

1) Where was it stated that the Stone Tablet was Rikudou's?
2) The whole idea of Rikudou creating sons is ethically borderline barbaric, especially considering he was a monk.
3) The Shinigami's design was introduced in Part 1, the same time that Hiruzen repeatedly was stated to be Konoha's strongest Hokage and it was rumoured that the Uchiha shared blood with the Hyuuga, I doubt Kishimoto thought in detail about the plot ten years ahead.
4) Much of what was said was told by Obito, who was most likely told by Madara, who was most likely told by whoever etcetera etcetera, need I say more on that?
5) The whole Naka Shrine/Uzumaki Temple thing again is just theoretical, it doesn't suggest a blood relation, and could just as easily be interpreted as a way of safeguarding their use.

Will you just stop being in denial, obviously you're a Senju fanboy that's why you deny the obvious, the Sage is Uzumaki, it is an absolute logical certainty, and painfully as obvious as Tobi=Obito.

See, you don't even know that Rikudou created the Tablet, as stated here:

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Just accept it, the Sage is Uzumaki.

 

[BlacLord™]

so explain why there clan was wiped out. it couldn't be because of there sealing

Why not? The manga again stated that the Uzumaki were prodigious in Fuuinjutsu but were crude in their methodology, and that was the reason, the whole Uzu no Kuni was destroyed.

 

[SIR HERDERP PRESIDERP SDO]

Why not? The manga again stated that the Uzumaki were prodigious in Fuuinjutsu but were crude in their methodology, and that was the reason, the whole Uzu no Kuni was destroyed.

Learn from your mistakes with the Tobi's Identity Fiasco, it's irritatingly obvious the Rikudou Sennin is Uzumaki, to deny that is to deny reason, logic, and common sense.

 

[spckoroma]

Why not? The manga again stated that the Uzumaki were prodigious in Fuuinjutsu but were crude in their methodology, and that was the reason, the whole Uzu no Kuni was destroyed.

I see bigger threats then that.You have far more clans that are threat then just Fuuinjutsu users. I don't think that's a valid point.

 

[BlacLord™]

Will you just stop being in denial, obviously you're a Senju fanboy that's why you deny the obvious, the Sage is Uzumaki, it is an absolute logical certainty, and painfully as obvious as Tobi=Obito.

See, you don't even know that Rikudou created the Tablet, as stated here:

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Senju fanboy? Wow. I like two Senju and suddenly I'm a fanboy? In actuality Sir Derp, Uzumaki Naruto is my joint favouite character of the series. I can't believe you're resulting to petty insults to back your argument.

The manga states, he left the secrets to them, not the tablet. For all we know, the secrets could've been scribed by the Elder Son or a descendant on the same side. You're still not bringing solid facts to the table, most of what've you said comes from what is fundamentally more theory, like the swirl patterns. I can tell you've worked hard on this and it's a solid effort but please, counter me properly instead of retorting with such meaningless slur.

Learn from your mistakes with the Tobi's Identity Fiasco, it's irritatingly obvious the Rikudou Sennin is Uzumaki, to deny that is to deny reason, logic, and common sense.

What mistakes? I always believed that Obito was Tobi. It would be logic and common sense if your basis was fact, without fact, it remains a theory.

 

[SIR HERDERP PRESIDERP SDO]

When 599 was revealed, Izuna theorists desperately argued that it's still Izuna's consciousness/spirit inhabiting Obito's body:

For all we know, Izuna's consciousnesses is what is inhabiting Obito's body.

Izuna Theorists are also still in the game, with Obito's body simply being the shell which holds his consciousness.

We must learn to avoid the mistakes of the past

 

[SIR HERDERP PRESIDERP SDO]

The manga states, he left the secrets to them, not the tablet. For all we know, the secrets could've been scribed by the Elder Son or a descendant on the same side.

Are you sure?

Viz:

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[BlacLord™]

Are you sure?

Viz:

You must be registered for see images

Why didn't you use the Viz in the first place?

 

[SilverfoxUchiha]

Senju fanboy? Wow. I like two Senju and suddenly I'm a fanboy? In actuality Sir Derp, Uzumaki Naruto is my joint favouite character of the series. I can't believe you're resulting to petty insults to back your argument.

The manga states, he left the secrets to them, not the tablet. For all we know, the secrets could've been scribed by the Elder Son or a descendant on the same side. You're still not bringing solid facts to the table, most of what've you said comes from what is fundamentally more theory, like the swirl patterns. I can tell you've worked hard on this and it's a solid effort but please, counter me properly instead of retorting with such meaningless slur.

Are you for real?? From the scan we can blatantly see that the Uzumaki Tablet was left by Rikudo Sennin. The fact that you have suggested that one of the Sons may have inscribed Rikudos secrets is even more proof of your floored argument as you are actually stating that the Uzumaki Tablet existed at the time when the two Sons of the Sage were alive, which would effectively mean that the Uzumaki Clan must have therefore also existed at the time of the existence of the two sons, which was the era of the Sage of the Six Paths. Considering this (and connecting the dots/clues, as well as the blatant information within the Manga itself) would it not be highly plausible that the Sage was indeed Uzumaki??

I sense you're in denial. Even tho admittedly it is only theory, all evidence points to the Sage being an Uzumaki. Just admit it... deep down you feel it's a possibility.

 

[SilverfoxUchiha]

Why didn't you use the Viz in the first place?

heh hehe well... at least you've seen it now loool