[VS] Ace vs Time Skip Sabo

[Punk Hazard]

So you're saying I should use the translation you prefer instead of the translation I prefer? Even though your translation is up to interpretation (consume can mean a variety of things) while mine isn't? Also, it's a FACT that Akainu's magma is much hotter then Ace's Fire.

I mean, you're using a mangy-looking translation with a very dirty clean up. It's obvious your scan isn't of quality, so the translation is questionable. Meanwhile, MS, which is what I used, has been known for producing the most accurate scans behind Viz.

Uhm no, consume pretty means what I said in this context. Magma isn't eating the fire, it's overtaking it and smothering it, which is pretty much the only other definition of consume that applies

LOL no it's not. There is literally no source saying Akainu's magma is hotter.

 

[Dannie]

Sabo got dis'

 

[loj]

I mean, you're using a mangy-looking translation with a very dirty clean up. It's obvious your scan isn't of quality, so the translation is questionable. Meanwhile, MS, which is what I used, has been known for producing the most accurate scans behind Viz.

Uhm no, consume pretty means what I said in this context. Magma isn't eating the fire, it's overtaking it and smothering it, which is pretty much the only other definition of consume that applies

LOL no it's not. There is literally no source saying Akainu's magma is hotter.

Yeah I think u are right then.

 

[Apêx1]

I mean, you're using a mangy-looking translation with a very dirty clean up. It's obvious your scan isn't of quality, so the translation is questionable. Meanwhile, MS, which is what I used, has been known for producing the most accurate scans behind Viz.

Uhm no, consume pretty means what I said in this context. Magma isn't eating the fire, it's overtaking it and smothering it, which is pretty much the only other definition of consume that applies

LOL no it's not. There is literally no source saying Akainu's magma is hotter.

Scan quality doesn't indicate translation quality. MS producing the most accurate scans is subjective, as far as I am concerned MP is almost always closer to the original VIZ then MS, since MS tends to try and make the translation cooler/more intense, etc.

It doesn't have to be stated, it's obvious. Ice block which was mountain sized based on the size of the giants and regular people next to it [

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]. Then we see a small Magma Punch melting the entire Ice instantly, without the magma decreasing or anything of the like [

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]. Magma was like 20 times the size of Akainu, Ice block was like 1000 times the size of the people beneath it.

 

[TRE MERCER]

lmao APEX GET OWNED.​

.........

Still no arguments. SMHHHHHH​

 

[Punk Hazard]

Scan quality doesn't indicate translation quality. MS producing the most accurate scans is subjective, as far as I am concerned MP is almost always closer to the original VIZ then MS, since MS tends to try and make the translation cooler/more intense, etc.

It doesn't have to be stated, it's obvious. Ice block which was mountain sized based on the size of the giants and regular people next to it [

You must be registered for see links

]. Then we see a small Magma Punch melting the entire Ice instantly, without the magma decreasing or anything of the like [

You must be registered for see links

]. Magma was like 20 times the size of Akainu, Ice block was like 1000 times the size of the people beneath it.

There is a reflection. If the scans are of poor quality, that reflects poorly on the translation. They put very little work into it, so the translation's credibility can be assumed to be iffy.

No, it's not. I mean, you can believe so if you want, but ask anyone. Hell, look at the past ten threads about chapter discussions. I guarantee a majority of them will have at least three "Waiting for MS translation"/"MP was wrong/Out of order/Confusing/Terribly written", or most often, both. MP is not a good translation site.

Uhm, you think size reflect temperature? A candle burns hotter than a pool of magma. A mountain of ice isn't colder than the tip of the iceberg. A larger flame isn't hotter than a smaller one, just because it's bigger.

 

[Uzumaki Macho]

Lmao MP called Doffy one of the four emperors, said Chinjao had a bounty of 5 billion, and had lots of other stupid translations. MS is clearly superior.

 

[Apêx1]

There is a reflection. If the scans are of poor quality, that reflects poorly on the translation. They put very little work into it, so the translation's credibility can be assumed to be iffy.

No, it's not. I mean, you can believe so if you want, but ask anyone. Hell, look at the past ten threads about chapter discussions. I guarantee a majority of them will have at least three "Waiting for MS translation"/"MP was wrong/Out of order/Confusing/Terribly written", or most often, both. MP is not a good translation site.

Uhm, you think size reflect temperature? A candle burns hotter than a pool of magma. A mountain of ice isn't colder than the tip of the iceberg. A larger flame isn't hotter than a smaller one, just because it's bigger.

Subjective as I said. Only because MP may make a mistake every now and then does not mean the general translations are any worse then MS's.

Why are you denying the point of Akainu's magma>Ice? A candle is hotter then magma in the real world. Not in OP verse, stop using stupid real life examples because they don't hold any value in this debate. And you're clearly not reading my points here and ignoring all evidence I present. And again, the core of the Enkai Entei would be hotter then the regular fire he produces, just because it's the core. Not to mention a larger fire will almost always mean a hotter fire when talking, and in this case I'm pretty sure Oda compared Enkai Entei to a small sun. Then there's the fact that Ace should have some form of control over his flames, given Enel's strongest attack was 200 million volts while his weaker attacks couldn't even kill Usopp rofl. I am not saying his ability to manipulate fire would be limitless, but Enkai Entei was obviously portrayed on a higher pedestal then any of his other attacks.

 

[ToshiZO]

@Apex
1.whether you stated it applies to other crews or not is irrelevant...the point was to clearly show you division commanders doesnt necessarily equate to rank. The WB crew is not an exception. It matches some characters and it doesnt match others...nothing new to this manga or others.

2.Thatch did not consume the yami yami IIRC...soo hes basically featless with no hype but getting killed by BB...nothing is clear about it...nothing indicates hes stronger than Jozu if anything everything indicates hes weaker.

3.lol MS is vastly superior to MP. You're probably used to the Naruto scans....One Piece is different...the OP MS version is many times more accurate than MP. MP is hard to even pass off as english at times.

 

[A v i]

Scan quality doesn't indicate translation quality. MS producing the most accurate scans is subjective, as far as I am concerned MP is almost always closer to the original VIZ then MS, since MS tends to try and make the translation cooler/more intense, etc.

Read these pages and decide it for yourself.

Spoiler

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Spoiler

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[Punk Hazard]

Subjective as I said. Only because MP may make a mistake every now and then does not mean the general translations are any worse then MS's.

Why are you denying the point of Akainu's magma>Ice? A candle is hotter then magma in the real world. Not in OP verse, stop using stupid real life examples because they don't hold any value in this debate. And you're clearly not reading my points here and ignoring all evidence I present. And again, the core of the Enkai Entei would be hotter then the regular fire he produces, just because it's the core. Not to mention a larger fire will almost always mean a hotter fire when talking, and in this case I'm pretty sure Oda compared Enkai Entei to a small sun. Then there's the fact that Ace should have some form of control over his flames, given Enel's strongest attack was 200 million volts while his weaker attacks couldn't even kill Usopp rofl. I am not saying his ability to manipulate fire would be limitless, but Enkai Entei was obviously portrayed on a higher pedestal then any of his other attacks.

As Macho said above, MP has called Doffy one of the Yonko and said Chinjao's bounty is 5 billion. Yes, making mistakes does not mean everything is a mistake. But making as many mistakes as MP does, and on the scale they do, makes everything they have questionable. It greatly reduces their credibility when they choose to leave in the translation as "Doffy is one of the Yonko" knowing he is not. MP is, matter of factly, not a credible source. Period.

Akainu's magma actually wasn't stronger than ice. When Akainu launched magma into the ice, both cancelled out.When Jozu launched the giant ice bolder, Akainu launched magma. The ice was evaporated, and the magma disappeared, no residual magma from that attack was raining down. When Akainu launched Meteor Volcano and the magma struck the ice, the ice melted and the magma was no where to be seen. Similarly, when Ace's Mirror Flame clashed with Aokiji's Peasant Beak, the attacks were evenly clashing, and both cancelled the other out. This supports that it has nothing to do with temperature, as either fire or magma is hotter(Fire is), but they both cancelled out with ice. Another thing to note is that Akainu uses magma, which is semi-molten rock, meaning there is a solidity to it. This is proven through when Whitebeard caught one of the magma meteors Akainu launched on his Bisento, and blew out the flames, leaving nothing but a smoking boulder on the blade. This means that the ice would be crushed by whatever solidity is contained in the lava, making it easier to melt by reducing it to small pieces rather than a giant mountain of ice. This would also effect fire by having a solid, earth based material that can block the flames from oxygen and pat it out, similar to how you can put out fire by dumping sand on it.

 

[CrimsonReaper]

Sabo low-mid diff.

 

[Bogard]

Ace grew faster than Sabo with time. Sabo should still win though because he had 2years improvement or more over Ace, probably mid difficulty

 

[Apêx1]

As Macho said above, MP has called Doffy one of the Yonko and said Chinjao's bounty is 5 billion. Yes, making mistakes does not mean everything is a mistake. But making as many mistakes as MP does, and on the scale they do, makes everything they have questionable. It greatly reduces their credibility when they choose to leave in the translation as "Doffy is one of the Yonko" knowing he is not. MP is, matter of factly, not a credible source. Period.

Here's a thread where you can see people arguing about it

You must be registered for see links

. As you see, even though MP might make mistranslations for a few things it doesn't necessarily mean they are any worse translations wise, since MS is generally considered to come out with liberal translations. Bold is your opinion, many others are of the opinion that MP is just as credible, if not more credible then MS.

Akainu's magma actually wasn't stronger than ice. When Akainu launched magma into the ice, both cancelled out.When Jozu launched the giant ice bolder, Akainu launched magma. The ice was evaporated, and the magma disappeared, no residual magma from that attack was raining down. When Akainu launched Meteor Volcano and the magma struck the ice, the ice melted and the magma was no where to be seen. Similarly, when Ace's Mirror Flame clashed with Aokiji's Peasant Beak, the attacks were evenly clashing, and both cancelled the other out. This supports that it has nothing to do with temperature, as either fire or magma is hotter(Fire is), but they both cancelled out with ice. Another thing to note is that Akainu uses magma, which is semi-molten rock, meaning there is a solidity to it. This is proven through when Whitebeard caught one of the magma meteors Akainu launched on his Bisento, and blew out the flames, leaving nothing but a smoking boulder on the blade. This means that the ice would be crushed by whatever solidity is contained in the lava, making it easier to melt by reducing it to small pieces rather than a giant mountain of ice. This would also effect fire by having a solid, earth based material that can block the flames from oxygen and pat it out, similar to how you can put out fire by dumping sand on it.

Do you even read this manga, or do you like to appeal to ignorance in hopes that I go along with it? When he launched magma into the ice, he turned the previously present Ice into a of magma sea [

You must be registered for see links

]. I seriously also suggest you learn to comprehend manga. Manga is read from right to left. Here's the scan that I already provided you [

You must be registered for see links

]. The magma melted it instantly and the magma that melted the ice started raining down on the people on the bottom left panel. In case you are still failing to read, here's a page later of it raining down some more [

You must be registered for see links

]. You can see on the top left panel that there is no reduction in amount of magma. Here's the size of the massive mountain sized ice block [

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] which was many times the size of his great eruption. And you arguing that Magma is semi-molten rock like in real life just helps my point, because every time ice has made contact with magma in Marineford the magma was still in molten form, it never transitioned back to a boulder.

@Apex
1.whether you stated it applies to other crews or not is irrelevant...the point was to clearly show you division commanders doesnt necessarily equate to rank. The WB crew is not an exception. It matches some characters and it doesnt match others...nothing new to this manga or others.

2.Thatch did not consume the yami yami IIRC...soo hes basically featless with no hype but getting killed by BB...nothing is clear about it...nothing indicates hes stronger than Jozu if anything everything indicates hes weaker.

3.lol MS is vastly superior to MP. You're probably used to the Naruto scans....One Piece is different...the OP MS version is many times more accurate than MP. MP is hard to even pass off as english at times.

1. You can deny it all you want, it won't change what is portrayed, and that is lower crew number=stronger.

2. Fair enough, it's speculative for me to say he ate it. So I'll agree that it was a bad point. But yes, Jozu is 3rd division commander and Thatch is 4th, so he'd logically be weaker.

3. Entirely subjective when we look at this from a large perspective concerning all chapters.

 

[Uzumaki Macho]

Here's a thread where you can see people arguing about it

You must be registered for see links

. As you see, even though MP might make mistranslations for a few things it doesn't necessarily mean they are any worse translations wise, since MS is generally considered to come out with liberal translations. Bold is your opinion, many others are of the opinion that MP is just as credible, if not more credible then MS.



Do you even read this manga, or do you like to appeal to ignorance in hopes that I go along with it? When he launched magma into the ice, he turned the previously present Ice into a of magma sea [

You must be registered for see links

]. I seriously also suggest you learn to comprehend manga. Manga is read from right to left. Here's the scan that I already provided you [

You must be registered for see links

]. The magma melted it instantly and the magma that melted the ice started raining down on the people on the bottom left panel. In case you are still failing to read, here's a page later of it raining down some more [

You must be registered for see links

]. You can see on the top left panel that there is no reduction in amount of magma. Here's the size of the massive mountain sized ice block [

You must be registered for see links

] which was many times the size of his great eruption. And you arguing that Magma is semi-molten rock like in real life just helps my point, because every time ice has made contact with magma in Marineford the magma was still in molten form, it never transitioned back to a boulder.



1. You can deny it all you want, it won't change what is portrayed, and that is lower crew number=stronger.

2. Fair enough, it's speculative for me to say he ate it. So I'll agree that it was a bad point. But yes, Jozu is 3rd division commander and Thatch is 4th, so he'd logically be weaker.

3. Entirely subjective when we look at this from a large perspective concerning all chapters.

Do you even have any proof that division number equals strength?

 

[U mAd]

Ace grew faster than Sabo with time. Sabo should still win though because he had 2years improvement or more over Ace, probably mid difficulty

why is this even an argument this guys got it right^.ace had better improvement rate but sabo's got 2 years advantage he takes this.

 

[Punk Hazard]

Here's a thread where you can see people arguing about it

You must be registered for see links

. As you see, even though MP might make mistranslations for a few things it doesn't necessarily mean they are any worse translations wise, since MS is generally considered to come out with liberal translations. Bold is your opinion, many others are of the opinion that MP is just as credible, if not more credible then MS.

That's actually exactly what it means. By making extreme mistranslations on a regular basis, and having translations that make no sense, they have ruined their credibility.

Do you even read this manga, or do you like to appeal to ignorance in hopes that I go along with it? When he launched magma into the ice, he turned the previously present Ice into a of magma sea [

You must be registered for see links

]. I seriously also suggest you learn to comprehend manga. Manga is read from right to left. Here's the scan that I already provided you [

You must be registered for see links

]. The magma melted it instantly and the magma that melted the ice started raining down on the people on the bottom left panel. In case you are still failing to read, here's a page later of it raining down some more [

You must be registered for see links

]. You can see on the top left panel that there is no reduction in amount of magma. Here's the size of the massive mountain sized ice block [

You must be registered for see links

] which was many times the size of his great eruption. And you arguing that Magma is semi-molten rock like in real life just helps my point, because every time ice has made contact with magma in Marineford the magma was still in molten form, it never transitioned back to a boulder.

There you go with the crappy translations again. The sea wasn't turned into magma, the sea was boiled by the magma.[

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]. I was wrong about the residual magma, but that still doesn't prove that it's any hotter than fire. Akainu's attack has a solid base, so it can blast through the ice, crushing it and then the heat evaporates it. The reason there was any residue was because of the solid component. Notice that Akainu's attack was also broken apart. When the magma fell into the water, the magma was nullified, only heating up the water. There was no molten rock in the area. Blasting away the ice mountain was the only time any magma was left, all other times it was nullified.

 

[Apêx1]

That's actually exactly what it means. By making extreme mistranslations on a regular basis, and having translations that make no sense, they have ruined their credibility.

Opinionated once again. I showed you many people having opinions like mine. Not going to bother debating this because it's a battle of whose opinion is right rather then anything else.

There you go with the crappy translations again. The sea wasn't turned into magma, the sea was boiled by the magma.[

You must be registered for see links

]. I was wrong about the residual magma, but that still doesn't prove that it's any hotter than fire. Akainu's attack has a solid base, so it can blast through the ice, crushing it and then the heat evaporates it. The reason there was any residue was because of the solid component. Notice that Akainu's attack was also broken apart. When the magma fell into the water, the magma was nullified, only heating up the water. There was no molten rock in the area. Blasting away the ice mountain was the only time any magma was left, all other times it was nullified.

But the magma didn't turn into stone, so the point stands. And it does. Fire and Ice were cancelled out in direct proportion. Magma was not cancelled out by both Fire and Ice, it not once reverted to the stone state against Ice. Akainu's attack having a solid base is NOT an argument. It was at the very least, 50 times smaller then the mountain sized Ice block. Yet it melted it INSTANTLY and CONTINUED to go on and rain down AS MAGMA. It breaking apart does not mean shit, surely it'd be weakened, but it was negligibly weakened.

 

[Amaterasu]

Lol not even close.

Amaterasu you cool and all, you made me some nice avas but hell no. Any new world fighter with haki is not beating Ace.

Ok I exagerrated a bit

 

[Main I]

Opinionated once again. I showed you many people having opinions like mine. Not going to bother debating this because it's a battle of whose opinion is right rather then anything else.




But the magma didn't turn into stone, so the point stands. And it does. Fire and Ice were cancelled out in direct proportion. Magma was not cancelled out by both Fire and Ice, it not once reverted to the stone state against Ice. Akainu's attack having a solid base is NOT an argument. It was at the very least, 50 times smaller then the mountain sized Ice block. Yet it melted it INSTANTLY and CONTINUED to go on and rain down AS MAGMA. It breaking apart does not mean shit, surely it'd be weakened, but it was negligibly weakened.

How was that block mountain sized? Lol, do you know how large mountains are? Please give me a calculation proving that block was at least 300 meters in diameter because it certainly didn't look like it.